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Taitz: new twist on old Obama copyright story

It was last January when Orly came up with this document anomaly, if you could call it that. Obama’s copyright application for Dreams from My Father has the letters “U S A” in place of the author’s year born. The year of birth is not applicable because US Copyright law doesn’t consider the birth and death dates of US authors (while it is relevant for  most foreign authors). I debunked it then in my article, “Taitz continues to baffle.”

Taitz is back with the same story again, citing Paul Irey as her authority on copyright applications. Only this time, Irey states that the certificate of copyright from the US Registrar of Copyrights is itself a forgery, and probably made for the purpose of hiding “Kenya” as Obama’s place of birth on the original, and done by the same forger who forged Obama’s birth certificate.

Does the Registrar of Copyrights have a Xerox WorkCentre too? I suppose it’s possible.

While Irey doesn’t name the forger, he narrows it down a bit by saying:

I predict the forger may disappear soon because just like Fuddy … she is in the same situation now.

Given that Paul Irey works closely with Doug Vogt, we have a pretty good idea who Irey means (I won’t mention the name, but you know who the innocent bystander in Vogt’s suit is).

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51 Responses to Taitz: new twist on old Obama copyright story

  1. avatar
    Curious George June 7, 2014 at 2:14 pm #

    Dr. C,

    ” (I won’t mention the name, but you know who the innocent bystander in Vogt’s suit is).”

    Any wonder how that is going now for Vogt and Irey?

  2. avatar
    Comrade Fogovich June 7, 2014 at 2:33 pm #

    Of all the people on either side of the birther conspiracy theory, the one most likely to disappear IMHO is Joe Arpaio. He’s 82. He’s grossly overweight. It’s hard to imagine him having any kind of a healthy diet – note the anecdote about him feasting off the cheese plate at a fundraiser in Stephen Lemons’ story this week.

    I wonder what’s going on this week between Joe and Mike Zullo. I can’t imagine that they knew Montgomery was a con artist. We saw the caliber of Zullo’s investigative skills when he “investigated” me … by reading a blog post on thepostemail.com. He was really interested in finding out about me, and that was the sum total of his inquiry. A blog post on a birther website. Detective Zullo, I call him. :D

    So I doubt that he did any checking into Montgomery’s background. It probably came as a real shock to him and Joe to learn that the source of the second, “criminal” investigation was semi-famous as a con artist. If I’m right, I imagine Joe might not be too thrilled with Zullo the Clown today. He might even be a little tetchy about it. :D

  3. avatar
    Suranis June 7, 2014 at 2:40 pm #

    Well, Obama made me disappear!!!!

    I got better.

  4. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy June 7, 2014 at 2:57 pm #

    I can.

    Comrade Fogovich: I can’t imagine that they knew Montgomery was a con artist.

  5. avatar
    Joey June 7, 2014 at 3:00 pm #

    I feel like a 1980s song today:
    Oh Miki you’re so fine, you’re so fine you blow my mind, hey Miki hey Miki
    Oh Miki you’re so fine, you’re so fine you blow my mind, hey Miki, hey Miki

  6. avatar
    Curious George June 7, 2014 at 4:00 pm #

    I really like cheerleaders.

    :)

    http://www.youtube.com/embed/yhMscI05dTY?autoplay=1

  7. avatar
    Curious George June 7, 2014 at 4:12 pm #

    I like mice too.

    ;)

    http://www.youtube.com/embed/QNK5KzI48mM?autoplay=1

  8. avatar
    Thinker June 7, 2014 at 4:19 pm #

    Rereading the post from January about this particular bit of idiocy, I was reminded that when she first posted about it back then, she wrote that the date of birth was missing, noting that it said “USA” instead of his actual date of birth. I’m sure she assumed that the author’s DOB was required. After people pointed out that the instructions for filling out the form specifically say that it is not required, she issued an updated press release in which she said that the date of birth is a “necessary entry.” She put a demonstrably false “fact” in her updated press release after she learned that it was wrong because she believed that, without it, her alleged discovery didn’t really mean much. She just lies and lies and lies and lies.

