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Mississippi fritz: Documents and copies

Maybe I’m getting old, but the number of loose cannons on the deck of the SS Birther has created such pandemonium that I’m getting a little confused as to who is saying what. I know that some of the Orly Taitz faction has zeroed in on documents filed by attorneys for the Mississippi Democratic Executive Committee, in the Taitz case. Orly Taitz herself has no technical skills to probe documents, so whatever she says is coming from elsewhere. Here’s what she wrote, though:

I asked [Kevin Davidson] about the new document, which was produced by Obama’s attorneys Tepper and Begley, which was sent to Judge Wingate. In the new version forgers cleaned up several signs of forgery, the original layers were flattened and the white halo was cleaned up.

Thanks to commenters for the following: This nonsense might have originated with one Henry Blake, whose letter appears, attached to Strunk’s appeal (starting on Page 122). Orly Taitz also filed an affidavit from Blake in her Mississippi case.

So, let me explain what she means and lay it out chronologically:

Orly Taitz filed a copy of Barack Obama’s birth certificate with the Court in Mississippi. She printed out the White House PDF and then scanned it, and in the process messed it up so badly that it was largely unreadable. No one accused Taitz with faking the document. Some thought she should have gotten one of her supporters who knows a thing or two about scanners to get her some decent equipment.

Attorneys for the Democrats included a readable copy of the birth certificate, saying to the Court, here is a readable copy of what Taitz submitted. The document provided to the court is the White House PDF with a cover page added. It has the same layers as the White House PFD and it has halos. It has the Court Docket header added, but otherwise it’s the same. I checked this myself and you can too. Here’s a detail from it showing the court docket header:

image

Here is a detail from the Court docket copy of the PDF, showing the characteristic missing “R” from one of the layers I extracted using Adobe Acrobat 9:

image

Later, after Taitz accused the Defendants’ counsel of submitting a fake document to the court, attorney Scott Tepper asked for and received a verification from the State of Hawaii, and that was submitted to the court. Tepper submitted to the Court a copy of his correspondence to the State of Hawaii. Look at this detail from page 4:

MSOBwArror

You can see clearly that the copy of the birth certificate that Tepper sent Hawaii was not the White House PDF, but rather a copy from the Court docket, since the docket header (Document 15-1) from his original submission is shown on the page. Obviously Tepper had to print out the Court docket entry in order to mail it to the State of Hawaii, and then he re-scanned the package along with his cover letter. It is beyond comprehension how the birthers could spin a tale of Tepper altering the White House PDF and not see what is pointed to by the big red arrow in the illustration above, showing clear and unequivocally that it is not the White House PDF, but the Court Docket entry that was printed and scanned.

Tepper’s scanner didn’t do the same compression song and dance that the White House equipment did, and so there are distinct differences. Also, remember that is a copy of a copy. It should be obvious from the court docket headers exactly where the documents came from and it is obvious that no “new” copy of the birth certificate has appeared anywhere. Despite Taitz’ wild claims, there was no flim-flam directed at confusing the Court. This is just a copy of a copy.

Both Tepper and Taitz printed copies of an Obama birth certificate and scanned them for a court filing. Both removed certain PDF document structure (layers) in the process. Nobody claims Orly faked the document, but she makes a federal case (literally) of Tepper doing exactly the same thing.

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262 Responses to Mississippi fritz: Documents and copies

  1. avatar
    Reality Check January 7, 2013 at 8:21 pm #

    Have you read Vogt and Irey’s analysis on these images? It is a hoot. I think it is in a string of emails between them that Strunk filed in his latest masterpiece. It is why I call them Tweedle Dee and Tweedle Dum although Dumb and Dumber might even be more appropriate.

  2. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy January 7, 2013 at 8:24 pm #

    I haven’t, but now having looked at the documents, it must be a hoot if they thing anything whatever is odd here. I guess I should go find it and add a link.

    Reality Check: Have you read Vogt and Irey’s analysis on these images? It is a hoot.

  3. avatar
    Thinker January 7, 2013 at 8:35 pm #

    This “forgery of a forgery” thing was too stupid for me to even get my head around when Taitz wrote about it, but I get it now. I think RC is referring to an exchange between Paul Irey and Taitz’s newest birfoon “expert” Henry Wayland Blake. It starts on p. 122 of a pile of crap that Strunk allegedly filed in federal court last month, available on scribd http://www.scribd.com/doc/117739292/CONFORMED-USCA-DC-Circuit-Petition-for-Writ-of-Mandamus-for-Relief-12-PENDING-OP-with-Application-for-fee-relief

  4. avatar
    aesthetocyst January 7, 2013 at 8:39 pm #

    “Some thought she should have gotten one of her supporters who knows a thing or two about scanners to get her some decent equipment.”

    She would rely on Vogt. Would you buy a scanner from that man?

    I often wonder how he finds the time to move hardware what with all of his other, otherworldly pursuits. The Walter Mitty of the copy room set?

  5. avatar
    GLaB January 7, 2013 at 8:51 pm #

    This is just a copy of a copy.

    Actually, this is just a copy of a copy of a copy of a copy.

  6. avatar
    Hermitian January 7, 2013 at 8:53 pm #

    Suffice it to say that Mr. C. just posted a bunch of assumptions which are all false.

  7. avatar
    Hermitian January 7, 2013 at 9:03 pm #

    AFFIDAVIT

    I Henry Blake, being first duly sworn, do hereby state under oath and under penalty of perjury that the following facts are true:

    I. I am over the age of 18 years old and am a resident of Tennessee. The information contained in this affidavit is based upon my own personal knowledge and, if called as a witness, I could testify competently thereto. I attained higher education as follows: BS Mechanical Engineering, MS & PhD in Engineering Mechanics. I have over 40 years experience with a variety of computers including: Personal Computers, Work Stations, Mainframes and Super Computers.

    II. I have general knowledge of foregoing legal filings in the Federal District Court Case 3:12-cv-00280-HTW-LRA and have specific knowledge of the digital images of copies of President Obama’s purported Long-Form Certificate of Live Birth (LFCOLB) appearing within the case filing documents.

    III. I have examined the two image copies of the purported LFCOLB which exist as digital electronic page documents, namely

    05/04/2012 15 MOTION for Judgment on the Pleadings by Democrat Party of Mississippi
    (Attachments: # 1 Exhibit LFBC from White House, # 2 Exhibit COLB from
    Campaign, # 3 Exhibit DOH Verification re White House BC, # 4 Exhibit Hawaii
    Gov April 27 2011 News Release, # 5 Exhibit DOH White House Correspondence,
    # 6 Exhibit DOH 08−93 News Release, # 7 Exhibit DOH 09−063 News Release, #
    8 Exhibit CDC Report re Birth Certificate History)(Begley, Samuel) (Entered:
    05/04/2012) [.pdf (page 8)]

    and

    06/06/2012 35 MOTION to Supplement Counsel for MDEC’s Response 30 in Opposition to
    Plaintiff Taitz’s Motion for Sanctions 25 re 30 Response to Motion, by Democrat
    Party of Mississippi (Attachments: # 1 Exhibit MDEC Counsel Request to HI
    DOH for Verification of President Obamas Hawaiian Birth Cert, # 2 Exhibit
    Hawaii DOH Verification of President Obamas Hawaiian Birth−Issued May 31
    2012)(Begley, Samuel) (Entered: 06/06/2012) [.pdf (page 11)]

    see also court document

    10513240131.pdf 05/26/2012 Re: Request for Verification of Vital Records Pursuant
    to Hawai’ i. Rev. Stat. 338-14.3 and 338-1 8(g)(4) [.pdf (page 4)]

    and which were filed by the Mississippi Democratic Executive Committee (MDEC), as well as the original PDF image of President Obama’s LFCOLB, which was posted on the White House web site on Apr. 27, 2011,

    http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/rss_viewer/birth-certificate-long-form.pdf

    and have found significant alterations were made to the original White House LFCOLB PDF image file. Specifically the copy of the LFCOLB appearing in the second and third documents above differ significantly from the copy appearing in the first document and from the original copy posted on the White House website.

    Page 8 of the first document above is nearly identical to the white House LFCOLB PDF image file. Page 11 of the second above document is identical to page 4 of the third document. For convenience I will denote the two copies that I recently examined as (page 8) and as (page 4/11).

    IV. The alterations made to the White House LFCOLB PDF image to create the (page 8) image copy are incidental.

    1. The (page 8) image copy is otherwise identical to the white House image except for the “Case Label” added at the top margin.

    2. Only the Case label is selectable by mouse and cursor on (page 8)

    3. The (page 8) image copy was altered to make the (page 4/11) image copy.

    V. I found that the alterations to the (page 8) image copy to create the (page 4/11) image copy are extensive as follows:

    1. A second Case Label was added

    2. The (page 8) image was flattened, rasterized and green color was added

    3. The color of all text was changed from near-Black to Black-Green

    4. Numerous form lines were repaired or replaced entirely

    5. The basket-weave background was softened and touched up

    6. Specific words were made selectable by mouse and cursor in Adobe Reader

    7. Hidden editing was applied (see 8.- 11. below):

    8. Ten Line Objects were added

    9. Two Green Color objects were added

    10. Two Broad-line Strikeouts were applied, one to the words “Kapiolani Maternity & Gynecological”, and the other to the word “August”

    11. Seven Rectangular Black Redaction Box Objects were added which altogether cover nearly all of the typed text

    VI. The remaining typed, stamped (or form) words left unstruck or unredacted and appearing on the hidden image of (page4/11) are:

    1. Both Case Labels

    2. State of Hawaii Certificate of Live Birth Department of Health

    3. 61 10641 (file number 151 is redacted)

    4. Barack Hussein Obama, II (“X” in single-birth box)

    5. Honolulu (in two places)

    6. 6085 Kalaianaole Highway

    7. Labels for ten form-boxes

    8. State Registrar’s date and signature stamps

    VII. Words which can be selected on (page 4/11) by mouse and cursor in Adobe Reader are:

    1. Both Case Labels

    2. State of Hawaii Certificate of Live Birth Department of Health

    2. 61 10641 (File number 151 is non-selectable)

    3. Barack Hussein Obama, II

    4. Honolulu

    5. Kapiolani Maternity & Gynecological Hospital

    6. 6085 Kalanianaole

    7. Hussein Obama

    8. University

    9. State Registrar’s date and signature stamps.

    I attest to this under penalty of perjury.

    Henry Blake, PhD
    11/09/2012

  8. avatar
    aesthetocyst January 7, 2013 at 9:10 pm #

    Thinker: an exchange between Paul Irey and Taitz’s newest birfoon “expert” Henry Wayland Blake.

    Wow, thanks thinker. And we thought PDF Madness was dead. They just keep going deeper and deeper!

    First, a perfectly rational statement of the obvious:

    “I believe that the most likely scenario is that Tepper created a paper copy of his three‐page letter to Fuddy on 05/26/2012. He attached a paper printout copy of the original WH LFCOLB and mailed this four‐page paper copy to Fuddy.”

    …. which was merely a setup for a detour into the ludicrous!

    “Tepper and Onaka then collaborated to alter the WH LFCOLB to create the Tepper page 4 LFCOLB.”

    The documents are two renditions of the same image. What would they make of Monet? Would they accuse him of forging cathedrals & waterlilies?

    Unless a difference in the information conveyed by the images can be identified, the only reason for this reaction is a predetermination of fraud.

    Considered in isolation, there nothing here to base the baseless, pointless idea of, as they call it, a “bait and switch”. A switch of what? To what end? They are saying Tepper filed one image in MS, sent that image to HI, and then for some weird reason, expended effort in creating a new image to file in MS as having been sent to HI …. which is identical in content to the first image!

    The birfers should be alleging that Tepper filed one image in MS, sent something different to HI, and then represented a copy of the image filed in MS as having been to HI. There would be no way to prove this from Tepper’s filings, short of an independent verification (of the verification!) from Hawaii. If Tepper had really pulled a ‘bait and switch’, then why the heck would there be anything different about the images?!? That would be a dead giveaway.

