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102 Responses to The occasional open thread (part 2)

  1. avatar
    Bob October 2, 2009 at 2:37 pm #

    Taitz’s surreply and Kreep’s motion to sever.

  2. avatar
    Bob October 2, 2009 at 2:55 pm #

    Donofrio reporting that Hawaii has released index data about Obama.

    Guess what?: A male named Barack Hussein Obama II was born in Hawaii.

    Glad that is cleared up.

  3. avatar
    JoZeppy October 2, 2009 at 3:18 pm #

    Birther cat fight!!!

  4. avatar
    kimba October 2, 2009 at 3:33 pm #

    Bizarre. Leo friend KingsKid requests index data for vital records for Barack H Obama, and Barack H Obama II. Fukino replies that the index data for birth of Barack H Obama II and marriage index for Stanley Dunham and Barack H Obama is available at hq, and Leo is confused why they gave the marriage data. Makes a Huge deal about oh, oh, big mystery. Who the f*ck did he think requesting information for Barack H Obama meant? What a stupid dense tool. I’m sorry, I can’t believe what a dumb rock Leo is. How did he pass the bar?

  5. avatar
    Catbit October 2, 2009 at 3:40 pm #

    ..The same way Orly passed the bar?

  6. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy October 2, 2009 at 4:29 pm #

    I think I read that in the newspaper somewhere.

  7. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy October 2, 2009 at 4:42 pm #

    Orly Taitz DID NOT WRITE THAT.

  8. avatar
    Expelliarmus October 2, 2009 at 4:46 pm #

    I’d point out that by figuring out what to ask for and how to ask for it, Donofrio has also killed the birther rumor about Maya Soetero having a COLB. (The one invented ages ago by “Techdude” as part of a claim that the Barack Obama birth certificate was forged).

    He’s also put to rest all speculation about whether or not Barack Obama & Stanley Dunham were married.

    I agree that Donofrio is clueless if he can’t figure out that asking for index data for all “vital records” of “Barack Obama” is going to result in disclosure of all such records for everyone who happens to be named “Barack Obama”. I think from reading Donofrio’s blog and comments that neither he nor his followers understand what a “vital record” is — they were also disturbed that there was no health department record of the Obama/Dunham divorce. (Well, duh!)

  9. avatar
    Bob October 2, 2009 at 5:04 pm #

    Sometimes I wonder what’s in it for Charles Lincoln. He writes all this stuff and Taitz gets all the glory. Surely he’s not getting paid. Is he just grateful to be back in the game, even if he’s been reduced to ghostwriter?

  10. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy October 2, 2009 at 5:05 pm #

    In a number of states, the department of health is the repository for all vital records, including marriages and divorces. I don’t know about Hawaii.

  11. avatar
    kimba October 2, 2009 at 5:08 pm #

    They must be making some money from that foreclosure thing. Didn’t Lucas say they’re working out of a house in Laguna Niguel that Lincoln purloined by foreclosure. LN is some pricey real estate.

  12. avatar
    kimba October 2, 2009 at 5:09 pm #

    Alternate answer:

    He’s doing it for free because he’s a patriot. {snark}

  13. avatar
    kimba October 2, 2009 at 5:14 pm #

    Leo is killing all the birther theories:

    – Barack born in Hawaii.
    – Ann and Barack were married.
    – No Hawaii BC for Maya.Which officially discredits TechDude.
    – Indirectly this all discredits Polarik.

    Leo. Killing the Dream. Now he’s got to convince them and build them up that the true way is to accept these things and the real prize/ right argument is the British citizenship, and two parents must be citizens theories. Leo. Building Champions.

  14. avatar
    jvn October 2, 2009 at 5:14 pm #

    My guess is that he will soon come to doubt the veracity of the index data that has been provided because it DOES NOT show any “amended” information, nor anything else that matters.

    He will, no doubt continue to try to force the “release of information used to make the public statement,” but we all know where that is going.

    And how about the split between him and his supposed client? At least now Leo doesn’t have to pretend he’s ever going to file anything in Hawaii!

    The Leotards are breaking up!

  15. avatar
    Bob October 2, 2009 at 5:26 pm #

    Hawaii says they can certify divorce certificates. Here’s the issue: What’s a divorce certificate? I can’t find example a Hawaii divorce certificate, and it seems like no such beast would exist since divorces are made final by a court order.

  16. avatar
    Bob October 2, 2009 at 5:31 pm #

    Reading the comments on Donofrio site, this is being touted as a real victory because (1) it forced the DoH to release data (which was already publicly available and repeated confirmed) and (2) lays a foundation for the “real issues,” like this amended birth certificate.

    It also, oh-so-conveniently, let’s the “SHOW ME THE BIRTH CERTIFICATE!!!” folks continue to breathe.

