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MDL consolidation of “Obama eligibility” cases

It was a slow news day, OK?

I was tipped off to a web site and an organization that I wasn’t familiar with today. It is the United Civil Rights Councils of America. The primary raison d’être for the organization seems to be something with parental visitation rights, but they host a huge page on the Obama eligibility question. (The anti-Obama page is different in format from the rest of the site, which raises questions as to whether it is supposed to be there). Some of the assertions on the page include:

  1. If Obama is removed from office, there will have to be new elections in 2010.
  2. The Attorney General is not allowed to defend Obama on any issue relating to citizenship or eligibility.
  3. The Presidential Records (US Code Title 44, Chapter 22) makes all of Obama’s documents public records (including that pesky long form).
  4. There are “several available, concrete-solid standing postures of virtually any U.S. Citizen, eligible Voter, Taxpayer, Landowner, or the like.”

However, the title bit for this article is this:

Since, even after allowing an entire year now since the fraudulent 2008 General Election, it STILL seems that nobody is able to get actually serious enough to throw a flagrantly-obvious impostor/usurper out of office, in using the court system and the laws already in force, it seems there’s no choice but to soon enter into each of your own respective cases, immediately move to consolidate them all together under MDL (federal Multi-District Litigation), and maybe also bump it up into a huge mass-action or class-action suit, allowing for each and every U.S. Citizen, Taxpayer, Voter and Landowner to be able to self-join/self-intervene by geography (i.e., by jurisdiction), using simple checkbox “legal standing” forms made available online, and then self-filed per each of their own respective Divisional courthouses. And, I just happen to have a nationwide network of 3200+ online groups (for every single State, County, Parish, Borough and Independent City across the whole country) to actually do it, if really needed… That is, unless I can finally see some serious progress made *by the others leading* in these various “NObama” impostor/usurper cases still active in any court, and that good progress implemented in the most urgently quick and direct fashion, by using any or all of the legal info/ammo provided below. [coloration removed]

63 Responses to MDL consolidation of “Obama eligibility” cases

  1. avatar
    Greg November 4, 2009 at 10:38 pm #

    Oh, that’s hilarious!

    Although, it could be beneficial. Bring all the nutters together into a class action, only then deny the entire group standing, then that decision is binding on all members of the class unless they specifically opted out!

    Unfortunately, the defendants would probably oppose class certification on the grounds that the court lacks jurisdiction and the claimants lack standing.

    The only question that birthers need to answer is how they want to lose. Do you want to lose in state court or Federal Court? Do you want to lose on a Quo Warranto or a claim of fraud? Do you want to lose on a motion to dismiss or failure to prosecute? Do you want to lose on standing or deference to military decisions?

  2. avatar
    aarrgghh November 4, 2009 at 10:40 pm #

    with the major cases now banished to appellate purgatory, birfistan seems to be falling into a forced hibernation. for example, there hasn’t been a new birther thread on free republic in three days, since nov. 1.

  3. avatar
    Texlaw November 5, 2009 at 12:17 am #

    Wait till this branch of wingnuttia finds out they have to pay filing fees. End of plan.

  4. avatar
    nBc November 5, 2009 at 1:23 am #

    Check out the history of one of the founders of this organization, Mr. Torm Howse.

    Misconceptions, Perceptions, and Ethics My look at the Family Rights Movement leadership, and the PAAO by: Theresa M. Martin

    Grieving Parents Lose Thousands to Local Con Artist

    Howse, who has spent time in prison for intimidation and battery, been convicted of child abuse and allegedly has two warrants out for his arrest, offers his services writing legal papers. His own emails quote the rate of $40 an hour. He has told some parents that $400 would get his services for life. Yet he was able to get $1,000 from one parent and $3,000 from another. Howse usually has the money sent through the website’s PayPal donation account.

    Don’t forget to watch William Wagners’ Youtube videos

    ENTRY DISCUSSING MOTION TO VACATE AND FOR FINDINGS OF FACT

    TORM L. HOWSE, APPELLANT-RESPONDENT,
    v. KELLY J. BRAMBLE (FORMERLY HENSLEY), APPELLEE-PETITIONER.

