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The best defense

“The best defense is a good offense” or so the saying goes.

I had an email from Deep Birther alerting me about an article that ties the Herman Cain sexual harassment story, being discussed on our open thread, to Obama Conspiracies beyond the crazy assertions repeated by Rush Limbaugh that David Axelrod was behind the business.

I have no opinion about whether Herman Cain is guilty of serial sexual harassment, or a victim of a political smear. Both seem equally plausible. What’s interesting is how the story is spun and how folks on both sides seem to align their opinion to broader political affiliations. I found a juicy bit of pro-Cain spin at the HillBuzz web site.

Last week, the agenda-driven, drive-by media trashed Republican presidential candidate Herman Cain with unsubstantiated and poorly sourced sexual innuendo.

And in defense of Cain, the author, Kevin DuJan, goes on the offensive:

This week, let’s all talk about Democrat President Barack Obama being gay, him sexually harassing male actor Kal Penn, and his frequenting of Chicago gay bathhouse “Man’s Country” –” using the Left’s established precedent for journalistic integrity when it comes to rumor and gossip.

I think the article is more of an attack on the “liberal media” than it is against Barack Obama.

Sometimes these stories reach a consensus, such as in the case of Bill Clinton. Sometimes they just linger on as in the case of Clarence Thomas. The Obama story seems to have fizzled (except for birthers who just keep going and going and going). We’ll have wait and see about Herman Cain.

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54 Responses to The best defense

  1. avatar
    Jody November 12, 2011 at 10:18 pm #

    Since Kalpen Modi (state name Kal Penn) is still with the Office of Public Engagement – here’s his Whitehouse.gov webpage http://www.whitehouse.gov/administration/eop/ope/staff/Kalpen-Modi – I’d say that the premise that he left because he was being sexually harassed is easily debunked. A quick check of his wikipedia page would have saved them some embarrassment there.

  2. avatar
    Dave November 12, 2011 at 10:40 pm #

    The wingnut crowd has long since developed a reflex of responding to negative news about conservatives by labelling it as a liberal lie. But here we are in a GOP nomination battle where only one candidate can win, which will necessarily involve making the others lose. Mud is going to get thrown. Sooner or later it’s going to become difficult to maintain the line that negative stuff about conservatives only comes from liberals.

  3. avatar
    misha November 13, 2011 at 12:33 am #

    Anyone see the real pattern:

    Shrub GW Bush: God told me to invade Iraq. Ha! God told me to buy wholesale.

    Now it’s the pizza man’s turn: Cain says God persuaded him to run. But only if Cain delivers like Domino’s.

    When someone talks to God, they are praying. When someone gets an answer, they are schizophrenic.

  4. avatar
    Keith November 13, 2011 at 1:06 am #

    I saw a political cartoon that sort of approached this topic in the paper yesterday, but I can’t find it now to discover the artist, so I can’t link you to the actual cartoon.

    The best I can do is link to this similar cartoon, by Stahler of the Columbus Dispatch.

    The scene is similar, but the speech bubble has a different caption. Two folks in front of the TV when the GOP debates come on. In the one I’m referring to the caption reads:

    “I wish they would stop putting on so many of these Democratic Party advertisements.”

    Or words to that effect.

    I mean really, all the Democrats have to do put these things on constant replay every night in October of 2012.

    (Stahler is not the artist of the cartoon I saw yesterday, and I apologize to that actual artist that I cannot identify him to give hem credit.)

  5. avatar
    Obsolete November 13, 2011 at 1:12 am #

    Did Obama (or his employer) settle financially with anyone for sexually harassing them? No? Then it is not the same as Cain.

  6. avatar
    Lupin November 13, 2011 at 4:45 am #

    Obsolete: Did Obama (or his employer) settle financially with anyone for sexually harassing them? No? Then it is not the same as Cain.

    I was just going to say that.

  7. avatar
    Lupin November 13, 2011 at 4:46 am #

    I could be wrong, but don’t you think Obama’s team would be DELIGHTED to run against Cain?