  17. avatar
    Bob October 2, 2009 at 5:32 pm #

    I would guess Lincoln thinks he can somehow monatize Taitz’s bar card. Somehow there’s money in it for Lincoln if he does all the heavy lifting on these “foreclosures” and she signs her name.

  18. avatar
    SvenMagnussen October 2, 2009 at 5:42 pm #

    Curious Similarities between BHO and casino billionaire Kirk Kerkorian:

    1) Both have married and fathered two daughters.
    2) Both have changed their name during their lifetime.
    3) Both began speaking and writing English as their household language at the age of 9 or 10.
    4) Both claim to be Natural born citizens of the United States of America, but neither can definitely name a hospital they were born at.
    5) Both value their friendship with Nancy Pelosi, Harry Reid and Joe Biden.
    6) Both are left-handed.

  19. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy October 2, 2009 at 5:54 pm #

    A Divorce Certificate is like a COLB for divorces. It is a certification that there was a divorce. You can get them in South Carolina.

  20. avatar
    kimba October 2, 2009 at 5:56 pm #

    You are a goofball Sven. Barack lived in Hawaii for his first 6 years. His mother and his grandparents were from Kansas. What language do you think they spoke? Hawaiian? Kansian? Please cite for us the proof you have that Barack Obama ever changed his name. Now run along you big silly.

  21. avatar
    Con Rep October 2, 2009 at 6:21 pm #

    I’m not surprised by the birth cert, or the fact that Maya has no info on file.

    What does surprise me is the index data for the Obama/Dunham marriage. Obama himself, in “Dreams,” speculated that there was no marriage cert, and has been quoted to that affect, subsequently, in the press. And various reporters have stated that there’s no marriage record.

    Didn’t the media know about the index?

  22. avatar
    SvenMagnussen October 2, 2009 at 6:25 pm #

    Step into the real world, Kimba. Not all families living in America speak English as their first language in their household.

    It worked out well for Kerkorian and for BO.

  23. avatar
    Jez October 2, 2009 at 6:25 pm #

    OMG!
    Barack Obama is Kirk Kerkorian!

  24. avatar
    kimba October 2, 2009 at 6:28 pm #

    Give it up Sven. Barack lived in Honolulu with the Dunhams. Three Kansas natives. Your head is up your rump if you think they spoke anything other than English. My gosh you are fool and a tool, Sven. And gullible. I know I’m in for a laugh and a half when I see you have posted!

  25. avatar
    Bob October 2, 2009 at 6:30 pm #

    Taitz moves to recuse Judge Land and requests an extention of time to respond to the sanctions OSC.

  26. avatar
    SFJeff October 2, 2009 at 6:36 pm #

    Yep, the jig is up- Sven has figured is out-Obama and Kerkorian are the same person.

  27. avatar
    Bob October 2, 2009 at 6:46 pm #

    From Taitz’s site: She not happy with Kreep’s motion.

    My favorite whopper: “He just joined me in prior case in state court and squeezed himself in this case….He, also, left for HI for 12 days when we were supposed to be in court.”

    On the day of the hearing for the dismissal motion in Keyes v. Bowen, where was Taitz?: Stalking Chief Justice Roberts in Idaho.

  28. avatar
    SFJeff October 2, 2009 at 6:47 pm #

    It occurs to me that far from moving too fast, President Obama is clearly disappointing many people.

    As a Muslim- why has he moved so slowly to declare the United States a Muslim Theocracy? Why has he not yet implimented Sharia?

    As a Gun Control Freak, why hasn’t he started confiscating guns yet? Doesn’t he know people are about ready to revolt?

    As a black racist why hasn’t he painted the White House yet?

    As a Proto-Hitler/Mussolini, why haven’t his brown shirts been clearing out those annoying public meetings of dissenters?

    As a hop head, why hasn’t he legalized drugs yet?

    As a native son of Kenya, why hasn’t he made Kenya his chief foreign priority?

    As a Carter like- soft on defense- President- for gods sake- when will he get around to turning our nukes over to Iran?

    And when will he stop with this ‘all American’ family stuff(his wife walks to manly too), and have a public sex scandal, preferably with his own gender?

    Really, the President has many priorities, but why hasn’t he focused on these important ones that were raised so often during the election?

  29. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy October 2, 2009 at 7:17 pm #

    And what language do you think Barack Obama grew up speaking?

  30. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy October 2, 2009 at 7:17 pm #

    Where in “Dreams” does Obama say that?

  31. avatar
    richCares October 2, 2009 at 7:28 pm #

    wow,fun time for us!

  32. avatar
    misha October 2, 2009 at 7:42 pm #

    I know, and how much did he pay to have his half-sister’s index record scrubbed? I mean, everyone knows she was born in Hawaii, and her COLB was used to make his. When is Leo going to unmask Obama’s confederate at Vital Statistics?

