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Having the last word

One thing struck me in the order dismissing the ballot challenge, Liberty Legal Foundation v. National Democratic Party of the U.S.A. The judge, before dismissing the case, had some harsh words about a submission of supplemental authority from the Plaintiffs’ attorney, Van R. Irion. What he said was that the brief was really a sur-reply, something that is usually not allowed under the rules. Judge Anderson wrote:

The Court finds that Plaintiffs’ Motion is not well-taken. Even though Plaintiffs label the brief they seek leave to file a “supplemental response,” Plaintiffs are in fact seeking leave to file a sur-reply. As many courts have noted, “[s]ur-replies . . . are highly disfavored, as they usually are a strategic effort by the nonmoving party to have the last word on a matter.”

Sur-replies are allowed sometimes when the Defense raises a new legal argument or submitted new evidence, something Judge Anderson said was not the case in LLF.

Jerry Collette is also working on a document he calls “Supplemental Brief in Opposition to Motions to Dismiss.” Depending on when it is submitted and when the Defense files their reply, this might be a sur-reply too. In any case, the Defense gets the last word. I wonder if Jerry has a dollar figure in mind of how much he has damaged the Florida Democratic Party with his frivolous lawsuit.

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25 Responses to Having the last word

  1. avatar
    JPotter June 24, 2012 at 12:35 am #

    I thought Collette was concerned with describing the ‘damages’ he has suffered in terms of dollar signs. You’re not suspecting him of malicious intent, are ya?

    Well, OK, i definitely am.

    His one frivolous suit wasted a little time. But his attempt to franchise it out and encourage a crowdsourced litigious wave from sea to shining sea … clear attempt to clog the courts and sap Democratic resources. Essentially negative fundraising / volunteering.

    Any confirmed reports of his DIY kit being used anywhere?

  2. avatar
    Chef June 24, 2012 at 2:57 am #

    Looks like you’re not that interested in conspiracy theories anymore and more interested in legal this and that. Maybe you should start your own law school like this birfoon:

    http://www.lysanderspoonerlawschool.org

  3. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy June 24, 2012 at 7:41 am #

    Jack Cashill used to have a page on his web site touting the award of “2012 Book of the Year” from the Lysander Spooner Law School. Mr Olsen (who does the Spooner site) used to comment here.

    I think the coverage here is balanced between legal and conspiratorial aspects of the birthers. Most of the lawsuits allege conspiracies anyway. Articles dealing with birth location, for example, can be found here:

    http://www.obamaconspiracy.org/category/birth-location/

    Chef: Looks like you’re not that interested in conspiracy theories anymore and more interested in legal this and that. Maybe you should start your own law school like this birfoon:

    http://www.lysanderspoonerlawschool.org

  4. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy June 24, 2012 at 8:51 am #

    What I’m saying is that Collette is oblivious to the consequences of his irresponsible actions. I’ve not seen any reports of anyone using his Kit to file a lawsuit; and after his case is dismissed next month, I wouldn’t see much point in anyone doing so.

    JPotter: I thought Collette was concerned with describing the ‘damages’ he has suffered in terms of dollar signs. You’re not suspecting him of malicious intent, are ya?

  5. avatar
    realist June 24, 2012 at 9:33 am #

    He can supplement or “sur-reply” if it’s permitted, all he wishes. The fact remains that his “tort” claim of “negligence per se” does not exist.

  6. avatar
    john June 24, 2012 at 10:24 am #

    Obama Lawyers in Tennessee Federal Court Case essentially admit that Obama is NOT eligible to serve as the POTUS – “Defendants [the Tennessee Democrat Party and the Democrat National Committee] assert that the Tennessee Democrat Party has the right to nominate whoever it chooses to run as a candidate, including someone who is not qualified for the office.”

    Read more: http://times247.com/articles/dnc-voters-not-constitution-determines-eligibility#ixzz1yijkiyUF

  7. avatar
    bgansel9 June 24, 2012 at 12:28 pm #

    Dr. Conspiracy: I’ve not seen any reports of anyone using his Kit to file a lawsuit; and after his case is dismissed next month, I wouldn’t see much point in anyone doing so.

    Doc, I’m afraid you give these birthers far too much credit for critical thinking. It doesn’t matter if they lose suit after suit, he is one of their heroes and I’m sure they will eventually choose to use the kit simply just to try to get one successful case through and prove his work correct.

  8. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy June 24, 2012 at 2:27 pm #

    John, thanks for the link. I wanted to write about that particularly silly spin.

