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Congress rejects Grinols subpoenas

I’m rather proud that I learned how to spell “subpoena” and can do it repeatedly, without error and without consulting a dictionary. If I ever needed to have a subpoena issued, I would probably consult a lawyer, and if I did consult a lawyer, one lawyer in particular stands at the very top of the list of ones that I would not consult: Orly Taitz.

Except for “friendlies,” I am not aware that Orly Taitz ever actually got anything in response to a subpoena except the occasional rejection letter, such as the one she got  from the Maricopa County Attorney on behalf of Sheriff Joe Arpaio once.

I am one of the adherents of the “shiny object” theory of Orly Law, believing that Orly Taitz uses legal methods that sound impressive, that use Latin phrases, that other lawyers use and that have some tangentially similar shape to real legal methods. Certainly one of the more frequent methods employed by Taitz is the subpoena, most recently directed at members of Congress in the Grinols v. Electoral College case where the docket is becoming clogged with them. Taitz is suing the 535 members of Congress (among others) and seems to think that the US Attorney who has responded on behalf of federal defendants in the case should have individually notified each member of the suit. Taitz is demanding that a list of members she contacted answer a questionnaire about the representation.

The Office of the General Counsel of the US House of Representatives on behalf of 22 members of Congress has sent a letter to Taitz explaining to her 5 reasons why her subpoena is worthless, and why the members of Congress will not be responding.

Read the letter:

Answer From the Deputy General Counsel of the US Congress in Grinols v. Electoral College by Doctor Conspiracy

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116 Responses to Congress rejects Grinols subpoenas

  1. avatar
    John Reilly March 19, 2013 at 11:45 am #

    One of the reasons, that the subpoena is from California but was served in Washington, D.C., is an error Dr. Taitz has committed over and over again.

    One wonders whether she will now seek to hold the recipients in contempt as she threatened.

  2. avatar
    The Magic M March 19, 2013 at 12:01 pm #

    Orly’s idea that a subpoena doesn’t just give her “discovery” into any document she wants (as she tried with Hawaii w.r.t. the BC) but can compel the recipient to answer any question she poses is kinda new here (though it may have been used by other legal cranks before).

    She seems to see this as an end-run around the legal prerequisites for depositions.

    Of course, in her deranged mind, it will actually get her anywhere if she can “prove” that even one Congress or EC member did not “know” or “agree” Congress/the EC was represented by the AG in one of her cases.
    She thinks this will allow her to claim “fraud” w.r.t. opposing counsel and thus to re-open cases where she has already lost all “expedited ex parte emergency post hoc factum quo warranto third amended motions for en banc reconsideration””.
    She also thinks this will show her flying monkeys that the ebil gubnment is shielding the poor innocent Congress critters from her super-important cases, thereby further enforcing the “they have something to hide” meme.

  3. avatar
    Birther Weary March 19, 2013 at 12:07 pm #

    I’m rather proud that I learned how to spell “subpoena” and can do it repeatedly, without error and without consulting a dictionary

    You’re a better man than I am, Doc. If I didn’t have spell check in Firefox, I’d be lost.

  4. avatar
    Birther Weary March 19, 2013 at 12:10 pm #

    Orly now has 22 more people to add the her traitors list. I read the other day that she thinks the new Pope personally selected her for his initial Tweet. He’s going be surprised when the subpoena arrives at the Vatican.

  5. avatar
    Andrew Morris March 19, 2013 at 12:16 pm #

    Another month before Judge England shuts her down, hopefully for good.

  6. avatar
    Andrew Vrba, PmG March 19, 2013 at 12:27 pm #

    Andrew Morris:
    Another month before Judge England shuts her down, hopefully for good.

    Firing her into the sun will be the only way that feat can be accomplished.

  7. avatar
    Rickey March 19, 2013 at 12:30 pm #

    This is a serious smackdown for Orly because all of the Representatives she served are anti-Obama. They at least had the good sense to turn the subpoenas over to the Office of General Counsel.

    The letter succinctly sums up many of the errors which Orly repeatedly makes, demonstrating once again that she never learns from her mistakes.

  8. avatar
    Rickey March 19, 2013 at 12:36 pm #

    I notice that Mr. Pittard points out the “third party status of the Members as to this action.” I wonder if Orly will now realize that the individual members of Congress are not defendants in this case.

  9. avatar
    Kiwiwriter March 19, 2013 at 12:37 pm #

    I always remember how to spell “subpoena,” by mentally pronouncing it “sub-po-ena.”

    I like that phrase, “vexatious litigation strategy.” That’s the understatement of the decade.

    More “traitors” for her enemies list, I guess…it will include the entire electorate, I’m sure.

  10. avatar
    richCares March 19, 2013 at 12:46 pm #

    Congress making a big mistake on this, don’t they know who Orly is, Orly’s biography was featured in the movie “Wizard of Oz”, you recall the song “Ding Dong the Witch is…..”

  11. avatar
    Thomas Brown March 19, 2013 at 1:08 pm #

    Andrew Vrba, PmG: Firing her into the sun will be the only way that feat can be accomplished.

    …or maybe frozen in a block of carbonite and kept on display, like Han Solo?

  12. avatar
    Daniel March 19, 2013 at 1:11 pm #

    Hmmm isn’t it about past time for John to show up and explain to us how unfair it was of the Office of the Counsel General to expect Orly to play by the rules?

  13. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy March 19, 2013 at 1:28 pm #

    Is there any doubt as to the answer?

    Rickey: I wonder if Orly will now realize that the individual members of Congress are not defendants in this case.

  14. avatar
    Joe Acerbic March 19, 2013 at 1:38 pm #

    “that use Latin phrases, that other lawyers use and that have some tangentially similar shape to real legal methods”

    That’s cargo cult law.

  15. avatar
    predicto March 19, 2013 at 3:10 pm #

    You can also spell it subpena if you prefer.

    http://dictionary.law.com/Default.aspx?selected=2041

    Yeah, law nerd here.

  16. avatar
    ben March 19, 2013 at 3:51 pm #

    This woman is REALLY STUPID but vastly entertaining. Her legal skills are non existent but then considering where her law degree is from. As for her dentistry skills one can only pity the individuals who actually go to her for treatment. In california her dentistry office is ramshackle and dirty. Like I said the all caps information (with bad grammar & spelling) reveals all. Anyone who communicates in writing with all caps is seriously in need of a “shrink”

  17. avatar
    Kiwiwriter March 19, 2013 at 3:54 pm #

    richCares: Congress making a big mistake on this, don’t they know who Orly is, Orly’s biography was featured in the movie “Wizard of Oz”, you recall the song “Ding Dong the Witch is…..”

    I have a pet theory that we cannot go through a day without hearing or seeing a reference to “The Wizard of Oz,” and that is today’s reference for me.

    I presume that her “Winkies,” the “flying monkeys” of the movie, are her supporters. They were played by the same folks who also played the Munchkins, under different make-up, by the way. Coincidence or Obot conspiracy? You decide!

  18. avatar
    ben March 19, 2013 at 4:08 pm #

    Oh but wait there’s more..(with Orly it usually is !). Now she will communicate in all CAPS to her vast throngs of people who actually send her money thinking she is actually doing something important. These are the same folks who respond to those Nigerian scams. After the money trickles in she will ask can someone “research” this or that or call or write to some government entity and demand. To her the USA is a Nazi state…if thats the case in her deluded primal brain then she must be in collusion….with ?…..oh I give up Im laughing so hard I can hardly type this.

  19. avatar
    alg March 19, 2013 at 4:08 pm #

    This must be a particularly nasty blow following her reception at CPAC. Perhaps she should prevail upon Clint Eastwood for help since he knows so much about handling empty chairs.

  20. avatar
    Kiwiwriter March 19, 2013 at 4:11 pm #

    ben: This woman is REALLY STUPID but vastly entertaining. Her legal skills are non existent but then considering where her law degree is from. As for her dentistry skills one can only pity the individuals who actually go to her for treatment. In california her dentistry office is ramshackle and dirty. Like I said the all caps information (with bad grammar & spelling) reveals all. Anyone who communicates in writing with all caps is seriously in need of a “shrink”

    I read the few reviews of her dentistry practice. All negative. However, that doesn’t mean much…the negative reviews could have just been from some of Orly’s more angry opponents. Sadly, I’m sure she is being abused by folks for her idiocies and antics — more than just snotty names on her comments pages. I heartily agree that she deserves ridicule and condemnation, but not harassment and threats. Nobody does. Don’t become what you behold.

    Anyway, she’s probably as lousy a dentist as she is a lawyer.