    And when did Axlerod and Emanuel convert to Islam? Obama had an imam whisked into the White House – it’s obvious.

    Jesus, Mary, Joseph and Leo!

  33. avatar
    misha October 2, 2009 at 7:47 pm #

    He won his law license in a poker game.

  34. avatar
    misha October 2, 2009 at 7:53 pm #

    Yiddish, like me. Get with the program. And I was born Lev Bronstein, and changed my name to Leon Trotsky Misha.

  35. avatar
    misha October 2, 2009 at 7:55 pm #

    And they have the same SS number!! I read it on the internets.

  36. avatar
    JoZeppy October 2, 2009 at 8:07 pm #

    I hope Orly brought her check book…somehow I don’t think this is quite what Judge Land had in mind when he gave her until today to show cause why he shouldn’t sanction her.

  37. avatar
    Black Lion October 2, 2009 at 9:42 pm #

    If you go to Leo’s site or to tROSL the birthers still don’t believe the information that was released. They still think that there is some additional information, that Dr. Fukono or Okubo are lying, and that the state is lying for the President. So this won’t change their minds…

  38. avatar
    kimba October 2, 2009 at 9:53 pm #

    You’ve almost pushed that Jacklyn lady over the edge. ( shhh, whispers – nicely done)

  39. avatar
    kimba October 2, 2009 at 9:54 pm #

    leotards. heh.

  40. avatar
    kimba October 2, 2009 at 9:59 pm #

    Your post reminded me of this picture.
    http://underneaththeirrobes.blogs.com/main/images/carol_channing_john_roberts.jpg

  41. avatar
    SvenMagnussen October 2, 2009 at 10:00 pm #

    Leo is what is known in the casino industry as a “cooler.”

    He makes an appearance. He makes a lot noise to establish a following and then he quits. Walks away and takes as many with him as possible.

    What Fukino hasn’t stated is the most important of all. Why does BO’s COLB say his it was “filed” and not “accepted.”

  42. avatar
    Bob October 2, 2009 at 11:29 pm #

    The judge writes back to Apuzzo about his case.

  43. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy October 2, 2009 at 11:57 pm #

    nononononono! The link is broken. Here is what the judge said:

    Dear Counsel:

    I have received Mr. Apuzzo’s letter of yesterday’s date. Please be assured that these matters are receiving the court’s attention. I remind counsel that both sides had obtained enlargements of time for submitting your written arguments to the court. Briefing upon the motions was not completed until July 31, 2009, and the parties have raised many issues and arguments. Counsel and clients may expect a written determination as soon as my research and decision upon these issues are completed.

  44. avatar
    Bob October 2, 2009 at 11:57 pm #

    Have you seen a Hawaiian one?

  45. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy October 3, 2009 at 12:07 am #

    No I have not seen one from Hawaii and I rather doubt that there is such a thing.

  46. avatar
    Bob October 3, 2009 at 12:16 am #

    What Fukino hasn’t stated is the most important of all. Why does BO’s COLB say his it was “filed” and not “accepted.”

    That’s not important at all. The part about Hawaiian birth is all the matters; the rest is just whining and crying and finger pointing.

  47. avatar
    Bob October 3, 2009 at 12:18 am #

    Hawaii’s verbiage notwithstanding, I don’t think one exists either (at least in the modern era).

    Which is exactly why there was no index data about divorces in response to information request.

  48. avatar
    Rickey October 3, 2009 at 12:52 am #

    Apparently it is a mis-interpretation of these passages on p. 22:

    In fact, how and when the marriage occurred remains a bit murky, a bill of particulars that I’ve never quite had the courage to explore. There’s no record of a real wedding, a cake, a ring, giving away of the bride. No families were in attendance; it’s not even clear that people back in Kansas were fully informed. Just a small civil ceremony, a justice of the peace. The whole thing seems so fragile in retrospect, so haphazard.

    There is no suggestion that Obama doubted that there was a marriage certificate. He was simply commenting that it wasn’t a traditional wedding. It’s clear that his grandparents on his mother’s side weren’t thrilled about the idea of their daughter marrying a black man from Africa.

  49. avatar
    nBc October 3, 2009 at 1:42 am #

    Sven asks

    What Fukino hasn’t stated is the most important of all. Why does BO’s COLB say his it was “filed” and not “accepted.”

    Because all COLB’s have ‘date filed’ on them?

    That was easy…

    Geez

  50. avatar
    Con Rep October 3, 2009 at 4:56 am #

    Apparently it is a mis-interpretation of these passages on p. 22:

    Fair enough, but it is open to interpretation, such as in the phrase “There’s no record of a real wedding.”