  9. avatar
    Jamese777 June 24, 2012 at 2:30 pm #

    john:
    Obama Lawyers in Tennessee Federal Court Case essentially admit that Obama is NOT eligible to serve as the POTUS – “Defendants [the Tennessee Democrat Party and the Democrat National Committee] assert that the Tennessee Democrat Party has the right to nominate whoever it chooses to run as a candidate, including someone who is not qualified for the office.”
    **********
    All the Democratic Party in Tennessee argued is what obvious to anyone, there is nothing illegal about RUNNING for president if a person is Ineligible, it is only actually assuming the office of the presidency which requires natural born citizenship, age 35 and 14 years residence.
    In 2008 for example, Nicaraguan born naturalized American citizen Roger Calero ran for president as the candidate of the Socialist Workers Party.

    Read more: http://times247.com/articles/dnc-voters-not-constitution-determines-eligibility#ixzz1yijkiyUF

  10. avatar
    Rickey June 24, 2012 at 2:37 pm #

    john:
    Obama Lawyers in Tennessee Federal Court Case essentially admit that Obama is NOT eligible to serve as the POTUS – “Defendants [the Tennessee Democrat Party and the Democrat National Committee] assert that the Tennessee Democrat Party has the right to nominate whoever it chooses to run as a candidate, including someone who is not qualified for the office.”

    Your reading comprehension deficiencies are biting you in the ass again.

  11. avatar
    Thomas Brown June 24, 2012 at 3:31 pm #

    Rickey: Your reading comprehension deficiencies are biting you in the ass again.

    And when the rest of his deficiencies finish biting him, he’ll have no ass left. But then that would give them access to start working on his head.

  12. avatar
    JPotter June 24, 2012 at 7:19 pm #

    john: … Lawyers … admit … Obama … NOT eligible … / … Democrat Party has right to nominate … someone … not qualified … / … voters … determine eligibility …

    Wow! Including the URL, that’s an illogic double leap, from spin to “well duh” and back to spin again! Well, done, John!

    I also note that the phrase embedded in the URL (the file name of the story!) doesn’t actually appear in the story itself …. a subliminal message? 😛

  13. avatar
    AlCum June 24, 2012 at 11:54 pm #

    john:
    Obama Lawyers in Tennessee Federal Court Case essentially admit that Obama is NOT eligible to serve as the POTUS

    Would you be so kind as to show us where you think they did any such thing?

  14. avatar
    Whatever4 June 25, 2012 at 3:19 am #

    john:
    Obama Lawyers in Tennessee Federal Court Case essentially admit that Obama is NOT eligible to serve as the POTUS – “Defendants [the Tennessee Democrat Party and the Democrat National Committee] assert that the Tennessee Democrat Party has the right to nominate whoever it chooses to run as a candidate, including someone who is not qualified for the office.”

    The defendants never said Obama wasn’t eligible, they said that they could nominate someone who wasn’t eligible. (They could, for instance, nominate someone who would be 35 in January but wasn’t 35 yet.)

  15. avatar
    Whatever4 June 25, 2012 at 3:21 am #

    Hey John: I am looking for a list of current birther claims. Can you post a claim dump in the Open Thread? (I’m serious. Really.)

  16. avatar
    The Magic M June 25, 2012 at 8:45 am #

    john: Obama Lawyers in Tennessee Federal Court Case essentially admit that Obama is NOT eligible to serve as the POTUS – “Defendants [the Tennessee Democrat Party and the Democrat National Committee] assert that the Tennessee Democrat Party has the right to nominate whoever it chooses to run as a candidate, including someone who is not qualified for the office.”

    It’s always hard to tell if birthers have a problem with understanding basic English or are spin artists of Orwellian proportions.
    If the lawyers had instead said “including Nelson Mandela”, would you have concluded “Obama’s lawyers essentially admit that Obama is Nelson Mandela”? *duh*

  17. avatar
    Reality Check June 25, 2012 at 9:00 am #

    Back to the topic….

    Jerry seems to be taking to heart the free legal advice provided to him here and on RC Radio. I think that will become even more clear when the latest supplemental motion is filed. However, no amount of tweaking and citations can fix a case that is fatally flawed.

  18. avatar
    Stanislaw June 25, 2012 at 9:48 am #

    john:
    Obama Lawyers in Tennessee Federal Court Case essentially admit that Obama is NOT eligible to serve as the POTUS – “Defendants [the Tennessee Democrat Party and the Democrat National Committee] assert that the Tennessee Democrat Party has the right to nominate whoever it chooses to run as a candidate, including someone who is not qualified for the office.”