  9. avatar
    Hektor June 7, 2014 at 5:36 pm #

    In 1959, at the age of twenty-three, [Barack Obama, Sr.] arrived at the University of Hawaii as that institution’s first African student. He studied econometrics, worked with unsurpassed concentration, and graduated in three years at the top of his class. His friends were legion, and he helped organize the International Students Association, of which he became the first president. In a Russian language course, he met an awkward, shy American girl, only eighteen, and they fell in love. The girl’s parents, wary at first, were won over by his charm and intellect; the young couple married, and she bore them a son, to whom he bequeathed his name. He won another scholarship–this time to pursue his Ph.D. at Harvard–but not the money to take his new family with him. A separation occurred, and he returned to Africa to fulfill his promise to the continent. The mother and child stayed behind, but the bond of love survived the distances…

    Barack Obama II, Dreams from My Father pp 9-10.

    I wonder if Innocent Bystander forged my copy of Dreams as well as the copyright form.

  10. avatar
    Comrade Fogovich June 7, 2014 at 6:36 pm #

    Comrade Fogovich:
    I can’t imagine that they knew Montgomery was a con artist.

    Dr. Conspiracy:
    I can.

    But if they knew Montgomery was a con artist, why did they get involved with him at all? Why wouldn’t they double-check everything and anything he said?

  11. avatar
    Majority Will June 7, 2014 at 7:16 pm #

    Idiots.

  12. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy June 7, 2014 at 7:39 pm #

    Assuming yours is more than a rhetorical question…

    They are conspiracy theorists. Even if they know Montgomery’s history, confirmation bias will lead them to believe whatever story he uses to explain the past, so long as Montgomery is selling what Arpaio wants to believe. Montgomery can say he’s the victim of the government just like Arpaio is. He’s innocent, but jealous people in the CIA and a crooked partner smeared him to get his invention. The race code fiasco alone proves that Zullo can be conned, and the fact that Arpaio buys any of the Cold Case Posse stuff proves that he’s credulous. And naturally long-time lawman Arpaio is convinced that he’s smarter than any con man.

    So, no, a con man being able to con Arpaio, even though they know his history, requires no stretch at all for me to believe.

    Comrade Fogovich: But if they knew Montgomery was a con artist, why did they get involved with him at all? Why wouldn’t they double-check everything and anything he said?

  13. avatar
    Thinker June 7, 2014 at 8:02 pm #

    This is not directly related to Zullo or Montgomery, but here’s an example of how a scammer can get people on board even after he’s been exposed. This is an email Larry Klayman sent to George Miller in Feb. of 2012 when the Article 2 SuperPAC people were considering hiring him for the Florida ballot challenge. Miller did not post the email to which this was a response, but presumably he was inquiring about the many bad things he had heard about Klayman. And here’s Klayman’s response (as posted on the Fogbow at the time http://www.thefogbow.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=88&t=7234&hilit=indicted&start=50#p343315)
    ——————————————————————————-
    “I am a fighter and I don’t scare or back off when I think I am right. When you get into the ring, sometimes you take some punches. My clients do not want a wall flower and I have always done what I think is right, with the grace of God.

    Here are the responses:

    1. My ex wife is very vindictive. I divorced her in 2003 and has kept the children from me for 4 years after I had a steady girlfriend, beginning in 2007. There is case law that under these circumstances I do am absolved from child support. The case is Hartman v. Hartman in Fairfax County Family Court in Virginia where we were divorced. The children live in a house I paid for and I have paid hundreds of thousands of dollars in real estate and other benefits to her since the divorce. It is a matter of principal for me not to pay child support when I cannot see my children. She is remarried and lives in a house in Cleveland I paid for. The case you mention is a low level crime, not punishable with jail. They want me to pay the support and I will not on principal. I would rather go to trial, because I have a good defense and still cannot see or even talk with my children. I will win this on principal. I do not roll over, as you don’t.

    2. I let my Pa license lapse because I did not want to take the time to take continuing legal education. I have not had a case in Pa. for 20 or more years. Pa. is not important to me and I am licensed in other states.