    In his book, “Obama: From Promise to Power,” David Mendell writes: “”Sometime in late 1960, the two slipped off alone to the island of Maui and apparently married. Obama later confessed that he never searched for the government documents on the marriage, although Madelyn insisted they were legally married.” This terminology also suggests that there’s a doubt, even from an approved biographer, and the only one granted access to Madelyn Dunham.

    I suppose my point is that since this publicly-accessible index exists, why didn’t the Hawaiian media find it, or alternately, why didn’t someone at the HI DOH direct some media source to the index? Maybe I’m overly optimistic, but it seems to me that if some of these rumors were nipped in the bud early on, there wouldn’t be as much birther muck to dig though now.

  51. avatar
    Paul Pieniezny October 3, 2009 at 8:24 am #

    Translated into Simple English: “Mr Apuzzo, I know you lied, but not yet how often. Do not worry, you’ll get your OSC in due time. I am still considering the amount.”

  52. avatar
    Paul Pieniezny October 3, 2009 at 8:33 am #

    The kibitzer sure did not win it at a game of chess.

    Off Topic, I rather like that first quotation in Wikipedia on “kiBBitzer”. The last quotation is not half bad either. Both are very relevant on the birfer issue!

  53. avatar
    Paul Pieniezny October 3, 2009 at 8:35 am #

    … with a glass of, wait for it, Belgian beer?

  54. avatar
    Paul Pieniezny October 3, 2009 at 8:43 am #

    Dutch, like Martin Van Buren, the first US presiden,t born in the United States. You see, Lolo was as uppity as BHO I, and spoke Dutch to his son, not a third world language like Bahasa. BHO II’s mother, knowing that they would go and live in Indonesia, switched from Russian evening class to Dutch. Si non e voro, e ben trovato.

  55. avatar
    JoZeppy October 3, 2009 at 9:03 am #

    Finally had a chance to sit down with Orly’s motion to recuse. It never ceases to amaze me that how she doesn’t graps the most basic concepts that a first year law student would understand after his Civil Procedure class. A brush up on evidence might help here too. “Colored and/or certified copies of Kenyan birth records”??? The kicker is that they would be admissable under the ancient documents rule…They are purporetedly over 20 years old but the other two criteria, of being in a condition that makes it free from suspicion concerning its authenticity, and
    found in a place where such a writing was likely to be kept….somehow I think those criteria will be lacking (not to mention citing the litany of bogus birther claims like the supposed executive orders sealing his personal records). Although I have to say this is the first time I’ve seen the phrase “batshit crazy” quoted in a brief.

    Me thinks Judge Land might just consider this her response to the his Order to Show Cause, slap her with the $10k fine, and refer the violations to the California bar for additional action (me thinks he’ll suggest disbarment?).

    I will miss her crazy and poorly written briefs. If I ever teach a class in legal writing, I will certainly use her briefs as an example of what never to do.

  56. avatar
    kimba October 3, 2009 at 9:31 am #

    He speaks at least basic Bahasa because on his first visit to the State Dept, after he spoke to the staff and went to shake hands, someone called out to Obama in Bahasa and he had a bit of conversation with the person. ~Ooooo, he speaks an asian language. So scary and so unnatural in a natural born citizen. ~ Isn’t it funny how something I view as another bit of information that shows he’s well-educated, well-read, perhaps has a broad world view is seen as suspicious and scary by the birthers.

  57. avatar
    kimba October 3, 2009 at 9:36 am #

    He sends a long letter, gets back a postcard. Times are hard…Tell me again why he didn’t just call the judge’s office?

  58. avatar
    kimba October 3, 2009 at 9:39 am #

    I have seen Rahm referred to as “tiny dancer” on a quite-progressive site. I find this very funny.

  59. avatar
    Bob October 3, 2009 at 11:52 am #

    That doesn’t suggest doubt, but rather no one bothered to look.

    Hawaii has flatly stated they were married. End of storty.

  60. avatar
    kimba October 3, 2009 at 12:16 pm #

    Oh no mister, don’t end-of-story us. ‘Real’ natural born citizens never wonder about their parents’ marriage. Because as the Constitution tells us, natural born citizens are the children of two natural born citizens who were wed in a traditional Christian church ceremony. The bride is a virgin and the groom is a member of the rotary club. There’s a big lacy photo album with smiling pictures of the whole natural born family, on both sides, all the way back to the Mayflower. It says right there in Article II. Somewhere. Don’t you read?

  61. avatar
    Bob October 3, 2009 at 12:19 pm #

    Sinclair teams up with Berg in Liberi v. Taitz.

  62. avatar
    Bob October 3, 2009 at 12:28 pm #

    Big Bird is a big birfer.

  63. avatar
    Con Rep October 3, 2009 at 1:43 pm #

    Bob, I’m not a birther, by any means, but in order to combat birtherism, one needs facts. It’s almost impossible to dissuade them, but facts at least give one a stick with which to poke them.