  8. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy November 13, 2011 at 7:24 am #

    Perhaps this is the cartoon you meant:

    http://0.tqn.com/d/politicalhumor/1/0/3/L/4/GOP-Obama-Commercials.jpg

    Keith: I saw a political cartoon that sort of approached this topic in the paper yesterday, but I can’t find it now to discover the artist, so I can’t link you to the actual cartoon.

  9. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy November 13, 2011 at 8:22 am #

    Here’s a political cartoon on the Cain harassment story:

    http://0.tqn.com/d/politicalhumor/1/0/F/K/4/herman-cain-grope.jpg

  10. avatar
    Loren November 13, 2011 at 8:55 am #

    Interesting thing about the Kal Penn mention…as best as I can tell, those allegations actually BEGAN with Mr. DuJan. It’s just his own wild speculation, based on nothing more than 1) Penn worked for Obama, 2) Penn stopped working for Obama, and 3) Penn was mugged while living in DC.

  11. avatar
    Loren November 13, 2011 at 9:00 am #

    Wait, sorry, I forgot to mention that when he first posited a gay relationship between the two, he added an update citing another source who supposedly agreed with him:

    Larry Sinclair.

    http://hillbuzz.org/what-was-kal-penn-doing-at-dupont-circle-after-midnight

  12. avatar
    Jim F November 13, 2011 at 11:08 am #

    So God has made a prediction. What happens if Mr Cain loses? This could be serious.
    Seriously, what makes anyone think that God is the interested enough in US politics to be giving advise to any candidate. Do Americans actually believe this stuff?

  13. avatar
    Majority Will November 13, 2011 at 12:19 pm #

    Jim F: What happens if Mr Cain loses?

    They’ll probably blame Satan who I’ve heard, coincidentally, is a serial groper, fear monger and lover of really crappy fast food.

  14. avatar
    Norbrook November 13, 2011 at 2:35 pm #

    Let’s see, as far as I can tell, God has told Michele Bachmann, Rick Perry, and now, Herman Cain to run. At least according to their own statements. Which leads me to believe that either they’re lying, schizophrenic, or God has a nasty sense of humor when it comes to politics.

  15. avatar
    Keith November 13, 2011 at 3:27 pm #

    Dr. Conspiracy:
    Perhaps this is the cartoon you meant:

    http://0.tqn.com/d/politicalhumor/1/0/3/L/4/GOP-Obama-Commercials.jpg

    That’s the one!

    Thanks.

  16. avatar
    Keith November 13, 2011 at 3:29 pm #

    Norbrook:
    Let’s see, as far as I can tell, God has told Michele Bachmann, Rick Perry, and now, Herman Cain to run.At least according to their own statements.Which leads me to believe that either they’re lying, schizophrenic, or God has a nasty sense of humor when it comes to politics.

    Or maybe God is trying to ensure a win for Obama?

  17. avatar
    Sally HIll November 13, 2011 at 3:48 pm #

    Obsolete: No? Then it is not the same as Cain.

    And you know this how?

    Because the media never reported on it – that will be a cold day in heII.
    Or
    Did you ask Obama himself if he ever settled any sexual harassment charges?
    Yeah – I didn’t think so.

  18. avatar
    Sally HIll November 13, 2011 at 3:58 pm #

    On second thought – it really wouldn’t matter if you had ask him yourself.

    Given his track record on telling the truth, I’d say chances are pretty good that his answer would likely be a lie.

  19. avatar
    Scientist November 13, 2011 at 4:53 pm #

    Sally HIll: Did you ask Obama himself if he ever settled any sexual harassment charges?

    No one ever asked Cain until the FACT that his employer had paid settlements ended up in the hands of Politico. They gave him 10 days to respond, yet his incompetent campaign appeared flat-footed when the story came out and appears so up to today.