    3. I have been a member in good standing with the Florida Bar for 35 years continuously, and never suspended or disciplined. The criminal client I agreed to pay 5 K to was only as a nuisance. Her new lawyer (her case was transferred from Miami to Orlando and she retained new counsel) admitted I did not owe her money and even said he would not have paid her anything. I paid what I agreed to just to get rid of her ; I just did so later than I had agreed to initially, because I did not have the money at that time to pay. In fact I had paid 2K quickly; she just had to wait to get the remainder. I was paying my ex wife alimony and child support of 11K per month. You can look at the agreement with the Florida Bar which explains this.

    4.As for Judicial Watch, I was the one who sued Fitton of JW for breaching my severance agreement when I left to run for the U.S. Senate, as well as defrauding donors. It is Fitton who defrauded donors and in fact I forced him and JW to return monies that they solicited to buy a building that was never purchased after I left. You can talk to Louse Benson, who is on your emailng list. She was one of the defrauded donors and I sued to get her a refund.

    George, I am not defensive about all of this. But it would not surprise me if this was not Fitton spreading this stuff as he has always feared me returning to JW and has tried to harm me.

    I am an advocate and I answer to no one except those I love, my clients and God.

    If your group wants to knit pick, maybe I am not the right person. This will not be an exercise in political correctness. You need a strong advocate, not a pansy.

    Justice Clarence Thomas once told me; If you fight for strong causes you have to be prepared to get cut. He certainly did and Anita Hill is regrettably similar to my former wife.

    All the best and God bless,”
    —————————————————————————–
    Quite an act of trickery and scumbaggery, and one that could easily reel in a moron like a birther who really just wanted his preconceived notions confirmed that Klayman is a much-victimized and fearless patriot and hero so he could prove Obots wrong.

    Comrade Fogovich:
    But if they knew Montgomery was a con artist, why did they get involved with him at all? Why wouldn’t they double-check everything and anything he said?

  14. avatar
    Comrade Fogovich June 7, 2014 at 8:29 pm #

    OK, I understand all that. Yeah, I could see Vogt and Zullo in particular falling for a line of patter. Mankewicz and Anglin are supposed to be hardened cops, who are – or should be – harder to fool. Cops get lied to every day of their lives, and develop a serious skepticism. And Joe might have spoken to Montgomery on the phone, but not met him in person. But he wants to believe.

    On the whole, though, I still think it’s more likely than not that Zullo and Arpaio didn’t know Montgomery’s history. Zullo has shown that he couldn’t investigate his way out of a wet paper bag. Mankewicz and Anglin might have accepted the story for $50,000 in overtime, and Joe’s getting old.

    I hope we learn a lot more than we know today. :idea:

  15. avatar
    Thinker June 7, 2014 at 9:04 pm #

    I think our new friend DSM–who knows quite a bit about Montgomery–would say that Montgomery is savvy enough to scam even relatively sophisticated people (which obviously excludes birthers–I have no doubt he could have scammed Vogt and Zullo) like law enforcement who know his background. But your suggestion that maybe Mankewicz and Anglin just did it for the money makes sense too. We’ll have to wait and see I guess.

    Comrade Fogovich:
    Mankewicz and Anglin are supposed to be hardened cops, who are – or should be – harder to fool. Cops get lied to every day of their lives, and develop a serious skepticism. […] Mankewicz and Anglin might have accepted the story for $50,000 in overtime, and Joe’s getting old.

  16. avatar
    Suranis June 7, 2014 at 9:25 pm #

    I think its simply that Arpiao didn’t really care. He’s pretty skilled at having a fall guy take all the flack, and he had Zullo all set up to be the fall guy. Zullo came to him with “a real computer expert” and his smug confidence meant that he didn’t do due diligence. And then dangling the chance to nail his enemy and Arpiao would have been hooked. After all why not, he;s always scated through by blaming his fall guys so therer;s no reason not to take the bait, and its not like it’s HIS money.

    Finding that Montgomery was a con man would have been something of a shock.