    Hawaii can state whatever they want — statements aren’t facts. My point is, they could have directed the media toward this index long ago, and they didn’t.

    I know they’re swamped with bs birther demands, but they have apparently contributed to the situation by not clearing these matters up sooner with what they are now stating is a publicly available index.

  64. avatar
    kimba October 3, 2009 at 1:57 pm #

    You know ConRep, every person who has come here and started out “I’m not a birther, but…” has turned out to be a ultra hard core birther. You’re going to be like John and Sally Hill: you’ll start out with innocuous questions and “gosh, why can’t they just….” then all of a sudden one day, boom, you’ll pop up with full out birther talking points, chapter and verse. The State of Hawaii Dept of Health is busy with the health of the Hawaiian people. Why would they take the time to play games with the press? Dr Fukino released the index data in her statements. It’s too bad if birthers have to have it spelled out for them, “hello, I am about to tell you index data” or even worse, need a certified copy mailed to each individually.

  65. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy October 3, 2009 at 2:00 pm #

    Actually they don’t all have “date filed” on them. Some are one way and some another. See my article from last February:

    http://www.obamaconspiracy.org/2009/02/date-filed-v-date-accepted/

  66. avatar
    ImaForener October 3, 2009 at 3:31 pm #

    Lucas Smith is back on Ebay, this time giving people the opportunity to buy a ticket that will give them a “free” book that he is writing – should you be so inclined it is Ebay item 160366879198.

    “Dissertation contains scores of marshaled documents, maps, African passport stamps in Smith’s passport and other instruments which establish, under both standards of evidence, preponderance of the evidence and beyond a reasonable doubt, that US President Barack Obama was born at Coast Province General Hospital, Mombasa, British Protectorate of Kenya.

    Dissertation discusses and lays out specific reasoning behind Lucas Smith’s travel to Africa in 2009. Smith did not travel to Africa with beforehand knowledge of Barack Obama’s Kenyan Birth. Smith is a writer and traveled to Africa for a story in the Congo.

    Dissertation discusses in intricate detail birth documents and other identity instruments and their history.

    Dissertation details and documents Smith’s journey beginning in January 2009 which included travel to and through Africa and Kenya and Coast Province General Hospital (CPGH).

    Dissertation discusses at length Smith’s criminal history.

    Lastly, the dissertation discusses a new economic plan for the United States of America.”

    Based on that description, I believe we now have proof that Lucas Smith is in fact the love child of Larry Sinclair and Joe the Plumber.

  67. avatar
    misha October 3, 2009 at 3:51 pm #

    No, Lucas Smith is the love child of Glenn Beck and a girlfriend, he may be beating. Did Glenn Beck father Lucas Smith when he was in an alcohol and heroin haze? I’m not saying he did, but why hasn’t he issued a statement that this is not true?

    I’ll still waiting for Beck to release his criminal record abstract, which he is refusing to do. Also, there is a Glenn Beck in NJ, who has a criminal record. Are they the same person? We’ll never know until Beck comes clean.

    WHAT ARE YOU HIDING GLENN?

  68. avatar
    Black Lion October 3, 2009 at 3:55 pm #

    I try…She is the worst…When she can’t refute any of the statements made she usually resorts to personal attacks….It is amusing to see all of them basically ignore the index data and still push the COLB is fake stories…

  69. avatar
    misha October 3, 2009 at 4:03 pm #

    Dear Judge Land:

    You are a corrupt horse’s rear end, and I demand you recuse yourself in favor of a real patriot who will help me throw that negro in prison, where he belongs.

    I don’t recognize Soetoro’s authority, and not yours either. You are just like the communist authorities in Moldova, and me and my friends will sue you until the end of time.

    Orly Taitz,DDS,ESQ

  70. avatar
    MS October 3, 2009 at 4:32 pm #

    I thought I’d take the opportunity of this open thread to thank Doc C. and the other posters here.

    Over the past few months I’ve frequently had people come to me saying that they ‘heard this’ and then repeat some absurd birther rumor. Referencing this site is the easiest way I’ve found of resolving these people’s doubts, and I imagine many others use the site in the same way.

    Keep up the good work,guys.I believe you have far more influence than you may realize.

  71. avatar
    Adrianinflorida October 3, 2009 at 4:41 pm #

    All 39 of em (ssn’s) per ornery

    misha: And they have the same SS number!! I read it on the internets.

  72. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy October 3, 2009 at 5:34 pm #

    Thank you. That’s why I’m here.

  73. avatar
    Randy October 3, 2009 at 10:59 pm #

    Thanks for the website Dr. C.

    After being a lurker for 7 months I miss you people when I am away from my computer.

    Props to Misha, Kimba, Bob and even Sven or HEAVY or TRUTH.