    If a reporter had such information on Obama, then you would have herad about it. It would be a career-maker and no reporter would sit on it. Whatever political sympathies a reporter might have their career will always be #1.. So do you, Sally Hill have evidence that Obama has ever paid a settlemment for sexual harassment or for anything else? Either bring it forward or shut your pie hole.

  20. avatar
    Jamese777 November 13, 2011 at 7:16 pm #

    “Cain’s Image Showing Signs of Decline Amid Allegations”
    http://www.gallup.com/poll/150641/cain-image-showing-signs-decline-amid-allegations.aspx

    Latest Cain-Obama Matchup Polling
    realclearpolitics.com average:
    10/7 – 11/8

    Obama: 49.1
    Cain: 41.1
    Obama +8.0
    http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2012/president/president_obama_vs_republican_candidates.html

  21. avatar
    Northland10 November 13, 2011 at 7:17 pm #

    Sally HIll: Given his track record on telling the truth, I’d say chances are pretty good that his answer would likely be a lie.

    Maybe you would like to give an example of his many lies with actual proof, facts and evidence. Just saying does not make it true. Though politicians have a tendency to stretch the truth in ways that would make a contortionist jealous, you claim that he always lies is lacking proof.

  22. avatar
    Scientist November 13, 2011 at 7:28 pm #

    Interestingly there was a piece on Kal Penn in today’s NYT. Not only is he making NO allegations regarding harassment, he loved working at the White House, has signed up to work on Obama’s re-election and would love to work at the White House in Obama’s second term. He took a sabbatical to film the 3rd “Harold and Kumar” movie.
    http://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/13/fashion/kal-penn-returns-to-movies-from-the-white-house.html?ref=fashion

    The charge Kevin DuJan is not only completely lacking in support, it is ludicrous.

  23. avatar
    US Citizen November 13, 2011 at 8:14 pm #

    I personally find Cain to be an opportunist.
    A black man who takes an Italian story’s name, the book and movie written and directed by Italians and uses it for marketing is about as ludicrous as an Italian marketing himself as a homeboy rapper.

    This isn’t a racist dig as much as it is a comment on honesty.
    If Cain is willing to market himself in such sheep’s clothing, he has the potential to change his persona to anything else that profits him.
    This is exemplified by his sexual conquests where he’s obviously felt license to do as he pleases and then deny it once caught.
    Again, dishonesty.

    And to what degree has Mr. Cain studied law or government?
    Did he dedicate his life to helping and serving others or simply finding a marketing scheme that served his purposes?
    One could say that Jimmy Carter was a peanut farmer, but he was a senator and governor before he was president.
    Cain appears to be the GOPs answer to quell racism as the reason Obama won, but in doing so appears to validate race as a reason to enter politics instead.

  24. avatar
    J. Edward Tremlett November 13, 2011 at 8:47 pm #

    There’s a really good cartoon that has a tv commentator saying that Obama is getting a free pass from the Media because he’s black, and in the next panel he’s shrieking that the media is attacking Cain because he’s black.

  25. avatar
    Rickey November 13, 2011 at 9:15 pm #

    US Citizen:
    I personally find Cain to be an opportunist.
    A black man who takes an Italian story’s name, the book and movie written and directed by Italians and uses it for marketing is about as ludicrous as an Italian marketing himself as a homeboy rapper.

    In in the interest of fairness, Cain had nothing to do with naming Godfather’s Pizza. The company was established in 1974 and Cain didn’t become involved until 1986.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godfather%27s_Pizza

  26. avatar
    Rickey November 13, 2011 at 9:24 pm #

    Sally HIll: And you know this how?

    Because the media never reported on it – that will be a cold day in heII.
    Or
    Did you ask Obama himself if he ever settled any sexual harassment charges?
    Yeah – I didn’t think so.

    As if Fox News would bury the story if a woman came forward with evidence that Obama had paid her $35,000 to settle a sexual harassment claim.

