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Birther rumors pervade treason complaint

Walter Fitzpatrick III has a list 5 of treason complaints written against President Obama in the last 2 months over at his Jag Hunter site.

I looked at one of them sent 4 days ago to a Florida federal grand jury by Navy veteran Joseph Mayer, and found it filled with birther nonsense. The rhetoric is rather over the top, and Obama is blamed for lots of things that have gone wrong in the world. Adding things like “Obama is a Muslim” and references to his social-security number show that Mr. Mayer is suffering from a severe deficit of facts as well as a distorted perspective on current events. He’s so far detached from reality that he even believes the POSFKBC (President Obama’s second fake Kenyan birth certificate), the one with the baby footprint on it.

Peppering federal grand juries with affidavits seems to be a current birther emphasis, promoted by such web sites as The Hidden 4th Branch who say:

SIMPLY STATED: AS CONGRESSMEN GET FLOODED WITH LETTERS, SO CAN WE FLOOD THE SPECIAL FEDERAL GRAND JURIES with COMPLAINTS!

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60 Responses to Birther rumors pervade treason complaint

  1. avatar
    O'phony is a MUSLIM December 30, 2012 at 10:36 am #

    Hear O’phony, who now says he is a Christian but practices “Taqiyya” and is really a Muslim liar, phony fraud, drug head, ignorant college flunky with a 2. grade or less, and now in the White House.

    Obummer a.k.a Soebarkah, Obama, Soetero, Admits He Is A Muslim

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tCAffMSWSzY

    Btw!Using other than one’s legal name is fraud …. isn’t it ?

  2. avatar
    ASK Esq December 30, 2012 at 10:41 am #

    O'phony is a MUSLIM:
    Hear O’phony, who now says he is a Christian but practices “Taqiyya” and is really a Muslim liar, phony fraud, drug head, ignorant college flunky with a 2. grade or less, and now in the White House.

    Obummer a.k.a Soebarkah, Obama, Soetero, Admits He Is A Muslim

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tCAffMSWSzY

    Btw!Using other than one’s legal name is fraud …. isn’t it ?

    What, you’re not also telling us about his having been a time-traveler who visited Mars?

  3. avatar
    SueDB December 30, 2012 at 10:48 am #

    Don’t forget the reptilians!

  4. avatar
    Arthur December 30, 2012 at 10:49 am #

    Whether it’s the complaints sent by Fitzpatrick or Mayer, or the post of the fellow above, one of the things that’s common to birther style is hysterical exaggeration. Reminds me of the fire and brimstone rhetoric of fundamentalists–which, of course, many birthers are. Religious fanaticism and political lunacy go together like fiscal and cliff.

  5. avatar
    donna December 30, 2012 at 10:52 am #

    obama eats pork & shellfish ………….. a NO NO in the muslim faith

    obama drinks alcohol ………….. a NO NO in the muslim faith

    obama wears gold jewelry ………….. a NO NO in the muslim faith for males

    the majority of obama’s kenyan relatives are 7th day adventists

  6. avatar
    Vic December 30, 2012 at 10:57 am #

    O'phony is a MUSLIM:
    Btw!Using other than one’s legal name is fraud …. isn’t it ?

    So you’re admitting that you are a fraud, right? That couldn’t possibly be your legal name that you used, could it?

  7. avatar
    Jim December 30, 2012 at 11:15 am #

    Thanks Doc, keep up the entertaining work. Quick edit “Mr. Mayer is suffering from a severe deficit of facts as wall as” should be “as well as”.

  8. avatar
    bgansel9 December 30, 2012 at 11:25 am #

    O'phony is a MUSLIM: ignorant college flunky with a 2. grade or less

    Which is why the GOP has so totally bowled him over in fiscal cliff negotiations, right?

    I think you had better talk to the GOP congressmen who are seemingly amazed that Obama has routed them the way he has. Yeah, something every college flunky could do, right?

    You’re the one who is failing.