  21. avatar
    nbc March 19, 2013 at 4:11 pm #

    Oh the stupidity and ignorance… It used to shock me, not so much right now…

  22. avatar
    ben March 19, 2013 at 4:13 pm #

    If she prevails upon Clint Eastwood, I believe he would offer her vacant two legged stool…the empty chair is reserved for him…it has a back rest for supporting spineless back.

  23. avatar
    Kiwiwriter March 19, 2013 at 4:18 pm #

    ben: Oh but wait there’s more..(with Orly it usually is !). Now she will communicate in all CAPS to her vast throngs of people who actually send her money thinking she is actually doing something important. These are the same folks who respond to those Nigerian scams. After the money trickles in she will ask can someone “research” this or that or call or write to some government entity and demand. To her the USA is a Nazi state…if thats the case in her deluded primal brain then she must be in collusion….with ?…..oh I give up Im laughing so hard I can hardly type this.

    It always annoys me when people whip out the “Hitler Zombie” in political debate. Only someone with no understanding of history could analogize American politics with Nazi Germany in the 1930s and 1940s, or, more importantly, Weimar Germany in the 1920s, which was the foundation stone for Herr Hitler. We do not have foreign occupation, runaway inflation, weak and constantly changing central government ruling by decree, violent political private armies, and attempted coups.

    If this was Nazi Germany, Orly Taitz would not be screeching at political conventions or hosting a blog. She would either be suffering dysentery at Ravensbruck, having been rounded up early on under the Enabling Act, or be shuffled off to an extermination camp in the “General Government,” later, under the Wannsee Protocols. Either way, she wouldn’t be at liberty to sue the government and shriek about it.

  24. avatar
    Birther Weary March 19, 2013 at 4:32 pm #

    Kiwiwriter: I read the few reviews of her dentistry practice. All negative. However, that doesn’t mean much…the negative reviews could have just been from some of Orly’s more angry opponents. Sadly, I’m sure she is being abused by folks for her idiocies and antics — more than just snotty names on her comments pages. I heartily agree that she deserves ridicule and condemnation, but not harassment and threats. Nobody does. Don’t become what you behold.

    Anyway, she’s probably as lousy a dentist as she is a lawyer.

    The only time Orly spends in her dental office is to stop by and pick up the receipts.

  25. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy March 19, 2013 at 4:45 pm #

    Mmm, insightful.

    Joe Acerbic: That’s cargo cult law.

  26. avatar
    Deborah March 19, 2013 at 5:03 pm #

    Is inter-racial marriage a felony in Russia? Do we have any representatives in Congress speaking on behalf of Americans born of mixed blood?

    I don’t always use Wikipedia for research, but when I do it is usually when I am in search of common sense, simplified explanations for the ignorant and erudite alike. In a 1967 case, ironically named “Loving v. Virginia,” the Supreme Court banned efforts to make inter-racial marriage a crime. Surely Congress is aware of this. But not according to Orly’s followers who believe she should be awarded the Congressional Medal of Honor.

    Loving Day is a holiday on June 12, and though it is not recognized as a national holiday, there are efforts to have Obama declare it as a national holiday.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-miscegenation_laws_in_the_United_States

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-miscegenation_laws_in_the_United_States

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-miscegenation_laws_in_the_United_States

    More and more I am coming to the conclusion that she is mentally ill, but not in a good way. Narcicissm is just not one of those mental illnesses that people have much sympathy for…

    This is sometimes more fun than it ought to be.

  27. avatar
    Plantmaster March 19, 2013 at 5:25 pm #

    Birther Weary:

    Orly now has 22 more people to add the her traitors list. I read the other day that she thinks the new Pope personally selected her for his initial Tweet. He’s going be surprised when the subpoena arrives at the Vatican.
    **********
    And with a Jesuit Pope, you can bet Strunk is wishing he could join the suit…

  28. avatar
    Kiwiwriter March 19, 2013 at 5:37 pm #

    Plantmaster: Birther Weary:Orly now has 22 more people to add the her traitors list. I read the other day that she thinks the new Pope personally selected her for his initial Tweet. He’s going be surprised when the subpoena arrives at the Vatican.**********And with a Jesuit Pope, you can bet Strunk is wishing he could join the suit…

    Oh, boy, I forgot about Strunk…what’s the story on his bizarre name?

  29. avatar
    Rickey March 19, 2013 at 6:15 pm #

    Kiwiwriter: Oh, boy, I forgot about Strunk…what’s the story on his bizarre name?

    Apparently it’s a sovereign citizen thing.

    Of course, Strunk isn’t sufficiently sovereign to refuse the Social Security benefits which he lives on.

  30. avatar
    Deborah March 19, 2013 at 6:15 pm #

    Tell the Pope marriage is a religion where the church and state meet. Hopefully we’ll move in the direction where the government is out of the bedroom and marriages are performed by the church only. But some people (even in modern times!) are holding on to the idea that Congress approved and funded the first printing of Bibles in America when it was still necessary to get the King’s approval to print a Bible. This, and more, is debunked by a website Liars for Jesus.

    http://www.liarsforjesus.com/downloads/LFJ_chap_1.pdf

  31. avatar
    Bob March 19, 2013 at 7:10 pm #

    I wonder if any of these members of Congress are even aware they were “subpoenaed” by Lady Liberty Legal Litterbug or did their staff just handle it and not bother them with it.

  32. avatar
    Deborah March 19, 2013 at 7:11 pm #

    When serving legal notices to parties, the judiciary is the third party mediator. The rules of service are established by the court so no party in a dispute takes the law into their own hand, but brings the dispute properly before a fair mediator. Once in a legal dispute, my landlady “served me” by nailing an eviction to my door. Lol. 🙂 The principle she violated was in failing to recognize the mediator concept. She did lose that case- for several reasons.

  33. avatar
    W. Kevin Vicklund March 19, 2013 at 7:59 pm #

    Looks like the judge is starting to get a bit testy over the recent filings and the general incompetence:

    Plaintiffs’ counsel has called and e-mailed chambers staff several times seeking legal advice or to ask questions about how to proceed with their suit. This communication is inappropriate. The Court directs Plaintiffs’ counsel to both the Federal Rules of Civil Procedure and the Eastern District of California’s Local Rules. Both sets of rules explain how parties should interact with the Court and how to litigate their lawsuit. Both sets of rules are available online. In the future, Plaintiffs’ counsel should consult both the Federal Rules of Civil Procedure and the Eastern District’s Local Rules before proceeding. Local Rules 200 – 305 apply to civil cases, like the one at hand.Local Rule 230 specifically deals with civil motions. In the future, Plaintiffs must comply with this rule.

    If Plaintiffs’ counsel wants to request something from the Court, she must file a noticed motion, which means she must file “a notice of motion, motion, accompanying briefs, affidavits, if appropriate, and copies of all documentary evidence that the moving party intends to submit in support of the motion.” E.D. Cal. Local R. 230(b). Properly noticed motions are set for hearings at least 28 days after they are filed. Id. Plaintiffs’ counsel should not e-mail, call, or file an ex parte request if she wants the Court to act. The only way that Plaintiffs’ Counsel should interact with the Court is through formally filed motions that comply with Local Rule 230. As explained above, motions are set for hearings at least 28 days after they are filed. Thus, Plaintiffs’ counsel should not expect the Court to act any faster than 28 days, as the local rules require that time to pass before a motion can be heard. Chambers staff will disregard all communication that does not comply with both sets of rules.
    IT IS SO ORDERED.
    DATED: March 14, 2013

    http://ia601604.us.archive.org/23/items/gov.uscourts.caed.248085/gov.uscourts.caed.248085.98.0.pdf

    h/t Fogbow

  34. avatar
    Deborah March 19, 2013 at 8:48 pm #

    “Plaintiffs’ counsel should not e-mail, call, or file an ex parte request if she wants the Court to act.” (from Order above).

    Ex parte communications are illegal in California (I do not know about all states). An ex parte communication is a letter, e-mail, phone call, etc. to the judge that is without the knowledge of the party in dispute. Ex parte means, without the other party. California does not permit this because in effect, it is presumptuous- it presumes the judge will advise one party to the prejudice of the other party.

    As for the court’s statement that her communication is “inappropriate.” That’s an understatement. All the name-dropping she does in her “press releases” (which I suspect are written in her own hand, and in the third person) is informal and disrespectful treatment toward people who are for the most part complete strangers to her. That is what is so inappropriate. The moral of the story is, treat strangers with respect- red, yellow, black, white, or what have you.