    I am always amused by the way you right-wingers continue to claim that the media is in the tank for Obama, as if media figures such as Bill O’Reilly, Sean Hannity, Ann Coulter, Rush Limbaurgh, et al. do not exist.

  27. avatar
    Dr Kenneth Noisewater (Bob Ross) November 13, 2011 at 9:39 pm #

    Sally HIll:
    On second thought – it really wouldn’t matter if you had ask him yourself.

    Given his track record on telling the truth, I’d say chances are pretty good that his answer would likely be a lie.

    There you go making baseless assumptions again but as with the rest of your thoughts you just make stuff up.

  28. avatar
    Obsolete November 14, 2011 at 1:09 am #

    It really burns birther-enablers like Sally Hill that by all accounts, Obama is in a great marriage, is an ideal father, and has great kids.
    They love sinners and liars like Cain, who shout the loudest about being Christian while actually doing the least in their lives to follow Christ. They are fooled by the loudest voice.

  29. avatar
    Obsolete November 14, 2011 at 1:14 am #

    Does anyone else see the similarities between Cain supporters and Penn State supporters? They both support liars, sinners, and sexual aggressors who use their power to abuse and cover it up.
    Their supporters have thrown out common sense to worship their true God, Football or the wealthy elite.

  30. avatar
    Lawyerwitharealdegree November 14, 2011 at 1:49 am #

    It’s kind of disappointing to read this entry by DocC. He completely overlooks the fact that two women were paid an entire year’s salary to settle their sexual harassment claims. I have handled sexual harassment claims, and I can assure you that sums equal to $35,000 and $46,000 are NOT paid for “baseless allegations”. Nor are such sums paid as nuisance value.

    It’s pretty clear to me that Cain was out of control, and it cost the National Restaurant Association over $80,000 to buy the silence of Cain’s victims. Don’t forget, there are MEN who have come forward and said they witnessed some of Cain’s behavior. These men are not anonymous.

  31. avatar
    AnotherBird November 14, 2011 at 3:21 am #

    Lawyerwitharealdegree:
    It’s kind of disappointing to read this entry by DocC.He completely overlooks the fact that two women were paid an entire year’s salary to settle their sexual harassment claims.I have handled sexual harassment claims, and I can assure you that sums equal to $35,000 and $46,000 are NOT paid for “baseless allegations”.Nor are such sums paid as nuisance value.

    It’s pretty clear to me that Cain was out of control, and it cost the National Restaurant Association over $80,000 to buy the silence of Cain’s victims.Don’t forget, there are MEN who have come forward and said they witnessed some of Cain’s behavior.These men are not anonymous.

    I think it is where or not it will be a political liability, so far these types of accusations have never been.

  32. avatar
    The Magic M November 14, 2011 at 8:53 am #

    Obsolete: They love sinners and liars like Cain, who shout the loudest about being Christian while actually doing the least in their lives to follow Christ. They are fooled by the loudest voice.

    Actually, when you think of it, religion absolutely needs “the loudest voice” and couldn’t care less if the owner of said voice is actually a practice-what-you-preach guy.
    A good religious speaker can possibly convert (or strengthen) thousands, so it doesn’t matter in the big picture if he’s sinful as hell himself. Big number wins.

    And that’s why they love these guys. They go “whatever … may have done in private, he’s still helped our church so much”.

  33. avatar
    Jim F November 14, 2011 at 10:30 am #

    I just noticed a novel campaign strategy over on the Defend our Freedoms website.
    Orly pleads with her possible opponents in the primary not to run against her. It is not because she dosen’t believe she will beat them but because she does not want to waste her cash and energy before the big one against Ms Feinstein. Apparently her pleas for urgent funds are falling on stoney ground. She still needs a few thousand $$ just to get on the ballot. What a waste, I hope she gets there. It will be interesting see how she will sue her Rep .opponents

  34. avatar
    Sef November 14, 2011 at 10:44 am #

    Jim F:
    I just noticed a novel campaign strategy over on the Defend our Freedoms website.
    Orly pleads with her possible opponents in the primary not to run against her. It is not because she dosen’t believe she will beat them but because she does not want to waste her cash and energy before the big one against Ms Feinstein. Apparently her pleas for urgent funds are falling on stoney ground. She still needs a few thousand $$ just to get on the ballot. What a waste, I hope she gets there. It will be interesting see how she will sue her Rep .opponents

    Wasn’t that how they did it in her native USSR: one person on the ballot and everyone had to vote under penalty of whatever? OT is just going back to her roots.