  9. avatar
    misha marinsky December 30, 2012 at 11:47 am #

    O'phony is a MUSLIM: Hear O’phony

    You forgot Obama is a communist, the unicorns and the kitchen sink.

  10. avatar
    misha marinsky December 30, 2012 at 11:54 am #

    O'phony is a MUSLIM: Btw!Using other than one’s legal name is fraud …. isn’t it ?

    Yes, it is. BTW, here is Obama’s Kenya birth certificate:

    http://newyorkleftist.blogspot.ca/2009/09/another-kenyan-birth-certificate.html

  11. avatar
    Northland10 December 30, 2012 at 12:18 pm #

    misha marinsky: You forgot Obama is a communist, the unicorns and the kitchen sink.

    Obama’s a kitchen sink? How long till that shows up in one of Orly’s pleadings?

  12. avatar
    Andrew Vrba, PmG December 30, 2012 at 12:23 pm #

    I heard he can summon penguins to do his bidding, and he can fly. He can also out-roundhouse kick Chuck Norris.

  13. avatar
    Bob December 30, 2012 at 12:23 pm #

    Hey Birther O’Phony,

    Why don’t you file a ballot challenge or write a letter to your congressperson or set yourself on fire or something?

  14. avatar
    Rickey December 30, 2012 at 2:08 pm #

    O'phony is a MUSLIM:

    Btw!Using other than one’s legal name is fraud …. isn’t it ?

    Where is your evidence that Barack Hussein Obama is not his legal name?

  15. avatar
    Majority Will December 30, 2012 at 2:26 pm #

    Andrew Vrba, PmG:
    I heard he can summon penguins to do his bidding, and he can fly. He can also out-roundhouse kick Chuck Norris.

    Chuck Norris, another idiotic birther bigot.

  16. avatar
    Mary Brown December 30, 2012 at 3:52 pm #

    I remind many of my conservative friends who are troubled by this stuff that they stood by and let it happen. Everyone thought they could defeat the President by emphasizing the economy and by anger. The problem is that the anger turned into hatred and the hatred was focused on the President. The crazy people took over a political movement as a result. What many did not realize was that many people who are not as politically liberal as folks here will not vote for crazy. I know people with that mindset and listen to conservative pundits of like mind. They want to put the genie back in the bottle and can’t figure out how. The unfortunate result is that people can no longer exchange ideas that might be worth thinking about.

  17. avatar
    jtmunkus December 30, 2012 at 5:16 pm #

    Hey, Phony guy:

    Sorry to burst your condom, but ain’t nobody gettin’ into no Harvard with no 2.0 – not even with affirmative action.

    Juris Doctor Magna Cum Laude? Well, you don’t even know that that means.

    Best of luck.

  18. avatar
    donna December 30, 2012 at 5:24 pm #

    O’phony is a MUSLIM: ignorant college flunky with a 2. grade or less

    take if from classmate CONSERVATIVE Bradford Berenson Harvard Law, class of ’91; associate White House counsel, 2001-’03 UNDER BUSH:

    “You don’t become president of the Harvard Law Review, no matter how political, or how liberal the place is, by virtue of affirmative action, or by virtue of not being at the very top of your class in terms of legal ability.”

    “Barack was at the VERY TOP OF HIS CLASS in terms of legal ability. ”

    “He had a FIRST-CLASS LEGAL MIND and, in my view, was selected to be president of the Review ENTIRELY ON HIS MERITS.”

    AND one of karl rove’s deputies helped obama get elected to law review

  19. avatar
    Andrew Vrba, PmG December 30, 2012 at 7:13 pm #

    Majority Will: Chuck Norris, another idiotic birther bigot.

    I’d actually call Chuck Norris a sissy to his face, because Bill Brasky could kick his ass.

  20. avatar
    Majority Will December 30, 2012 at 7:18 pm #

    Andrew Vrba, PmG: I’d actually call Chuck Norris a sissy to his face, because Bill Brasky could kick his ass.

    It would be more satisfying to see Bill Wallace take him down.