  5. avatar
    misha November 5, 2009 at 2:06 am #

    Birds of a feather. Orly, the rest of the Three Stooges, and this completes (for now) the crew.

    What a country.

  6. avatar
    wendy November 5, 2009 at 2:18 am #

    say what??
    § 2204. Restrictions on access to Presidential records
    How Current is This?
    (a) Prior to the conclusion of his term of office or last consecutive term of office, as the case may be, the President shall specify durations, not to exceed 12 years, for which access shall be restricted with respect to information, in a Presidential record, within one or more of the following categories:
    (1)
    (A) specifically authorized under criteria established by an Executive order to be kept secret in the interest of national defense or foreign policy and
    (B) in fact properly classified pursuant to such Executive order;
    (2) relating to appointments to Federal office;
    (3) specifically exempted from disclosure by statute (other than sections 552 and 552b of title 5, United States Code), provided that such statute
    (A) requires that the material be withheld from the public in such a manner as to leave no discretion on the issue, or
    (B) establishes particular criteria for withholding or refers to particular types of material to be withheld;
    (4) trade secrets and commercial or financial information obtained from a person and privileged or confidential;
    (5) confidential communications requesting or submitting advice, between the President and his advisers, or between such advisers; or
    (6) personnel and medical files and similar files the disclosure of which would constitute a clearly unwarranted invasion of personal privacy.

    personally, I would take a 2nd look at item 6 of this list.
    Of course, the alternate is to (once again) hand them a simple copy of the short form, along with the explanation of it being absolutely valid and legal.
    Or do we just watch them squirm?

  7. avatar
    Lupin November 5, 2009 at 2:36 am #

    In an earlier thread I mentioned French lawyer Bernard Mery who had gone on a crusade against what he perceived to be a freemason conspiracy and had been disbarred in 2003 as a result (after a 4-year investigation).

    Curiosity compelled me to check on what had happened since, and I found that after suing the Paris Bar association, Mery was reinstated in 2005.

    Since then he and the Paris Bar Association have been suing each other for damages.

    I will humbly extend my apologies to all here for having presumed that we French were better at controlling our lunatic fringe. Obviously we’re not.

    Back to our regular programming.

  8. avatar
    Jules November 5, 2009 at 8:09 am #

    Um, how is Obama’s long-from birth certificate a presidential record? 44 U.S.C. § 2201(2) defines “presidential record”, and I am reasonably confident that Obama’s original birth certificate or any certified copy thereof was created or received other than in Obama’s capacity as President. The original document was created in 1961 and sits somewhere in Hawaii’s archives. All certified copies issued to Obama would have been issued some years before Obama became President, as this would have been prior to Hawaii switching to issuing only short-form certifications of birth.

    I take it that the standing argument is just for laughs, as it’s contradicted by quite a vast body of case law.

  9. avatar
    elmo November 5, 2009 at 9:09 am #

    Hmm. Maybe if he’s able to scam some money from people wanting to join a class action lawsuit against “The Usurper” he’ll be able to pay some of his back child support. Think so? Naw, me, neither.

  10. avatar
    misha November 5, 2009 at 10:00 am #

    I vote let the reptiles squirm. Even if the original BC was released, Orly et al would just scream Hawaii was in the conspiracy.

    Here are some authentic Kenya birth certificates, with a seal!

    http://newyorkleftist.blogspot.com/2009/09/another-kenyan-birth-certificate.html

    http://newyorkleftist.blogspot.com/2009/08/my-cats-kenyan-birth-certificate.html

    http://newyorkleftist.blogspot.com/2009/08/my-authentic-kenyan-birth-certificate.html

  11. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy November 5, 2009 at 10:09 am #

    Jules, of course, you are right. This is the same mistake in the definition of “presidential records” that the birthers use in claiming that an Obama presidential order sealed the same records.