  35. avatar
    Rickey March 19, 2013 at 8:54 pm #

    W. Kevin Vicklund:
    Looks like the judge is starting to get a bit testy over the recent filings and the general incompetence:

    Judge England is reading the riot act to her.

    I am a bit surprised that he didn’t mention that she has been serving subpoenas before there has been a Rule 26 conference, but that may come.

  36. avatar
    ben March 19, 2013 at 10:57 pm #

    When Orly loses a case…which has been the case (sic) so far. She immediately posts in CAPS that the judge, indeed the entire court system is in Obama’s pocket…& if the judge or any official is Afriican American then she whips out the race card. She frequently rails on about illegals etc yet I can bet you she has quite a few illegal helping hands at home to whom she pays less than minimum pay & of course no SOCIAL SECURITY or TAXES.

    Yes indeed she does call the court more than often. This communication is ex parte, especially more so since she is the counsel in the case…but then are we really talking about a lawyer, legal ethics, rules of procedure or a clown. Like I said she would be a great stand up comedian for a very short period of time for the right crowd. Meanwhile I am loving the entertainment…even prime time sitcoms cant compete with this type of humor?

  37. avatar
    Thomas Brown March 19, 2013 at 11:06 pm #

    Bob:
    Legal Litterbug

    Superb epithet, my friend.

  38. avatar
    Keith March 19, 2013 at 11:27 pm #

    Thomas Brown: Bob:
    Legal Litterbug

    Superb epithet, my friend.

    Seconded.

    Ever since I read it I’ve been sitting here trying to top it… I got nothin’.

  39. avatar
    Deborah March 19, 2013 at 11:46 pm #

    There’s not a lot of similarity between this and the California McMartin Preschool case in which a mentally ill woman accused a day care center of ritual child sexual abuse- except that the California legal system spent approximately 15 million dollars trying to prosecute that day care center based on the false accusations of a mentally ill woman. The trial lasted two years! And the suspects were eventually exonerated.

    There is corruption in all three branches of government, I’m sure. But Orly’s method of addressing it is not going to work I am also sure. She’s a distraction from the real issues that need to be solved, and she’s a very costly distraction, and a social phenomenon (also similar to the McMartin case). She could have a psychotic nervous breakdown, she could leave the country in infamy, or…now how could Orly manage to stay in this country as a credible professional? Or even Corsi…and Arpaio, etc. The waste of money going on is a hideous disgrace.

  40. avatar
    Linda Joy Adams March 20, 2013 at 12:06 am #

    She’s dealing with a civil matter and has to prove something is wrong. I’ve begged her for almost two years , now to get the original birth certificate ( the real one) form Topeka Ks where my mother took An to the hospital to have him.As well as the death certificates his murders real Dad, in a racist attack on both of them, plus the arranged marriage certificate to Obama st a couple months before birth and the marriage and birth announcements from the Topeka capital Journal. The judge is Topeka Ks i waiting for her to ask for the court order since 9/12. Start in Topeka Ks where it all began. The whole main media and birther movement has made millions off a a no issue. He is actually an American in every way. Some may not think he;s the best one among us, but he;s ours. I really don;t know why his immediate family did not tell him the whole truth of his origins when he became an adult. But he;s not the first baby never told. But most don;t run for president. Linda Joy Adams eye wintess

  41. avatar
    justlw March 20, 2013 at 12:09 am #

    I see we’re getting the ionospheric skip from Outer Weembonia again.

  42. avatar
    Birther Weary March 20, 2013 at 1:15 am #

    justlw:
    I see we’re getting the ionospheric skip from Outer Weembonia again.

    Is it a full moon tonight?

  43. avatar
    Deborah March 20, 2013 at 1:37 am #

    Linda does not write very well, but she has a blog and Facebook. She claims that her father was the Reverend Tracy Hardy (married to Florence Hardy). She says that Obama’s real father was murdered in a racist attack, and the mother, needing a birth certificate was married by her father the Reverend to Obama Sr. She says that Obama was born in Kansas. This is the essence of her claims on her blogs and Facebook- I do not know if they are true, and if not, if they have been debunked. I have not searched Dr. C’s site to verify the info- just translating it. Linda appears to be claiming that she is either a family member of Obama, and/or or a witness to some of these events. She claims that three people were murdered. She can be Googled.

  44. avatar
    aesthetocyst March 20, 2013 at 2:04 am #

    Andrew Vrba, PmG: Firing her into the sun will be the only way that feat can be accomplished.

    Please do not be so cavalier about the purity and integrity of our primary energy source. Fire her into someone else’s sun … preferably in another galaxy.

    I would suggest a black hole, but, according to Hawking, that would eventually spew her stupid all over the local cluster.

  45. avatar
    Deborah March 20, 2013 at 2:37 am #

    Dr. C wrote an article titled “Obama Birth Certificate Found in Kansas?” which I found in the Dr. C search engine when I typed in the name Linda Joy Adams. From the looks of it, she is African American, elderly (in her seventies or so) and not very literate. No one is taking her seriously. It appears that she is trying to communicate what sounds like a lynching episode.

    I have no idea if her claims are legitimate or not. I do recall Obama specifically said when he first came into office that “America would have to face up to it’s history”- which was a highly inflammatory remark to some at the time. Linda is claiming that Obama does not know the truth about his father (who she claims was lynched).

    Now have at it, Sherlocks. What if it is the truth?

  46. avatar
    justlw March 20, 2013 at 3:12 am #

    W. Kevin Vicklund: Looks like the judge is starting to get a bit testy over the recent filings and the general incompetence:

    The online version of Turbo Tax has various features throughout where, while you’re doing your taxes, you can ask questions to people of varying levels of expertise (IIRC, I think you can shoot questions into their various fora for free, or for money, chat with a Genyoowine CPA.)

    Taft should have the same kind of feature, where their various esteemed and illustrious alumni, for a low, low annual fee, have the ability to go online and press a [TALK TO A REAL LAWYER(TM)] button. Or maybe a Clippy-like thing:

    “It looks like you’re trying to serve the President in his personal capacity. Can I suggest you contact his private counsel?”

  47. avatar
    Deborah March 20, 2013 at 3:43 am #

    So far via Google, I have seen Linda Joy Adams make claims of being related to Obama, Palin and one of the Popes. (She also has a relative with the name Daniel Wayne Pope). She ties Westboro Baptist Church into all this, and claims that Hilary Clinton knew Stanley Dunham. Credibility meter is on low. She does make a claim to have filed an affadavit with the Sec.of the State of Kansas, and she claims that Stanley Dunham’s water broke on the back seat of a family vehicle and there may be DNA. Here’s a link below.

    http://unitedtruthseekers.com/profiles/blogs/president-obama-born-in-topeka-ks

  48. avatar
    bgansel9 March 20, 2013 at 4:33 am #

    ben: if thats the case in her deluded primal brain then she must be in collusion….with ?

    Hopefully one day with the United States justice system. This seditious “vexatious litigant” should be thrown out of the country.

  49. avatar
    Deborah March 20, 2013 at 4:42 am #

    We have to treat the mentally ill differently than we do. I did post a PBS video a couple weeks ago that prison over-population is the result of Regan de-institutionalization. The mentally ill are now housed in prisons. I don’t have the answer, but I just spent the hour researching Linda who posted above. This is mental illness, and maybe our intrigue with it is some view into ourselves. This is just sad to me, now. We call it entertainment but in reality I don’t think it is entertaining.

    Keith March 19, 2013 at 11:27 pm (Quote) #

    Thomas Brown: Bob:
    Legal Litterbug

    Superb epithet, my friend.

    Seconded.

    Ever since I read it I’ve been sitting here trying to top it… I got nothin’

  50. avatar
    Lupin March 20, 2013 at 4:58 am #

    My mother was formally diagnosed with Alzheimer in 2010, but when discussing her somewhat eccentric previous behavior,with her doctor, we agreed that there were signs of mild demential (chalked up to her eccentricity) as early as 2002.

    I recently read that people with Alzheimer lose 2% of their mental faculties EVERY MONTH. (I can’t find the source right now.)

    I wouldn’t be at all surprised if Orly was in the early stages of some kind of dementia.

  51. avatar
    Deborah March 20, 2013 at 5:15 am #

    I recently had to ask the family members of an elderly friend of mine with either Alzheimer’s or dementia to take away his guns, and they did. This was because there was a person in our town, very near his house who was threatening suicide (the cops ended up killing him) and my friend with dementia saw it on the news and thought someone had escaped from prison and he slept with a handgun next to his bed all night.

