WorldNetDaily reports that Maricopa County Sheriff Joe Arpaio has appointed a posse consisting of two retired law enforcement persons and two attorneys to investigate allegations from the local Tea Party at the instigation of Jerome Corsi. The posse is headed by Michael Zullo, a retired police detective from New Jersey. WND claims that the posse will have subpoena power.
While the WND article is very long, the preceding paragraph is really all the news in it. WND wrote:
Arpaio’s move is unprecedented in that WND research can find no other instance in United States history in which a county sheriff’s office has undertaken an investigation of a document pertaining to a sitting United States president.
“WND research” is the oxymoron referenced in the article’s title.
So far, no other news organization is reporting this story. That’s a shame because one really cannot rely on WorldNetDaily to report any story fairly or completely, and of course their own gonzo journalist Jerome Corsi is in the middle of this business, making it even less objective. I wasn’t able to find any pertinent information about Mr. Zullo myself.
Sheriff Arpaio is reported to have currently 52 posses, according to the Sonoran News, a local conservative web site.
Finally another news source is covering the story, the Tucson Citizen. Their editorial position is made clear by the headline: Birther Madness: Crazy Uncle Joe Arpaio wasting taxpayer money investigating Obama’s birth certificate.
When Arpaio was asked whether he thinks there is anything to the birther claims, he replied:
I don’t know because I haven’t looked at it. I’m not going to spend hours and hours looking at volumes of information. Give it to them, they’re not being paid, they’re doing it for nothing.
The BirtherReport birthers are all excited. Maricopa County Sherrif Joe Arapaio is convening a “POSSE” to investigate the President’s birth certificate.
“The BirtherReport birthers are all excited. Maricopa County Sherrif Joe Arapaio is convening a “POSSE” to investigate the President’s birth certificate”
Really excited, however they did not include pictures of the restroom walls, if they did it would show white spots all over, that’s how excited they were.
Those people at birthereport.com have serious issues with mental health, what a sick site!
WND has a new story about Sheriff Joe
I moved the preceding 3 comments here from elsewhere to document that these folks got the story first.
It’s hugely frustrating to have to write an article with WND as the only source.
Yaa! Now Sheriff Arpiao wants the Obama’s birth certificate with supeona power. Cough it up Fuddy! Thank you Sheriff Arpiao. LTC Terry Lakin owes you a debt of gratitude for bringing this issue to light. We will have to see though if it really goes anywhere.
1st subpoena should be for Alvin Onaka’s smiley face stamp to make headlines. 2nd subpoena should be for the Court Order that sealed Obama’s original LFBC.
3rd subpoena will be for ImAObot’s medical, psychiatric and pharmacological history
I just checked the Arizona Republic and Phoenix New Times sites and there’s not a peep on either about this.
Reading the WND piece I can tell you it makes no sense. Posse members have no – as in zero, zip – law enforcement authority. They’re not police officers.
Even if they were police don’t issue subpoenas. In Arizona (as in most states) they are issued by prosecutors and/or judges.
Bottom line: This “story” stinks to high heaven.
John, ImaObot, Bovril:
Dream on. The sheriff has no unilateral subpoena power. Posse members have no police powers.
I didn’t think one state’s subpoena was valid in another state. So who is he going to subpoena?
Nothing anybody finds could help Terry Lakin.
I predict that the state of Hawaii’s liberal Democrat Attorney General, David Louie will tell Sheriff Arpaio’s “posse” to go intercourse themselves. Hawaii law does not allow a confidential birth record to be released under subpoena (as Orly Taitz has already discovered).
Any eighth grader should be able to read Hawaii Revised Statute 338-18 (b) which clearly states that a confidential birth record can be released to “a person whose right to inspect or obtain a certified copy of the record is established by an order of a court of competent jurisdiction.”
A “posse” issued subpoena is not “an order of a court of competent jurisdiction.”
There may be some uniform code (like the Uniform Commercial Code) that states subscribe to that might work but first they’ve got to get past a couple hurdles:
1 – What’s the crime in Arizona? And who is going to investigate it? Possee members aren’t police officers.
2 – Who is going to issue a subpoena? Not Arpaio….despite WND’s wishful thinking.
Other than that………………………..
It doesn’t matter. Hawaii Confidential Birth records can’t be released under a subpoena from anywhere or anybody. You need a valid court order signed by a judge.
Theoretically……and i mean that just for the purposes of discussion here as this is really a lot of nonsense…….an outside jurisdiction could issue a subpoena and ask an Hawaii court to sign off on it.