  74. avatar
    Rickey October 4, 2009 at 1:01 am #

    Sometime in late 1960, the two slipped off alone to the island of Maui and apparently married. Obama later confessed that he never searched for the government documents on the marriage, although Madelyn insisted they were legally married.

    Looking at it in context, my conclusion is that Obama’s comment about a “real marriage” means a marriage with the traditional trappings of photographs, giving away of the bride, reception, etc. As for Obama not searching for government documents, I’ve never seen the marriage license of my parents. I believed them when they said that they were married.

    Of course, the marital status of his parents is irrelevant regarding the issue of Obama’s eligibility to be president.

  75. avatar
    SvenMagnussen October 4, 2009 at 9:14 am #

    Statistics.

    Hawai`i, 1961, 4 white babies born alive outside of a hospital and without a midwife attendant
    Hawai`i, 1961, 38 nonwhite babies born alive outside of a hospital without and without a midwife attendant

    Hawai`i, 1961, urban, 2 white babies born alive outside of a hospital and without a midwife attendant
    Hawai`i, 1961, urban, 10 nonwhite babies born alive outside of a hospital and without a midwife attendant

    Hawai`i, 1961, metropolitan counties, urban, 2 white babies born alive outside of a hospital and without a midwife attendant
    Hawai`i, 1961, metropolitan counties, urban, 8 nonwhite babies born alive outside of a hospital and without a midwife attendant

  76. avatar
    Bob October 4, 2009 at 12:33 pm #

    Out of how many total births?

  77. avatar
    SvenMagnussen October 4, 2009 at 12:37 pm #

    You have to vote “like” on my message before I can answer.

  78. avatar
    misha October 4, 2009 at 1:30 pm #

    Sven, how many births had a midhusband attendant? You should add that to those with a midwife attendant, to get an accurate picture.

    Give me the figures for midhusband attended births, and then we can discuss Obama’s scenario.

  79. avatar
    Bob October 4, 2009 at 1:59 pm #

    Since Sven can’t help be cute, I’ll estimate there were 17,495[*] births.

    Assuming there’s no overlap in Sven’s data sets, that would be a total of 64 babies. And assuming an even distibution of unwitnessed births, that would leave you with a 0.4% chance that one of those babies was Obama.

    Or a 99.6% chance that it was not Obama.

    [*]: 10641*365/222

  80. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy October 4, 2009 at 2:29 pm #

    Actually official statistics from Hawaii in 1961 show no midwife assisted births. This may be an artifact of data collection.

  81. avatar
    SvenMagnussen October 4, 2009 at 9:41 pm #

    If there is a 99.6% chance of Obama not being born in Honolulu, HI, then he must have been born in Mombassa, Kenya.

  82. avatar
    misha October 4, 2009 at 10:49 pm #

    I think you are correct. Here is the birth certificate.

  83. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy October 4, 2009 at 11:13 pm #

    SvenMagnussen: If there is a 99.6% chance of Obama not being born in Honolulu, HI, then he must have been born in Mombassa, Kenya.

    No, what Bob said is that there is a .4% chance (and actually it isn’t but that’s another story) that Obama’s birth was unattended, opening up a small possibility of fraud. If Obama were not born in Hawaii then he could have been born anywhere, and Kenya is a very unlikely alternative for logistical reasons among others discussed elsewhere on this web site.

  84. avatar
    nbc October 5, 2009 at 12:36 am #

    It seems you are working from a false premise.

  85. avatar
    SFJeff October 6, 2009 at 4:14 pm #

    I had a somewhat random thought.

    Assume for a moment that a citizen had a legitimate concern that President Obama was not born in the United States, and therefore was not eligible. I am willing to concede that someone could at some point have that concern, and that this was their real concern and had nothing to do with despising President Obama or his policies.

    Why then, would this same person- if their concern was whether President Obama was born in the United States, then also pursue whether he was not legitimate because:
    a) he was adopted in Indonesia
    b) because not both of his parents were citizens

    And also ask for a laundry list of documents that have nothing to do with eligibility?

    A thinking person might come to the conclusion that such persons had a prior agenda of de-legitimizing the President rather than just questioning where he was born.

  86. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy October 7, 2009 at 12:00 am #

    I have come to view birtherism as a massive attempt to shift the burden of proof, and it is an attempt that some of us have bought into.

    If the birther says: “Sarah Obama says she witnessed her grandson’s birth in Kenya”, this is a claim of evidence that can be refuted or debunked.

    However, if the birther makes the equally false statement “the State of Hawaii issues COLB’s to foreign born persons that says they were born in Hawaii whether they were or not”, then that is not a claim of evidence, and need not be refuted because whether true or not, it doesn’t lead anyone to conclude that the particular individual, Barack Obama, has such a putative misleading certification.