    There is one thing the birfers haven’t(?) noted. The image shrank slightly in the second filing. Gosh, how did that happen? ;)

  9. avatar
    Reality Check January 7, 2013 at 9:23 pm #

    Thanks! Yes, I forgot it was Henry Blake. I am sure Vogt was in on it too.

    Thinker: I think RC is referring to an exchange between Paul Irey and Taitz’s newest birfoon “expert” Henry Wayland Blake.

  10. avatar
    Hermitian January 7, 2013 at 9:50 pm #

    “aesthetocystJanuary 7, 2013 at 9:10 pm (Quote)#

    “Thinker: an exchange between Paul Irey and Taitz’s newest birfoon “expert” Henry Wayland Blake.

    “Wow, thanks thinker. And we thought PDF Madness was dead. They just keep going deeper and deeper!

    “First, a perfectly rational statement of the obvious:

    ““I believe that the most likely scenario is that Tepper created a paper copy of his three‐page letter to Fuddy on 05/26/2012. He attached a paper printout copy of the original WH LFCOLB and mailed this four‐page paper copy to Fuddy.”

    …. which was merely a setup for a detour into the ludicrous!

    ““Tepper and Onaka then collaborated to alter the WH LFCOLB to create the Tepper page 4 LFCOLB.”

    “The documents are two renditions of the same image. What would they make of Monet? Would they accuse him of forging cathedrals & waterlilies?

    “Unless a difference in the information conveyed by the images can be identified, the only reason for this reaction is a predetermination of fraud.

    “Considered in isolation, there nothing here to base the baseless, pointless idea of, as they call it, a “bait and switch”. A switch of what? To what end? They are saying Tepper filed one image in MS, sent that image to HI, and then for some weird reason, expended effort in creating a new image to file in MS as having been sent to HI …. which is identical in content to the first image!

    “The birfers should be alleging that Tepper filed one image in MS, sent something different to HI, and then represented a copy of the image filed in MS as having been to HI. There would be no way to prove this from Tepper’s filings, short of an independent verification (of the verification!) from Hawaii. If Tepper had really pulled a ‘bait and switch’, then why the heck would there be anything different about the images?!? That would be a dead giveaway.

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHYou wish…It wouldn’t be a dead giveaway because I’m the only one who busted his scam.

    And Mr. C didn’t find it even after all my help.

    And by my count this is the second time that Obama has used the bait and switch. What do they say about a pattern of crime. May be a Rico violation?
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

    “There is one thing the birfers haven’t(?) noted. The image shrank slightly in the second filing. Gosh, how did that happen?

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    Way to go Dumski!

    You just argued Taitz’s case for her.

    How soon you Obots forget your lessons. A genuine $100 bill is prima facie evidence that the bearer of the bill can exchange it for $100 in merchandise. However a counterfeit $100 bill is worthless. So a verification letter from the Secret Service that the counterfeit bill is genuine does not mean that the counterfeit bill can be exchanged for $100 worth of merchandise. It just means that either the SS agent is in bed with the counterfeiter or that the SS forensic tech screwed up and found it to be genuine. The counterfeit bill is still not prima facie evidence that the bill can be exchanged for $100 worth of merchandise.

    I suggest you read the Federal Rules of evidence regarding production of duplicate copies in lieu of original documents.

    And then you should read all about the Best Evidence Rule.

    And then maybe you should reflect on the fact that Obama has stipulated to Judge Wingate that he requested and received two certified copies of his original long-form hospital generated long-form birth certificate from Loretta Fuddy on Apr 25, 2011. And instead of producing either of these to Judge Wingate, he has produced instead two non-duplicate (ie. forged) copies. And the two certified copies cost a total of $14.

    So why does Obama get a pass when any other citizen who presents a birth certificate to any Federal Agency must present a certified copy which meets the requirements of a 2004 Federal law?
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

  11. avatar
    Hermitian January 7, 2013 at 9:58 pm #

    We could easily end all of this fraud if Obama would just release his two certified copies to Judge Wingate.

    But then they say that Obama is really tight with his own money. Just ask his brother in Kenya. Sadly most progressives are like that. They love to spend other people’s money but not their own.

  12. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy January 7, 2013 at 10:30 pm #

    Sorry, did I pop your little red balloon?

    Hermitian: Suffice it to say that Mr. C. just posted a bunch of assumptions which are all false.

  13. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy January 7, 2013 at 10:33 pm #

    We can rule that one out. The verification from Onaka specifically states that he retrieved the PDF from the White House web site.

    aesthetocyst: The birfers should be alleging that Tepper filed one image in MS, sent something different to HI, and then represented a copy of the image filed in MS as having been to HI.

  14. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy January 7, 2013 at 10:37 pm #

    Why do you think Barack Obama “got a pass” and didn’t present a certified copy of his birth certificate to a federal agency? Did you just make that up for convenience or what?

    In my lifetime, I have only once submitted my birth certificate to a federal agency, the US Department of State, and that was to obtain a US Passport. Why do you think Barack Obama didn’t do that? Since then, I can’t think of any reason for him to have submitted a birth certificate. Can you?

    Hermitian: So why does Obama get a pass when any other citizen who presents a birth certificate to any Federal Agency must present a certified copy which meets the requirements of a 2004 Federal law?

  15. avatar
    Hermitian January 7, 2013 at 10:40 pm #

    “Reality CheckJanuary 7, 2013 at 9:23 pm (Quote)#

    “Thanks! Yes, I forgot it was Henry Blake. I am sure Vogt was in on it too.

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    RC don’t you think it’s about time to ask Tepper and Begley what they were in on?
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

    Thinker: I think RC is referring to an exchange between Paul Irey and Taitz’s newest birfoon “expert” Henry Wayland Blake.

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    I listened to two hours of buffoonery on RC radio last Saturday. Sounded like a bunch of first graders.
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

  16. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy January 7, 2013 at 10:46 pm #

    I am still stunned that Blake, after picking every nit under the sun examining that document, failed to actually read it and thereby missed the elephant in the room, the federal court document header on it, showing that it came from the earlier federal Docket itself. If there were ever a poster child for birther blindness, this is it. I read the Strunk Blake letter 3 times, and the Blake declaration above once more because I couldn’t believe what I was reading. How could he miss that!

    I’ll say it again. I’m not so smart; it’s the birthers who make me seem smart by comparison.

    Hermitian: I attest to this under penalty of perjury.

    Henry Blake, PhD

  17. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy January 7, 2013 at 10:48 pm #

    Quit whining. Your pet theory has just been flushed. Move on.

    Hermitian: I listened to two hours of buffoonery on RC radio last Saturday. Sounded like a bunch of first graders.

  18. avatar
    Hermitian January 7, 2013 at 10:53 pm #

    “Dr. ConspiracyJanuary 7, 2013 at 10:37 pm (Quote)#

    “Why do you think Barack Obama “got a pass” and didn’t present a certified copy of his birth certificate to a federal agency? Did you just make that up for convenience or what?

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    You just told your readers (and Taitz) that the WH LFCOLB PDF image is not a certified copy. Then it follows that if Obama has produced only the WH lFCOLB PDF image and a extensively altered version of same then he hasn’t yet produced either of his two certified copies to any court or election official.

    Now you are going to tell your readers that its OK for the President to present a non-certified copy because a Federal Court is not a Federal Agency. That may be technically true but try selling that one to the average citizen who has to present a certified copy just to get his passport.
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

    In my lifetime, I have only once submitted my birth certificate to a federal agency, the US Department of State, and that was to obtain a US Passport. Why do you think Barack Obama didn’t do that? Since then, I can’t think of any reason for him to have submitted a birth certificate. Can you?

    Hermitian: So why does Obama get a pass when any other citizen who presents a birth certificate to any Federal Agency must present a certified copy which meets the requirements of a 2004 Federal law?

  19. avatar
    Hermitian January 7, 2013 at 10:59 pm #

    “Dr. ConspiracyJanuary 7, 2013 at 10:37 pm (Quote)#
    Comment

    “In my lifetime, I have only once submitted my birth certificate to a federal agency, the US Department of State, and that was to obtain a US Passport. Why do you think Barack Obama didn’t do that? Since then, I can’t think of any reason for him to have submitted a birth certificate. Can you?”

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    Maybe when he got his Presidential Passport.

    Nah! He probably got another pass.
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

  20. avatar
    Whatever4 January 7, 2013 at 11:01 pm #

    Hermitian:

    How soon you Obots forget your lessons.A genuine $100 bill is prima facie evidence that the bearer of the bill can exchange it for $100 in merchandise.However a counterfeit $100 bill is worthless.So a verification letter from the Secret Service that the counterfeit bill is genuine does not mean that the counterfeit bill can be exchanged for $100 worth of merchandise.It just means that either the SS agent is in bed with the counterfeiter or that the SS forensic tech screwed up and found it to be genuine.The counterfeit bill is still not prima facie evidence that the bill can be exchanged for $100 worth of merchandise.

    I suggest you read the Federal Rules of evidence regarding production of duplicate copies in lieu of original documents.

    And then you should read all about the Best Evidence Rule.

    And then maybe you should reflect on the fact that Obama has stipulated to Judge Wingate that he requested and received two certified copies of his original long-form hospital generated long-form birth certificate from Loretta Fuddy on Apr 25, 2011.And instead of producing either of these to Judge Wingate, he has produced instead two non-duplicate (ie. forged) copies.And the two certified copies cost a total of $14.

    So why does Obama get a pass when any other citizen who presents a birth certificate to any Federal Agency must present a certified copy which meets the requirements of a 2004 Federal law?
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

    You really are clueless, and I rarely ever say that to anyone. There’s been no evidence presented in this case yet. There have only been motions filed. None of these files have been presented claiming they are certified copies of anything. No one has tried to spend a counterfeit $100 bill. The defense has never said they intend to spend the picture of the $100 bill. It’s just a PICTURE of a $100 bill. The Secret Service isn’t looking at it trying to see if it is counterfeit bill. No one asked them to see if it was counterfeit. Everyone but idiots know that it’s a picture, just like everyone knows the image of the BC isn’t purported to be a certified birth certificate. The rules of evidence don’t apply to these pictures because they aren’t evidence and never will be,

  21. avatar
    Hermitian January 7, 2013 at 11:13 pm #

    “Whatever4January 7, 2013 at 11:01 pm (Quote)#

    “Hermitian:

    “There’s been no evidence presented in this case yet.”

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    Please post the ruling of Judge Wingate stating that the WH LFCOLB PDF image which was filed with the letter correspondance between Obama and Fuddy is not evidence in either the election challenge or the Federal Rico case.
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

  22. avatar
    Thinker January 7, 2013 at 11:14 pm #

    Hermi: Obama didn’t present anything to Judge Wingate regarding his birth certificate. Everything on the record in this case regarding Obama’s birth certificate was either submitted by Taitz or by the Mississippi Democratic Party. Taitz was way, way down the rabbit hole in this case before she approximated proper service closely enough to get the President to respond, which wasn’t until 10/29. The certification from HI was submitted to the court by the Mississippi Democratic Party on 5/4/12.

    Also, the “best evidence rule” does not mean original documents. Certified copies of documents are “best evidence” according to federal rules. Taitz doesn’t know this because she is a moron.

    And, remember, the Mississippi Democratic Party did not submit a copy of the President’s birth certificate–certified or otherwise, paper or electronic–to the court as proof that he was born in Hawaii. They are not entitled to a copy according to Hawaii law. They submitted to the court a verification from the state of Hawaii that the facts stated on the birth certificate on the White House web site are the same facts on the birth certificate held by the state of Hawaii. That’s what Hawaii law provides for third parties in court proceedings.

    Taitz biggest problem–besides being a hate-filled moron, lunatic, and incompetent lawyer–is that she has not figured out how to get a court to compel Obama to produce his birth certificate in court. There is no law that says the president must have a birth certificate and there is no law that says that Orly Taitz has the authority to determine who is eligible to be president.