  21. avatar
    bgansel9 December 30, 2012 at 7:51 pm #

    Mary Brown: They want to put the genie back in the bottle and can’t figure out how.

    Genies don’t go back in bottles. Find another solution.

  22. avatar
    Paul Pieniezny December 30, 2012 at 8:13 pm #

    jtmunkus:
    Hey, Phony guy:

    Sorry to burst your condom, but ain’t nobody gettin’ into no Harvard with no 2.0 – not even with affirmative action.

    Juris Doctor Magna Cum Laude?Well, you don’t even know that that means.

    Best of luck.

    Now that is funny, you answering a birther’s fraud claim with cum laude. Funny because a few hours ago I used fraud and cum laud in a rhyme supposedly made up by Orly.

    When I saw the line in the entire post I first thought I should delete it, because it sounded so “dirty”. Then I decided to keep it, because “dirty” is basically what birthers, and in particular Taitz are marketing.

  23. avatar
    Paul Pieniezny December 30, 2012 at 8:18 pm #

    Rickey: Where is your evidence that Barack Hussein Obama is not his legal name?

    Well, that is how this whole thing with the birth certificate started. Some nutter claiming his name was not Hussein,,,

  24. avatar
    Andrew Vrba, PmG December 30, 2012 at 8:30 pm #

    Majority Will: It would be more satisfying to see Bill Wallace take him down.

    The reference was to the SNL “Bill Brasky” sketches, which are where the “Chuck Norris facts” meme got pinched from.

  25. avatar
    Majority Will December 30, 2012 at 8:35 pm #

    Andrew Vrba, PmG: The reference was to the SNL “Bill Brasky” sketches, which are where the “Chuck Norris facts” meme got pinched from.

    Yeah, I got that. I’d still rather see Superfoot take him down.

  26. avatar
    Paul December 31, 2012 at 2:16 pm #

    Ok, wait — Doc, this guy sent this as a SWORN STATEMENT to a federal grand jury. Does that mean he could be charged with perjury?

  27. avatar
    Repeat December 31, 2012 at 2:54 pm #

    The remarks shown below needed to be repeated because some “???” on this website just don’t get it. The O’phony one said in his own words that “HE IS A MUSLIM” don’t any of you understand the “liar” at all ? It’s what he said… not what someone else said about his being a muslim critter. OH! now I get it… the O’phony is lying about his muslim faith referred to in the tv interview where he mentioned Senator McCain not raising the question that O’phony is a muslim, huh! O’phony claims he is a Christian where one turns the other cheek instead of whopping of someones head and dedicated to killing Christians and Jews as the muslims are doing in Egypt, and Iraq, and Afghanistan, and Pakistan… etc

    ****************************

    “Hear O’phony, who now says he is a Christian but practices “Taqiyya” and is really a Muslim liar, phony fraud, drug head, ignorant college flunky with a 2. grade or less, and now in the White House.

    Obummer a.k.a Soebarkah, Obama, Soetero, Admits He Is A Muslim

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tCAffMSWSzY

    Btw!Using other than one’s legal name is fraud …. isn’t it ?”

  28. avatar
    DaveH December 31, 2012 at 3:10 pm #

    It wouldn’t make any difference if Obama was Muslim since there is no religious test to be president.

    The video proves nothing. It is easy to tell that video segments are edited in such a way to use words he actually said to make it appear that he claimed he is a Muslim when the fact is he is not.

    The only fraud I see is the link you posted.

    Repeat:
    The remarks shown below needed to be repeated because some “???”on this website just don’t get it.The O’phony one said in his own words that “HE IS A MUSLIM” don’t any of you understand the “liar” at all ?It’s what he said… not what someone else said about his being a muslim critter.OH! now I get it… the O’phony is lying about his muslim faith referred to in the tv interview where he mentioned Senator McCain not raising the question that O’phonyis a muslim, huh!O’phony claims he is a Christian where one turns the other cheek instead of whopping of someones head and dedicated to killing Christians and Jews as the muslims are doing in Egypt, and Iraq, and Afghanistan, and Pakistan… etc

    ****************************

    “Hear O’phony, who now says he is a Christian but practices “Taqiyya” and is really a Muslim liar, phony fraud, drug head, ignorant college flunky with a 2. grade or less, and now in the White House.