    Possibility is not evidence. It is not our necessity to prove impossible each possibility, but only to refute actual claims of evidence, like fake birth certificates from Kenya. Trying to refute possibility leads one into a never ending battle against increasingly remote possibilities.

    And all alleged evidence that Barack Obama was born outside Hawaii has long been refuted.

  87. avatar
    TRUTH October 29, 2009 at 11:15 am #

    The Democrats’ all-new “opt out” idea for health care reform is the latest fig leaf for a total government takeover of the health care system.

    Democrats tell us they’ve been trying to nationalize health care for 65 years, but the first anyone heard of the “opt out” provision was about a week ago. They keep changing the language so people can’t figure out what’s going on.

    The most important fact about the “opt out” scheme allegedly allowing states to decline government health insurance is that a state can’t “opt out” of paying for it. All 50 states will pay for it. A state legislature can only opt out of allowing its own citizens to receive the benefits of a federal program they’re paying for.

    It’s like a movie theater offering a “money back guarantee” and then explaining, you don’t get your money back, but you don’t have to stay and watch the movie if you don’t like it. That’s not what most people are thinking when they hear the words “opt out.” The term more likely to come to mind is “scam.”

    (quoted from Human Events)

  88. avatar
    SFJeff October 29, 2009 at 11:39 am #

    Hah- once again Truth smears his own name.

    “Democrats tell us they’ve been trying to nationalize health care for 65 years”

    is about as true as me saying that

    “Republicans tell us they have been trying to sell off the National Parks for 65 years”

    Anyone can say anything, but it is really asinine to call yourself Truth and then lie.

  89. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy October 29, 2009 at 11:48 am #

    Of course the idiots in my state, who historically “opted out of the entire country,” will be the first in line to opt out of this.

  90. avatar
    TRUTH October 29, 2009 at 11:49 am #

    Once again SFJeff pulls off the amazing feat of shoving his head up his rear and speaking crap. Your truly amazing SFJ. I’m not a Liar a$$wipe, I give my opinions, quote reputable sources and on the rare occasion respond to idiots such as you, but I’m not a liar. So if your so wonderful and honest, lets hear some of your honest facts in stead of whining.

  91. avatar
    SFJeff October 29, 2009 at 12:05 pm #

    Okay Truth- prove me wrong- show me the quote that Democrats made saying they have been trying to nationalize healthcare for 65 years?

    Show me where the intention is to take over the ‘entire’ healthcare system? Please show me anything of substance if you can.

  92. avatar
    TRUTH October 29, 2009 at 12:23 pm #

    SFJ Einstein, I posted a QUOTE from a Website, which I annotated as such. Although I Agree with it, it is a “QUOTE”, not my words. If you don’t like it so be it, I don’t care two squats about your ignorant opinion and have to prove nothing to you. How about you disprove it if you wanna play that game. Last I looked your not my boss, spouse or maker, so do it your damn self.

  93. avatar
    TRUTH November 19, 2009 at 12:55 pm #

    Another thought, that makes two in one day, I’m getting a headache.

    It would be interesting to see a poll of people to see
    ….What people that were
    1-100% behind Obama 1yr ago are now 100% against him
    2- 100% behind him now at question their choice
    3- 100% Against him now like some of what he’s done
    4- 100% Against him now 100% for him

    I’ve heard of the 1’s and 2’s, but no 3’s or 4’s. Just curious if there are people like that out there. It would be a Wee bit biased to do in here being this room leans a bit Port. Ok, I’m outta thoughts, back to the grind.

  94. avatar
    SFJeff November 19, 2009 at 1:28 pm #

    “1-100% behind Obama 1yr ago are now 100% against him
    2- 100% behind him now at question their choice
    3- 100% Against him now like some of what he’s done
    4- 100% Against him now 100% for him”

    I actually haven’t spoken to anyone who admits to any of #1-4.

    I think that almost any thinking voter should dislike at least something President Obama has done or not done- just like any thinking person would find something to have disliked at the end of President Bush’s or any previous President’s first year.

    Personally, I don’t care for how President Obama has made his ambassador appointments and I think coming out against Fox News was a stupid move. Economy I am still holding my breath on, but I figure no matter who was President right now, and no matter what policy path they took there would be plenty of Recession to go around. Foreign Policy I am pretty happy about at the moment.

    I wish President Obama would push the Health care legislation more forcefully.

  95. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy November 19, 2009 at 3:54 pm #

    SFJeff: I wish President Obama would push the Health care legislation more forcefully.

    Me too.

  96. avatar
    TRUTH November 19, 2009 at 9:40 pm #

    Improving Health Care would be a GREAT Thing. Being honest what is in the Bill would be even better. WHY’s Reed take it behind closed doors for days and days, POP Out! and expect it the same day to be passed? 2074 pages give or take a few. Ya think he doesn’t want anyone reading it maybe? It may have lots of Good Stuff in it. But I’d put a paycheck for every 1 thing good it has 2 bad. Why Else won’t they even consider other options being made? Because other health care bills don’t have pork slipped in between the good that line the pockets of supporters. Reed, Pelosi and Obama are all excellent Crooks.