    Birfers will never, ever win this fight. They are wrong on the facts and wrong on the law. Period. End. of. story.

    Hermitian:
    I suggest you read the Federal Rules of evidence regarding production of duplicate copies in lieu of original documents.

    And then you should read all about the Best Evidence Rule.

    And then maybe you should reflect on the fact that Obama has stipulated to Judge Wingate that he requested and received two certified copies of his original long-form hospital generated long-form birth certificate from Loretta Fuddy on Apr 25, 2011.And instead of producing either of these to Judge Wingate, he has produced instead two non-duplicate (ie. forged) copies.And the two certified copies cost a total of $14.

  23. avatar
    aesthetocyst January 7, 2013 at 11:15 pm #

    Dr. Conspiracy: We can rule that one out. The verification from Onaka specifically states that he retrieved the PDF from the White House web site.

    … and all of the images involved stubbornly resemble said PDF on said web site. THanks for closing off their one slender hope.

    Dead ends, dead ends everywhere!

  24. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy January 7, 2013 at 11:19 pm #

    No, typically when you get a new passport, you use your old one as proof of citizenship, not a birth certificate.

    Hermitian: Maybe when he got his Presidential Passport.

    Nah! He probably got another pass.

  25. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy January 7, 2013 at 11:21 pm #

    Can you think of any President in the history of the Republic who has? Get real.

    Hermitian: You just told your readers (and Taitz) that the WH LFCOLB PDF image is not a certified copy. Then it follows that if Obama has produced only the WH lFCOLB PDF image and a extensively altered version of same then he hasn’t yet produced either of his two certified copies to any court or election official.

  26. avatar
    Hermitian January 7, 2013 at 11:22 pm #

    “Dr. ConspiracyJanuary 7, 2013 at 10:46 pm (Quote)#
    Comment

    “I am still stunned that Blake, after picking every nit under the sun examining that document, failed to actually read it and thereby missed the elephant in the room, the federal court document header on it, showing that it came from the earlier federal Docket itself. If there were ever a poster child for birther blindness, this is it. I read the Strunk Blake letter 3 times, and the Blake declaration above once more because I couldn’t believe what I was reading. How could he miss that!

    “I’ll say it again. I’m not so smart; it’s the birthers who make me seem smart by comparison.

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    IV. The alterations made to the White House LFCOLB PDF image to create the (page 8) image copy are incidental.

    1. The (page 8) image copy is otherwise identical to the white House image except for the “Case Label” added at the top margin.

    V. I found that the alterations to the (page 8) image copy to create the (page 4/11) image copy are extensive as follows:

    1. A second Case Label was added

    All Obots really are blind as bats.

    They can’t read English plain either.
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

  27. avatar
    aesthetocyst January 7, 2013 at 11:26 pm #

    Hermitian: It wouldn’t be a dead giveaway because I’m the only one who busted his scam.

    The logics am strong in this one. ( *LOL* )

    Hermitian: all my help.

    Your secretiveness constitutes “help”? Your foolishness is your consistent undoing, but it isn’t intentional, and therefore not ‘help’.

    aesthetocyst: The image shrank slightly in the second filing. Gosh, how did that happen?

    Hermitian: Way to go Dumski! You just argued Taitz’s case for he

    And …. WHOOOOooooooosh !!!

    Right over your head! That was a jibe at the technical incompetence of birfers. Thanks for nibbling.

    Everytime I start thinking you’re just playing dumb to facilitate your silliness, you manage to convince me that, no, you really have subjugated all reason to your agenda … or you’re just a childish idiot.

  28. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy January 7, 2013 at 11:29 pm #

    OK, you got me on that one. I was scanning for “15-1″ in the section describing what was done, not the detailed differences section. I should have read the second document 3 times too.

    So if Blake SAW the docket header, why didn’t he understand what it implied?

    Think for a moment. The purpose of the Hawaii verification was to show that the document that Tepper submitted to the Court was legitimate, countering Taitz’s claim that Tepper had submitted a forgery. Tepper, a very experienced attorney, would have known that Hawaii verifying the White House birth certificate didn’t directly deal with the claim that HE had submitted a forgery, so naturally he sent Hawaii a printed copy of what HE submitted to the court, printed from the Court Docket and bearing the Court’s docket header.

    To suggest that there was any electronic document manipulation in this process is crazy, just plain crazy. But it goes to show how utterly detached from normal thinking birthers are.

    Hermitian: 1. A second Case Label was added

    All Obots really are blind as bats.

    They can’t read English plain either.

  29. avatar
    y_p_w January 7, 2013 at 11:29 pm #

    Dr. Conspiracy:

    In my lifetime, I have only once submitted my birth certificate to a federal agency, the US Department of State, and that was to obtain a US Passport. Why do you think Barack Obama didn’t do that? Since then, I can’t think of any reason for him to have submitted a birth certificate. Can you?

    A birth certificate can be used as proof of citizenship for employment eligibility along with a government photo ID, but that isn’t submitted to the government per se. I understand that in the past a birth certificate was useful to obtain a Social Security Number. Native born US citizens may need to present a birth certificate when joining the military.

    These are the only examples I can think of.

    Frankly for most government transactions a passport is sufficient as long as the holder keeps a current one.

  30. avatar
    SluggoJD January 7, 2013 at 11:31 pm #

    Hermitian:
    “Whatever4January 7, 2013 at 11:01 pm(Quote)#

    “Hermitian:

    “There’s been no evidence presented in this case yet.”

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    Please post the ruling of Judge Wingate stating that the WH LFCOLB PDF image which was filed with the letter correspondance between Obama and Fuddy is not evidence in either the election challenge or the Federal Rico case.
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

    Up yours. Nobody owes you or any other racist nut case a damn thing.

    You’re a loser, and you will continue to be a loser. Obama is President. You are an anonymous turd. I wonder who laughs, and who is worthy of being laughed at.

    I for one can’t begin to understand why a racist turd, such as yourself, would be proud or arrogant about anything. Perhaps you were voted worst smelling turd long ago, or perhaps you’re able to ride a bike and chew gum at the same time.

  31. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy January 7, 2013 at 11:40 pm #

    It is always possible that Hermitian is an Obot saboteur trying to discredit the birthers, and doing a damned find job of it! Note, that I have no inside information that suggests this.

    aesthetocyst: Everytime I start thinking you’re just playing dumb to facilitate your silliness, you manage to convince me that, no, you really have subjugated all reason to your agenda … or you’re just a childish idiot.

  32. avatar
    aesthetocyst January 7, 2013 at 11:46 pm #

    Dr. Conspiracy:
    It is always possible that Hermitian is an Obot saboteur trying to discredit the birthers, and doing a damned find job of it! Note, that I have no inside information that suggests this.

    The idea has popped up many times. If it were so, HHHopkins deserve a lifetime Achievement Webby for Excellence in Trolling. H’s (if false) is so consistent, and dedicated, it would far outshine Colbert as a parody persona.

  33. avatar
    Reality Check January 7, 2013 at 11:51 pm #

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

    Just because I can.

  34. avatar
    aesthetocyst January 7, 2013 at 11:54 pm #

    It has also occurred to me … the supreme irony of someone calling themselves ‘Hermitian” managing to demonstrate a total inability to digital imaging and in particular image compression a field which relies on matrix operations … and owes a great debt to Charles Hermite …. father of … Hermitian Theory … Hermitian operators … Hermitian matrices.

  35. avatar
    Reality Check January 7, 2013 at 11:55 pm #

    The problem is that is that is not possible to differentiate genuine Birther stupidity from satire. You just cannot outdo the Birthers when you want to pretend to be stupid.

    aesthetocyst: The idea has popped up many times. If it were so, HHHopkins deserve a lifetime Achievement Webby for Excellence in Trolling. H’s (if false) is so consistent, and dedicated, it would far outshine Colbert as a parody persona.

  36. avatar
    aesthetocyst January 7, 2013 at 11:56 pm #

    aesthetocyst: …to comprehend digital…

    [ Spoiled by the absent edit function ... I taitz'd myself! ]

  37. avatar
    Thinker January 8, 2013 at 12:00 am #

    I thought that about Martha Trowbridge. Her stuff about Obama being the son of Malcolm X was just too crazy for a real, live person with a functioning brain stem to cook up, but I was wrong. Somebody posted a photo of her on the Fogbow recently.

    I must admit that part of the reason I thought she was fake was because of her unusual last name. There is a Trowbridge Street in Cambridge, Massachusetts a couple of blocks from Harvard Law School (and right across the street from where Ben Affleck and Matt Damon went to high school). It’s only a couple of blocks long and no one who wasn’t from Cambridge would even know it’s there. What with Cambridge being the center of the world and all, I thought her last name was an inside joke.

    I was wrong. It was just a coincidence.

    Dr. Conspiracy:
    It is always possible that Hermitian is an Obot saboteur trying to discredit the birthers, and doing a damned find job of it!

  38. avatar
    Hermitian January 8, 2013 at 12:11 am #

    “ThinkerJanuary 7, 2013 at 11:14 pm (Quote)#

    “Hermi: Obama didn’t present anything to Judge Wingate regarding his birth certificate. Everything on the record in this case regarding Obama’s birth certificate was either submitted by Taitz or by the Mississippi Democratic Party. Taitz was way, way down the rabbit hole in this case before she approximated proper service closely enough to get the President to respond, which wasn’t until 10/29. The certification from HI was submitted to the court by the Mississippi Democratic Party on 5/4/12.

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    Actually it was filed on 06/06/2012 as court Document 35-2.
    Document 35-1 was also filed on this same date.

    The MDEC attorneys have not informed Judge Wingate as to the creation date of the Tepper page 4/11 LFCOLB PDF image or identified where and from whom it was obtained.

    Mr. C just revealed yesterday that he had “reconstructed” Obama’s LFCOLB 2 years before it was created.
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

    “Also, the “best evidence rule” does not mean original documents. Certified copies of documents are “best evidence” according to federal rules. Taitz doesn’t know this because she is a moron.”

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    Right genius! Keep thinking she’s a moron and she will eat your lunch.

    Best Evidence Rule:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Best_evidence_rule

    The best evidence rule has been codified in Rules 1001 to 1008 of the Federal Rules of Evidence.[4]

    [4] Federal Rules of Evidence, Rule 1001

    “Rule 1002. Requirement of the Original”
    1. An original writing, recording, or photograph is required in order to prove its content unless these rules or a federal statute provides otherwise.

    “Rule 1003. Admissibility of Duplicates”
    1. A duplicate is admissible to the same extent as the original unless a genuine question is raised about the original’s authenticity or the circumstances make it unfair to admit the duplicate.

    Orly Taitz has raised a genuine question about the original’s authenticity. The situation makes it unfair to the plaintiffs for Obama to submit a certified copy.

    There are no Federal Rules of Evidence that anticipate that a party will submit a non-duplicate (or forged copy) in lieu of the original.

    Thus even assuming that Obama’s certified copies are originals, it is unfair to the plaintiffs to permit Obama to submit a non-duplicate and non-certified copy of a certified copy.

    That’s just the way it is.
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

  39. avatar
    misha marinsky January 8, 2013 at 12:14 am #

    Hermitian: So why does Obama get a pass when any other citizen who presents a birth certificate to any Federal Agency must present a certified copy which meets the requirements of a 2004 Federal law?

    What you are saying is true, but how else is the Communist Party going to subvert and take over the country?

    Да здравствует Ленин!

  40. avatar
    Hermitian January 8, 2013 at 12:18 am #

    A Hermitian matrix is equal to it’s tranjugate.

    Live with it…

  41. avatar
    misha marinsky January 8, 2013 at 12:27 am #

    Hermitian: I found that the alterations to the (page 8) image copy to create the (page 4/11) image copy are extensive as follows:

    Actually, the media is controlled by Fox and Ailes.

    Glenn Beck’s 1990 rape and murder was never investigated. Where did Mitt Romney bury the girl he strangled in 1987?