    Obummer a.k.a Soebarkah, Obama, Soetero, Admits He Is A Muslim

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tCAffMSWSzY

    Btw!Using other than one’s legal name is fraud …. isn’t it ?”

  29. avatar
    Scientist December 31, 2012 at 3:11 pm #

    Look, I mean no offense to any of the very good people here who are believers in one or another faith, but, to me, religions are elaborate fairy tales. There is neither a heaven nor a hell-when you die, the worms eat you and that’s that. The Universe no more cares about you than you care about the bacteria that live on your skin. So, I couldn’t care in the slightest whether the President or anyone else for that matter prefers Jack and the Beanstalk, Hansel and Gretel or Little Red Riding Hood. Would you like me to repeat that?

  30. avatar
    Majority Will December 31, 2012 at 3:36 pm #

    The No Religious Test Clause of the United States Constitution is found in Article VI, paragraph 3, and states that:

    The Senators and Representatives before mentioned, and the Members of the several State Legislatures, and all executive and judicial Officers, both of the United States and of the several States, shall be bound by Oath or Affirmation, to support this Constitution; but no religious test shall ever be required as a qualification to any office or public trust under the United States.

    It’s no surprise that mentally challenged birther bigots are anti-American scum.

  31. avatar
    JPotter December 31, 2012 at 3:36 pm #

    Repeat: Using other than one’s legal name is fraud …. isn’t it ?”

    No. In common practice, it is extremely rare to use one’s legal name. Is your full name “Repeat”?

    Thanks for asking, you may now rest easier.

  32. avatar
    Dr Kenneth Noisewater December 31, 2012 at 3:45 pm #

    Repeat:
    Btw!Using other than one’s legal name is fraud …. isn’t it ?”

    You mean like David Dwight Eisenhower, William Blythe, Leslie King Jr, Willard Romney, John Coolidge, Thomas Wilson, Stephen Cleveland, and Hiram Grant?

  33. avatar
    RoadScholar December 31, 2012 at 3:59 pm #

    Oh, RepeatTheChildRapist, how clever of you to call the President “O’Phony”! And how typical of brain-dead trolls for you not to recognize when a video has been edited to make it seem like someone is saying what they did not, in fact, say! Your mother/sister/crack-dealer must be so proud.

  34. avatar
    Daniel December 31, 2012 at 4:00 pm #

    Not that Obama is, but……

    When did it become illegal for someone to be a Muslim in America?

    When did it become illegal for a Muslim to run for, or serve as, President?

  35. avatar
    DaveH December 31, 2012 at 4:57 pm #

    One of the things I always get irritated with when it comes to Orly is when she claims that President Obama is using a name that is not his.

    Just because his mother enrolled him in a school in Indonesia with his step-father’s surname does not legally change his name. Many children whose mother’s remarried use the step-father’s surname when enrolled in school.

    The name on his birth certificate from Hawaii is Barack Hussein Obama II. He was never required to change his name back to Obama when it was never legally changed from Obama.

    If I could bitch slap Orly upside the head everytime she brings this argument up in the crap she files with the courts, I would feel a lot better.

  36. avatar
    Paul December 31, 2012 at 5:21 pm #

    DaveH:
    One of the things I always get irritated with when it comes to Orly is when she claims that President Obama is using a name that is not his.

    Just because his mother enrolled him in a school in Indonesia with his step-father’s surname does not legally change his name. Many children whose mother’s remarried use the step-father’s surname when enrolled in school.

    The name on his birth certificate from Hawaii is Barack Hussein Obama II. He was never required to change his name back to Obama when it was never legally changed from Obama.

    If I could bitch slap Orly upside the head everytime she brings this argument up in the crap she files with the courts, I would feel a lot better.