    Organic brain disease can be compounded by personality disorders, and certainly social problems. Society can only learn to become more empathic, and leave the treatments to doctors. My friend was lucky to have friends and family to intervene. Some people have no one, and many, such as the blacks, have in fact suffered horribly.

  52. avatar
    bgansel9 March 20, 2013 at 10:27 am #

    Ben, I shouldn’t post right after I wake up. I just realized your post said “collusion” and I read it as “collision.” Oops! LMAO My bad.

  53. avatar
    Jim March 20, 2013 at 11:12 am #

    Lupin:
    My mother was formally diagnosed with Alzheimer in 2010, but when discussing her somewhat eccentric previous behavior,with her doctor, we agreed that there were signs of mild demential (chalked up to her eccentricity) as early as 2002.

    My heart goes out to you Lupin, lost my father in 2010 after a long struggle with it. It’s no fun watching them waste away like that.

  54. avatar
    richCares March 20, 2013 at 11:13 am #

    “Now have at it, Sherlocks. What if it is the truth?”
    .
    the truth is that unicorns don’t have 2 horns and that has been verified

  55. avatar
    Woodrowfan March 20, 2013 at 11:25 am #

    Orly doesn’t surprise me, she’s mentally ill. It’s her husband and the people that follow and trust her that amaze me.

  56. avatar
    The Magic M March 20, 2013 at 11:53 am #

    Woodrowfan: It’s her husband

    Has anybody seen him lately? I still haven’t seen proof Orly didn’t murder him and spends all his money for birther lawsuits. Where is his life certificate? No court has yet ruled Orly did not murder her husband. I demand discovery!

    😉

  57. avatar
    Kiwiwriter March 20, 2013 at 12:37 pm #

    Rickey: Apparently it’s a sovereign citizen thing. Of course, Strunk isn’t sufficiently sovereign to refuse the Social Security benefits which he lives on.

    HAH! Like all of these rightwing nutters….Tom Metzger opposes welfare, but he takes it. Glenn Miller favored secession, but took his veterans’ benefits. Hypocrites and egomaniacs all.

  58. avatar
    Lupin March 20, 2013 at 1:06 pm #

    Jim: My heart goes out to you Lupin, lost my father in 2010 after a long struggle with it. It’s no fun watching them waste away like that.

    Thank you. It’s getting pretty bad.

  59. avatar
    donna March 20, 2013 at 1:45 pm #

    ORDER: Plaintiffs’ counsel has called and e-mailed chambers staff several times seeking
    legal advice or to ask questions about how to proceed with their suit. This communication is inappropriate. The Court directs Plaintiffs’ counsel to both the Federal Rules of Civil Procedure and the Eastern District of California’s Local Rules. Both sets of rules explain how parties should interact with the Court and how to litigate their lawsuit. Both sets of rules are available online. In the future, Plaintiffs’ counsel should consult both the Federal Rules of Civil Procedure and the Eastern District’s Local Rules before proceeding. Local Rules 200 – 305 apply to civil cases, like the one at hand. Local Rule 230 specifically deals with civil motions. In the future, Plaintiffs must comply with this rule.

    If Plaintiffs’ counsel wants to request something from the Court, she must file a noticed motion, which means she must file “a notice of motion, motion, accompanying briefs, affidavits, if appropriate, and copies of all documentary evidence that the moving party intends to submit in support of the motion.”

    [……]

    Chambers staff will disregard all communication that does not comply with both sets of rules.

    http://ia601604.us.archive.org/23/items/gov.uscourts.caed.248085/gov.uscourts.caed.248085.98.0.pdf?utm_medium=referral&utm_source=pulsenews

  60. avatar
    Rickey March 20, 2013 at 1:51 pm #

    Deborah:
    Linda does not write very well, but she has a blog and Facebook. She claims that her father was the Reverend Tracy Hardy (married to Florence Hardy). She says that Obama’s real father was murdered in a racist attack, and the mother, needing a birth certificate was married by her father the Reverend to Obama Sr. She says that Obama was born in Kansas. This is the essence of her claims on her blogs and Facebook- I do not know if they are true, and if not, if they have been debunked. I have not searched Dr. C’s site to verify the info- just translating it.Linda appears to be claiming that she is either a family member of Obama, and/or or a witness to some of these events. She claims that three people were murdered. She can be Googled.

    Linda clearly is deranged.

    If Obama’s “real father” had died before he was born, there would have been no need for Stanley Ann to get married in order to obtain a birth certificate. It certainly wouldn’t have been the first time a father died before his child was born.

    Also, there is no evidence that Stanley Ann was in Kansas in 1961. To believe Linda’s story you have to believe that Staney Ann flew from Hawaii to Kansas, gave birth, then flew back to Hawaii, and then flew to Washington in September to attend college. A birth in Kenya actually is slightly more plausible than Linda’s ramblings.

  61. avatar
    American Mzungu March 20, 2013 at 3:32 pm #

    Rickey: A birth in Kenya actually is slightly more plausible than Linda’s ramblings.

    Well, the fable about DARPA Mars time travel by Obama is also slightly more plausible than Linda’s ramblings.

  62. avatar
    Deborah March 20, 2013 at 6:59 pm #

    Rickey- I’ll answer later. Yes, the thread concluded with issues of mental illness, but more can be said on Linda’s claims.

    We are still on yesterday’s news? Oh crap, I was spending my time on Dr. C’s topic of the day- which has nothing to do with this thread, really. 🙂

  63. avatar
    Keith March 20, 2013 at 7:05 pm #

    Deborah: Linda does not write very well, but she has a blog and Facebook.

    Yes, she has dropped in here from time to time. Most people treat her like you would any crazy person in the street. She runs down after a while.

  64. avatar
    Deborah March 20, 2013 at 10:26 pm #

    Got it, Keith…I SAID that…:) But still, you have to at least listen.

  65. avatar
    The Magic M March 21, 2013 at 6:23 am #

    Rickey: To believe Linda’s story you have to believe that Staney Ann flew from Hawaii to Kansas, gave birth, then flew back to Hawaii, and then flew to Washington in September to attend college.

    Or just to believe Kansas is in Hawaii.

    I just watched “Idiocracy” last night and I’m reminded of this quote:

    Secretary of Defense: “And what about the nuc– nucular reactor in Florida? It’s broke and leaking or something’s happening.”
    Secretary of Energy: “I thought it was in Georgia.”
    Secretary of Defense: “Georgia’s in Florida, dumb ass.”

  66. avatar
    G March 23, 2013 at 10:18 pm #

    While I agree that the “government” should generally stay out of our bedrooms, I don’t understand your position on why you want to change marriage contracts to become a “church only” function. Please explain your rationale here…

    Deborah: Hopefully we’ll move in the direction where the government is out of the bedroom and marriages are performed by the church only.

  67. avatar
    G March 23, 2013 at 10:19 pm #

    My wife and I love that movie…because of references just like that one… 😉

    The Magic M: Or just to believe Kansas is in Hawaii.

    I just watched “Idiocracy” last night and I’m reminded of this quote:

    Secretary of Defense: “And what about the nuc– nucular reactor in Florida? It’s broke and leaking or something’s happening.”
    Secretary of Energy: “I thought it was in Georgia.”
    Secretary of Defense: “Georgia’s in Florida, dumb ass.”

  68. avatar
    G March 23, 2013 at 10:43 pm #

    Yeah, the whole mental illness situation in this country is a huge issue that we, as a society, need to find better (and more compassionate) answers of how to address and manage. I agree with you and many others who have identified the de-institutionalization efforts as something that seems to have caused more harm and problems then benefits. You also noted the compounding problems it provides to our out-of-control dysfunctional prison system too…another area that needs major rethinking and restructuring, beyond just the problem of being an ill-conceived solution to mental illness and substance addiction.

    I too don’t have the answers to how to fix and solve these problems and I am often conflicted on which mental illness situations cause me to feel sympathetic or not.

    For example, Linda here clearly has a type of mental illness in how her mind associates famous people she’s heard about into her “memories”…I’ve seen that type of mental illness several times before and I’m often sympathetic to the emotional mental state of the person (but not to the point of enabling or humoring them on the kooky things they say). In general, my experience with these types of folks is that their illness causes them to actually believe in and continuously build upon their fantasy re-imagined personal history…so I see them usually as victims of their mental association/memory gone awry…

    …but other clearly mentally ill people, such as Orly, are a different story. I have no sympathy for vindictive and out-of-control vexatious narcissist crazy people at all. I see them as harmful to themselves and society as a whole…and potentially dangerous (at least on the “inspire other crazy people” level, if not always the personal level) in their paranoid/martyr-complex aspects of their narcissistic mania.