    There’s the proof who really controls the news. If Obama was implicated, Fox would be all over it.

  42. avatar
    Hermitian January 8, 2013 at 12:36 am #

    “Dr. ConspiracyJanuary 7, 2013 at 11:29 pm (Quote)#

    “OK, you got me on that one. I was scanning for “15-1″ in the section describing what was done, not the detailed differences section. I should have read the second document 3 times too.

    “So if Blake SAW the docket header, why didn’t he understand what it implied?

    “Think for a moment. The purpose of the Hawaii verification was to show that the document that Tepper submitted to the Court was legitimate, countering Taitz’s claim that Tepper had submitted a forgery. Tepper, a very experienced attorney, would have known that Hawaii verifying the White House birth certificate didn’t directly deal with the claim that HE had submitted a forgery, so naturally he sent Hawaii a printed copy of what HE submitted to the court, printed from the Court Docket and bearing the Court’s docket header.

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    I’ll make it simple for you. Did he attach the printed page 8 LFCOLB or the printed page 4/11 LFCOLB to his letter to Fuddy?
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

    “To suggest that there was any electronic document manipulation in this process is crazy, just plain crazy. But it goes to show how utterly detached from normal thinking birthers are”.

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    Said the premier Obot Birth Certificate expert who didn’t accept my challenge to compare the two different LFCOLB PDF Images and catalog all the changes that were made to the WH LFCOLB PDF image to create the Tepper page 4/11 LFCOLB PDF image.
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

  43. avatar
    Rickey January 8, 2013 at 12:41 am #

    Hermitian:

    Hermitian: So why does Obama get a pass when any other citizen who presents a birth certificate to any Federal Agency must present a certified copy which meets the requirements of a 2004 Federal law?

    What pass? As far as we know, Obama hasn’t presented his birth certificate to any Federal agency since he first applied for a U.S. passport. And if he did, he most likely submitted the COLB which was issued to him in 2007.

    What you bithers don’t seem to realize is that Obama has never used his LFBC for any official purpose. If I were to forge my birth certificate and posted it on Facebook to convince my friends that I am ten years younger than I actually am, I would not be breaking any law. On the other hand, if I forged my birth certificate and then tried to use it obtain a passport or driver’s license, I would be breaking the law.

  44. avatar
    Whatever4 January 8, 2013 at 1:48 am #

    Hermitian:
    “Whatever4January 7, 2013 at 11:01 pm(Quote)#

    “Hermitian:

    “There’s been no evidence presented in this case yet.”

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    Please post the ruling of Judge Wingate stating that the WH LFCOLB PDF image which was filed with the letter correspondance between Obama and Fuddy is not evidence in either the election challenge or the Federal Rico case.
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

    There isn’t such a ruling as the evidence part of the lawsuit hasn’t begun (and won’t ever begin). Show us any ruling that anything has been accepted as evidence. IANAL, but I’m not an idiot.

  45. avatar
    Joey January 8, 2013 at 3:44 am #

    Hermitian:
    “Whatever4January 7, 2013 at 11:01 pm(Quote)#

    “Hermitian:

    “There’s been no evidence presented in this case yet.”

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    Please post the ruling of Judge Wingate stating that the WH LFCOLB PDF image which was filed with the letter correspondance between Obama and Fuddy is not evidence in either the election challenge or the Federal Rico case.
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

    There have been exhibits presented to Judge Wingate in dispositive motions by the prosecution and in pre-trial motions by the plaintiffs. Judge Wingate has not yet acted on the pre-trial/dispositive motions for either plaintiffs or defense.
    The trial is not yet in the evidentiary phase and there has been no discovery.
    Hermitian might want to at least watch an episode or two of law and order before she/he posts here and makes a fool of her/himself.

  46. avatar
    Hermitian January 8, 2013 at 8:10 am #

    JoeyJanuary 8, 2013 at 3:44 am (Quote)#

    Hermitian:
    “Whatever4January 7, 2013 at 11:01 pm(Quote)#

    “Hermitian:

    ““There’s been no evidence presented in this case yet.”

    “HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    Please post the ruling of Judge Wingate stating that the WH LFCOLB PDF image which was filed with the letter correspondance between Obama and Fuddy is not evidence in either the election challenge or the Federal Rico case.
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

    “There have been exhibits presented to Judge Wingate in dispositive motions by the prosecution and in pre-trial motions by the plaintiffs.”

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    So we have prosecutors, plaintiffs and defendants in this civil trial. IANAL either but which country has these “triangle” (i.e. three sided) cases?
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

  47. avatar
    Hermitian January 8, 2013 at 8:25 am #

    “RickeyJanuary 8, 2013 at 12:41 am (Quote)#
    Comment

    “Hermitian:

    “Hermitian: So why does Obama get a pass when any other citizen who presents a birth certificate to any Federal Agency must present a certified copy which meets the requirements of a 2004 Federal law?

    “What pass? As far as we know, Obama hasn’t presented his birth certificate to any Federal agency since he first applied for a U.S. passport. And if he did, he most likely submitted the COLB which was issued to him in 2007.

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    Oops! Don’t you mean June 2008. That’s the official statement on the WH web site.
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

    “What you bithers don’t seem to realize is that Obama has never used his LFBC for any official purpose. If I were to forge my birth certificate and posted it on Facebook to” convince my friends that I am ten years younger than I actually am, I would not be breaking any law. On the other hand, if I forged my birth certificate and then tried to use it obtain a passport or driver’s license, I would be breaking the law.”

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

    So when the White House Posted the Obama LFCOLB on the WH server and handed out paper copies of it and his COLB along with the letter correspondence between Obama and Fuddy in an early morning presser for the WH press core and then the President did another (i.e. separate) WH press conference to announce that he had just released additional official information about the facts of his birth to the world, that was not an official action !

    Oh! I see — it wasn’t an official purpose because Bauer scrubbed the room of all copies of the LFCOLB before the President spoke so that he would have plausible deniability.
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

  48. avatar
    Rene Magritte January 8, 2013 at 9:41 am #

    I see on LinkedIn that Henry Blake is “Retired at Oak Ridge National Laboraty”

    I submit that

    1) There is no such place as “Retired at Oak Ridge National Laboraty”

    2) There is an “Oak Ridge National Laboratory“, but it is not, in fact, a retirement community.

    3) As everyone knows, Henry Blake was killed in a plane crash returning home from Korea.

    I therefore declare that “Henry Blake” is himself a counterfeit and a forgery. I’ll bring the frogs.

  49. avatar
    LW January 8, 2013 at 9:48 am #

    Is editing/deleting now disabled here even in standard web browsers?

  50. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy January 8, 2013 at 10:11 am #

    You seem to be talking about the “second case label.” It is the FIRST case label that is the smoking gun.

    Hermitian: IV. The alterations made to the White House LFCOLB PDF image to create the (page 8) image copy are incidental.

    1. The (page 8) image copy is otherwise identical to the white House image except for the “Case Label” added at the top margin.

    V. I found that the alterations to the (page 8) image copy to create the (page 4/11) image copy are extensive as follows:

    1. A second Case Label was added

    All Obots really are blind as bats.

  51. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy January 8, 2013 at 10:12 am #

    Where did this little bit of alleged information come from?

    Hermitian: Oh! I see — it wasn’t an official purpose because Bauer scrubbed the room of all copies of the LFCOLB before the President spoke so that he would have plausible deniability.

  52. avatar
    Lupin January 8, 2013 at 10:14 am #

    Is “Hermitian” a troll?

    It’s hard to believe someone can be that stupid otherwise?

  53. avatar
    Thomas Brown January 8, 2013 at 10:17 am #

    Whatever4: So a verification letter from the Secret Service that the counterfeit bill is genuine does not mean that the counterfeit bill can be exchanged for $100 worth of merchandise.It just means that either the SS agent is in bed with the counterfeiter or that the SS forensic tech screwed up and found it to be genuine.

    Love it.

    In Hermie’s loony topsy-trurvy bizarro world, Secret Service agents being in cahoots with forgers and their forensic techs being incompetent is a regular, common occurrence.

    The stupid…. It burns….

  54. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy January 8, 2013 at 10:19 am #

    It would be complete lunacy to compare a document and a scan of a printed copy of it and detail all the changes. Duh, of course there are differences. I don’t think you even yet realize the total insanity of what Blake did and how he interpreted events.

    Look at what Blake is suggesting:

    Tepper took the White House Birth certificate PDF file. Then he altered it to add a fake US Courts ECF header. Then he extensively manipulated the file doing all sorts of layer merging, halo removal and other stuff, added other documents then submitted it back to the court.

    Compared to:

    Tepper printed out the Court ECF document, added it to a stack of other documents to mail to Hawaii, a copy of which he scanned and filed with the court, saying: here’s what we sent to Hawaii.

    Name ONE detail that fits the Rube Goldberg twisted crazy manipulation in the first, with the normal course of business in the second. Stuff like this is why there is a birther movement, total inability to spot nonsense.

    Hermitian: Said the premier Obot Birth Certificate expert who didn’t accept my challenge to compare the two different LFCOLB PDF Images and catalog all the changes that were made to the WH LFCOLB PDF image to create the Tepper page 4/11 LFCOLB PDF image.

  55. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy January 8, 2013 at 10:21 am #

    No, Hermitian is not a troll. I know who he is, but such things are off limits for discussion.

    Lupin: Is “Hermitian” a troll?

  56. avatar
    LW January 8, 2013 at 10:42 am #

    Hermitian: Right genius! Keep thinking she’s a moron and she will eat your lunch.

    Said of the woman who cited Wikipedia in Keyes v. Bowen.

  57. avatar
    donna January 8, 2013 at 10:50 am #

    LW

    Judge Charles Marginis told Taitz, “You should know that evidence is not stuff printed from the internet.”

  58. avatar
    aesthetocyst January 8, 2013 at 10:51 am #

    Dr. Conspiracy: No, Hermitian is not a troll. I know who he is, but such things are off limits for discussion.

    I’ll never tell. It’s fun to play along. But, damn the truth funny. All the birfers continually punk each other LOL!

  59. avatar
    Hermitian January 8, 2013 at 11:17 am #

    “Dr. ConspiracyJanuary 8, 2013 at 10:12 am (Quote)#

    “Where did this little bit of alleged information come from?

    “Hermitian: Oh! I see — it wasn’t an official purpose because Bauer scrubbed the room of all copies of the LFCOLB before the President spoke so that he would have plausible deniability.

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    The part about no copies in the room when Obama spoke came from the transcript of the early morning presser for the WH press core.

    For what other reason would Bauer do that other than plausible deniability?

    Bauer resigned as the President’s Counsel and left the White House a month or two later.
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

  60. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy January 8, 2013 at 11:19 am #

    Orly Taitz is not a moron. I think that’s why some folks suggested it was a bad idea for me to phone her. However, it’s the birther’s lunch she’s eating and has been for 4 years.

    Hermitian: Right genius! Keep thinking she’s a moron and she will eat your lunch.

  61. avatar
    Scientist January 8, 2013 at 11:23 am #

    Hermitian: So when the White House Posted the Obama LFCOLB on the WH server and handed out paper copies of it and his COLB along with the letter correspondence between Obama and Fuddy in an early morning presser for the WH press core and then the President did another (i.e. separate) WH press conference to announce that he had just released additional official information about the facts of his birth to the world, that was not an official action !

    I don’t believe that pressers have any official status whatsoever. They certainly don’t appear in the Constitution. There is no legal obligation for the White House to speak with the press at all.

  62. avatar
    donna January 8, 2013 at 11:37 am #

    doc: it’s the birther’s lunch she’s eating and has been for 4 years.

    i remember when klayman said he needed $25k to fund his lawsuits – in normal litigation (in ny at least), attorneys file copies of their timeslips (and retainer agreements) with their pleadings – no one is monitoring what these birther litigants are spending

  63. avatar
    JD Reed January 8, 2013 at 11:42 am #

    Hermitian: Right genius! Keep thinking she’s a moron and she will eat your lunch.