    Jules: I take it that the standing argument is just for laughs

    The entire article was just for laughs.

  12. avatar
    kimba November 5, 2009 at 10:24 am #

    Well, all of the above, of course. They want to attempt them all.

  13. avatar
    aarrgghh November 5, 2009 at 11:36 am #

    there yet may be some feeble signs of life in birfistan after all …

    but he’s gonna hafta work a little harder though — running for a batshirt’s not quite as easy as running for governor.

  14. avatar
    Whatever4 November 5, 2009 at 11:36 am #

    A little knowledge is a dangerous thing. I normally try to follow the arguments. But on this page, I keep getting lost in the weeds. He starts by making a wrong assumption (president=employee, presidential record=any record belonging to a president, including pre-presidential personal records), then runs with it in random directions. It’s hard to even know where to begin.

    It does sound like the rest of his site even though it doesn’t look like it.

  15. avatar
    euphgeek November 5, 2009 at 11:37 am #

    Actually, there has been one nirther thread posted on November 3rd. But they do seem to be getting depressed. The ones who have been chasing this issue down the rabbit hole for the past year and a half just don’t have the fire in their eyes they did only a couple of months ago. Judge Carter’s decision seems to have put them in a deep funk and they’re now reduced to muttering about “taking to the streets” and the “inevitable” armed revolution.

  16. avatar
    JoZeppy November 5, 2009 at 12:02 pm #

    wow….of the more delusional websites I’ve seen in a while. This guy makes Orly seem like the next Louis Brandeis.

    I’m just curious…how does one come to the conclusion that John McCain is the temporary president, and Nader the temporary vice president. Last time I read the constitution, the 20th Amendment says if a President elect fails to qualify, the vice president elect acts as president. I don’t see anything in the Constitution that says the guy who loses the election gets to be president, and a guy who really got his butt whipped gets to be VP. And where exactly does the constitution provide for temporary presidents, and new elections? If anything, the House chooses the president, if the president and vice president fail to qualify. But what stands in the way of the legally elected vice president from assuming office? But then again, this is the same person that things a birth certificate is a presidential record. It’s really sad the lenghts some people go in order to rationalize their desire to overturn an election that they lost. Why can’t they just admit to themselves they don’t really care for the idea of democracy, and move to a dictatorship that shares their personal values.

    And if you want to see where this guys breed of crazy comes from, check out his “new Joint Constitution.” Ron Paul secretary of the Treasury? Sara Palin Attorney General? Don’t you think it might be a good idea to have the chief law enforcement office of the United States perhaps have a J.D., and not someone who just barely got their BA in journalism? I suppose at least he didn’t suggest Orly for AG. And is there a reason why their religious matter?

  17. avatar
    Benji Franklin November 5, 2009 at 12:47 pm #

    Dear Joe,

    It’s difficult for a sane person to empathize with some of these nutbags. We tend to keep thinking that the obvious ways in which they still are mentally balanced indicates an innate ability to get back to reality on this topic too at any moment – not so! Except for the haters and racist sites, visiting Birther sites is just a frightening window opening to let us see the reach of mental illness.

    Benji Franklin

  18. avatar
    wendy November 5, 2009 at 12:55 pm #

    gotta give the guy credit for clearly illustrating one thing…

    you can spend hours and hours, looking up law references, spouting many millions of words..and never mean a damn thing, legally. But it all LOOKS real impressive, doesn’t it? And because it is online, it MUST BE REAL, right?
    Just one more version of many well written scripts. None of which change the reality.

  19. avatar
    AdrianInFlorida November 5, 2009 at 1:39 pm #

    Just, uh, crap, I want that 10 minutes back. 🙂

  20. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy November 5, 2009 at 2:05 pm #

    I had the unusual experience of filling out an I-9 (employment eligibility form) this morning, and I had to verify an employees identification and qualifications to work in the United States, which included a birth certificate. It had a raised seal; it was dated (date FILED) within one year of the date of birth; and it had all those other attributes that the State Department looks for. Was it a long form or a short form? Made no difference. Did it have the name of the hospital and the doctor? I didn’t look.