  35. avatar
    The Magic M November 14, 2011 at 11:35 am #

    Jim F: Orly pleads with her possible opponents in the primary not to run against her.

    And on her website, she asks for her flying monkeys to contact her opponents and tell them not to run against her.

    She must be really confused by all this “freedom” and “dissenting opinion” outside her Moldovan Communist Party gatherings…

  36. avatar
    Majority Will November 14, 2011 at 11:44 am #

    Jim F:
    I just noticed a novel campaign strategy over on the Defend our Freedoms website.
    Orly pleads with her possible opponents in the primary not to run against her. It is not because she dosen’t believe she will beat them but because she does not want to waste her cash and energy before the big one against Ms Feinstein. Apparently her pleas for urgent funds are falling on stoney ground. She still needs a few thousand $$ just to get on the ballot. What a waste, I hope she gets there. It will be interesting see how she will sue her Rep .opponents

    If she needs the money so badly, why doesn’t she rent out a few rooms in her Laguna Niguel mansion?

  37. avatar
    Sef November 14, 2011 at 12:25 pm #

    Majority Will: If she needs the money so badly, why doesn’t she rent out a few rooms in her Laguna Niguel mansion?

    Here’s another way to look at this property.
    http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/31912-Monarch-Crst-Laguna-Niguel-CA-92677/25575662_zpid

  38. avatar
    Majority Will November 14, 2011 at 1:21 pm #

    Sef: Here’s another way to look at this property.
    http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/31912-Monarch-Crst-Laguna-Niguel-CA-92677/25575662_zpid

    Orly Taitz’s mortgage is $10,059 per month, her sons are in Ivy League schools and her very wealthy husband drives a Tesla sports car with a base price of $109,000.

    Do the birther saps living at the poverty level who give her their Social Security checks know this?

    I guess you can never underestimate the combined power of blinding bigotry and stupidity.

  39. avatar
    Daniel November 14, 2011 at 1:26 pm #

    Jim F:
    I just noticed a novel campaign strategy over on the Defend our Freedoms website.
    Orly pleads with her possible opponents in the primary not to run against her. It is not because she dosen’t believe she will beat them but because she does not want to waste her cash and energy before the big one against Ms Feinstein. Apparently her pleas for urgent funds are falling on stoney ground. She still needs a few thousand $$ just to get on the ballot. What a waste, I hope she gets there. It will be interesting see how she will sue her Rep .opponents

    Notice she slips in a not so subtle reference to her failed lawsuit against Dunn. IOW, “run against me and I’ll sue ya”.

  40. avatar
    Sean November 14, 2011 at 4:24 pm #

    The wrong questions are being asked here. Worst case scenario is Cain is guilty of some sexual harassment and in that case, who cares? In 2011, that’s old hat and a non-issue.

    The question should be: is Cain a political plant? Anyone expect him to win? His tax plan comes from the popular video game Sims City and at one debate he quoted the Pokemon Movie.

    Forget sexual harassment. Cain just doesn’t smell right.

  41. avatar
    Paul Pieniezny November 14, 2011 at 4:37 pm #

    Sean:
    The wrong questions are being asked here. Worst case scenario is Cain is guilty of some sexual harassment and in that case, who cares? In 2011, that’s old hat and a non-issue.

    The question should be: is Cain a political plant? Anyone expect him to win? His tax plan comes from the popular video game Sims City and at one debate he quoted the Pokemon Movie.