    …Then there are the unhinged mentally ill folks who end up shooting and killing people…I have no sympathy for them roaming free untreated in society or getting access to weapons at all.

    Deborah: We have to treat the mentally ill differently than we do. I did post a PBS video a couple weeks ago that prison over-population is the result of Regan de-institutionalization. The mentally ill are now housed in prisons. I don’t have the answer, but I just spent the hour researching Linda who posted above. This is mental illness, and maybe our intrigue with it is some view into ourselves. This is just sad to me, now. We call it entertainment but in reality I don’t think it is entertaining.

  69. avatar
    Linda Joy Adams March 23, 2013 at 10:48 pm #

    You can read all the details on my own sites starts 7/26/12 and in Daily recaps/ Ann, the pres’s mother was sent to Fred Phelps at Westboro Baptist to go to school. and she got away. I’m a second cousin. of hers through her Dad Daniel Wayne Pope who stole the wall t of Stanley Dunham to go to WWII when too young. I knew the Dad. and 50+ years ago one needed a marriage certificate to not be ostracized by society. Today, people are not that self righteous. I have started posting pictures on m Linda Joy Adams at flickr. I ;m not making any money form this and it seems the pictures are making some nervous. There are very few eyewitnesses in the media any where on this. And the Pres himself said in 2004, in a required clip on s cspan recently, that he took what he;d been told and wove a story. Even David Mariness and others have admitted they had the Toepka Ks info and because the Pres wasn’t confirming it they didn’t follow through to check things out. Now millions have been invested in the fake bio created by his maternal grandmother and apparently also filed documents in Hawaii, too over concerns for safety.you have to start at the beginning to get the truth and that;s in Topeka Ks. I’m;m in a life and death struggle over govt corruption and that ;s on my sites, too. I was not on the Internet in 2008 and had no idea this birther movement has started as I voted for other relatives on the opposite ticket then. IN blogging to blow the whistle on govt corruption that includes a ‘let her die’ order on me which is well documented I began to learn aobut the controversy and tried to get someone to go to Ks as I;m hundreds of miles form there and get the public records, at least. and so far none will in the birther movement as it i proves he;s eleigible , just the wrong state. Orly Taitz has a judge in Topeka waiting for her to ask for the court order and she keeps losing cases as she has to get the real proof in a civil case. Its in Toepka ks. Linda Joy Adams

  70. avatar
    Arthur March 23, 2013 at 11:30 pm #

    Linda Joy Adams: You can read all the details on my own sites starts 7/26/12 and in Daily recaps/

    Linda,

    Even the people at Obama Release Your Records think you’re off your rocker. When those wackos dismiss you as nuts, that’s a level of crazy deserving of true recognition.

    Those who are about to lose their minds, salute you!

  71. avatar
    gorefan March 24, 2013 at 12:10 am #

    Linda Joy Adams:

    Have you been contacted by Carl Gallups or Mike Zullo?

  72. avatar
    Majority Will March 24, 2013 at 8:14 am #

    Arthur: Linda,

    Even the people at Obama Release Your Records think you’re off your rocker. When those wackos dismiss you as nuts, that’s a level of crazy deserving of true recognition.

    Those who are about to lose their minds, salute you!

    Her crap is not even good fiction.

  73. avatar
    Andrew Vrba, PmG March 24, 2013 at 8:23 am #

    Linda, do you know what you and Jehova’s Witnesses have in common? No one is listening to what you have to say.

  74. avatar
    Deborah March 24, 2013 at 3:12 pm #

    Weirdly, some research I have done found that Linda Joy Adams is a French guy impersonating a mentally ill person.

    Whatever the case, it’s plain that she is either mentally ill, or pretending. I’ve read her blog and Facebook fairly extensively. I gave it more it more attention than it deserved, just in case Obama’s family actually was the victim of a lynching. But in reading all through Linda’s blog and Facebook, I found that Linda also claims to be related to Sarah Palin and one of the Popes (in addition to having a relative with the last name Pope). She also claims that Hilary Clinton and Obama’s mother knew each other.

    Linda Joy Adams is not to be believed. You can just read her blog and Facebook and make that determination yourself.

    As far as mentally ill people of the caliber of Orly (those who don’t generate much empathy), I found the case of vexatious litigant Jack Thompson, the infamous lawyer who tried to bring down the video game industry and was finally disbarred. He, too, sued EVERYONE, and it appears that even disbarment will not stop him. After the Sandy Hook Elementary School massacre, once again he contacted the CEO of a video game manufacturer and left a message asking how it felt to have so much blood on his hands?

    http://explosivespam.wordpress.com/2011/10/19/what-is-wrong-with-jack-thompson/

    Article above titled What is Wrong with Jack Thompson?

  75. avatar
    Deborah March 24, 2013 at 3:32 pm #

    G- I just don’t think the government should regulate marriage OR divorce. I also think marriage is a “religion” and the state should stay out of it period…but, uh, this thread is kind of out of control and chaotic now and hard to keep up with. The topic will come up again with regard to inter-racial marriage and the citizenship rights of the children of inter-racial marriage. Some research I have done shows that in Israel, if you are born of a mixed marriage, you are denied citizenship rights, and/or your rights are reduced (can’t own property, etc.). More to come in a more orderly environment.

  76. avatar
    Linda Joy Adams March 24, 2013 at 3:51 pm #

    No one cares about the truth or eye witnesses which few have gotten anywhere in the media. I d not appreciate the snide remarks by those who were not present and did not live through all this. I had no idea that 10 months after I and my family prayed and decided to go public with the truth, no one will even check the available records and talk to the witnesses. Their moneys and reputations have been invested in a lie that Pres Obama;s ad mists is misreporting what he;d been told ad I know as eye witness that in 1/71 he was not to be told. What was the fear at such a late date? Ann, his mother still being able to identify ther attackers? Read very carefully wheat and how I;ve said, it. I may have to re post some of the earlier face book on this as some got lost as I had begun casting on there firs. I;ve tried to give you exactly what I knew firsthand and the step by step process of the whole learning process. Some are mad at me because I won;t just speculate and make up things as most have done that are published and made millions from untruths. I make no money form this and am exactly who I say I am.a 68 year old social security employee injured badly and up against a Goliath that has killed too many already. Until I began posting pictures on line of Pres Obama;s ancestors, most comments aren’t as rude? as what is on here. So some must be getting very nervous over the pics? for over 5 years, the main media and birthers have believed the president’s untruths of his bio, which the only issue is did he know and when did he know it and not come clean over it. Every positng of mine was e=mailed to the campaign and white house and still is n no one has asked me to stop. I want the Pres to know his full heritage so he can can know the full truth and its very possible from what I know and gleaned that is maternal grandmother almost got herself prosecuted for filing fake documents in Hawaii back in 1961, it was after I called Sheriff Joe ands asked them to check for a possible criminal file and had posted that also in Daily recaps, that his staff said he was f dropping the birth certificate investigation. Please go check things out before disparaging eye witnesses only interested in the truth being told and helping all of us through some terrible times with a president that no one will be honest with him, and that is;t good and why I personally think ( I was not there as eye witness on Benghazi) but why didn’t someone pond on his door and say we need you Mr President to take charge?) Why , enablers afraid to be honest with ther own president. Sorry birthers he has always been eligible to be the president and you have staked your money and reputations on a lie that he isn’t. Rather than blame me, who was not aware of the controversy as not on the Internet 6 years, ago and had not seen him for over a decade and then in a crowd and he had left before I realized who he was Blame the media who had the facts abot Toepka ks ands irked ther duty to vet the bio of the president and ask him directly about the Toepka Ks records.They a did not serve a us well, did they. and as for Orly Taitz she has to get the real proof and that;s in Toepka Ks and the Shawnee County Judge is waiting for her to ask for a court order for the records since last 9/12. I fled the affidavit and got on the phone with the staff as they spent over an hour getting the records together, death of real Dad 9 to rebut the husband Obama Sr being the Dad, ias some say he;s not natural born over that, and the birth at Forbes. Forget the two bios of Stanley Dunham mixed up between the real one, which the state of Ks authorities verified wasn’t his grandfather in trying to find relatives and t and my cousin Dan Pope, who stole his wallet to go to WWII and tricked the military and served at age 14 as an older man. She had free medical care at military hospital as his dependent . Ive tried very hard to separate eye witness form second hand and give all the leads possible for any one to check things out and pray they will stop colling eyewitnesses names and complete the real vetting of the president which the main media shirked ther duty on. What does this mean legally? Does the president have to go back and redo the forms for ballots and say, I didn’t know any better, no one told me. and will some of is enablers around him get fired? Following the truth is not always going to end up were one thinks it will. And I;m not in agreement with a lot of the politics going on right now and Congress is starting to wake up and get some basic laws passed to fix the death panels coming next year for all that we feds have had to deal with for way too long and I have dead co workers to prove how bad the corrupted federal system has been for way too long with political lappionees being allowed to stop criminal investigations and that didn’t;t start with Obama or even with Bush.