  21. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy November 5, 2009 at 2:19 pm #

    Sorry, we have no no-refund policy.

  22. avatar
    milspec November 5, 2009 at 2:44 pm #

    Me too, waht a load of whooie

  23. avatar
    Det. Cliff Hanger November 5, 2009 at 3:01 pm #

    Press Secretary Robert Gibbs said he had a copy of Obama’s birth certificate, not his Certification of Live Birth, but his birth certificate.

    Any record brought from the personal residence of the Obama’s to the White House and announced by the Press Secretary is a Presidential Record subject to inspection.

    Let’s see it. What’s he got to hide?

  24. avatar
    Jez November 5, 2009 at 3:02 pm #

    I think they are going by the “original” Constitution. I’ve seen that phrasing used a few time.
    Prior to the 12th (?) Amendment, the Pres / VP were the 1st and 2nd place on the overall ballot. No separate run for VP, he was just the guy that came in second.
    So, in this twisted take on reality, McCain came in 2nd and Nader 3rd in the number of votes. Since Obama isn’t qualified, again in their own little world, that means that McCain actually won, with Nader his VP.
    Yes. It scares me too that I understand it.
    But I’ve seen that “Original Constitution” (sometime coupled with “and the Bill of Rights”) before. Basically, there are people that want to repeal the last 17 amendments.

  25. avatar
    Black Lion November 5, 2009 at 3:25 pm #

    And most people call their COLB a birth certificate. You would need more than that. Secondly where in the world did you get the requirement that “any record brought from the personal residence of the Obama’s to the White House and announced by the Press Secretary is a Presidential Record subject to inspection?” Can you show us the relevant law that states that?

  26. avatar
    Black Lion November 5, 2009 at 3:44 pm #

    That guy is a wingnut….That was one of the most incoherent screeds I have ever seen….It reminds me of Orly….

    This I found especially interesting…

    “Obama’s “Presidential records” are expressly PUBLIC by mandate of simple written law (and, combined with using AG Holder & U.S. Attorneys, i.e., our *taxdollars*, in an expressly-unconstitutional manner, defending Obama in any citizenship issues, then Obama gets to pay back every single red cent of that $1.7+ million spent so far… plus interest and penalties, naturally… plus, getting deported, or imprisoned, or whatever else…).”

    I guess he has already been found guilty…You can see how they have take the wingnut 1.7 mllion dollar amount and run with it…My other question is how do you deport an American citizen? Funny stuff….

  27. avatar
    Miss M November 5, 2009 at 3:48 pm #

    In repsonse to the above comment

    Huh? Did you just get dropped off onto this planet? Come back after you do some qualified research. That arguement is OLD news, bud. Your monniker is a misnomer.

  28. avatar
    wendy November 5, 2009 at 4:35 pm #

    You are new here, I think.
    You might be able to run that past a few 4th graders and have them believe it. The intelligence level over here is just a tad higher.
    1- colb is simply an alternate name for a legal document that validates facts relating to the birth of a person. colb and birth certificates have NO LEGAL DIFFERENCE.

    2. If you still want to see Obama’s birth certificate/ colb, it has been online for over a year, and validated by the State of Hawaii. It contains ALL ELEMENTS relating to if Obama is/ is not a natural born citizen, since it confirms he was born in Honolulu, Hawaii.
    To put it another way.. if you don’t know a real record when you see it, that is your problem.

  29. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy November 5, 2009 at 5:16 pm #

    wendy: You [Det. Cliff Hanger] are new here, I think.

    Nah, it just Sven Magnussen with one of his many sock puppets.

  30. avatar
    Det. Cliff Hanger November 5, 2009 at 6:23 pm #

    Breaking News: Congress to demand the Usurper produce his birth certificate.