    Mr. H, so far after more than four years of trying, exactly how many of other peoples’ lunches has Orly ingested?\
    No, she’s not a moron. She’s either delusional or she’s a scam artist playing the birther faithful for fools.

  64. avatar
    LW January 8, 2013 at 11:52 am #

    Hermitian: The part about no copies in the room when Obama spoke came from the transcript of the early morning presser for the WH press core.

    This transcript?

    Or this one?

    Or some other one?

    LWLWLWLWLWLW. Say it soft and it’s almost like praying.

  65. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy January 8, 2013 at 11:53 am #

    I believe that if you listen to the birthers, you may learn something, even though you always have to check the sources.

    Such was the case here. I was on vacation on April 27, 2011, the day the long form was released and I didn’t have any research capability, and I only got to watch the White House press conference later.

    Hermitian told me something that I didn’t know: that there was a press briefing before the President spoke. A quick check of the White House web site located the transcript that Hermitian referenced:

    http://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press-office/2011/04/27/press-gaggle-press-secretary-jay-carney-4272011

    In true birther fashion, Hermitian filters the evidence in an odd way. He said:

    [Bob] Bauer scrubbed the room of all copies of the LFCOLB before the President spoke so that he would have plausible deniability.

    In fact, this is not literally true. What Bauer said was that he was taking the original certified copy with him, and that the President wouldn’t be holding it. He never said or even hinted that the copies handed out to the press, the non-certified copies, were being removed from the room. The transcript indicates that at the beginning of the briefing that all of the press had copies of the birth certificate in their hands.

    However, the reason that I write such a long reply, and why I talked about learning something, is another fact that the press briefing disclosed: that the ORIGINAL certified copy of Obama’s long form was shown to the press, the whole group of them, not just Savannah Guthrie, who photographed it. I presumed this true, but I never had the documentation until now. Thanks Hermitian. From the transcript:

    Q You’ve got two certified copies, according to this study. You have these physical —
    MR. PFEIFFER: Yes. I showed you one … It has a seal on it.

    Hermitian: The part about no copies in the room when Obama spoke came from the transcript of the early morning presser for the WH press core.

    For what other reason would Bauer do that other than plausible deniability?

    Bauer resigned as the President’s Counsel and left the White House a month or two later.

  66. avatar
    CarlOrcas January 8, 2013 at 11:53 am #

    Hermitian: WH press core

    So which came first…..the press “core” or the rotten apple?

  67. avatar
    CarlOrcas January 8, 2013 at 11:59 am #

    Hermitian: Right genius! Keep thinking she’s a moron and she will eat your lunch.

    I think it’s safe to say, at this point in the process, that Orly is suffering from a serious case of legal anorexia.

  68. avatar
    LW January 8, 2013 at 12:04 pm #

    Hermitian: Bauer resigned as the President’s Counsel and left the White House a month or two later.

    Two months later, to be specific–to return to his prior role as counsel for Obama’s campaign team. So I’m having a hard time finding a causal link between that action and the BC press gaggle.

  69. avatar
    donna January 8, 2013 at 12:12 pm #

    DOC:

    i love this part: (emphasis mine)

    MR. PFEIFFER: There has been — no one that I can recall actually asked us to — we were asked to release the President’s birth certificate in 2008. We did that. And then NO ONE — it never — up until a few weeks ago, there was never an issue about that that wasn’t the birth certificate from any CREDIBLE INDIVIDUAL OR MEDIA OUTFIT. And it hasn’t been until — I mean, Jay was asked about this yesterday –

  70. avatar
    aesthetocyst January 8, 2013 at 12:13 pm #

    Dr. Conspiracy: I believe that if you listen to the birthers, you may learn something, even though you always have to check the sources.

    Oh, absolutely! Herms used to live on the Amazon boards, and was always very upfront about sources, every time he found a shiny. He laid them down like they were irrefutable. And, every time, the real story turned out to be Herms crrrrrrrazy misinterpretations. In another aspect of the reactive nature of debunking, obsession drives loons to dig up the darndest things; they’ll do your work for you.

    I guess he got tired of being laughed at, as for the past several months, he’s only alluded to his sources. He’s getting smarter. If you play his game and name what he must be referring to, he has the option of saying, “Nope, guess again!” and/or insisting he has a super-sekrit source which he can not now reveal … all in due time, haha. And, so long as he doesn’t commit to a specific source, he can even deny when presented with the correct material from another source.

    I keep thinking to go easy on him, lest he stop paying off. But he makes it so hard LOL

  71. avatar
    aesthetocyst January 8, 2013 at 12:14 pm #

    LW: Two months later, to be specific–to return to his prior role as counsel for Obama’s campaign team.

    You mean, the same week the re-election campaign officially kicked off in Chicago, May 2011?

    What a curious and suspicious coincidence.

  72. avatar
    donna January 8, 2013 at 12:29 pm #

    hermit/martian:

    on june 2, 2011, bauer returned to private practice to again represent the president’s election team and the Democratic National Committee

    He was formerly a partner at Perkins Coie. In November, 2009, he was named to be the next White House Counsel, upon the resignation of Gregory Craig. Bauer was President Obama’s personal attorney and the general counsel of the Obama for America presidential campaign prior to his appointment as White House Counsel. He has also previously served as the general counsel to the Democratic National Committee, and had advised President Obama since Mr. Obama came to Washington, D.C. in 2005 as U. S. Senator.

  73. avatar
    DP January 8, 2013 at 12:58 pm #

    What’s up with the string of “H”s? Visually, it’s rather irritating.

  74. avatar
    Sudoku January 8, 2013 at 1:10 pm #

    Hm….that is a head-scratcher. Could you explain how the President would have plausible deniability for his own birth certificate?

    Hermitian: Oh! I see — it wasn’t an official purpose because Bauer scrubbed the room of all copies of the LFCOLB before the President spoke so that he would have plausible deniability.

  75. avatar
    Thomas Brown January 8, 2013 at 1:20 pm #

    DP:
    What’s up with the string of “H”s? Visually, it’s rather irritating.

    Hey, irritating is Hemitian’s middle name!

    Wait… I was wrong… it’s actually “Eeesh.”

  76. avatar
    aesthetocyst January 8, 2013 at 1:21 pm #

    DP:
    What’s up with the string of “H”s? Visually, it’s rather irritating.

    ASCII fences. Better than tin foil.

  77. avatar
    CarlOrcas January 8, 2013 at 1:24 pm #

    Sudoku:
    Hm….that is a head-scratcher. Could you explain how the President would have plausible deniability for his own birth certificate?

    Thanks for asking. I was just getting ready to do it when I saw your post. I can’t wait to see the answer!

  78. avatar
    Hermitian January 8, 2013 at 1:25 pm #

    “Dr. ConspiracyJanuary 8, 2013 at 10:19 am (Quote)#
    Comment

    “It would be complete lunacy to compare a document and a scan of a printed copy of it and detail all the changes. Duh, of course there are differences. I don’t think you even yet realize the total insanity of what Blake did and how he interpreted events.”

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    No given the circumstances, a sane person would extract the page 8 WH PDF image from the 15-1.pdf court document, add the second case label in green color, and then merge that minimally altered WH LFCOLB PDF image page with the PDF file of the Tepper 3-page letter as page 4.

    This work flow would require no printing or scanning.

    To carry out this work flow would have been simple and clearly legal. The second case label would be the only alteration to the initial court filing of the WH LFCOLB PDF image.

    We know that the Tepper 3-page letter existed as a separate PDF document because that 3-page document was uploaded to scribd on 06/06/2012. HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

    “Look at what Blake is suggesting:

    “Tepper took the White House Birth certificate PDF file. Then he altered it to add a fake US Courts ECF header. Then he extensively manipulated the file doing all sorts of layer merging, halo removal and other stuff, added other documents then submitted it back to the court.”

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    Wrong! That’s not what I am suggesting at all.

    I certainly didn’t suggest that the case label was forged. Don’t put words in my mouth.

    I don’t know what Tepper did. Only he knows that.

    However Tepper did submit the extensively altered page 4/11 PDF image in the separate four-page court document 35-1.pdf that was filed with Judge Wingate on 06/06/2012. This four-page document consists of the three-page request for verification letter on the letterhead of Tepper’s law firm. This letter is signed only by Tepper. A search of the four-page document (after application of OCR) for the name “Begley” returns zero hits. A separate three page electronic document with the fourth page missing was uploaded to Scribd on 6/06/2012. This three-page document was identical to the first three pages of the court document 35-1 with the first page numbered 1 of 4. The date of the Tepper to Fuddy letter was 05/26/2012. Most likely the initial document was a Word document.

    The creation date of the extensively altered one-page 4/11 LFCOLB PDF image is unknown as is it’s creator.

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

    “Compared to:

    “Tepper printed out the Court ECF document, added it to a stack of other documents to mail to Hawaii, a copy of which he scanned and filed with the court, saying: here’s what we sent to Hawaii”

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    See my comment below !
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

    “Name ONE detail that fits the Rube Goldberg twisted crazy manipulation in the first, with the normal course of business in the second. Stuff like this is why there is a birther movement, total inability to spot nonsense.

    “”Hermitian: Said the premier Obot Birth Certificate expert who didn’t accept my challenge to compare the two different LFCOLB PDF Images and catalog all the changes that were made to the WH LFCOLB PDF image to create the Tepper page 4/11 LFCOLB PDF image.””

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    The Tepper four-page PDF court document 35-1 was created on 06/04/2012 and was last modified on 06/06/2012.

    The creation date of the extensively altered one-page 4/11 LFCOLB PDF image is unknown as is it’s creator.

    The Tepper to Fuddy letter was dated 05/26/2012.

    The Onaka verification letter (see court document 35-2.pdf) was dated 05/31/20012.

    The unanswered question remains — Did Tepper attach the WH LFCOLB PDF image or the extensively altered Tepper page 4/11 LFCOLB image to his letter to Fuddy?

    With regards to the alterations made to the WH LFCOLB PDF image to create the Tepper page 4/11 LFCOLB PDF image I stand on my affadavit.
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

  79. avatar
    CarlOrcas January 8, 2013 at 1:32 pm #

    aesthetocyst: ASCII fences. Better than tin foil.

    Actually it reminds me of how one fellow used to handle messages on the old Compuserve Forums. He was probably using a TRS80. Maybe Hermetian is waiting for the bugs to be worked out of Windows 3.0 before he upgrades.

  80. avatar
    Joey January 8, 2013 at 2:15 pm #

    Hermitian:
    JoeyJanuary 8, 2013 at 3:44 am(Quote)#

    Hermitian:“Whatever4January 7, 2013 at 11:01 pm(Quote)#

    “Hermitian:

    ““There’s been no evidence presented in this case yet.”

    “HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHPlease post the ruling of Judge Wingate stating that the WH LFCOLB PDF image which was filed with the letter correspondance between Obama and Fuddy is not evidence in either the election challenge or the Federal Rico case.HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

    “There have been exhibits presented to Judge Wingate in dispositive motions by the prosecution and in pre-trial motions by the plaintiffs.”

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    So we have prosecutors, plaintiffs and defendants in this civil trial.IANAL either but which country has these “triangle” (i.e. three sided) cases?
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

    What parts of the words “EXHIBITS” in “MOTIONS” were too difficult for you to understand?
    This civil action is not yet in the evidentiary phase and there is no assurance that it ever will be.
    The defense submitted a copy of the whitehouse.gov image of the long form and a certified letter of verification that they asked Judge Wingate to take Judicial Notice of, in a Motion For Judgement on The Pleadings, which is a dispositive motion.

    A motion for judgement on the pleadings is a party’s request to the Court to rule in his/her favor based on the pleadings on file, WITHOUT ACCEPTING EVIDENCE, as when the outcome of the case rests on the Court’s interpretation of the law.
    The function of a motion for judgement on the pleadings is to DISPOSE of baseless claims or defenses when formal pleadings reveal their lack of merit.