  77. avatar
    donna March 24, 2013 at 4:09 pm #

    Deborah:

    marriage licenses are issued by the states having nothing to do with religion – when members of the clergy officiate, they receive a fee – now, more and more are relying on family members and friends, who are ministers for the day, to officiate and omitting the clergy

    due to the full faith and credit clause in the constitution, marriage licenses from one state are accepted in every other state

    even when one state’s marriage laws conflict with those of another, the marriage licenses of that state are still accepted in other states

    Marriageable age in the US varies by state, but generally 18, with two exceptions: 19 in Nebraska and 21 in Mississippi. Most states, however, allow minors below 18 to marry (generally they have to be at least 16 but sometimes lower) with parental and/or judicial consent, and some states allow female minors below 18 to marry without parental or judicial consent if she is pregnant.

    those marriages are considered “valid” in every state regardless of state laws and who officiated

  78. avatar
    Linda Joy Adams March 24, 2013 at 4:29 pm #

    I believe in traditional marriage and that its a sacred sacrament, but many do not agree and this nation is divided with some states having constitutional amendments to state constitutions and over ther laws sharply divided over it. As my study of history, ( as i recall it) Its was the Roman Empire that made marriage the govt;s business. It was (always before?)) a contract, whether verbal or written and if ther;s spit, issues have to be divided over property and children, etc. Govt can;t get out of knowing who is responsible for the children but one can declare that at birth. Disagreements would still end up with got having to resolve any disputes. BUT the bigger issue is that the NEXT OF KIN RIGHTS got ignored and its a major problem. We live in a society where we can create our own families and often they are platonic arrangements. Still contract law. where disputes can be settled by govt courts. And if one is i a religion that doesn’t’; allow divorce, then or First amendment rights says one can leave the religion and go form another sect. with al the others that want divorce. I don’t; see any other way to solve the horrible divide created over a moral issue being imposed one way or another on all of us. Of course other laws will change. Income tax is based on marriage and it will have to be abolished for some other revenue creator, like a 1 cent sales tax on all items but food and medicine? Single payer health care, like Medicare rather than the scam by the New world order that;s being imposed on all of us next year, ( In the beginning the rationale for Medicare a single payer, was that families were changing and many were getting divorced and its was getting complicated,then, who would be on whose policy, in the mid 60″s. Food stamp entitlement is based on the income and resources of who eats at the table, not who is married to who… so an attempt was started 40 years ago to get the govt or of the bedroom and allow people to create ther own families whether platonic or otherwise. Maybe more stability in relationships might just occur. And no one is saying A Bride can;t have a wedding at a place of faith or in a more secular setting with loved ones and friends in attendance to publicly state their love.. Ron Paul mentioned this issue, but he never got much coverage to fully get a chance to explain what he meant, which may be different from what I mean. But Govt will still have a place in case of property disputes, or protection of minor children who are not considered old enough to make living arrangement choices and those responsible shirk that duty. The USA could give leadership to others of this world in this as they have already. Under the Roman Catholic state churches in Europe in the past, one had to be baptised member in the church to be a citizen. Makes the first amendment of the constitution of the USA, much more understandable what our founders were breaking free of in forming a nation with many varied beliefs. .

  79. avatar
    Majority Will March 24, 2013 at 4:55 pm #

    Deborah:
    Weirdly, some research I have done found that Linda Joy Adams is a French guy impersonating a mentally ill person.

    Whatever the case, it’s plain that she is either mentally ill, or pretending. I’ve read her blog and Facebook fairly extensively. I gave it more it more attention than it deserved, just in case Obama’s family actually was the victim of a lynching. But in reading all through Linda’s blog and Facebook, I found that Linda also claims to be related to Sarah Palin and one of the Popes (in addition to having a relative with the last name Pope). She also claims that Hilary Clinton and Obama’s mother knew each other.

    Linda Joy Adams is not to be believed. You can just read her blog and Facebook and make that determination yourself.

    As far as mentally ill people of the caliber of Orly (those who don’t generate much empathy), I found the case of vexatious litigant Jack Thompson, the infamous lawyer who tried to bring down the video game industry and was finally disbarred. He, too, sued EVERYONE, and it appears that even disbarment will not stop him. After the Sandy Hook Elementary School massacre, once again he contacted the CEO of a video game manufacturer and left a message asking how it felt to have so much blood on his hands?

    http://explosivespam.wordpress.com/2011/10/19/what-is-wrong-with-jack-thompson/

    Article above titled What is Wrong with Jack Thompson?

    Re: French guy impersonating a mentally ill person.

    Geir Smith?

  80. avatar
    Kiwiwriter March 24, 2013 at 5:20 pm #

    Linda Joy Adams, I believe you need to take a basic English class, and learn about spelling, grammar, punctuation, and paragraphing.

  81. avatar
    J.D. Sue March 24, 2013 at 8:08 pm #

    Deborah: I just don’t think the government should regulate marriage OR divorce. I also think marriage is a “religion” and the state should stay out of it period…but, uh, this thread is kind of out of control and chaotic now and hard to keep up with. The topic will come up again with regard to inter-racial marriage and the citizenship rights of the children of inter-racial marriage. Some research I have done shows that in Israel, if you are born of a mixed marriage, you are denied citizenship rights, and/or your rights are reduced (can’t own property, etc.).


    Hmmm, I think your research might make you rethink the religious angle, particularly if you look at Israel as an example. As a preliminary matter, the intermarriage legal issue in Israel is not based on race at all! It is entirely based on religion; in Israel a mixed marriage is between people of different religious backgrounds; people of difference races but the same religion are not legally considered mixed marriages In Israel, the marriage laws are the way they are BECAUSE of the influence of religious institutions; the extremely orthodox have tremendous influence on politics and particularly family-related laws (e.g., marriage, burial, inheritance) based on strict religious law. It’s a real problem and much to the chagrin of Everyone except the very religious.

    In the US, marriage laws govern legal responsibilities/rights and assets/liabilities of the married couple. Only a government can regulate such things, but at least in the US the religious institutions have less political control over those laws. I understand you have issues with the family law courts and I don’t blame you, but having churches run everything is not the answer to those problems.

  82. avatar
    Paul Pieniezny March 24, 2013 at 8:23 pm #

    Kiwiwriter:
    Linda Joy Adams, I believe you need to take a basic English class, and learn about spelling, grammar, punctuation, and paragraphing.

    I am afraid that if she mended those, it would just be even clearer that her arguments are nutty because her grasp of history is even weaker than her grasp of language. Income tax is based on marriage? WTF.

  83. avatar
    Kiwiwriter March 24, 2013 at 9:58 pm #

    Paul Pieniezny: I am afraid that if she mended those, it would just be even clearer that her arguments are nutty because her grasp of history is even weaker than her grasp of language. Income tax is based on marriage? WTF.

    Well, at least if she followed the English language, I could rip her bloody for her case. The appalling way she writes, I can’t follow her argument, let alone trash it.

    I try to comfort myself in knowing that 95 percent of the public has probably never heard of Orly Taitz, that there are 50,000 people on the Secret Service’s “Watch List,” (lunacy is actually slightly common), and that more people think Elvis is alive than think the Holocaust did not happen.

  84. avatar
    Keith March 24, 2013 at 11:42 pm #

    Deborah: Article above titled What is Wrong with Jack Thompson?

    Ain’t nothin’ wrong with Jack Thompson, mate!

    He’s a great actor, and a great representative of all things Aussie.

  85. avatar
    Keith March 24, 2013 at 11:44 pm #

    Linda Joy Adams: No one cares…

    You got that right.

    By the way, paragraphs are your friend.

  86. avatar
    bovril March 25, 2013 at 5:32 am #

    Linda,

    Seriously, seek professional, qualified psychiatric help as a matter or urgency.

    Your fact free diatribes or rather stream of consciousness dumps, bear exactly zero relationship to reality.

    The President was not born in Topeka, KY
    You were not present at his birth
    No Shawnee County judge is waiting for anything
    You never, ever met the Presidents mother, nor are you related to her
    You are not a relation of Pope John Paul II

    Now, I’m sure your a nice person and I don’t class you in the same bucket of filth that houses Taitz, Berg, Corsi, Farah, Zullo et-al. You are however profoundly ….mistaken…in your beliefs and need to assess your stories against reality.