  31. avatar
    nbc November 5, 2009 at 6:47 pm #

    Haha. Time to send out the COLB again 🙂

  32. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy November 5, 2009 at 7:29 pm #

    HEY! Misleading headlines are MY job.

  33. avatar
    richCares November 5, 2009 at 7:53 pm #

    Though asked many times, Nathan Deal has refused to show his birth certificate, what is he hiding. How can he or his followers be trusted. The rumor is he was born in Chile.

  34. avatar
    misha November 5, 2009 at 8:57 pm #

    And what is Glenn Beck hiding? Where was he in 1990, when that girl was raped and murdered?

  35. avatar
    ImaForener November 5, 2009 at 10:40 pm #

    Meanwhile over at the blog of the first Batshirt winner, the Obama-is-King-of_Hawaii theory is now morphing into the Obama-is-a-FreeMason theory. No really it is.

    As for the melding of parental visitation rights and presidential eligibility, I have noticed that there are a couple of regulars on other sites who combine birtherism with screeds on the evils of the judiciary…cause they lost a custody battle.

    I tells ya, it’s bad enough that the vimmin and ze blacks iz keepin’ the white man down, but once the FreeMasons get in on the action there is totally no hope for Whitey.

  36. avatar
    aarrgghh November 5, 2009 at 11:49 pm #

    birfers tend to be very good at rehabbing personal hardships, real and imaginary, into constitutional crises of biblical proportions.

  37. avatar
    G November 6, 2009 at 12:34 am #

    ooooh…another wacky GOP congressman goes all birther and announces he’s written a letter demanding to see the President’s documents…and better yet, we are given the link to the story from the “OMG any day now” guy…

    LOL! Well, thanks for giving me my chuckle of the day, but if you and “OMG” guy are really pining away and spending every waking moments clicking your heels together like Dorothy in the Wizard of Oz thinking this is your latest “great white hope” or that anything is going to happen from this (other than making us all laugh)…well… gee…. how’s that working out for ya so far?

  38. avatar
    Lupin November 6, 2009 at 2:13 am #

    Just as I mentioned that crazy French attorney on a crusade against the Masons, who got disbarred then reinstated.

    Weird.

  39. avatar
    Mike November 6, 2009 at 7:08 am #

    A COLB is a birth certificate. A birth certificate is a document issued by the state attesting to a person’s birth date and location.

    The reason people think only the “long form” is a birth certificate is because of laziness on the part of the States, which often historically simply photocopied/photostatted hospitals’ vital records and issued those as birth certificates. What makes them birth certificates is the issuing authority, not the format.

  40. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy November 6, 2009 at 7:54 am #

    I wouldn’t call the use of technology to increase productivity and reduce the time necessary to provide a public service “laziness”.

  41. avatar
    Black Lion November 6, 2009 at 10:55 am #

    Over at tROSL, the so called letter that Rep. Nathan Deal is going to write has become the new OMG! moment for the birthers.
    From the article…

    “Rep. Nathan Deal (R-GA), a candidate in the GOP primary for Governor of Georgia, has announced that he is signing a letter to the White House with several of his colleagues –asking for a copy of President Obama’s birth certificate. “Nathan Deal – I am joining several of my colleagues in the House in writing a letter to the President asking that he release a copy of his birth certificate so we can have an answer to this question.””

    http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2009/11/gop-rep-deal-candidate-for-georgia-governor-asking-for-obamas-birth-certificate.php

    You have to ask yourself why Deal needs a letter. Couldn’t he just call the President, mosey on over to the White House, and ask to see it himself? It looks more like our friend is pandering to the wingnut base for votes, especially in GA. These guys will whore themselves to that disturbed part of the base to win. The birthers are so dumb that they never ask themselves the question, if Deal was so concerned why didn’t he object when Congress was certifying the Electoral College vote. Interesting.

  42. avatar
    ballantine November 6, 2009 at 11:21 am #

    I admire your patience to argue with the idiots over there. I used to do it a bit, but it’s like talking to a wall. It kind of amazes me that people actually think the long form is going to reveal anything. Do they ever stand back and think about how implausible their theories are. Do they really think the Hawaiian officials are lying or that his grandmother procured it by fraud or whatever the latest theory is.