    Yeah, that always grinds on me too. She claims “there’s no proof he ever changed it back”. Well where is YOUR evidence he ever changed it to begin with?!?

  37. avatar
    Mary Brown December 31, 2012 at 5:59 pm #

    It never offends me when someone has a different view of faith than I or other believers have. What bothers me is when that difference is expanded to include a belief about intelligence, morals or whatever -by either group. We are all individuals who deserve to be judged as such. The problem, as I see it, is that we rarely know one another. In death, I expect to meet a holy God.
    Scientist does not.

  38. avatar
    misha marinsky December 31, 2012 at 9:09 pm #

    Daniel: When did it become illegal for someone to be a Muslim in America?

    When did it become illegal for a Muslim to run for, or serve as, President?

    Area Man Passionate Defender Of What He Imagines Constitution To Be

    http://www.theonion.com/articles/area-man-passionate-defender-of-what-he-imagines-c,2849/

  39. avatar
    misha marinsky December 31, 2012 at 9:28 pm #

    Scientist: religions are elaborate fairy tales

    The Jewish bible, or scriptures, is allegory like Greek mythology. Call it Jewish mythology. As the Greeks had their Pantheon to explain the universe around them, Jews had theirs.

    Scientist: There is neither a heaven nor a hell

    I have written this before: Several years ago, I had an aneurysm which caused the worst stroke survivable. I was in the hospital for two months. One month in a coma, and another re-learning to walk.

    I was told my heart had stopped, and was shocked by the rescue squad. I’ve been there and back. There isn’t anything – just blackness.

    I do not have Scientist’s credentials, but I do have a NYS optician license, and a related degree. I have training in general anatomy, cranial anatomy, physiology, pharmacology and the correction of refractive errors.

    I ask again: Where was this god in Auschwitz, or at slave auctions where children were sold from their parents?

  40. avatar
    Arthur December 31, 2012 at 9:44 pm #

    misha marinsky: I ask again: Where was this god in Auschwitz, or at slave auctions where children were sold from their parents?

    At ORYR they’d probably answer, “Teaching those lousy sinners a lesson!”

  41. avatar
    Paul January 1, 2013 at 12:26 am #

    misha marinsky:

    I ask again: Where was this god in Auschwitz, or at slave auctions where children were sold from their parents?

    Please marry me

  42. avatar
    misha marinsky January 1, 2013 at 12:43 am #

    Paul: Please marry me

    1. I’m straight.
    2. My wife just told me she figured out the studio owner is my girlfriend, and I’ve been shouted at all day. I don’t need any more complications.

    Misha is Russian for Michael. I was named after my grandfather.

  43. avatar
    Scientist January 1, 2013 at 7:43 am #

    Mary Brown: In death, I expect to meet a holy God.
    Scientist does not.

    In that (I hope) far-off day when we find out which of us was right, if it is you, I will gladly buy you a drink. I assume you would make the same offer, but if I turn out to have been right, neither of us will be in a position to benefit from the drink.

  44. avatar
    bobj January 1, 2013 at 9:22 am #

    Repeat: The O’phony one said in his own words that “HE IS A MUSLIM” don’t any of you understand the “liar” at all ? It’s what he said… not what someone else said about his being a muslim critter

    citation please.

  45. avatar
    Judge Mental January 1, 2013 at 12:23 pm #

    bobj: citation please.

    A link to an obamsnippets.com video (or a second generation copy of one) will probably follow from him shortly. When you then point out that it is a spoof comedy video made by people who make no secret whatsoever that they make spoof comedy videos of Obama by editing ‘snippets’ (there’s a surprise eh?) of film and narrative to make it appear that things which weren’t said are being said, he will then call you a gullible obot and ask how you “know” this.

    When you point to the obamasnippets.com people themselves listing their videos on youtube and elsewhere as ‘comedy’ he wll then call you more names and stomp off never to return.

    How do I know?…..Been through that exact scenario elsewhere about 10 times now…the most recent occasion only a couple of days ago.