Given the players in this episode of the birther drama – Joe Arpaio and WND – the chances of anything happening are pretty slim.
Since he’s got a lot of time on his hands these days maybe he should volunteer for Sheriff Joe’s posse.
*rolls eyes*. You jokers crack me up. It is really hard to believe that you can honestly be that delusional and think this little WND story is going anywhere. Hey, I get it – you guys really really hate/fear Obama. *whatever*. But why must you always lower yourselves and come across so gullible… I mean seriously, you can’t really be that dumb and actually think anything is going to come of this, do you? Come on guys, at what point are you just so emotionally detatched from reality that you become nothing but a danger to yourselves??
*sigh*. Sorry, but your latest *OMG* moment is going to end like all the others have… with nothing….
Can posses lynch a sitting US President?
Wow, I could never say that better. But perhaps some of them don’t really believe this crap, but just pretend…funded RW operations, that kind of thing. Or perhaps I just have more faith in humanity as a species than I should.
Yes they can. It’s in the Constitution (Article XIII, Section XV, Clause 128.
What I would love to see is that after the posse investigation and a subpoena and a court hearing in Hawaii to honor a Maricopa County, Arizona subpoena, the Hawaii Department of Health provides the posse with their own copy of Obama’s short form COLB which has been available on the internet since 2008! 😉
Going to the internet today is the best chance they have of getting anything!!
There will be no “posse investigation” because posse members have no authority…..or at least no more authority than any citizen of Maricopa County.
There will be no subpoena because the Sheriff can’t issue one and no county attorney or judge in Arizona (all elected BTW) will go near this nonsense.
The last county attorney that hitched his star to Arpaio’s little red wagon is facing disbarment for the crap he pulled including indicting a judge for ruling against he and the sheriff.
*sigh*.Sorry, but your latest *OMG* moment is going to end like all the others have… with nothing….
ditoo from me, another OMG moment for john to see fail, “failure” is johns middle name, he loves it, that’s what keeps him a birther.
Obama’s LFBC wasn’t EVER sealed by a court order. It is protected by Hawaiian law, same as anyone born in Hawaii. You and other birthers who fail to understand this are usually wrong about any other points of law you refer to.
In this forum there is a lot of they can’t do this and they can’t do that….what are u guys worried about.
Obama is a natural born citizen according to the Constitution.
Cease with the panic. He’s is only a Sheriff.
Sheriffs serve subpoenas issued by courts but they do not issue them. Only a properly constituted grand jury can issue a subpoena. And such a subpoena would not be valid outside Arizona.
Obama’s father is a permanent resident and domiciled at his birth in Hawaii. He clearly meets the standards in the WKA decision.
WkA was affirmed a natural born Citizen.
The Framers never heard of the loser named Vattel.
Lets dismiss the Obama birth certificate when Senior writes in his INS records his birth is two years different.
Lets dismiss Senior’s INS records when he writes his race is Kenya and signs the document. Never mind the Obama birth certificate reads Senior’s race is African and he does not sign the document.
Lets dismiss Justice Waite’s precedent definition of a natural born Citizen.
Who cares. The hell with the Constitution. Let it ride.
Hey vattel, where in the Constiitution does it mention anything about parents?
Denying anything to anyone based on who their parents were is EXACTLY the type of Old European claptrap that Americans have always rejected. Go back to Europe-I’ll even chip in for your one-way ticket..
It is amazing that people who don’t understand case law keep pretending to be experts on the internet. WKA of course didn’t one needed a resident father. It said the common law was adopted and children of domiciled aliens were included. DUh. And it is comical at this point how so many people listen to that idiot Donofrio that Minor is precedent. Any lawyer who make such a claim in court would likely be sanctioned. Do you know what obiter dictum is? I think not. It is hard to believe that even a child would cite as authority on the question of the status of children of aliens a case that expressly declined to address the status of children of aliens. Simply unbelievable.
DancingRabbit/DraggingCanoe/e. vattel demonstrates his real interest in the Constitution. It is all about his hate for the President.
Wow, he did not sign the certificate where it asks for the Father’s signature. Hold it, there is no place for him to sign. I do not recall any certificate having the Father’s signature.
Are we worried… not at all… Every birther’s “we got him” moments has fallen flat.
And Sheriff’s Posse’s certainly don’t issue subpoenas. They hold bake sales, ride in Rodeo parades, and occasionally help out in search and rescue operations.
If Sheriff Joe is serious about pursuing this from a legal standpoint, he doesn’t need to involve a Posse. He has plenty of legal nous in the Maricopa County government to draw on (though he is in just about everybody’s bad books) including inside his own department.