  43. avatar
    Mike November 6, 2009 at 12:26 pm #

    Meh. I think it’s somewhat lazy to not have an official birth certificate which is, you know, an actual birth certificate, rather than a notarised photocopy, especially when said document may be in use in several official contexts, but I take your point.

  44. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy November 6, 2009 at 1:06 pm #

    All legal birth certificates in private hands are copies.

  45. avatar
    Black Lion November 6, 2009 at 1:07 pm #

    I try….It is really tough because most of them have already made up their minds and repeat the same discredited birhter talking points. I mean they even have a guy that is pushing the “Obama is the anti-Christ” theory…These people hate the President so much that they would prefer to believe in the wild conspiracy theories rather than what makes sense…

  46. avatar
    G November 6, 2009 at 2:39 pm #

    Unfortunately, I have a sinking feeling that the “Obama is the anti-Christ” will be their fallback meme that gains steam over the next three years.

    For one thing, there are a lot of closet Armageddonists out there, particularly amongst the evangelical crowd, who spend way more time than is healthy wishing and praying to bring about their “rapture” fantasies and who increasingly are pinning their hopes on 2012 becoming their year of prophecy fulfilled.

    As we approach that year and date, their anxiety and expectations for such will likely get more zealous and louder.

    That 2012 happens to also be a presidential reelection year will not be lost on these folks, particularly as the mounting failures all their other birther efforts (frivolous lawsuits and crazy claims, fantasy Grand Juries, etc) endlessly pile up with no success on their side.

    Therefore, a zealous, hateful and fearful “anti-christ” claim will be all that they have left to cling to to justify their prejudices and mystically explain away their failures in their own minds.

    Unfortunately, I think this zealous hate-filled lather will make them increasingly dangerous and prone to acting out in “righteous vengeance”.

  47. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy November 6, 2009 at 3:20 pm #

    G: there are a lot of closet Armageddonists out there… who increasingly are pinning their hopes on 2012 becoming their year of prophecy fulfilled.

    I would suggest Eugen Weber’s book Apocalypses: Prophesies, Cults and Millennial Beliefs through the Ages. Weber describes serious expectations for the end of the world dating back at least to the 6th century. Martin Luther was convinced that the end would come during his lifetime, and we need to back no farther than 2000 for a hotbed of millennial agitation. But perhaps the best example is the event that failed to happen in the 19th century, the Great Disappointment.

    For a lighter evangelical treatment see: Bruce & Stan’s Guide to the End of the World: A User-friendly Approach by Bruce Bickel and Stan Jantz.

    I don’t see that these kooks are any different from the millions that came before them.

  48. avatar
    Det. Cliff Hanger November 6, 2009 at 4:40 pm #

    Title 44, Chap 22, § 2203(b) Management and custody of Presidential records

    Documentary materials produced or received by the President, his staff, or units or individuals in the Executive Office of the President the function of which is to advise and assist the President, shall, to the extent practicable, be categorized as Presidential records or personal records upon their creation or receipt and be filed separately.

    America wants to see the Usurper’s birth certificate. His Press Secretary says they have it at the White House. Let’s see it. What’s he got to hide?

  49. avatar
    wendy November 6, 2009 at 5:21 pm #

    Do you just like playing word games??

    Birth certificates are personal records, they are NOT CREATED by a President in the function of his job.
    Putting this in the bluntest terms possible… no one gives a flying leap what birthers want. SOMEONE needs to explain the difference between what you WANT, and what you have legal rights to have.
    Just to clue you in..
    there is no usurper, for you to see a birth certificate of.
    Thousands of people being stupid does not qualify as a “Constitutional crisis”. It qualifies as mass ignorance.

