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A comment at ORYR

This exchange appeared over at Obama Release Your Records.

RacerJim: It’s funny indeed how the Obots can explain away each and every anomaly with each and every image of each and every document pertaining to Obama’s birth, citizenship, Social Security number, Selective Service Registration, et al.

Dr. Conspiracy: It’s funny how birthers base their entire world view on a bunch of supposed anomalies which are easily explained.

In most cases, a more accurate statement would be that birthers find things that they do not understand because of their lack of expertise and knowledge, and then call their ignorance an "anomaly" that is unexplained. A great example is the statement that "no one used African American for race on a birth certificate in 1961" when in fact the 1961 federal instruction book for coding birth certificates specifies what to code for the statistical report when somebody enters "African-American" for race. The objection is ignorance, not anomaly.

Birthers, hundreds of them, have scoured every available document, public statement, and photograph related to Obama and have poured over every word, scratch, and detail imposing the most negative possible interpretations. Real life is messy and not everything matches up to some Socratic ideal of perfection. Finding mistakes in the record of a person’s life is normal. Misstatements are normal. It’s true of everybody, and it doesn’t mean fraud.

But at the end of the day, not a single thing in the pile could be considered real evidence. The largest part of the birther "anomaly" store, the supposed forgery of the long form, exploded when it was found, and conclusively proven, that it all was the normal artifacts of an office machine like a Xerox WorkCentre 7655 and Mac Preview. Take a minute to peruse the catalog of things birthers have been wrong about.

http://www.obamaconspiracy.org/bookmarks/debunk/

The issue is not the large list of anomalies in Obama’s records, but the large list of mistakes birthers made about them.

I realize that this is not an audience that is ready to accept the facts, but they are the facts nonetheless.

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16 Responses to A comment at ORYR

  1. avatar
    Curious George September 14, 2013 at 11:47 am #

    For the Birthers ignorance is conclusive proof of forgery.

  2. avatar
    Rickey September 14, 2013 at 11:55 am #

    That’s a fine response, but it won’t change Racer Jim’s mind – or if it does, he will not admit it. I don’t initiate political posts on Facebook, but I do respond when I see someone I know post one which is factually incorrect (usually they are anti-Obama posts, of course, but of late Jane Fonda has been the subject of vitriol because she was cast as Nancy Reagan in The Butler). Typically my corrections are either ignored or I get a response such as “Why are you defending him/her?”

    On the other hand, I do occasionally get likes from sensible people who appreciate having the record set straight.

  3. avatar
    Andrew Vrba, PmG September 14, 2013 at 12:01 pm #

    To birthers going “LALALALA! I CAN’T HEAR YOU! YOU ARE WRONG! LALALALA I AM RIGHT!” is better than actually having factual information.
    They somehow believe that going “Nuh-uh!” is going to magically undo every fact and law that doesn’t support their bull crap. That if they wish hard enough, Obama will somehow no longer be President.

    At Birther Report, any one of Doc’s perfectly put together arguments gets dismissed as “unintelligible rants” and the like. Which in of itself is amusing, as most of Doc’s posts are short and to the point.

  4. avatar
    gorefan September 14, 2013 at 12:05 pm #

    Any notice now that the birth certificate isn’t a forgery – the birther rant is switching to Selective Service card?

    Doc at ORYR you said

    “Also, the FOIA image of Obama Selective Service System shows a bit of the next image of another form, making it clear that the form came from the Selective Service microfilm records.”

    Is this just on the image they sent you?

  5. avatar
    Andrew Vrba, PmG September 14, 2013 at 12:11 pm #

    This post by Chickenhawk amuses me http://obamareleaseyourrecords.blogspot.com/2013/09/mike-zullo-a-lot-of-stuff-here.html#IDComment719912104
    Silly idjit. I guess no one told him that many of the most successful people in America, and around the world, are geeks and nerds.

  6. avatar
    justlw September 14, 2013 at 12:58 pm #

    This is how I feel about so-called “science.” Everything just fits too neatly together. You ask a “scientist” a question, and they always seem to have an answer. How can this be?