  81. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy January 8, 2013 at 2:15 pm #

    You said that Tepper used the White House PDF as a basis for the document. That document has no case label. The inescapable conclusion of your version of events is that Tepper added the case label to the document.

    I said (perhaps incorrectly) that you failed to notice the the 15-1 document label. You said you did notice it, as evidenced by two statements that labels were added. So if you honestly were referencing the label that I was talking about, then you said it was added.

    If the Court ECF case label was added, then, you claimed it was a fake/forgery.

    Hermitian: Wrong! That’s not what I am suggesting at all.

    I certainly didn’t suggest that the case label was forged. Don’t put words in my mouth.

  82. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy January 8, 2013 at 2:17 pm #

    Of course you conveniently ignore that Tepper had to mail the whole thing to Hawaii. How does he do that without printing something?

    Sorry, you can wail and flail and try to deny the obvious, but your little theory is chock full of holes, and cannot explain the evidence. It is total nonsense.

    Hermitian: This work flow would require no printing or scanning.

  83. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy January 8, 2013 at 2:22 pm #

    Hermitian: The creation date of the extensively altered one-page 4/11 LFCOLB PDF image is unknown as is it’s creator.

  84. avatar
    Whatever4 January 8, 2013 at 2:52 pm #

    DP:
    What’s up with the string of “H”s? Visually, it’s rather irritating.

    Because __________________________ cuts the monitor and creates a gap for the electrons to ooze out.

  85. avatar
    aesthetocyst January 8, 2013 at 2:57 pm #

    Hermitian: “Look at what Blake is suggesting …

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    Wrong! That’s not what I am suggesting at all.

    He used to be more concerned about being secretive.

  86. avatar
    aesthetocyst January 8, 2013 at 3:17 pm #

    Hermitian: add the second case label in green color,

    Why would a ‘sane’ person change the color of the label? Just for kicks? Really, Herms. I can see you’re very defensive of your personal creation, but no one’s buying. The angle you’re selling is Occam’s Razor inverted. It doesn’t explain any of the differences logically. Nor does it get around the fact that these are two images of the same thing.

    Seriously, what is the point of the forgery you’re alleged? What has been switched, who has been deceived? They read the same. If making a crappy copy is forgery, then string Taitz up!

    You’ve been saying you had sent evidence and made calls to various gov’t agencies relating to various birfer memes over the past year. You finally found someone willing to take you seriously … your fellow birfers!

  87. avatar
    Hermitian January 8, 2013 at 3:33 pm #

    Dr. ConspiracyJanuary 8, 2013 at 11:53 am (Quote)#
    Comment

    “I believe that if you listen to the birthers, you may learn something, even though you always have to check the sources.

    “Such was the case here. I was on vacation on April 27, 2011, the day the long form was released and I didn’t have any research capability, and I only got to watch the White House press conference later.

    “Hermitian told me something that I didn’t know: that there was a press briefing before the President spoke.

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    Wonders never cease!
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

    “A quick check of the White House web site located the transcript that Hermitian referenced:

    http://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press-office/2011/04/27/press-gaggle-press-secretary-jay-carney-4272011

    “In true birther fashion, Hermitian filters the evidence in an odd way. He said:
    [Bob] Bauer scrubbed the room of all copies of the LFCOLB before the President spoke so that he would have plausible deniability.

    “In fact, this is not literally true. What Bauer said was that he was taking the original certified copy with him, and that the President wouldn’t be holding it. He never said or even hinted that the copies handed out to the press, the non-certified copies, were being removed from the room.”

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    So aren’t we splitting hairs here just a bit? Unless the President has binocular vision what’s the difference?

    However, it is clear from the transcript that if any certified copies were shown to the press, they were removed from the room before the President arrived.

    “Q Will the President be holding it?

    “”MR. PFEIFFER: He will not, and I will not leave it here for him to do so. But it will — the State Department of Health in Hawaii will obviously attest that that is a — what they have on file. As Bob said, it’s in a book in Hawaii.”“

    Some FILTER !

    Nevertheless nothing in either transcript sheds any light on whether or not a copy of his LFCOLB was in the room when the President spoke.
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

    “The transcript indicates that at the beginning of the briefing that all of the press had copies of the birth certificate in their hands.”

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    This reference to reporters having copies in hand at the beginning of the briefing was at the start of the press gaggle which began at 8:48 am. There is no reference to reporters holding copies when the President spoke later at 9:48 am.
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

    “However, the reason that I write such a long reply, and why I talked about learning something, is another fact that the press briefing disclosed: that the ORIGINAL certified copy of Obama’s long form was shown to the press, the whole group of them, not just Savannah Guthrie, who photographed it. I presumed this true, but I never had the documentation until now. Thanks Hermitian. From the transcript:

    “Q You’ve got two certified copies, according to this study. You have these physical –
    MR. PFEIFFER: Yes. I showed you one … It has a seal on it.

    ““Hermitian: The part about no copies in the room when Obama spoke came from the transcript of the early morning presser for the WH press core.
    For what other reason would Bauer do that other than plausible deniability?
    Bauer resigned as the President’s Counsel and left the White House a month or two later.”“

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    Actually the entire exchange between Pheiffer and the reporter was:

    Q You’ve got two certified copies, according to this study. You have these physical —
    1. MR. PFEIFFER: Yes. I showed you one. Just one.

    Q You showed us a photocopy of one.

    MR. PFEIFFER: No, I showed you —

    Q Does that have a stamp?

    MR. PFEIFFER: It has a seal on it.

    I’ll let the readers draw their own conclusions.
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

  88. avatar
    W. Kevin Vicklund January 8, 2013 at 3:36 pm #

    No given the circumstances, a sane person would extract the page 8 WH PDF image from the 15-1.pdf court document, add the second case label in green color, and then merge that minimally altered WH LFCOLB PDF image page with the PDF file of the Tepper 3-page letter as page 4.

    So let me get this straight, Blake.

    It is your contention that Tepper created a 3 page Word document, digitally modified it to make it looked like it was scanned (halos and all), changed it to a pdf, and added a case label in blue that had “…Page # of 4″ and uploaded this page to Scribd. He then massively altered the page 8 WH pdf image to make it look like it had been scanned and shrunk slightly, with a bit of a green tinge, and then added a case label in blue that had “…Page 4 of “. He then merged these two documents and submitted them to the court.

    vs.

    It is our contention that Tepper created a 3 page Word document, printed it out, added a printout of the page 8 WH pdf image, and kept a hard copy (either by a second printing or by copier). A few days later, this hard copy was scanned as a single pdf, the case label in blue was added, and filed with the court electronically. Later that day, someone uploaded the pdf to Scribd with the last page deleted.

    Which is more believable?

  89. avatar
    Rickey January 8, 2013 at 3:43 pm #

    Hermitian:

    So when the White House Posted the Obama LFCOLB on the WH server and handed out paper copies of it and his COLB along with the letter correspondence between Obama and Fuddy in an early morning presser for the WH press core and then the President did another (i.e. separate) WH press conference to announce that he had just released additional official information about the facts of his birth to the world, that was not an official action !

    It was an action, but it wasn’t an official action. It was a personal action. It served no legislative or executive purpose. The LFBC has not, to our knowledge, been used by Obama to comply with any law or regulation. He has not used it to obtain a passport or any license. He has not used to it register to vote. He simply provided copies of it to reporters and posted a copy of it on the White House website.

    If the LFBC is a forgery, what statute did Obama violate by posting it on the White House website? Please be specific.

  90. avatar
    Hermitian January 8, 2013 at 3:47 pm #

    “ScientistJanuary 8, 2013 at 11:23 am (Quote)#
    Comment

    “Hermitian: So when the White House Posted the Obama LFCOLB on the WH server and handed out paper copies of it and his COLB along with the letter correspondence between Obama and Fuddy in an early morning presser for the WH press core and then the President did another (i.e. separate) WH press conference to announce that he had just released additional official information about the facts of his birth to the world, that was not an official action !

    “I don’t believe that pressers have any official status whatsoever. They certainly don’t appear in the Constitution. There is no legal obligation for the White House to speak with the press at all.”

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    From the transcript of the press gaggle on the WH web site.

    “Q Why does this rise to the level of a presidential statement?

    ” MR. PFEIFFER: The President — this in itself — when you hear the President I think you’ll understand the point he’s making. That will be in not too long.”

    Because he’s the President and he wanted to speak to the press about his eligibility controversy which had been interferring with other business for several weeks.

    Dumbkin!
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

  91. avatar
    Rickey January 8, 2013 at 3:54 pm #

    Hermitian:

    Right genius!Keep thinking she’s a moron and she will eat your lunch.

    Orly isn’t a moron, She is, however, the most incompetent attorney I have come across in nearly 40 years of working with attorneys.

  92. avatar
    Hermitian January 8, 2013 at 3:55 pm #

    “CarlOrcasJanuary 8, 2013 at 1:24 pm (Quote)#
    Comment

    “Sudoku:

    Hm….that is a head-scratcher. Could you explain how the President would have plausible deniability for his own birth certificate?

    Thanks for asking. I was just getting ready to do it when I saw your post. I can’t wait to see the answer!

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    The President was hiding behind the “see no evil monkey” for this press statement.

    How do you know that he has ever seen his original long-form hospital generated birth certificate?
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

  93. avatar
    aesthetocyst January 8, 2013 at 4:00 pm #

    Hermitian: How do you know that he has ever seen his original long-form hospital generated birth certificate?

    Speaking of bait being switched, that’s quite a non-sequitur, Herms.

  94. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy January 8, 2013 at 4:00 pm #

    And there is no reference to body cavity searches where they verified that no reporter kept the material they were handed, and later published on the Internet.

    You’ve absolutely and completely lost touch with reality.

    Hermitian: This reference to reporters having copies in hand at the beginning of the briefing was at the start of the press gaggle which began at 8:48 am. There is no reference to reporters holding copies when the President spoke later at 9:48 am.

  95. avatar
    Hermitian January 8, 2013 at 4:06 pm #

    “Dr. ConspiracyJanuary 8, 2013 at 2:15 pm (Quote)#

    “You said that Tepper used the White House PDF as a basis for the document. That document has no case label. The inescapable conclusion of your version of events is that Tepper added the case label to the document.

    “I said (perhaps incorrectly) that you failed to notice the the 15-1 document label. You said you did notice it, as evidenced by two statements that labels were added. So if you honestly were referencing the label that I was talking about, then you said it was added.

    “If the Court ECF case label was added, then, you claimed it was a fake/forgery.

    “Hermitian: Wrong! That’s not what I am suggesting at all.

    “I certainly didn’t suggest that the case label was forged. Don’t put words in my mouth.

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    It’s all in my affidavit.

    “IV. The alterations made to the White House LFCOLB PDF image to create the (page 8) image copy are incidental.

    “1. The (page 8) image copy is otherwise identical to the white House image except for the “Case Label” added at the top margin.”

    —————————————————————————————————————–

    “V. I found that the alterations to the (page 8) image copy to create the (page 4/11) image copy are extensive as follows:

    “1. A second Case Label was added”

    You keep straining at gnats Mr. C !

    You are ducking the important issues.

    When are you going to get to your comparison of the page 8 LFCOLB PDF image and the Tepper page 4/11 LFCOLB PDF image?

    Orly Taitz is still waiting for your answer.
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

  96. avatar
    Hermitian January 8, 2013 at 4:17 pm #

    “Dr. ConspiracyJanuary 8, 2013 at 2:17 pm (Quote)#

    “Of course you conveniently ignore that Tepper had to mail the whole thing to Hawaii. How does he do that without printing something?

    “Sorry, you can wail and flail and try to deny the obvious, but your little theory is chock full of holes, and cannot explain the evidence. It is total nonsense.

    “Hermitian: This work flow would require no printing or scanning.