    Happy New Year to all.

  46. avatar
    Paul January 1, 2013 at 12:30 pm #

    misha marinsky: 1. I’m straight.
    2. My wife just told me she figured out the studio owner is my girlfriend, and I’ve been shouted at all day. I don’t need any more complications.

    Misha is Russian for Michael. I was named after my grandfather.

    HA! I stand chastened. (Well, actually I’m sitting.)

  47. avatar
    Andrew Vrba, PmG January 1, 2013 at 1:29 pm #

    Repeat: Blah blah blah Youtube video blah blah blah

    Yeah, well according to this, Wilford Brimley wants to eat people with Type 2 Diabetes!
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KICIOYlZTr8
    But hey, if its on Youtube its the gospel troof, rite?

  48. avatar
    Mary Brown January 1, 2013 at 2:28 pm #

    Scientist

    My family- and that includes inlaws and their families live in Oregon-in and around Portland. Our beliefs are varied and range from Catholic (both liberal and conservative) to Lutheran to Evangelical to theist to agnostic and atheist. Our group includes Socialist Workers, Republicans, Liberterians and all politcs be damned. Yet we know and respect and like and love one another -some more than others. How? We laugh. We have meals together and we discus sometimes vigorously and sometimes not. We help with the little ones growing up who range in age from 2 months to 16 years. Is it perfect? No. Do we get mad? Oh, yes. Sometimes people take a break from one another. But because we interact and communicate we have, I think, come to see the humanity in each person. We will be leaving Nebraska in about 3 years and then will be able to be full partners in all of this. I am sure many of you are partners and participants in family groups-that includes many kinds of families- like this. Oh, we love visitors. Birthers seem unable to connect and view others as a threat? Why? I do not know.

  49. avatar
    G January 1, 2013 at 4:40 pm #

    Amen to that! :)

    Mary Brown: My family- and that includes inlaws and their families live in Oregon-in and around Portland. Our beliefs are varied and range from Catholic (both liberal and conservative) to Lutheran to Evangelical to theist to agnostic and atheist. Our group includes Socialist Workers, Republicans, Liberterians and all politcs be damned. Yet we know and respect and like and love one another -some more than others. How? We laugh. We have meals together and we discus sometimes vigorously and sometimes not. We help with the little ones growing up who range in age from 2 months to 16 years. Is it perfect? No. Do we get mad? Oh, yes. Sometimes people take a break from one another. But because we interact and communicate we have, I think, come to see the humanity in each person. We will be leaving Nebraska in about 3 years and then will be able to be full partners in all of this. I am sure many of you are partners and participants in family groups-that includes many kinds of families- like this. Oh, we love visitors.

  50. avatar
    G January 1, 2013 at 4:44 pm #

    Certain mindsets and ideologies sadly focus more on the fear and distrust of differences over the notion that a sensible and functioning society must find common ground and ways to get along…

    Mary Brown: Birthers seem unable to connect and view others as a threat? Why? I do not know.

  51. avatar
    misha marinsky January 1, 2013 at 5:36 pm #

    Mary Brown: My family- and that includes inlaws and their families live in Oregon-in and around Portland…We will be leaving Nebraska in about 3 years and then will be able to be full partners in all of this…Oh, we love visitors.

    OT, but apropos: I have been talking to a Realtor, about the Pearl District. I am planning to fly there, in the near future. I am also looking across the river in Vancouver, because Washington state has made 420 a legal number.

    Portland is one of the best cities for artists and dogs.

  52. avatar
    misha marinsky January 1, 2013 at 5:44 pm #

    Mary Brown: We will be leaving Nebraska

    Johnny Carson, Dick Cavett and Warren Buffett are all from Nebraska. Werner Trucking, for whom I drove, is headquartered in Nebraska.

  53. avatar
    misha marinsky January 1, 2013 at 5:46 pm #

    Mary Brown: Birthers seem unable to connect and view others as a threat? Why? I do not know.

    Conservatives lack intellectual curiosity.