Speaking of being in the bad books, what Joe does need right now is a bit of fanatical right wing political support. Pretending to be serious about the birther’s claim by giving it to a pointless posse keeps him onside with those fanatical right wingers. Of course WND is going to pretend that the posse is ‘important’ and of course the regurgitators are going to praise Joe to the Saguaro tops for pretending to give them the time of day.
I really don’t get the “african” thing. Why does anyone think they know how an african in 1961 would have charactorized his race. You think maybe they didn’t like the term “negro” and couldn’t call themselves “african american.” Amazing that anyone thinks this is evidence.
simple questions: Where is the subpoena?
What is the posse hiding?
Why can’t they produce a subpoena?
The birthers got punked again by a grifter. In this case Sheriff Joe.
Are you birthers tired of getting punked yet?
And the HI Record’s Administrator took it upon himself/herself to seal Obama’s original LFBC containing sworn statements by the birth mother, delivery doctor and hospital administrator as to the facts of BHO’s II birth because he/she thought it would be best.
Consequently, a COLB “filed by” the registrar, as opposed to “accepted by” the registrar after examining the sworn statements of eyewitnesses, was best for everyone concerned.
Ha Ha Ha Ha.
Does the sheriff know a Record’s Administrator trumps eyewitness, sworn statements?
Obama has produced his BC and it is admissible in any court in this nation.
Get all the subpoenas and court orders you want, when Obama’s lawyer shows up with his BC the judge will say “Case Dismissed”.
What an utter moron.
It’s so amusing (and sad) to see the thought processes of birthers.
Which part of “It is protected by Hawaiian law, same as anyone born in Hawaii.” are you finding difficult to understand?
The “HI Records Administrator” did not take anything upon himself/herself.
The record is not ‘sealed’, it is protected by Hawai’ian law. All similar records are protected by Hawai’ian law.
The law wasn’t made up by any “HI Records Administrator”, it was enacted by the State Legislature. All “HI Records Administrators” swear to uphold that law when they take office. Every Hawai’ian expects that law to be upheld for everyone, equally, and without favor or prejudice. And that is exactly what has been done and what will continue to be done.
“It’s so amusing (and sad) to see the thought processes of birthers.”
“It’s so amusing (and really sad) to see the lack of thought processes of birthers.”
there, now better
Doc, why must you torture us with these morons?
The thought processes are there, they just forgot the lead tetraethyl. All we hear and see is a lot of knocking.
Questions: If, as you assert, the record is sealed just how do you know what’s in it? Have you seen it?
“I’m an Obot” has forgotten that when Hawaii had a Republican administration back in 2008, the previous Health Director, Dr. Chiyome Fukino issued a media release on October 30, 2008 which said (and I quote):
“There have been numerous requests for Sen. Barack Hussein Obama’s official birth certificate. State law (Hawaii Revised Statutes §338-18) prohibits the release of a certified birth certificate to persons who do not have a tangible interest in the vital record.
“Therefore, I as Director of Health for the State of Hawaii, along with the Registrar of Vital Statistics who has statutory authority to oversee and maintain these type of vital records, have personally seen and verified that the Hawaii State Department of Health has Sen. Obama’s original birth certificate on record in accordance with state policies and procedures.
No state official, including Governor Linda Lingle, has ever instructed that this vital record be handled in a manner different from any other vital record in the possession of the State of Hawaii.”
Saturday morning update: WND remains the only source. Just checked the Republic and New Times again and not a peep.
Even checked the TV news websites that usually fall for Arpaio stuff and nothing there either.
Makes as much sense as any other explanation!
Brown Eye more like it.
CarlOrcas asked, “if, as you assert, the record is sealed just how do you know what’s in it?” The answer is simple: ImaObot is the reincarnation of Johnny Carson’s, “Carnac the Magnificent”– you remember Carnac don’t you . . . he who could divine an answer before the question was posed?
Question: How does a deluded birther spell “victory”?
The Doc can’t afford high quality comic relief?
unlike birther sites which will in the majority of cases just ban a dissenting voice, this site allows a different point of veiw to be voiced so it can be analysed and debunked.
plus watching the birthers flailing around here is as much fun as watching a drunk try to open a childproof pill bottle 😀
“You will see it is all lies,you will see it is full of hate”.
by Carlos Gardel, who, actually after his death, got himself his own birthers (who even today claim that he was born in Uruguay).
But he continued “and the world could not care less. Yira! Yira!” That is the problem with birfers now, normal people could not care less.