  50. avatar
    wendy November 6, 2009 at 5:33 pm #

    it might help, if Deal hopes to become Gov of Georgia…
    can someone explain the difference between ASK and DEMAND?
    And, Obama can simply give them a copy of the same COLB posted online. Governors should be able to grasp what is/ isn’t a valid record.
    One would think…

  51. avatar
    SFJeff November 6, 2009 at 7:45 pm #

    “America wants to see the Usurper’s birth certificate.”

    ‘America’ would go “Who is the Ursurper? Who the hell are you talking about?”

    Or is the ‘America’ you refer to you and your knitting circle?

  52. avatar
    Det. Cliff Hanger November 6, 2009 at 10:59 pm #

    Congressman Deal and other Congressman may have a Constitutional opinion an NBC is born in the USA with two citizen parents. If so, a written request for documents is the beginning of a Congressional Inquiry.

    If the Usurper refuses to provide a certified copy of his BC, then Rep. Deal and others may call for a formal investigation through a committee with subpoena power and go from there.

    Here’s some interesting news announced today:

    WASHINGTON — Jeffrey Culver, a special agent of the U.S. Department of State’s Bureau of Diplomatic Security, has been selected as director of the Diplomatic Security Service and principal deputy assistant secretary of state for diplomatic security.

    During his 22 years with the Bureau, Culver served 13 years overseas as Regional Security Officer at U.S. embassies in Israel, India, Kenya, the United Arab Emirates, and Tanzania.

  53. avatar
    aarrgghh November 6, 2009 at 11:57 pm #

    sven fantasizes:

    if the usurper refuses to provide a certified copy of his BC, then rep. deal and others may call for a formal investigation through a committee with subpoena power and go from there.

    rep deal et al are free to call for a cab or a cup of coffee if they like. members of the minority party don’t have the power to direct investigations or issue subpoenas. maybe if they ask nicely, waxman will let them use the basement on weekends to write presentments.

  54. avatar
    aarrgghh November 7, 2009 at 12:29 am #

    doc cites:

    but perhaps the best example is the event that failed to happen in the 19th century, the great disappointment.

    priceless:

    some are tauntingly enquiring, ‘have you not gone up?’ even little children in the streets are shouting continually to passersby, ‘have you a ticket to go up?’ the public prints, of the most fashionable and popular kind…are caricaturing in the most shameful manner of the ‘white robes of the saints,’ revelation 6:11, the ‘going up,’ and the great day of ‘burning.’

    the mockery of children. lol. birfers and their ilk deserve no less.

  55. avatar
    nbc November 7, 2009 at 12:58 am #

    If so, a written request for documents is the beginning of a Congressional Inquiry.

    Remind me again, how many Republicans in the Senate and the House.

    Oops.

    Of course, Obama has already presented his COLB which is certified and shows him born in Hawaii, as confirmed by Hawaiian DOH officials.

    Nuts…

  56. avatar
    wendy November 7, 2009 at 1:11 am #

    *Congressman Deal and other Congressman may have a Constitutional opinion an NBC is born in the USA with two citizen parents. If so, a written request for documents is the beginning of a Congressional Inquiry.*
    They may have that opinion. They may be prepared to get their ass laughed right down the Capitol steps, too… if they are that dumb to get their legal knowledge off WND or conspiracy sites.
    If Deal or anyone else IN CONGRESS is so ignorant of the law, why are they in elected position to make laws? The world at large can be excused for falling for stunts. Not elected officials or Judges.
    If Deal believes that Obama is illegally in office.. pick up the phone and report him to Homeland Security. They have the power to see the “vault” copy. No supoena needed. Then DHS calls Deal back, and tells him to go back to school, and learn what critical thinking is.
    If Deal is truly that gullible, God help the state of Georgia.

  57. avatar
    Det. Cliff Hanger November 7, 2009 at 7:20 am #

    More “Sven fantasizes” …

    Looking back at my original message, it looks like Gibbs opened up inspection of the BC under the Presidential Records Act by announcing the WH had a copy of the BC.

    I would hope an eligible President wouldn’t make Deal et. al. go to the DC District Court to see the BC.