  17. avatar
    Notorial Dissent June 8, 2014 at 12:53 am #

    No, I think that finding he’d been taken would have been the shock, I don’t think the Shurf’s ego is up to that sort of failure, and he really can’t even blame poor dumb ole Zullo the Klown for it if he shelled out as much money as it is looking like he did.

    I still maintain that the resounding silence coming from the dark tower is more than ample proof of the suppositions that have been made. If there were any way he and the Klown could have been declaiming their innocence and not be committing perjury, they would be doing it by now, or if they thought they could bluff it out they’d be making even more noise, as distraction ALWAYS works. As it is, I think they got caught flatfooted and red handed and have no strategy to deal with it, and they don’t seem to be good at thinking on their feet, but then we knew the Klown wasn’t, and it seems now that the Shurf’s flacks got nutin’ as well. They can’t hide their involvement, and probably can’t hide the county money that was spent, so they’re in a bit of a pickle one might say.

  18. avatar
    Comrade Fogovich June 8, 2014 at 6:14 am #

    Investigating a federal judge and the Attorney General of the US should be a big story. I’m surprised nobody except Daily Kos has picked up on it yet.

    Hopefully, one of the Phoenix Tee Vee stations is trying to verify what Lemons’ wrote.

    As far as whether Joe knew he was working with a con artist or not, I submit for consideration the tale told by one of Lemons’ sources, that an underling tried to tell Joe that he’d been conned, and Joe blew up in a screaming fit.

    ‘Course, that could work either way. Either he had no idea he was working with a con man, or he was satisfied that Montgomery wasn’t conning him and was outraged that an underling would slander the source of the universe-shattering information.

    I’m stumped over here.

  19. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy June 8, 2014 at 7:30 am #

    I think that’s the problem, verification. How do they verify a confidential source? Not easy. They shouldn’t run with the story without confirmation.

    Comrade Fogovich: Investigating a federal judge and the Attorney General of the US should be a big story. I’m surprised nobody except Daily Kos has picked up on it yet.

    Hopefully, one of the Phoenix Tee Vee stations is trying to verify what Lemons’ wrote.

  20. avatar
    Thinker June 8, 2014 at 7:57 am #

    All that other media outlets would have to verify is that some relationship exists between Arpaio and Montgomery. Lemons’ article doesn’t include anything about what information Montgomery allegedly supplied or what specifically Arpaio is allegedly investigating regarding Judge Snow, Eric Holder, or President Obama so there’s nothing to verify about that.

    Dr. Conspiracy:
    I think that’s the problem, verification. How to they verify a confidential source? Not easy. They shouldn’t run with the story without confirmation.

  21. avatar
    Comrade Fogovich June 8, 2014 at 8:20 am #

    Dr. Conspiracy:
    I think that’s the problem, verification. How do they verify a confidential source? Not easy. They shouldn’t run with the story without confirmation.

    In a perfect world, they have sources of their own within the MCSO. If the Tee Vee stations don’t have sources as good or better than Stephen Lemons, they aren’t very good at investigative journalism, IMHO.

    But I’ll admit, there may be an atmosphere of fear and loathing at HQ this week. 8O

  22. avatar
    Comrade Fogovich June 8, 2014 at 8:28 am #

    Thinker:
    All that other media outlets would have to verify is that some relationship exists between Arpaio and Montgomery.

    In that regard, I believe the crack “maybe they [Mankiewicz and Anglin] like the weather up there [in Seattle] … or the snow crab” was an explicit admission that the two deputies indeed have spent a lot of time in Seattle. Joe was being cocky, but he DID admit that much.

    Fifty grand in overtime will buy a lot of snow crab. :D

  23. avatar
    Comrade Fogovich June 8, 2014 at 8:37 am #

    Nobody really likes the weather in Seattle, do they? :lol:

  24. avatar
    Suranis June 8, 2014 at 8:42 am #

    Yeah, I’d forgotten about that. Hmm…

    Comrade Fogovich: As far as whether Joe knew he was working with a con artist or not, I submit for consideration the tale told by one of Lemons’ sources, that an underling tried to tell Joe that he’d been conned, and Joe blew up in a screaming fit.