  97. avatar
    TRUTH February 14, 2010 at 9:22 am #

    http://patriotupdate.com/stories/read/2746/Rockefeller-on-Obama-Prez-isnt-believable

    Good Reading on Democrat Senator Rockefeller’s latest statement.

  98. avatar
    SvenMagnussen February 14, 2010 at 10:21 am #

    The Twenty-fifth Amendment (Amendment XXV) to the United States Constitution deals with succession to the Presidency and establishes procedures both for filling a vacancy in the office of the Vice President, as well as responding to Presidential disabilities.

    Section 3. Whenever the President transmits to the President pro tempore of the Senate and the Speaker of the House of Representatives his written declaration that he is unable to discharge the powers and duties of his office, and until he transmits to them a written declaration to the contrary, such powers and duties shall be discharged by the Vice President as Acting President.

  99. avatar
    DanDraper February 14, 2010 at 1:23 pm #

    SvenMagnussen: The Twenty-fifth Amendment (Amendment XXV) to the United States Constitution deals with succession to the Presidency and establishes procedures both for filling a vacancy in the office of the Vice President, as well as responding to Presidential disabilities.Section 3. Whenever the President transmits to the President pro tempore of the Senate and the Speaker of the House of Representatives his written declaration that he is unable to discharge the powers and duties of his office, and until he transmits to them a written declaration to the contrary, such powers and duties shall be discharged by the Vice President as Acting President.

    42 USC Sec. 408 01/19/04

    TITLE 42 – THE PUBLIC HEALTH AND WELFARE
    CHAPTER 7 – SOCIAL SECURITY
    SUBCHAPTER II – FEDERAL OLD-AGE, SURVIVORS, AND DISABILITY INSURANCE
    BENEFITS

    Sec. 408. Penalties

    (a) In general
    Whoever –

    (snip)

    7) for the purpose of causing an increase in any payment
    authorized under this subchapter (or any other program financed
    in whole or in part from Federal funds), or for the purpose of
    causing a payment under this subchapter (or any such other
    program) to be made when no payment is authorized thereunder, or
    for the purpose of obtaining (for himself or any other person)
    any payment or any other benefit to which he (or such other
    person) is not entitled, or for the purpose of obtaining anything
    of value from any person, or for any other purpose –
    (A) willfully, knowingly, and with intent to deceive, uses a
    social security account number, assigned by the Commissioner of
    Social Security (in the exercise of the Commissioner’s
    authority under section 405(c)(2) of this title to establish
    and maintain records) on the basis of false information
    furnished to the Commissioner of Social Security by him or by
    any other person; or
    (B) with intent to deceive, falsely represents a number to be
    the social security account number assigned by the Commissioner
    of Social Security to him or to another person, when in fact
    such number is not the social security account number assigned
    by the Commissioner of Social Security to him or to such other
    person;

    (snip)

    shall be guilty of a felony and upon conviction thereof shall be
    fined under title 18 or imprisoned for not more than five years, or
    both.

  100. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy February 14, 2010 at 2:12 pm #

    Hi Sven. Got a new sock puppet?

  101. avatar
    G February 14, 2010 at 2:37 pm #

    Wow. So you copy to the WND warped version of the story instead of one of a regular credible source on this.

    First of all, the real story is several days old already. Second, while you are getting yourself overfluffed on a salacious byline, if you would actually go find a real report on the story, you will see that other than the soundbyte, it comes down to nothing more than grumbling that policy hasn’t changed yet to improve the coal industry in WV.

    Gee… Government moving slower than anticipated and a president’s pledge to pursue clean coal technology and help the coal industry hasn’t materialized yet.

    No surprise there or anything unexpected, except an excuse to overhype and make mountains out of molehills by partisan hacks, salacious headline gossip freaks and of course birthers that need a fantasy to masturbate to on Valentine’s Day.

    I love how WND’s so-called “reporting” on the story spends most of its time quoting people’s comments on another online post of the story and talking about Joe Wilson’s outburst from last year and other completely unrelated events, just to stoke the fear/smear/anger that is their bread and butter.

  102. avatar
    G February 14, 2010 at 2:42 pm #

    So, what. I remain unimpressed.

    Let me guess, now your latest wild goose chase tactic is to fluff Orly’s whole crazy multiple credit card number schtick?

    Seriously? I mean that is one of the stupidest of all of her claims and is probably one of the biggest clue’s that she is mentally ill.

    Yeah, good luck with that one. Get used to disappointment. There is nothing happening at this time that would lead any rational person to expect to see the 25th amendment get invoked.