Yira is Argentine Spanish not normally found in most dictionaries. A little hint: it is probably derived from a Russian name for a girl meaning “night star”. No prizes for guessing which birfer I am always thinking of whenever an obot comments on a new bunch of birferloney with “all lies, and full of hate”;
Of course, you mean the usual websites who love to poke fun at Arizona for having an idiot like that in charge of lore (no typo) enforcement.
They are probably thinking this one is a bit over the top.
Actually I was thinking of local statons and one in particular…..KPHO TV.
We’re worried about you. We’re concerned that your fragile psyche will not be able to handle yet another birther OMG moment which is destined to be an epic fail.
Consider our efforts to be a form of intervention. And you’re welcome.
“It is amazing that people who don’t understand case law keep pretending to be experts on the internet. WKA of course didn’t one needed a resident father. It said the common law was adopted and children of domiciled aliens were included. DUh.”
I’m not one of those who pretends to be an expert, but as I read WKA, the Court found that Wong was born a citizen under the 14’th Amendment. The question at issue was whether Wong was born “subject to the jurisdiction” of the United States. We adopted the language of English common law, so it guided the interpretation of that phrase of the 14’th Amendment.
I wasn’t talking about people like you who seem to read and understand English just fine. I was talking about the idiots who can’t seem to read basic English and try to claim these cases say exactly the opposite of what they say. They are either stupid or dishonest. Claiming Minor rather than WKA is binding precedent is so stupid it would probably get a lawyer sanctioned by a real court. Hearing these clowns trying to argue what is dictum and the holdings of cases is downright comical.
One of the purposes of this web site is to separate fact from fiction. One way it does this is to let folks comment in a forum that is outside of their usual element, particularly for birthers, yielding a little more insight into their thinking. I find that one of the most effective ways of exposing birther fallacies is just to give them the rope to hang themselves.
I know that you use the term “moron” as a general insult rather than a reference to a particular IQ, but I think that it is important to realize that whatever mental defect birthers have, it is not specifically a lack of intelligence.
I’m interested in why the whale beached itself.
Maricopa County Sheriff’s Office spokesman Jesse Spurgin confirmed WND’s report.
“The Sheriff has asked his “Cold Case Posse” to examine the information that was provided to make a determination as to the veracity of this claim,” he wrote to me via e-mail. “A new posse HAS NOT been created to investigate the birth certificate claim.”
I see a few others are starting to report on WND’s claims, but most of what is out there is just poking fun of the WND article and only sources WND as the claim for this. Case in point:
Your article link below was the 1st one I’ve seen that added anything further to the story, than just reporting what WND wrote and giving official confirmation that some action was taken:
Of course, when reading that confirmation, it adds up to a whole lot less than what WND implies (no surprise).
In essence, to humor the Birthers, Sherrif Arpaio has dumped the files onto his moribund “Cold Case” team’s desk to look at.
In other words, nothing but politely paying the issue mere “lip service” by passing the buck.
All they have to do is pick up the file, flip through it for some light reading and laughter and come back at some future point and say that they’ve looked at it and concluded there is nothing they can do.
yep. if we’re starting a betting pool my pick would be 3weeks before an official announcement. long enough to make it seem like some form of investigation took place but not too long to test the birthers’ patience. i hate to be speculative when it comes to the birther issue but i imagine the statement will be along the lines of ” we have concluded that there are no opportunities within the mericopa county jurisdiction to further advance this investigation”.
“Spokesperson Lisa Allen tells ABC15 MCSO is not conducting any investigation.
She says the “Cold Case Posse” is an all-volunteer group of people with law enforcement experience.”
Followed closely by reactions of…….”OMG!!! ‘They’ have even managed to silence to Sherrif Joe!!!!
The left hand doesn’t know what the right hand is doing. Allen works directly for the sheriff so one of them is wrong.
Beware…..they may be dancing on the head of a pin: She’s right posse members can’t conduct an “investigation” but they can look into something for the sheriff.
My bet is we won’t hear anything (like ORYR’s recent around the world trip). Since the posse is funded by donations, why poison the well.
don’t know. i’ve seen a few birthers honestly believing that “this is the one!”. to the point that they think the investigation will travel to kenya ( who knew maricopa county jurisdiction extended to kenya? ). my gut feeling is that the birthers will be hounding sheriff joe for updates on the investigation.
I understand that, I’ve also seen birthers say that this should only take a few days since the evidence is overwhelming. BUt I see the handoff to the posse as a way for the sherifff to avoid having to answer any questions. As in ‘the posse is still investigating.’ But we’ll see.
” Oh, it will be, Dr. Jones, I assure you. We have top men working on it right now.”