  54. avatar
    Mary Brown January 1, 2013 at 9:28 pm #

    And Misha Washington has no state income tax and Oregon no state sales tax. So if you live in Vancouver just across the river you can have both. I do not have any relatives in the Pearl district but in the southeast and in Milwaukie.

  55. avatar
    JPotter January 1, 2013 at 9:33 pm #

    misha marinsky: Conservatives lack intellectual curiosity.

    New stuff is skeery.

    Last month, I came across a writer describing conservatism as a religion. The writer was writing in the late 18th century. It was hilarious to see, once again, how general principles are eternal. Now where did I put that citation … d’oh!

  56. avatar
    Mary Brown January 2, 2013 at 6:58 am #

    It depends on the conservative. For some yes but I have met and had discussions with folks who are quite rational. Stop putting people in boxes. When we do that we make a world that includes the rational people like us and the others. That attitude leads to what? An inability to entertain any idea that originates with those who have become our the others. As I listen to you I hear that.

  57. avatar
    Daniel January 2, 2013 at 10:49 am #

    misha marinsky: Conservatives lack intellectual curiosity.

    I am a Conservative. Please don’t pull a birther by using a wider brush than is necessary.

  58. avatar
    Horus January 2, 2013 at 5:00 pm #

    The people who believe that Obama is a fraud are the same people who also believe that human flesh eating zombies are also something to fear.

  59. avatar
    Thomas Brown January 2, 2013 at 5:39 pm #

    Daniel: I am a Conservative. Please don’t pull a birther by using a wider brush than is necessary.

    Seconded. My brother is a sane (and curious) conservative. How do I know he is sane? He thinks the birthers, creationists, Galt worshippers, gay-bashers, etc. now infesting the ranks of “conservatives” are flat-out bonkers.

    I estimate his IQ as similar to John Woodman’s, another conservative. At any rate they are both smart guys. Neither one has the tiniest, vaguest doubt that BHO is eligible for the office.

  60. avatar
    G January 2, 2013 at 11:19 pm #

    The problem is that so many terms in our language have become very subjective, despite people using them as a form of self-identity and group association. So really, what does “conservative” even mean to one person or another…it really isn’t consistent.

    However, in general, those in power (whether political or media based) identifying themselves as “conservative” these days (also including the loudest voices amongst the commenting masses in support of them) have given the term “conservative” a severe black-eye, here in the 21st century.

    Serious scholars tend to classify what passes as overal “conservatism” these days as various bastardized forms of what is referred to as “neoconservatism” and not at all like what is referred to as “classical conservatism”.

    Today’s prominent self-identifying “conservative” voices are certainly not in the model of Eisenhower nor Buckley nor Reagan nor Rockefeller at all. Those leaders and the voices that modeled them are all long gone and dead. Although there are sane and rational people who still self-identify themselves as “conservative”, they are doing so in loyalty to some earlier generational version of what that “brand” meant to them…

    …But that “brand” they still cling to is not the “brand” that is on prominent display these days. It is the crazy and shameful version of the “brand” which rules these days…and so the general term “conservative” can be rightfully considered to have been tarnished to the point of disrepute among the broad populace.

    So, while I agree against over-generalizations, I also am not going to stick my head in the sand and support the willful denial of what a 21st century American “conservative” designation tends to represent in action.

    Therefore, if you are decrying guilt by association here, maybe you should reexamine what you actually stand for and whether or not you need a different modern word or term to describe yourself…because the crazies have already turned “conservative” into nothing more than a synonym for regressiveness at best…

    As the old saying goes, lay down with dogs and you get fleas.

    Thomas Brown: Seconded.My brother is a sane (and curious) conservative.How do I know he is sane?He thinks the birthers, creationists, Galt worshippers, gay-bashers, etc. now infesting the ranks of “conservatives” are flat-out bonkers.

    I estimate his IQ as similar to John Woodman’s, another conservative.At any rate they are both smart guys.Neither one has the tiniest, vaguest doubt that BHO is eligible for the office.