  25. avatar
    Comrade Fogovich June 8, 2014 at 9:09 am #

    I get a gold star for good behavior for the months of April, May, and June (so far), because I have never used Falcon’s adorable nickname for Doc C. on any website. Not here, not on Birther Report, not on Fagblow … I haven’t even mentioned it to my lovely bride, who is a great admirer of his. I have been sorely tempted, but thus far I have shown iron self-discipline. :mrgreen:

  26. avatar
    Andrew Vrba, PmG June 8, 2014 at 12:37 pm #

    Comrade Fogovich:
    I haven’t even mentioned it to my lovely bride, who is a great admirer of his. I have been sorely tempted, but thus far I have shown iron self-discipline.

    So, does Mrs. Foggy ever get in on the anthill poking fun? Ridiculing birthers could easily be the hot new “Its fun and its free!” family activity of the summer.

  27. avatar
    Bob June 8, 2014 at 1:29 pm #

    (I know I keep saying this but) Orly seems more unhinged than ever.

    She had this post ☞ LINK

    “THIS IS HILARIOUS AND GREAT NEWS: OBAMA SUPPORTER SEEKS ASYLUM IN MOLDOVA, AS HE CAN’ TAKE ORLY TAITZ ANY MORE. URGE OBAMA TO FOLLOW HIS SUPPORTER AND WE ARE GOOD.”

    The person is not an”Obama supporter” in fact, quite the opposite.
    The person is not seeking “asylum” he’s asking how to move to either Israel or Moldova.
    The Obama “supporter” hasn’t gone anywhere so how could Obama follow him?
    It’s not “great news.”
    It’s not “hilarious.”

    The thing she links to appears to be mostly just insults for Orly and Obama and it looks like she accidentally combined it with one or two of her other posts.

  28. avatar
    bgansel9 June 8, 2014 at 2:07 pm #

    Bob: The thing she links to appears to be mostly just insults for Orly and Obama and it looks like she accidentally combined it with one or two of her other posts.

    It’s too bad Mr. Hutton didn’t send that to the United States Department of Justice and ask why a naturalized immigrant is acting as a political subversive in her adopted country?

    Orly can be de-naturalized too, if she doesn’t watch her step:

    http://immigration.findlaw.com/citizenship/can-your-u-s-citizenship-be-revoked-.html

  29. avatar
    Bonsall Obot June 8, 2014 at 2:36 pm #

    While I agree with Doc’s policy of not diagnosing mental disorders on the blog, there is absolutely nothing about her behavior that is inconsistent with those afflicted with bipolar disorder and with narcissistic personality disorder. But since she’s undiagnosed and since I could be wrong, I have no compunction about ridiculing her.

  30. avatar
    Rickey June 8, 2014 at 3:28 pm #

    Comrade Fogovich:

    As far as whether Joe knew he was working with a con artist or not, I submit for consideration the tale told by one of Lemons’ sources, that an underling tried to tell Joe that he’d been conned, and Joe blew up in a screaming fit.

    ‘Course, that could work either way. Either he had no idea he was working with a con man, or he was satisfied that Montgomery wasn’t conning him and was outraged that an underling would slander the source of the universe-shattering information.

    I’m stumped over here.

    The other possibility is that the Montgomery connection began with Arpaio and Zullo not knowing that Montgomery is a con artist, and that Montgomery was going to provide the “universe shattering” evidence that was to be the subject of the March press conference. Arpaio and Zullo then learned that they would look like fools if they relied on Montgomery, and March went out with a whimper.

    That scenario sounds plausible to me.

  31. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy June 8, 2014 at 3:59 pm #

    Now that Montgomery’s involvement has become public, it would be nice if Arpaio threw Zullo under the bus.

    Rickey: Montgomery was going to provide the “universe shattering” evidence that was to be the subject of the March press conference. Arpaio and Zullo then learned that they would look like fools if they relied on Montgomery, and March went out with a whimper.