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    I’m not ignoring anything. A good Engineer/Scientist always considers all possibilities. That is especially true in failure analysis of experiments yet to be performed. People can be killed you know.

    Or he could have sent an electronic document. Tepper would know. Why don’t you ask him what he did?
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

  97. avatar
    Hermitian January 8, 2013 at 4:23 pm #

    “aesthetocystJanuary 8, 2013 at 3:17 pm (Quote)#

    “Hermitian: add the second case label in green color,

    Why would a ‘sane’ person change the color of the label?”

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    So that the two overlapping case labels on the Tepper page 4/11 LFCOLB image would not both be blue?

    Just guessing.

    Why don’t you take the time out of your busy schedule to compare the page 8 PDF image with the page 4/11 PDF image and stop wasting my time?

    Then maybe you would see that changing the color of the second label does not require one to change the color of the entire certificate page. Instead one need only change the color of the added label.
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

  98. avatar
    Daniel January 8, 2013 at 4:36 pm #

    Dr. Conspiracy:
    And there is no reference to body cavity searches where they verified that no reporter kept the material they were handed, and later published on the Internet.

    You’ve absolutely and completely lost touch with reality.

    Hermitan mistakes volume for quality in his posts.

  99. avatar
    misha marinsky January 8, 2013 at 4:36 pm #

    Hermitian: I’ll let the readers draw their own conclusions.

    You’re using the H key, instead of crayons.

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

    See? I can do it, too. Watch this:

    XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOXXXXXXXXXOOOO

  100. avatar
    Hermitian January 8, 2013 at 4:40 pm #

    “aesthetocystJanuary 8, 2013 at 3:17 pm (Quote)#
    Comment

    Nor does it get around the fact that these are two images of the same thing.

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    The two different LFCOLB images are not duplicate copies of each other. Therefore they cannot both be images of the same thing.
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

    “Seriously, what is the point of the forgery you’re alleged? What has been switched.

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    Well whatever the motive is it must have been important because the intentional alteration of a certified document is a felony. Only the HDOH can legally alter a Hawaii birth certificate. To falsify a certifying element is a separate felony.
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

  101. avatar
    Majority Will January 8, 2013 at 4:52 pm #

    “There is no reference to reporters holding copies when the President spoke later at 9:48 am.”

    With a little ranch dressing, they were probably delicious.

    And it’s easy to see why birfers are ridiculed and laughed out of court.

  102. avatar
    Scientist January 8, 2013 at 4:52 pm #

    The state that Hermy has fallen into really makes me sad. In the good old days of 2011 and before, birthers used to argue that Obama was born in Kenya. Now that we have had the data, most particularly birthplace, verified again and again by the State of Hawaii, they are reduced to the pitiful position of arguing that the LFBC was forged, but WITH ALL THE CORRECT INFORMATION. Now this is so ridiculous that it causes grown men to keel over with abdominal pain from laughing.

    But let’s be kind to Hermy and pretend that it’s true. So what? Hermy says that would be a crime. Well, (as Reagan used to say), first, was it used for any official legal purpose or was it simply shown at a presser (and untruths are hardly unknown at pressers)? Second, fraud or perjury requires not just untruth but willful and MATERIAL untruth. And if the information on the certificate is correct, as Hawaii has verified, then there is no material untruth. Even a lie about who the father was (to cover up Frank Marshall Davis or Malcolm X or whomever) wouldn’t be material in the matter of presidential eligibility.

    So, dear Hermy, let me pretend to agree with you that the certificate was forged with the correct information. What exactly should be done about such a non-high crime, non-misdemeanor. Do you honestly think you could get 67 votes in the Senate or even 218 in the House over such nonsense? Do you think any federal or state prosecutor would waste 10 seconds over such crap? It’s a dead end pal.

  103. avatar
    Hermitian January 8, 2013 at 4:53 pm #

    W. Kevin VicklundJanuary 8, 2013 at 3:36 pm (Quote)#

    No given the circumstances, a sane person would extract the page 8 WH PDF image from the 15-1.pdf court document, add the second case label in green color, and then merge that minimally altered WH LFCOLB PDF image page with the PDF file of the Tepper 3-page letter as page 4.

    So let me get this straight, Blake.

    It is your contention that Tepper created a 3 page Word document, digitally modified it to make it looked like it was scanned (halos and all), changed it to a pdf, and added a case label in blue that had “…Page # of 4″ and uploaded this page to Scribd. He then massively altered the page 8 WH pdf image to make it look like it had been scanned and shrunk slightly, with a bit of a green tinge, and then added a case label in blue that had “…Page 4 of “. He then merged these two documents and submitted them to the court.

    vs.

    It is our contention that Tepper created a 3 page Word document, printed it out, added a printout of the page 8 WH pdf image, and kept a hard copy (either by a second printing or by copier). A few days later, this hard copy was scanned as a single pdf, the case label in blue was added, and filed with the court electronically. Later that day, someone uploaded the pdf to Scribd with the last page deleted.

    Which is more believable?

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    Neither

    Your first scenario is unintelligible.

    The work flow is problematic for your second scenario . There would be no need to retain a hard copy and scan it to PDF. The direct conversion from word to PDF eliminates two steps.
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

  104. avatar
    aesthetocyst January 8, 2013 at 4:58 pm #

    Dr. Conspiracy: You’ve absolutely and completely lost touch with reality.

    No kiddin’. A presser w/o press packets? The whole point of a presser is to send a message by disseminating information. Again, Herms illogic; why pass out handouts, only to demand them back (“Here’s teh message … now, give us back the message”), where is any such request in the transcript of media coverage, and why, oh why, would reporters meekly acquiesce and fork them over?

    What were all those reporters waving around on the Hill after the press conference? Check this clip from good ol’ FOX news:

    http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2011/04/27/white-house-releases-obamas-long-form-birth-certificate/

    Halfway through, the man on the spot displays a stapled collection of pages … with a white photocopy of the LFBC.

    The kicker? The clip is at 9:11am the day of the release. How did he get out of the room with that copy?!? LOL!

  105. avatar
    CarlOrcas January 8, 2013 at 5:06 pm #

    Hermitian: The President was hiding behind the “see no evil monkey” for this press statement.

    If he wanted to hide from it why did he come out in the press room right after it was shown to reporters? Were reporters prohibited from asking him about it if they had any questions?

    Hermitian: How do you know that he has ever seen his original long-form hospital generated birth certificate?

    I don’t. How is it relevant………..to anything??

    Do you know if he’s seen it? If so….how do you know?

  106. avatar
    CarlOrcas January 8, 2013 at 5:10 pm #

    Hermitian: This reference to reporters having copies in hand at the beginning of the briefing was at the start of the press gaggle which began at 8:48 am. There is no reference to reporters holding copies when the President spoke later at 9:48 am.

    So? What is your point?

    Hermitian: I’ll let the readers draw their own conclusions.

    It seems pretty clear, HHHHHHHH: They were shown one of the certified copies with a seal on it. It also appears it or the other one were photocopied and shown to reporters.

    What, exactly, is your conclusion?

  107. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy January 8, 2013 at 6:10 pm #

    OK Einstein:

    Look at the Tepper document:

    http://ia701203.us.archive.org/33/items/gov.uscourts.mssd.78493/gov.uscourts.mssd.78493.35.1.pdf

    and tell me if Page 1 is a direct conversion from Word to PDF, or whether it is a scan of a paper document. Anyone with the least competence could answer that question and say why.

    Hint.

    Make a word document and save it as a PDF, then look at what you get.

    The answer to my question only takes a glance!

    Hermitian: The work flow is problematic for your second scenario . There would be no need to retain a hard copy and scan it to PDF. The direct conversion from word to PDF eliminates two steps.

  108. avatar
    Hermitian January 8, 2013 at 6:16 pm #

    “Dr. ConspiracyJanuary 7, 2013 at 10:33 pm (Quote)#

    “We can rule that one out. The verification from Onaka specifically states that he retrieved the PDF from the White House web site.

    “aesthetocyst: The birfers should be alleging that Tepper filed one image in MS, sent something different to HI, and then represented a copy of the image filed in MS as having been to HI.”

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    Onaka’s statement:

    2. The information contained in the “Certificate of Live Birth” published at
    http://www.whitehouse gov/blog/2011/04/27/president-obamas-lonq-form-
    birth-certificate and reviewed by me on the date of this verification, a copy of
    which is attached with your request, matches the information contained in
    the original Certificate of Live Birth for Barack Hussein Obama, ll on file with
    the State of Hawaii Department of Health

    Did Tepper attach the page 8 PDF or the extensively altered page 4/11 PDF to his letter to Fuddy?

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

  109. avatar
    aesthetocyst January 8, 2013 at 6:52 pm #

    Hermitian: Did Tepper attach the page 8 PDF or the extensively altered page 4/11 PDF to his letter to Fuddy?

    OMG, Herms! Whatever Tepper sent to HI was reference only, to demonstrate what he had filed in MS.

    Onaka’s verification to Tepper is not verifying whatever Tepper mailed him. As you quoted it, Onaka doesn’t even mention it. He doesn’t have to, because ….

    If you can read plainly (heh, old Herm term), Onaka is verifying that the PDF posted at whitehouse.gov matches the original on file (yes, THE original) at HDOH …. neatly circumventing all the paper flying in MS, and making your pointless allegation moot.
    Everyone’s filing points to the WH PDF, and, by extension thanks to this verification, what’s in the vault in Hawaii.

    By rule, that’s the best evidence possible. ;)

  110. avatar
    Daniel January 8, 2013 at 7:20 pm #

    Hermitian:

    Did Tepper attach the page 8 PDF or the extensively altered page 4/11 PDF to his letter to Fuddy?

    Who cares?

    Hawaii verified the information, nothing else matters.

  111. avatar
    Andy January 8, 2013 at 7:42 pm #

    Hermitian (or Henry…)

    Do tell me this: what from the page 8 document was altered in a significant way for the page 4/11 document?

    In your affidavit, you list several changes. What of those changes is MATERIALLY different. We’re dealing with compressed images here, so what alteration actually changed the make-up of the document, as opposed to simply compressing in a different manner?

    Remember – the page 8 document is a pdf created via a computer, and the page 4/11 was done by scanner. But what was changed in a MATERIAL way? (Material meaning significant – something that changed not the make-up of the document, but it’s meaning…)

  112. avatar
    JoZeppy January 8, 2013 at 8:01 pm #

    Hermitian: Onaka’s statement:
    2. The information contained in the “Certificate of Live Birth” published at
    http://www.whitehouse gov/blog/2011/04/27/president-obamas-lonq-form-
    birth-certificate and reviewed by me on the date of this verification, a copy of
    which is attached with your request, matches the information contained in
    the original Certificate of Live Birth for Barack Hussein Obama, ll on file with
    the State of Hawaii Department of Health
    Did Tepper attach the page 8 PDF or the extensively altered page 4/11 PDF to his letter to Fuddy?

    What the blazes does it matter? Are you insane? Your “extensively altered” document contains the exact same information ad page 8 or the image on the White House website. Which was all verified by Onaka. Are you suggesting that the people are going around forging documents with the exact same information as the original just for sh!ts and giggles? Your obsession with pdf versions of the document is really silly, for the simple reason that the pdf aren’t documents. They aren’t forgeriers, for the simple reason that they aren’t real documents. They only matter in so far as the State of Hawaii has officially verified all the data on them, and provided a court and a secretary of state with a legal document verifying that information (and that verification is the functional equivalent of the original certified copy of the birth certificate in those instances it was provided).

  113. avatar
    Joey January 8, 2013 at 8:14 pm #

    Hermitian:
    “Dr. ConspiracyJanuary 7, 2013 at 10:33 pm(Quote)#

    “We can rule that one out. The verification from Onaka specifically states that he retrieved the PDF from the White House web site.

    “aesthetocyst: The birfers should be alleging that Tepper filed one image in MS, sent something different to HI, and then represented a copy of the image filed in MS as having been to HI.”