    I do hope you gain the help and support you plainly need and wish you the best in a hopeful recovery.

  87. avatar
    Dr Kenneth Noisewater March 25, 2013 at 12:15 pm #

    Linda Joy Adams: I realized who he was Blame the media who had the facts abot Toepka ks ands irked ther duty to vet the bio of the president and ask him directly about the Toepka Ks records.They a did not serve a us well, did they. and as for Orly Taitz she has to get the real proof and that;s in Toepka Ks and the Shawnee County Judge is waiting for her to ask for a court order for the records since last 9/12

    How does your claim compare to another nutter with three names claiming Obama was born in Washington State? You can’t both be right. You should make up a new story.

  88. avatar
    Sef March 25, 2013 at 12:51 pm #

    Dr Kenneth Noisewater: How does your claim compare to another nutter with three names claiming Obama was born in Washington State?You can’t both be right.You should make up a new story.

    What happened to the Florida nutcase who said the President was the son of Pablo Escobar?

  89. avatar
    The Magic M March 25, 2013 at 12:56 pm #

    Dr Kenneth Noisewater: How does your claim compare to another nutter with three names claiming Obama was born in Washington State? You can’t both be right.

    You probably gotta factor in “The Boys from Brazil” lore somewhere:

    Conspiracy Theory #39, revised edition:
    One of my arguments (for the sake of argument only) against the “50 year conspiracy” theory was that it would be epically dumb for such a plan to hinge on a single person (Obama could’ve died in an accident, or from a disease, or any other thing that could’ve derailed a plan that depended on grooming and protecting a single person for 5 decades to ultimately reach the goal of becoming President).
    Therefore, it would only be “logical” to assume that the Almighty Konspeeracee [tm] cloned Obama at least 3 times to have some backup.
    One of these Obamas was born in Hawaii, another in Kenya, the third in Topeka and the fourth in Washington State, and there may be others.
    This explains why Obama has a Hawaiian BC (clone #1), yet some Kenyan sources say Kenyan birth (clone #2) and his cousin and wife of Pope Francis, Linda Lovejoy, know he was born in Kansas (clone #3) etc.
    It also explains the conflicting birther claims how Obama could’ve been in College and Pakistan at the same time.

    See, if you gotta believe in a conspiracy theory, you could at least choose a consistent one. 😉

    I wonder why conspiracy theories are never like the ones I make up but always require “omnipotent” and “incredibly stupid” at the same time.
    I know that’s always the case, but I don’t know the psychological reason. Maybe believing in a conspiracy theory that is just omnipotent (and not also incredibly stupid) is too depressing and takes away the “if we can uncover it, we can end it” belief. Or it’s the belief that the conspirators cannot possibly be as intelligent as the “enlightened discoverers” and need to be “low-life sub-humans whose only power is money”.

  90. avatar
    Daniel March 25, 2013 at 1:05 pm #

    Linda Joy Adams: I believe in traditional marriage and that its a sacred sacrament,

    Are you referring to traditional. biblical marriage?

    That being, of course, between one man, and as many women as he could afford to purchase…

  91. avatar
    Daniel March 25, 2013 at 1:07 pm #

    Linda Joy Adams: No one cares about the truth or eye witnesses which few have gotten anywhere in the media. I d not appreciate the snide remarks by those who were not present and did not live through all this. I had no idea that 10 months after I and my family prayed and decided to go public with the truth, no one will even check the available records and talk to the witnesses.

    Eye witnesses have limitations. For instance, people who are insane and suffer from delusions or hallucinations, like yourself, firmly believe what they see, yet are not reliable witnesses, not matter how good their intent.

  92. avatar
    Kiwiwriter March 26, 2013 at 1:31 pm #

    bovril:
    Linda,

    Seriously, seek professional, qualified psychiatric help as a matter or urgency.

    Your fact free diatribes or rather stream of consciousness dumps, bear exactly zero relationship to reality.

    The President was not born in Topeka, KY
    You were not present at his birth
    No Shawnee County judge is waiting for anything
    You never, ever met the Presidents mother, nor are you related to her
    You are not a relation of Pope John Paul II

    Now, I’m sure your a nice person and I don’t class you in the same bucket of filth that houses Taitz, Berg, Corsi, Farah, Zullo et-al. You are however profoundly ….mistaken…in your beliefs and need to assess your stories against reality.

    I do hope you gain the help and support you plainly need and wish you the best in a hopeful recovery.

    Hey, she lives in a nice little house…right next to reality.

  93. avatar
    Deborah March 26, 2013 at 7:39 pm #

    Keith- not the actor, the disbarred attorney, Jack Thompson, who sued “everyone”. Link below.

    http://explosivespam.wordpress.com/2011/10/19/what-is-wrong-with-jack-thompson/

    Majority Will- yes, I believe it is Geir I found on a site called Before It’s News. I cannot tell if he and Linda Joy Adams are the same, or two different people. Probably different, but he posts frequently on Adams, and he claims to be a Messiah of sorts against “Antichrist” Obama.

    Donna and JD Sue- in my case it is a divorce agreement that was not given full faith and credit recognition. Anyhow, I don’t have a perfect theory, of course, but marriage and divorce should be a consent issue only, and handled only by a consent organization, such as a church, not law enforcement. I’m aware of Israel’s marriage policies- in that case it appears that race IS a religion.

    Sorry if I got any names mixed up here- it’s hard to answer multiple posts on a thread that is a few days old.

  94. avatar
    G March 26, 2013 at 7:57 pm #

    Crazy Geir has posted here under his own moniker several times in the past. I remain unconvinced that he is also posing as Linda. I think they are two different people.

    Deborah:
    Here is some of Geir’s incoherency:

    http://beforeitsnews.com/obama-birthplace-controversy/2013/03/obama-can-help-us-find-his-archives-in-kansas-obama-cousin-takes-birthers-head-thanks-me-geir-smith-again-thanks-linda-for-that-2458396.html

  95. avatar
    MattR March 26, 2013 at 8:20 pm #

    Deborah: Anyhow, I don’t have a perfect theory, of course, but marriage and divorce should be a consent issue only, and handled only by a consent organization, such as a church, not law enforcement

    If marriage becomes a striclty religious institution then it would lose all the legal benefits that come with it.

  96. avatar
    donna March 26, 2013 at 9:09 pm #

    Deborah: marriage licenses are granted by individual states and recognized by every other states

    NO religious institution is needed except for the FEE they collect to officiate – in fact, today, many opt for friends and family members, as ministers for the day, to officiate –

    divorces are decided by the states pursuant to statutes

    MattR: If marriage becomes a striclty religious institution then it would lose all the legal benefits that come with it.

    can you IMAGINE? it’s bad enough that religious institutions meddle in health issues – in my end of life directives, i have designated that i am never to go to a catholic or catholic merged hospitals which would ignore my wishes

  97. avatar
    Deborah March 27, 2013 at 12:08 am #

    MattR March 26, 2013 at 8:20 pm (Quote) #

    If marriage becomes a striclty religious institution then it would lose all the legal benefits that come with it.

    Those “benefits” can become terrible detriments when getting a divorce. There is frequently a targeted parent that gets alienated and is forced to live under a bridge and drive a bicycle the rest of his life.

    I’m opposed to government regulated marriage, period. If two people want to consent, if two people believe marriage is a “religion” of “love” then fine- it should all be consensual within a non-law-enforcement setting.

    As an aside, having nothing to do with this topic, I have noticed that in reading some of the issues in birtherstan I start to boil up and sweat with shame and humiliation over the bigotry of my fellow Americans, the worst of them combining religion and bigotry.

  98. avatar
    Majority Will March 27, 2013 at 4:58 am #

    MattR: If marriage becomes a striclty religious institution then it would lose all the legal benefits that come with it.

    Here are related remarks on marriage equality and the law from a friend of a friend:

    For those who do not know, the primary reason for marriage equality is not just to have the title of “marriage.” Domestic partnership is not legally the same thing as a marriage, because the Federal government does not recognize State government domestic partnerships as marriage. As a result: A friend of mine who has been with his boyfriend (Italian) cannot get a green card to allow his boyfriend to emigrate to the US. Domestic partners are counted as “single” for Federal taxes (they do not receive the marriage tax benefit, and are basically financially penalized for being gay). Spousal benefits (health care, etc.) are counted as taxable income at the Federal level. If a lesbian has a biological baby, her partner must go through a process of second-parent adoption, rather than automatically being a parent. Inheritances, social security, and pensions are not under the same rules that heterosexual couples enjoy. The list goes on and on. Marriage equality is not about changing religious ideals of marriage. No one can tell a priest, pastor, or rabbi they must marry same-sex couples. Marriage equality is about the *civil* union — what our Federal government legally recognizes. As such, all people should be entitled to equal *civil* rights, regardless of whether religions choose to recognize it as marriage or not. Same-sex couples should not face barriers to immigration and tax penalties that other Americans do not… that is institutional discrimination.