    But then again, it’s game over if the original BC sees the light of day.

    Det. Cliff Hanger: Press Secretary Robert Gibbs said he had a copy of Obama’s birth certificate, not his Certification of Live Birth, but his birth certificate.

    Any record brought from the personal residence of the Obama’s to the White House and announced by the Press Secretary is a Presidential Record subject to inspection.Let’s see it. What’s he got to hide?

  58. avatar
    Det. Cliff Hanger November 7, 2009 at 9:08 am #

    The MDL site has some interesting links:

    Congressman Paul and 17 other Congressman suing Clinton

    Lawsuit filed Friday, April 30, 1999
    Paul, bipartisan team, sue Clinton over Kosovo

    Members say President has violated Constitution, War Powers Resolution

    WASHINGTON, DC — A bipartisan group of 17 Members of Congress, including US Rep. Ron Paul (R-Surfside, Texas), filed a lawsuit on Friday, April 30, 1999, in federal court against President Bill Clinton for violating both the US Constitution and the 1973 War Powers Resolution with regard to Yugoslavia.

  59. avatar
    aarrgghh November 7, 2009 at 11:32 am #

    i could be wrong, but i don’t believe that was an eligibility suit.

    and republicans were in the majority. here’s what they won:

    a federal judge dismissed the lawsuit, ruling that since congress had voted for funding after clinton had actively engaged troops in the war with kosovo, legislators had sent a confusing message about whether they approved of the war.

  60. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy November 7, 2009 at 12:39 pm #

    After some consideration, it is very likely that the “birth certificate” the White House has is one of the COLB’s ordered by the Obama Campaign from Hawaii in 2007 in anticipation of proof of eligibility that might have been required under the campaign. (We do not know how many if any of these were actually used.) This would be the same document released on the Internet in June 2008, which we all know and love. Journalists from FactCheck.org were given a look at it, and I don’t see why any member of the White House press corps couldn’t get a look too. But of course, that document (because it is already available) is not what is being asked for.

    There is no document in Hawaii that has “Birth Certificate” at the top. They either have Certificates of Live Birth, Certificates of Hawaiian Birth or Certifications of Live Birth.

    But I do not think this is a “presidential record” by the definition of the statute.

  61. avatar
    G November 7, 2009 at 2:07 pm #

    Dr. Conspiracy,

    Great links and references, thanks! I’m somewhat familiar with a lot of them, having pursued and studied/monitored similar movements as a hobby/curiosity (definitely not believing any of their hokum, of course).

    The Great Disappointment is just one of many examples of similar movements and their epic failure and yes, most importantly, it is a cycle we see repeated endlessly by folks of this inclination.

    The most important statement in that Wikipedia link is the reference to the phenomena of Cognitive Dissonance, which is exactly what is happening here with the Birther movement and such similar movements.

    This is the common thread to all this craziness and why their failures in reality will unlikely ever “sink in” for many of their “true believers”.

    No, these kooks are not much different from any that came before them. However, their movements always increase in size and fervor when they approach dates or events which, in their mind, supports their apocalyptic fantasies. And to that extent, 2012 is probably going to be one of the loudest “Great Disappointment” events of the modern era, much more so than their last big set of dates/events leading up to the millennium/Y2K.

    Rest assured, the endless stinging string of failures the Birthers, Deathers, Teabaggers, Tenthers, Fantasy Grand Juries and their ilk are suffering will be increasingly tied into “anti-christ” and “end of the world 2012” explanations by their movements in order to compensate for the cognitive dissonance that they require to explain their failures in their poor, petty little minds.

  62. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy November 7, 2009 at 3:10 pm #

    This all may just be viral marketing for the movie 2012 to be released later this month. See also the Wikipedia page on the 2012 phenomenon.

  63. avatar
    Jez November 7, 2009 at 5:04 pm #

    Hey. Be nice to knitters. We have rather sharp pointy sticks. Lots of them in various sizes.

    And most knitters I personally know find the whole birther thing ridiculous.