He’ll have to start a posse to answer questions for the posse. How long before Orly asks her hoards to contact Sheriff Joe? They should use the USPS to help it out of its financial difficulties. Maybe a few million registered letters would help.
Orly won’t be supporting Sheriff A. She and Corsi are feuding.
Sending this to a volunteer “Posse” sounds much like the “refer to committee” method of killing a motion. This is an especially handy method on volunteer boards, referring it to the “special” committee that never actually meets, not that I have experience in such matters.
The thing is that Sheriff Joe doesn’t give a rats behind about his jurisdiction and he is just about fast and loose enough with departmental finances that he could find a way to fund just such an excursion to Kenya if he thought he could get away with it (he’d could claim it was paid for by the posse’ bake sale proceeds or something). Seeing as how he is under intense scrutiny by the FBI for misfeasance and/or malfeasance at the moment, I expect him to be very careful.
With the electorate so evenly polarized, no right wing politician can afford to upset even the fringiest of the fringe. Joe might be an incompetent tyrant, but he does have some political nous.
Here is some pertinent background info on the Sheriff for those not familiar with his foibles:
America’s toughest sheriff office ignored sex crimes, report says
The story made the TV news.
The best take away from the story
“The sheriff said the inquiry could take up to five years to complete.”
We’ll see. We must be careful, sometimes the “he’s only doing it to please the birthers” argument sounds dangerously familiar to the birthers’ “they agree with us and are just waiting for the right time” self-delusion.
Or, realizing he’s got not much time left, he’s willing to take anything he can use as an excuse later (“they’re only prosecuting me because I’m investigating Obama”). Remember Moran who blamed his (older) release on his (newer) birtherism.
Of more serious import is the linked story about refugees in Massachusetts going to AZ to get a drivers license and then returning to Mass. with little actual knowledge of how to drive. With that and Boston’s street signs getting in and out of Boston is REALLY fun. The story link: http://www.azfamily.com/video?id=130165478&sec=507182
when the posse report comes out there’ll be no way the usurper gets to stay in office. shurf joe winz another one! (but only if you donate …)
The quoting system/attribution strikes again.
this was a bizarre sideline to come out of this chapter of the birther story. what is the legality of donating money to an investigation? i heard a couple birthers question wether or not they could be assured that donations would go specifically for the “cold case posse” to investigate the BC. seems to me that would be a “pay for justice” scenario.
anyone have the knowin’ of the knowin’.
y’know … the more i think about it, that’s quite a tell all by itself:
shurf joe thinks obama’s going to be reelected.
Okay I am trying to decide who Sheriff Joe reminds me of most:
a) Jackie Gleason’s character in Smoke and the Bandit
b) The Sheriff from the Dukes of Hazard
c) Blazing Saddles- the entire movie.
You’re doing it again. gorefan’s not going to be pleased.
Sheriff Joe clarifies…. and Corsi lies…. AGAIN
“…Arpaio said his cold case posse of volunteers are not investigating, but inquiring.
“They’re looking into it to see if there is any smoke there,” he said. “Once they’re done I’ll look at it and see if there’s any jurisdiction that I have, as a county sheriff. If I feel there isn’t, maybe I’ll give it to other authorities in the state.”
3TV asked the sheriff if he believes the president’s birth certificate is fraudulent.
“I don’t know because I haven’t looked at it,” Arpaio said. “I’m not going to spend hours and hours looking at volumes of information. Give it to them, they’re not being paid, they’re doing it for nothing.”
German said Arpaio should find better ways to use his volunteer posse.
“Have them picking up the trash is more productive than the birth certificate issue,” said German.
Arpaio didn’t have a specific date the inquiry would wrap up.
The sheriff said the inquiry could take up to five years to complete.”
“The sheriff said the inquiry could take up to five years to complete.”
In other words….
We’ll get back to you about the same time Obama completes his second term.
so, anyone taking bets that the birthers turn on the sheriff before the rooster crows? most likely it will be “he was threatened!”, the stance reserved for those the birthers still wish to like, but there is still a could chance that they come back with “he was bought off!”
“good chance”…… sorry.
To be “fair and balanced” 🙂 Five years is the length of time that any of Sheriff Joe’s “Citizen Posses” is constituted for.
I’m sure that’s why he said “five years.”
The way birthers mangle quotes, such as claiming that Neil Abercrombie couldn’t find a birth certificate, I imagine the interpretation of your theoretical statement would end up something like this.
“We have …… to further advance this investigation.”
There is no time limit on posses.
That aside….the five year comment from Arpaio is just bizarre.
….and WND has spun it into a win!!!