    Read more: http://times247.com/articles/dnc-voters-not-constitution-determines-eligibility#ixzz1yijkiyUF

    john, you’re an idiot.

  19. avatar
    Dr. Kenneth Noisewater (Bob Ross) June 25, 2012 at 10:58 am #

    Dr. Conspiracy: What I’m saying is that Collette is oblivious to the consequences of his irresponsible actions. I’ve not seen any reports of anyone using his Kit to file a lawsuit; and after his case is dismissed next month, I wouldn’t see much point in anyone doing so.

    Back to Jerry’s blame the victim claim. Under his reasoning, anyone who uses his kit and gets subject to sanctions can then come back at him and sue him

  20. avatar
    nbc June 25, 2012 at 2:43 pm #

    john: Obama Lawyers in Tennessee Federal Court Case essentially admit that Obama is NOT eligible to serve as the POTUS – “Defendants [the Tennessee Democrat Party and the Democrat National Committee] assert that the Tennessee Democrat Party has the right to nominate whoever it chooses to run as a candidate, including someone who is not qualified for the office.”

    There is a step missing in your ‘logic’ which renders it moot. What the TN Democrat party IS saying is that the issue of eligibility is not relevant, not that it has been admitted to. Poor John, so desperate and so unable to apply logic and reason.

    Well done John

  21. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy June 25, 2012 at 3:15 pm #

    The latest communication I have from Jerry says that the revised supplement will be finished tomorrow. I don’t know enough about the law to conclude that his suit is fatally flawed; all I can say is that the current incarnation is unpersuasive to me to the extent that I’m willing to go out on a limb an I-beam and predict a loss.

    Reality Check: Jerry seems to be taking to heart the free legal advice provided to him here and on RC Radio. I think that will become even more clear when the latest supplemental motion is filed. However, no amount of tweaking and citations can fix a case that is fatally flawed.

  22. avatar
    aarrgghh June 25, 2012 at 4:04 pm #

    “essentially admit”, much like “indirectly confirm”, are just some of the magical weasel words birfers have to use to mesmerize themselves into hearing officeholders and legal professionals (ie, the people who matter) tell them the exact opposite of what’s being said.

  23. avatar
    G June 25, 2012 at 5:16 pm #

    Well, since all Birthers do is recycle the same dead horses over and over again, all you have to do is look to long debunked claims and tabloid rumour nonsense from 2-4 years ago and assume that will soon be the latest “new” thing in Birtherdom yet again…

    Whatever4:
    Hey John: I am looking for a list of current birther claims. Can you post a claim dump in the Open Thread? (I’m serious. Really.)

  24. avatar
    US Citizen June 26, 2012 at 3:53 am #

    A claim dump expressed as a single sentence:

    Obama is not eligible because he was born in Indonesia or Africa or China to either Frank Marshall Davis or Malcolm X and raised by Muslims, the Illuminati, NWO or lizard people and after being illegally elected through voter fraud, threats or bribes was sworn in twice by a RINO Supreme Court Judge.
    Or something like that, but all we KNOW is he can’t possibly be President… but it has nothing to do with the fact he’s black, half black or a democrat.

    Naturally, I can only cover these things from memory.
    If I’ve left anything out… why… just ask me specific questions and I’ll be glad to answer them one by one.
    -Lt. Cmdr. Philip Francis Queeg

  25. avatar
    Reality Check June 26, 2012 at 8:22 am #

    US Citizen: Naturally, I can only cover these things from memory.
    If I’ve left anything out… why… just ask me specific questions and I’ll be glad to answer them one by one.
    -Lt. Cmdr. Philip Francis Queeg

    So that’s it. The President stole their strawberry ice cream. I knew it!

    Dr. Conspiracy: Dr. Conspiracy June 25, 2012 at 3:15 pm (Quote) #

    The latest communication I have from Jerry says that the revised supplement will be finished tomorrow. I don’t know enough about the law to conclude that his suit is fatally flawed; all I can say is that the current incarnation is unpersuasive to me to the extent that I’m willing to go out on a limb an I-beam and predict a loss.

    IANAL either but adding citations to tort law cases is not going to cure the fact that he has no claim under tort law, he is trying to bring an election challenge under the guise of a tort claim, and the court has no power to order the state of Hawaii to do anything. The idea he has been injured because President Obama was the only Democratic candidate in Florida in 2012 and has a claim for monetary damages is absurd.