  32. avatar
    Rickey June 8, 2014 at 4:18 pm #

    Dr. Conspiracy:
    Now that Montgomery’s involvement has become public, it would be nice if Arpaio threw Zullo under the bus.

    That would be sweet.

  33. avatar
    Arthur June 8, 2014 at 4:37 pm #

    Rickey: The other possibility is that the Montgomery connection began with Arpaio and Zullo not knowing that Montgomery is a con artist, and that Montgomery was going to provide the “universe shattering” evidence that was to be the subject of the March press conference. Arpaio and Zullo then learned that they would look like fools if they relied on Montgomery, and March went out with a whimper.

    That’s the same scenario that came to me.

  34. avatar
    Suranis June 8, 2014 at 5:06 pm #

    Yes, that would explain the mid Febuary Zullo vanishing.

    But then, Joe Mannix kept posting at Birther report, soaking up the adulation… and he still hasnt posted anything. Curiouser and curiouser.

  35. avatar
    Thinker June 8, 2014 at 6:37 pm #

    I think people here are over-emphasizing Zullo’s importance in this. Montgomery probably got involved with this over the Xerox stuff, but the New Times article said it is not clear to what extent Zullo is involved in the Snow/Holder stuff. I think this Montgomery story will ultimately have very little to do with Zullo or the birther investigation. While the birther investigation is an idiotic waste of resources, they’ve already gotten away with that part. Nobody is ever going to be in legal jeopardy as a target of the alleged investigation and I can’t imagine that anybody in the MCSO (including Arpaio) would ever get in trouble for conducting the investigation because the whole thing is so far out there. However, cooking up an investigation of fake crimes committed by a real judge who has issued rulings against the Sheriff…assuming these fake crimes aren’t as fantastical as the birther nonsense, this could be a real problem for the people behind the scheme. I doubt Zullo is among them.

  36. avatar
    Rickey June 8, 2014 at 10:24 pm #

    I agree that Zullo probably has little or nothing to do with Montgomery. Arpaio wouldn’t be foolish enough to let Zullo work on a real investigation. However, it was Zullo who first announced that two detectives were working on the case. Then the Sheriff’s Department sort of confirmed Zullo’s story to Mitch Martinson of arizonapolitics.com:

    “We have two sheriff’s detectives assigned to look into other issues surrounding the birth certificate,” Jones told Martinson, in a blog item posted February 10. “However, they are not investigating the birth certificate issue itself.”

    Then the Sheriff’s Department denied that it had anything to do with the birth certificate, but did not deny that it had anything to do with Obama:

    “Mitch, I was misinformed,” Jones stated. “The detectives are not working on anything regarding the birth certificate. Not even surrounding. Mr. Zullo was incorrect: They are working on other serious cases not even related.”

    Obviously, if Arpaio has been investigating Judge Snow and Eric Holder, that has nothing to do with the birth certificate.

    Combine Zullo’s comments to Carl Gallups about two detectives working on the case and the information that two detectives have been spending time in Seattle with Montgomery, and the pieces seem to fit together. Obviously, it would have been big news if there were real evidence that Holder and Judge Snow had conspired to railroad Arpaio.

    I’m inclined to believe that the New Times story is true.

  37. avatar
    Lupin June 9, 2014 at 2:02 am #

    Dr. Conspiracy: Now that Montgomery’s involvement has become public, it would be nice if Arpaio threw Zullo under the bus.

    Any day now. :-)

  38. avatar
    Lupin June 9, 2014 at 2:06 am #

    Rickey: I’m inclined to believe that the New Times story is true.

    I’m inclined to agree but I doubt we’ll see any “real world” consequences. (I’d love to be proven wrong on this.) Only the choir on both sides of the aisle care. Arpaio = corrupt isn’t news; the media have known this for a while.

    The only people who could rise up en masse to put an end to this farce would be the good folks of Maricopa County, but I doubt they will.

    Outside our little grove, the story doesn’t have much traction, I think.