  7. avatar
    Joey September 14, 2013 at 1:27 pm #

    justlw:
    This is how I feel about so-called “science.”Everything just fits too neatly together.You ask a “scientist” a question, and they always seem to have an answer. How can this be?

    Beats me! (Non-Scientist)

  8. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy September 15, 2013 at 12:10 am #

    That is a very interesting question. I have never seen a version with the other form bit and I don’t know whether other images have been cropped to remove the other form, or whether it’s not there. The other form image indicates that the Obama form was on microfilm, strongly suggesting that the Obama form was coterminous with the creation of the microfilm and that probably from 1980.

    gorefan: Is this just on the image they sent you?

  9. avatar
    G September 15, 2013 at 1:12 am #

    Pretty much. Their entire worldview is based on denialism and imaginary magic thinking.

    Andrew Vrba, PmG: To birthers going “LALALALA! I CAN’T HEAR YOU! YOU ARE WRONG! LALALALA I AM RIGHT!” is better than actually having factual information.
    They somehow believe that going “Nuh-uh!” is going to magically undo every fact and law that doesn’t support their bull crap. That if they wish hard enough, Obama will somehow no longer be President.

  10. avatar
    gorefan September 15, 2013 at 2:59 am #

    Dr. Conspiracy: I don’t know whether other images have been cropped to remove the other form, or whether it’s not there.

    Here is the first public display of President Obama’s:

    Debbie schlussel

    Can’t tell if it has been cropped.

    Also if you zoom in on the P.O. stamp they are the same but different.

  11. avatar
    RanTalbott September 15, 2013 at 6:23 am #

    gorefan: Any notice now that the birth certificate isn’t a forgery – the birther rant is switching to Selective Service card?

    Like any religion, birtherism has “sects”with varying degrees of belief in, or emphasis on, different “doctrines”. Or a better analogy might be “cafeteria Catholics”, since the birther sub-groups don’t have the formal structure of religious denominations.
    Tomorrow there will be a rant from someone who thinks the “forged BC” is the be-all and end-all of the “problem”. Or maybe another round of “born in Kenya”.

  12. avatar
    JPotter September 15, 2013 at 1:58 pm #

    Correctly identifying a true anomaly requires experience and competence, and a suitable sample of examples from which to base comparisons and draw conclusions.

    Assumptions (that is, seeing something in a singular example that appears odd to a casual observer and deciding it must be exceptional, based on assumptions regarding all of the above), are not sufficient, and will always, unless one is lucky, lead to wrong conclusions.

    ____________

    “What do you want—my birth certificate?”

    Dr. M.L. Martin
    “Let There Be Light”
    Robert A. Heinlein
    1940

  13. avatar
    Arthur September 15, 2013 at 2:37 pm #

    RanTalbott: Or a better analogy might be “cafeteria Catholics

    I was thinking of “Dim Sum Birthers.” One moment they’re feasting on deep-fried Vattel, and then a new dish arrives and they’re gobbling steamed Soetoro. Shortly, a new portion will appear and they’ll be downing Muslim Brotherhood dumplings. Although birthers are always hungry, they’re never content with just one conspiratorial delicacy.

  14. avatar
    G September 15, 2013 at 3:38 pm #

    And of course, every serving they eat is nothing but a sh*t sandwich in the first place…

    Arthur: I was thinking of “Dim Sum Birthers.” One moment they’re feasting on deep-fried Vattel, and then a new dish arrives and they’re gobbling steamedSoetoro. Shortly, a new portion will appear and they’ll be downing Muslim Brotherhood dumplings. Although birthers are always hungry, they’re never content with just one conspiratorial delicacy.

  15. avatar
    Arthur September 15, 2013 at 4:17 pm #

    G: And of course, every serving they eat is nothing but a sh*t sandwich in the first place…

    Hmmm . . . maybe that’s why they don’t have any friends?

  16. avatar
    Keith September 15, 2013 at 11:01 pm #

    Dr. Conspiracy: That is a very interesting question. I have never seen a version with the other form bit and I don’t know whether other images have been cropped to remove the other form, or whether it’s not there.

    So… proof positive that the older image is a fraudulent flatulent forged fake form.