    Forget sexual harassment. Cain just doesn’t smell right.

    999 is from SimCity? I was convinced that when the crux came, it would be revealed he was actually promoting a new-fangled type of pizza. Price 9.99.

  42. avatar
    Majority Will November 14, 2011 at 4:41 pm #

    Paul Pieniezny: 999 is from SimCity? I was convinced that when the crux came, it would be revealed he was actually promoting a new-fangled type of pizza. Price 9.99.

    Herman Cain 999 Plan: Did It Come From SimCity?
    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/10/13/herman-cain-999-sim-city_n_1008952.html

  43. avatar
    Daniel November 14, 2011 at 5:00 pm #

    Sean: The question should be: is Cain a political plant?

    The Joke candidate that got away from them? That has been suggested by more than just you.

  44. avatar
    Scientist November 14, 2011 at 6:40 pm #

    Here is Cain exhibiting the depth of his knowledge on Libya

    http://2012.talkingpointsmemo.com/2011/11/cain-chokes-on-libya-question-got-all-this-stuff-twirling-around-in-my-head.php?ref=fpa_beta

    Many countries have joke parties whose sole purpose is to poke fun at the more serious parties. But when one of the 2 major parties in a superpower actually has candidates like Cain, Bachmann, Perry, or Trump, people who literally can’t explain where they stand on major issues and know absolutely nothing of the world, and these candidates get, even if only for a time, support above 1%, shocking, dangerous and shameful are the words that come to mind.

  45. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy November 14, 2011 at 8:18 pm #

    So you are saying that your experience characterizes all nuisance claims for all types of organizations? You should excuse me for not having such broad knowledge of the field.

    Lawyerwitharealdegree: It’s kind of disappointing to read this entry by DocC. He completely overlooks the fact that two women were paid an entire year’s salary to settle their sexual harassment claims. I have handled sexual harassment claims, and I can assure you that sums equal to $35,000 and $46,000 are NOT paid for “baseless allegations”. Nor are such sums paid as nuisance value.

  46. avatar
    Judge Mental November 14, 2011 at 8:20 pm #

    If the questioner near the end had been sharper he could have asked several things, one of which could have been along the lines of the following….”In reply to the question about what you would have done differently, you said that you would have made ‘better’ assessments of those who were uprising. You have now indicated that you don’t actually know what nature or extent of assessments were done. How is it possible to know that you would have done ‘better’ assessments if you don’t know anything about what assessments took place in the first place?.”

    It sounded to me like Cain had some vague recollection of someone having told him that all the overthrow of Ghaddaffi had achieved was to open the door to power for muslim fundamentalists (always a vote getter, the good old inventive scaremongering and muslim bashing) but he had no idea how to fit that into the framework of the questions, thus it spilled out as vague gobbledygook about assessing who the uprisers were.

  47. avatar
    Steve November 14, 2011 at 8:27 pm #

    Selwyn Duke, a regular guest on the Michael Savage show, has this to say about Cain:

    http://thenewamerican.com/opinion/selwyn-duke/9757-cains-pains-lets-talk-about-character

    Basically, well, what about Obama’s character…

    Is this what passes for logic among wingnuts?

  48. avatar
    Daniel November 14, 2011 at 10:24 pm #

    Steve:
    Selwyn Duke, a regular guest on the Michael Savage show, has this to say about Cain:

    http://thenewamerican.com/opinion/selwyn-duke/9757-cains-pains-lets-talk-about-character

    Basically, well, what about Obama’s character…

    Is this what passes for logic among wingnuts?

    “I know you are but what am I” has always been the favoured defence of shchoolyards and the politically inept.

  49. avatar
    Rickey November 15, 2011 at 10:19 am #

    Dr. Conspiracy:
    So you are saying that your experience characterizes all nuisance claims for all types of organizations? You should excuse me for not having such broad knowledge of the field.