  39. avatar
    Thinker June 9, 2014 at 5:54 am #

    Except that, as you note, the spokesperson for the MCSO said that Zullo was wrong about the two detectives working with him on something birfery. He didn’t ‘sort of’ confirm it. He initially confirmed it and then said he was wrong. That’s not sort of confirming it. That’s denying it. And yes, his denial did not rule out the possibility that they were working on something related to Obama, but I don’t find anything strange about that since he was not asked if they were working on something about Obama. He was asked if they were working with Mike Zullo on the birth certificate investigation. The answer was no.

    I believe the New Times article. I just don’t believe that the big news in it has much to do with Mike Zullo.

    Rickey:
    Combine Zullo’s comments to Carl Gallups about two detectives working on the case and the information that two detectives have been spending time in Seattle with Montgomery, and the pieces seem to fit together. Obviously, it would have been big news if there were real evidence that Holder and Judge Snow had conspired to railroad Arpaio.

  40. avatar
    Bernard Sussman June 9, 2014 at 6:53 am #

    One wrinkle is that a forger in this story is in a lot more trouble than a forger in the usual birfer fantasy. The usual birfer forger just faked a state document – the Hawaiian birth certificate – but this new copyright registration forger would have forged a FEDERAL document.
    Very probably a Copyright Office Registration is not that great a challenge to a forger, but the story is just evidence that, once the birfers get an idea into their heads, they stretch hard to reject every scrap of contrary evidence.

  41. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy June 9, 2014 at 7:34 am #

    The contact with Montgomery could have started with Zullo, with Montgomery as just another faux birther expert, and then branched into the Snow/Holder thing and been taken away from the Cold Case Posse.

    That would explain the confirmation and the denial.

    Thinker: I believe the New Times article. I just don’t believe that the big news in it has much to do with Mike Zullo.

  42. avatar
    Thinker June 9, 2014 at 9:32 am #

    I agree that Montgomery probably got involved with Arpaio because of Zullo, but I don’t agree that there was a confirmation and then a denial. MCSO Spokesperson Brandon Jones said he was incorrect when he ‘confirmed’ Zullo’s story about real investigators working on the birth certificate stuff. His statement was wrong and he took it back. MCSO has said officially that Zullo’s statement was incorrect. They did not confirm it. They denied it. Isn’t claiming that the MCSO confirmed and then denied Zullo’s statement equivalent to birthers claiming that Obama provided the information in that Acton Dystel biography, even though a credible source (the person who wrote it) has said that this is not what happened?

    Dr. Conspiracy:
    The contact with Montgomery could have started with Zullo, with Montgomery as just another faux birther expert, and then branched into the Snow/Holder thing and been taken away from the Cold Case Posse.

    That would explain the confirmation and the denial.

  43. avatar
    Rickey June 9, 2014 at 3:15 pm #

    Thinker:
    I agree that Montgomery probably got involved with Arpaio because of Zullo, but I don’t agree that there was a confirmation and then a denial. MCSO Spokesperson Brandon Jones said he was incorrect when he ‘confirmed’ Zullo’s story about real investigators working on the birth certificate stuff. His statement was wrong and he took it back. MCSO has said officially that Zullo’s statement was incorrect. They did not confirm it. They denied it. Isn’t claiming that the MCSO confirmed and then denied Zullo’s statement equivalent to birthers claiming that Obama provided the information in that Acton Dystel biography, even though a credible source (the person who wrote it) has said that this is not what happened?

    Regardless of how you want to characterize it, the back and forth between Martinson and Jones does seem to line up with the New Times story. Arpaio did apparently assign two detectives to work on something related to Obama, and Zullo knew about it and told Gallups about it.