  99. avatar
    The Magic M March 27, 2013 at 5:05 am #

    donna: in my end of life directives, i have designated that i am never to go to a catholic or catholic merged hospitals which would ignore my wishes

    Same here. Couple weeks ago there was a big scandal in Germany when a Catholic hospital refused treatment to a rape victim because regulations say they would also have been obliged to inform the woman about the “morning after pill” (which the church still is against).

  100. avatar
    J.D. Sue March 27, 2013 at 12:45 pm #

    Deborah: I’m aware of Israel’s marriage policies- in that case it appears that race IS a religion.

    —-

    This is nonsense; there are Jews of all races in and outside of Israel.

  101. avatar
    Majority Will March 27, 2013 at 12:53 pm #

    J.D. Sue: —-

    This is nonsense; there are Jews of all races in and outside of Israel.

    Yep.

  102. avatar
    G March 27, 2013 at 1:12 pm #

    You are certainly not alone in feeling that way. Reading that filth can make one really cynical about hope for humanity in general…

    Deborah: As an aside, having nothing to do with this topic, I have noticed that in reading some of the issues in birtherstan I start to boil up and sweat with shame and humiliation over the bigotry of my fellow Americans, the worst of them combining religion and bigotry.

  103. avatar
    G March 27, 2013 at 1:17 pm #

    Very well said. That really is the crux of the matter. Religious institutions simply don’t have to marry anyone they don’t wish too. But they have no right to impose their will upon secular institutions nor upon civil government.

    Their religious rights are still being respected and protected; they just refuse to respect the rights of those outside of their particular sect.

    Majority Will: Marriage equality is not about changing religious ideals of marriage. No one can tell a priest, pastor, or rabbi they must marry same-sex couples. Marriage equality is about the *civil* union — what our Federal government legally recognizes. As such, all people should be entitled to equal *civil* rights, regardless of whether religions choose to recognize it as marriage or not. Same-sex couples should not face barriers to immigration and tax penalties that other Americans do not… that is institutional discrimination.

  104. avatar
    J.D. Sue March 27, 2013 at 2:21 pm #

    Majority Will: Marriage equality is about the *civil* union — what our Federal government legally recognizes. As such, all people should be entitled to equal *civil* rights, regardless of whether religions choose to recognize it as marriage or not. Same-sex couples should not face barriers to immigration and tax penalties that other Americans do not… that is institutional discrimination.

    —-
    Exactly. It’s about 14th amendment equal protection under the law.

  105. avatar
    MattR March 27, 2013 at 2:24 pm #

    G:
    Very well said.That really is the crux of the matter.Religious institutions simply don’t have to marry anyone they don’t wish to.But they have no right to impose their will upon secular institutions nor upon civil government.

    I think it is worth emphasizing that this already applies in general and would not be anything new if same sex marriage became legal across the USA. My mother is Jewish and my father is Catholic. He wanted to get married in a church but they had a very hard time finding a priest who was willing to perform a ceremony with a Jewish bride.

  106. avatar
    misha marinsky March 27, 2013 at 2:39 pm #

    Deborah: the worst of them combining religion and bigotry.

    religion + GOP = fascism

    When fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying a cross. – Sinclair Lewis

  107. avatar
    misha marinsky March 27, 2013 at 3:01 pm #

    Sef: the President was the son of Pablo Escobar?

    He’s not? Uh, oh.

  108. avatar
    G March 27, 2013 at 4:49 pm #

    Agreed!

    Coming from a Catholic background, I know many similar stories. But I also know people from other strict sects that were even more against marriage between members of their church and anyone deemed “outside” of it…

    So yeah, its always been that way and legalization of gay marriage wouldn’t be really changing anything at all from how religious institutions already behave.

    MattR: I think it is worth emphasizing that this already applies in general and would not be anything new if same sex marriage became legal across the USA. My mother is Jewish and my father is Catholic. He wanted to get married in a church but they had a very hard time finding a priest who was willing to perform a ceremony with a Jewish bride.

    G: Religious institutions simply don’t have to marry anyone they don’t wish too.

  109. avatar
    MattR March 28, 2013 at 12:45 am #

    G: But I also know people from other strict sects that were even more against marriage between members of their church and anyone deemed “outside” of it…

    I forgot to mention that my mother’s father didn’t speak to her for 25+ years because she married outside the faith, though they semi-reconciled before he died.

  110. avatar
    The Magic M March 28, 2013 at 7:02 am #

    J.D. Sue: This is nonsense; there are Jews of all races in and outside of Israel.

    Exactly. In my first year at university, I dated a Jewish Ethiopian (based on today’s borders, I’d have to say “Jewish Eritrean”). Black and Jewish, a nightmare for my father. 😉

    I suppose the confusion comes from the Jewish principle “everyone with a Jewish mother is considered a Jew” – it sounds like a racial classification when it is a religious one.

    Sometimes I cringe when I see how German newspaper writers twist themselves in a knot to avoid saying someone’s a Jew and instead write things like “He was born the son of a Jewish tailor”. I never see anyone write “He was born the son of a Christian tailor.” As if being Jewish was genetic, or descended from the father.

  111. avatar
    misha marinsky March 28, 2013 at 9:27 am #

    J.D. Sue: This is nonsense; there are Jews of all races in and outside of Israel.

    My father was a pistol, and I’m a son of a gun.

  112. avatar
    J.D. Sue March 28, 2013 at 4:03 pm #

    The Magic M: Sometimes I cringe when I see how German newspaper writers twist themselves in a knot to avoid saying someone’s a Jew and instead write things like “He was born the son of a Jewish tailor”. I never see anyone write “He was born the son of a Christian tailor.”

    —-
    In the U.S., about a decade ago, we went through a “politically-correct” period where some people/institutions insisted it was more proper to say someone “just happened to be Jewish” instead of saying “Jewish”, or “just happened to be black (or fill in the blank).” I may be out of touch, but I think they gave up on that wordy stuff. I found it insulting, as if who we is just a mean twist of fate, as if all that wordiness was needed to soften our identities. They probably meant well, but it felt insulting. Also, until fairly recently, in the US it was common to see newspapers always mention when someone was black, and not mention race if the person was white (like in your Jewish/Christian example in Germany). Of course, in birtherstan, they still practice this custom…

    I imagine that Germany is still feeling its way to resolve and get past its history on this issue. In the 1980s I traveled to Israel and was shocked and pleased to see so many young Germans visiting and learning there. Today, I have an Israeli nephew who is an artist in Berlin. Things certainly have changed from our fathers’ day…

  113. avatar
    Kiwiwriter March 28, 2013 at 4:32 pm #

    Oddly enough, a lot of Jews have been moving to Germany from Russia, taking advantage of the economy and social structures. The Jewish community in Berlin is actually growing these days.

    I’ve always said that if I ever go to Israel, I would take Lufthansa, and ask for a kosher meal. I’d be guaranteed first-rate service. And they do fly there, via the hub at Frankfurt.

  114. avatar
    misha marinsky March 28, 2013 at 4:46 pm #

    Kiwiwriter: Oddly enough, a lot of Jews have been moving to Germany from Russia

    Before the Wall came down, West Berlin was a dying city. When someone graduated from high school, they left.

    Berlin was kept alive by Soviet-Jewish émigrés, who went there instead of Israel.

  115. avatar
    Kiwiwriter March 28, 2013 at 6:16 pm #

    misha marinsky: Before the Wall came down, West Berlin was a dying city. When someone graduated from high school, they left.

    Berlin was kept alive by Soviet-Jewish émigrés, who went there instead of Israel.

    Well, I’m glad Berlin is getting a third act. It is a great city, and Germany has suffered a great many self-inflicted wounds, Berlin in particular.

    It is very unfortunate that the nation of “Kultur” and “Light,” the land of Goethe, Hegel, Beethoven, and Schiller, has at the same time been such a blight on humanity. But I think the Germans have learned their lesson.

    And it’s worth noting that when German troops fought as part of NATO in Bosnia and Afghanistan, it was the first time in history that German troops gave their lives for democracy.