    I’m inclined to agree with Lawyerwitharealdegree that these were not nuisance settlements. For one thing, as far as I can tell no lawsuits were ever filed (which explains why Cain was parsing the difference between an agreement and a settlement). If, as Cain claims, the allegations were proven to be baseless, why reward the women with a year’s pay? Wouldn’t the association be running the risk of having more female employees come forward with spurious claims?

    Full disclosure: I have worked in the field of personal injury lawsuits for 35 years, but I don’t believe that I have ever worked on sexual harassment claim. Still, when we talk of nuisance settlements we are usually talking about a few thousand dollars. $35,000-$45,000 is a substantial amount and is considerably more than it would typically cost to defend such a lawsuit. And remember that these funds were not paid by an insurance company. The money came directly from the coffers of the National Restaurant Association.

  50. avatar
    Lawyerwitharealdegree November 15, 2011 at 12:38 pm #

    Dr. Conspiracy:
    So you are saying that your experience characterizes all nuisance claims for all types of organizations? You should excuse me for not having such broad knowledge of the field.

    No, I am saying that I was disappointed in your statement that you have no opinion about the validity of these claims. I pointed out that these are not merely accusations being flung in the heat of a political campaign, but that they reference back to actual settlements that were made by the NRA. Here’s what an OpEd in today’s NYT says (the editorialists being law professors:

    “That the National Restaurant Association decided to resolve the prior claims with compensation provides some picture of their nature: they were most likely not a one-time event (unless extremely severe), they were most likely not made by someone whose credibility could be easily demolished, and they were most likely not behaviors that would offend only an overly sensitive woman (as Mr. Cain suggested when he said that he had merely compared the height of one of his accusers, Karen Kraushaar, to the height of his wife). The law requires a pervasive pattern of unwelcome behavior of a sexual nature or acts of real severity as viewed by a reasonable person that create a hostile working environment, or demands to exchange sexual compliance for workplace benefits. Anything less would have provided the company little incentive to settle. ”

    http://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/15/opinion/why-herman-cain-is-unfit-to-lead.html?_r=1&hp

    It is unrealistic to dismiss these payments as nuisance payoffs. That’s just not the way things work in the real world. I was pointing out that it would be difficult to not have an opinion about the validity of the sexual harassment charges, given the fact of settlements consisting of a year’s salary.

  51. avatar
    thisoldhippie November 15, 2011 at 5:33 pm #

    Even without a lawsuit they would be considered “settlements” as the claims were settled out of court. Cain was just trying to muddy the waters. For sexual harassment claims, these are substantial. I work in a personal injury firm and throughout the years we have had both sexual harassment and sexual assault claims. It is very hard to get what many people consider “big money” out of these claims because for one the victim doesn’t want to have to go before a jury and have the entire thing played out in a public forum. Usually you mediate for the best possible outcome and the defense knows that. For them to pony up a years salary for both women shows that there was something to these claims. A nuisance payoff would probably not have been offered as the defendant isn’t the one who will be dragged through the money looking like a money hungry whore.

  52. avatar
    thisoldhippie November 15, 2011 at 5:34 pm #

    That’s “dragged through the mud”

  53. avatar
    Rickey November 15, 2011 at 8:09 pm #

    thisoldhippie:
    Even without a lawsuit they would be considered “settlements” as the claims were settled out of court. Cain was just trying to muddy the waters.

    Agreed. The fact that no lawsuit was filed merely gave Cain the opportunity to try to make a distinction between a settlement and an agreement. Of course, the women signed releases in exchange for monetary compensation, and as you say that is a settlement.

    There is an interesting piece about the value of sexual harassment cases here:

    http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/explainer/2011/11/herman_cain_settlement_what_s_the_going_rate_for_sexual_harassment_claims_.html

  54. avatar
    Horus November 17, 2011 at 8:56 pm #

    Sean: The question should be: is Cain a political plant? Anyone expect him to win?

    Yes, he is a wholly owned subsidiary of Koch Industries.