    I believe Jones was telling the truth when he corrected his first statement. That’s where your analogy to the Acton Dystel biography isn’t quite on target. The only significance to the first statement by Jones is that it confirms that two detectives were working on something and Zullo had some knowledge of it. Birthers, on the other hand, continue to believe that the Acton Dystel biography is proof that Obama was born in Kenya even though the person who wrote it has acknowledged that she made an error

  44. avatar
    The Magic M June 10, 2014 at 4:22 am #

    Dr. Conspiracy: it would be nice if Arpaio threw Zullo under the bus

    That might even be a welcome push for birtherism, as Zullo would likely spin it as “yielding to intense pressure and threats by the regime” which would again convince the birthers that Zullo was “just about to” release game-changing stuff. At least I can see how Zullo/Gallups would paint it.
    It’s a double bull’s eye – it would reinforce birther belief they are right, and it would provide a welcome excuse why they can’t release anything in July, or October, or ever.

  45. avatar
    Thinker June 10, 2014 at 8:53 am #

    Rickey: You are correct about a problem with my analogy. In the Acton Dystel situation, the information that has since been ‘unconfirmed’ is in fact wrong. That is not necessarily the case with what Zullo said about working with real detectives on birther stuff. There may be a grain of truth in some of what Zullo said. As a factual matter, just describing the sequence of events, it is true that the MCSO first confirmed and then denied Zullo’s statement, but I don’t think this can be used as evidence that there might be some truth to Zullo’s statement because they later disavowed the first statement. The MCSO first issued an erroneous statement and then corrected it. They are on the record as denying that there were detectives working on the birth certificate investigation and stating that Zullo’s statement to the contrary was wrong. This may or may not be an accurate characterization of Zullo’s relationship with the detectives, but it is clearly the stance the MCSO took at the time.

  46. avatar
    Thinker June 13, 2014 at 2:10 pm #

    Strunk’s new lawsuit about Shrimpton’s visa has an element in it related to this copyright document. I believe Strunk asserts that the Copyright Office has been stonewalling him, and repeats uncritically Irey’s claims of forgery. http://www.scribd.com/doc/228872216/NOTICE-of-INTENT-to-FILE-USDOJ-New-Case-Filing-USDC-DCD-OSC-June-10-2014-in-Matters-Related-to-US-DOS-and-Pending-Appeals-USCA-DCC-and-SCOTUS

  47. avatar
    Dave B. June 13, 2014 at 2:34 pm #

    In item 15 on page 9 of his complaint, filed in federal district court, Strunk lists “Barry Allen Owens” among President Obama’s aliases. That’s just nuts on top of nuts.

    Thinker: Strunk’s new lawsuit about Shrimpton’s visa

  48. avatar
    Thinker June 13, 2014 at 9:06 pm #

    I’ll bet that’s a reference to Nancy Owens’ claims that Obama is her half-brother. LMAO.

    Dave B.:
    In item 15 on page 9 of his complaint, filed in federal district court, Strunk lists “Barry Allen Owens” among President Obama’s aliases.That’s just nuts on top of nuts.

  49. avatar
    Dave B. June 13, 2014 at 9:10 pm #

    That’s what I mean– nuts on top of nuts, with a big pile of nuts on top. And more nuts.

    Thinker:
    I’ll bet that’s a reference to Nancy Owens’ claims that Obama is her half-brother. LMAO.

  50. avatar
    BillTheCat June 13, 2014 at 10:02 pm #

    Thinker:
    I’ll bet that’s a reference to Nancy Owens’ claims that Obama is her half-brother. LMAO.

    Nancy is going to have a joygasm. Someone actually believes her.

  51. avatar
    Keith June 14, 2014 at 2:39 am #

    Dave B.:
    That’s what I mean– nuts on top of nuts, with a big pile of nuts on top.And more nuts.

    Little kid walks into the soda shop. He’s got his birthday money in the pocket of his birthday cowboy suit that he’s wearing. He’s got the fringed shirt, the piped pants, the cowboy boots, the cowboy hat, the cowboy holster with the cowboy (toy) six-shooter. He’s a cowboy, right?

    So he goes to the counter and tells the waitress: “I’ll have a great big strawberry sundae with pineapple syrup and nuts on top – its my birthday today”.

    “Well Congratulations, cowpoke”, she says. “How old are you”?

    “Nine”, the kid says.

    “OK then pardner, you want your nuts crushed?”

    Kid pulls out his six-shooter and says: “You want your tits blown off?.