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    Onaka’s statement:

    2. The information contained in the “Certificate of Live Birth” published at
    http://www.whitehouse gov/blog/2011/04/27/president-obamas-lonq-form-
    birth-certificate and reviewed by me on the date of this verification, a copy of
    which is attached with your request, matches the information contained in
    the original Certificate of Live Birth for Barack Hussein Obama, ll on file with
    the State of Hawaii Department of Health

    Did Tepper attach the page 8 PDF or the extensively altered page 4/11 PDF to his letter to Fuddy?

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

    If any birther attorney wishes to depose Dr. Onaka and ask him questions about the process of his Letters of Verification, he is available in his office at the Hawaii Department of Health.

  114. avatar
    Joey January 8, 2013 at 8:28 pm #

    Hermitian is unaware of Federal Rules of Evidence 902 covering Self-Authenticating Vital Records and the requirements for a Vital Record to be Self-Authenticating and Federal Rule of Evidence 1005 which covers the use of copies of Vital Records to Prove Content.
    The whitehouse.gov image along with Dr. Onaka’s certified attestations of matching data are totally consistent with the requirements of the Federal Rules of Evidence.

  115. avatar
    Hermitian January 8, 2013 at 8:47 pm #

    “ScientistJanuary 8, 2013 at 4:52 pm (Quote)#

    “The state that Hermy has fallen into really makes me sad. In the good old days of 2011 and before, birthers used to argue that Obama was born in Kenya. Now that we have had the data, most particularly birthplace, verified again and again by the State of Hawaii, they are reduced to the pitiful position of arguing that the LFBC was forged, but WITH ALL THE CORRECT INFORMATION. Now this is so ridiculous that it causes grown men to keel over with abdominal pain from laughing.

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    Gee I thought you believed that all Birthers were a pain in the a__.
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

    “But let’s be kind to Hermy and pretend that it’s true. So what? Hermy says that would be a crime. Well, (as Reagan used to say), first, was it used for any official legal purpose or was it simply shown at a presser (and untruths are hardly unknown at pressers)?

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    Actually RR always said “trust but verify”.
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

    Second, fraud or perjury requires not just untruth but willful and MATERIAL untruth. And if the information on the certificate is correct, as Hawaii has verified, then there is no material untruth. Even a lie about who the father was (to cover up Frank Marshall Davis or Malcolm X or whomever) wouldn’t be material in the matter of presidential eligibility.”

  116. avatar
    Northland10 January 8, 2013 at 8:54 pm #

    Hermitian: Well whatever the motive is it must have been important because the intentional alteration of a certified document is a felony. Only the HDOH can legally alter a Hawaii birth certificate. To falsify a certifying element is a separate felony.

    You claim something is forged. What information is different that the original? What proof do you have that shows the information should be? Does your proof follow the same standards you expect of an image of a birth certificate? If it is forged, why has Orly not provided any sort of evidence the correct information, or what she thinks is correct?

    The court cases are trying to claim forgery and declare him ineligible, but a felony is not a dis-qualifier to be elected or sworn in. That issue lies in the world of Congress and the impeachment process. Even if it was a court issue as a normal felony, then it is the purview of the duly elected or appointed prosecutor with appropriate use of the Grand Jury.

    This whole issue comes down to, Orly is a usurper. She is usurping the role of Congress, the role of prosecutor, the role of the enforcement division of the SSA or a host of other duly appointed or elected offices. She is even attempting to usurp the role of elector or We the People.

  117. avatar
    Keith January 8, 2013 at 8:58 pm #

    Hermitian: Actually the entire exchange between Pheiffer and the reporter was:

    Q You’ve got two certified copies, according to this study. You have these physical –
    1. MR. PFEIFFER: Yes. I showed you one. Just one.

    Q You showed us a photocopy of one.

    MR. PFEIFFER: No, I showed you –

    Q Does that have a stamp?

    MR. PFEIFFER: It has a seal on it.

    I’ll let the readers draw their own conclusions.

    OK, my conclusion is that the seal was balancing a ball on its nose.

  118. avatar
    Keith January 8, 2013 at 9:05 pm #

    Hermitian: Well whatever the motive is it must have been important because the intentional alteration of a certified document is a felony. Only the HDOH can legally alter a Hawaii birth certificate. To falsify a certifying element is a separate felony.

    Please read the following statement 100 times. Or until you understand it.

    The PDF image is not a certified document and printing a PDF image does not make it a certified document – only a certified document is a certified document.

  119. avatar
    Rickey January 8, 2013 at 9:11 pm #

    Hermy keeps babbling about felonies but he has yet to identify a single statute which he believes that Obama has violated.

    I also believe that he should be banned until he agrees to use the quote function.

  120. avatar
    Hermitian January 8, 2013 at 10:49 pm #

    “KeithJanuary 8, 2013 at 9:05 pm (Quote)#
    Comment

    “”Hermitian: Well whatever the motive is it must have been important because the intentional alteration of a certified document is a felony. Only the HDOH can legally alter a Hawaii birth certificate. To falsify a certifying element is a separate felony.””

    Please read the following statement 100 times. Or until you understand it.

    The PDF image is not a certified document and printing a PDF image does not make it a certified document – only a certified document is a certified document

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    Please read the statement from the WH web site 100 times.

    “The President believed the distraction over his birth certificate wasn’t good for the country. It may have been good politics and good TV, but it was bad for the American people and distracting from the many challenges we face as a country. Therefore, the President directed his counsel to review the legal authority for seeking access to the long form certificate and to request on that basis that the Hawaii State Department of Health make an exception to release a copy of his long form birth certificate. They granted that exception in part because of the tremendous volume of requests they had been getting. President Barack Obama’s long form birth certificate can be seen here (PDF):”

    The President had his LFCOLB posted on the WH web site. This purported act of fraud is the basis for the ongoing investigation by Sheriff Arpaio’s Cold Case Posse investigation. The next report from the lead investigator is scheduled for 01/15/2013.

    “Chief Cold Case Posse Investigator Mike Zullo to Speak at Surprise, AZ Tea Party Meeting 1-15-13

    “Posted by By GeorgeM at 6 January, at 10 : 40 AM

    http://obamaballotchallenge.com/chief-cold-case-posse-investigator-mike-zullo-to-speak-at-surprise-az-tea-party-meeting-1-15-13
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

  121. avatar
    JD Reed January 8, 2013 at 11:08 pm #

    Northland10: This whole issue comes down to, Orly is a usurper.She is usurping the role of Congress, the role of prosecutor, the role of the enforcement division of the SSA or a host of other duly appointed or elected offices.She is even attempting to usurp the role of elector or We the People.

    Actually, Orly is not a usurper. She’s merely a wannabe, but she’ll never succeed.

  122. avatar
    CarlOrcas January 8, 2013 at 11:25 pm #

    Hermitian: The President had his LFCOLB posted on the WH web site. This purported act of fraud is the basis for the ongoing investigation by Sheriff Arpaio’s Cold Case Posse investigation. The next report from the lead investigator is scheduled for 01/15/2013.

    “Chief Cold Case Posse Investigator Mike Zullo to Speak at Surprise, AZ Tea Party Meeting 1-15-13

    Some questions Hermitian:

    1 – What “act of fraud” was committed? By whom? When? And, where? Please provide a cite for the specific Arizona law that was broken.

    2 – What authority does Zullo and the Cold Case Posse have to investigate any crime?

    3 – Assuming, for the sake of discussion, that a crime was, in fact, committed and the Posse does, in fact, have the authority to investigate that crime why is the “Chief Investigator” presenting their evidence to a group of Tea Party members and not the Maricopa County Attorney who is responsible for prosecuting crimes in Maricopa County?

    I look forward to your answers.

  123. avatar
    SluggoJD January 9, 2013 at 12:02 am #

    Hermitian:
    “KeithJanuary 8, 2013 at 9:05 pm(Quote)#
    Comment

    “”Hermitian: Well whatever the motive is it must have been important because the intentional alteration of a certified document is a felony. Only the HDOH can legally alter a Hawaii birth certificate. To falsify a certifying element is a separate felony.””

    Please read the following statement 100 times. Or until you understand it.

    The PDF image is not a certified document and printing a PDF image does not make it a certified document – only a certified document is a certified document

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    Please read the statement from the WH web site 100 times.

    “The President believed the distraction over his birth certificate wasn’t good for the country. It may have been good politics and good TV, but it was bad for the American people and distracting from the many challenges we face as a country. Therefore, the President directed his counsel to review the legal authority for seeking access to the long form certificate and to request on that basis that the Hawaii State Department of Health make an exception to release a copy of his long form birth certificate. They granted that exception in part because of the tremendous volume of requests they had been getting. President Barack Obama’s long form birth certificate can be seen here (PDF):”

    The President had his LFCOLB posted on the WH web site.This purported act of fraud is the basis for the ongoing investigation by Sheriff Arpaio’s Cold Case Posse investigation.The next report from the lead investigator is scheduled for 01/15/2013.

    “Chief Cold Case Posse Investigator Mike Zullo to Speak at Surprise, AZ Tea Party Meeting 1-15-13

    “Posted by By GeorgeM at 6 January, at 10 : 40 AM

    http://obamaballotchallenge.com/chief-cold-case-posse-investigator-mike-zullo-to-speak-at-surprise-az-tea-party-meeting-1-15-13
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

    Hey Turnip, I got a really simple question, that even someone with an IQ so…so tiny, should be able to answer…

    Newspapers reported Obama’s birth in Hawaii.
    The state of Hawaii has verified he was born there.
    Plus his mom was a citizen, so it really doesn’t even matter.

    So here’s my question – why is a copy of his BC so important?

  124. avatar
    Sudoku January 9, 2013 at 12:04 am #

    You seem to be upset by seeing the President’s BC online. I know that is a new thing, but maybe more and more of them will do it, since this has turned out so well for President Obama.

    The “see no evil monkey” situation and the commotion about whether the President has seen his birth certificate can be confusing. But rest assured, there is no required in the Constitution that the President even has to have a birth certificate. The fact that President Obama has released two is just gravy. Of course, since he is not require to have a BC, he sure-as-shootin’ doesn’t have to see or touch the thing.

    Hermitian: The President was hiding behind the “see no evil monkey” for this press statement.

    How do you know that he has ever seen his original long-form hospital generated birth certificate?

    Whoo! Your mind is just a spinning still, fretting over the birth certificate on the internet. I am not a lawyer, and I do not know all of the potential felonies that could be committed with falsifying or forging them, but I can assure you that you do not have to worry about that either.

    See, the paper copies the HDOH issued to the President are the certified copies. What is on the internet is not certified, it is just a copy to try to show everybody. Of course, it follows that an image of a HDOH seal on an on a image of the BC (which is neither certified nor claimed to be certified and has not presented as such) isn’t falsified either.

    Hermitian: Well whatever the motive is it must have been important because the intentional alteration of a certified document is a felony. Only the HDOH can legally alter a Hawaii birth certificate. To falsify a certifying element is a separate felony.

    Oh, HHHH, Life to too short to get into all the details of what is wrong with the Arpaio mess. The good Doc here has several information articles on the subject on that, but rest assured that it is not a crime to post your birth certificate on the internet.

    Hermitian: The President had his LFCOLB posted on the WH web site. This purported act of fraud is the basis for the ongoing investigation by Sheriff Arpaio’s Cold Case Posse investigation. The next report from the lead investigator is scheduled for 01/15/2013.

    I hope that helps.

  125. avatar
    misha marinsky January 9, 2013 at 12:09 am #

    Rickey: Hermy keeps babbling about felonies but he has yet to identify a single statute which he believes that Obama has violated.

    PWB

  126. avatar
    Hermitian January 9, 2013 at 12:23 am #

    “Dr. ConspiracyJanuary 8, 2013 at 6:10 pm (Quote)#
    Comment

    “OK Einstein:

    “Look at the Tepper document:

    http://ia701203.us.archive.org/33/items/gov.uscourts.mssd.78493/gov.uscourts.mssd.78493.35.1.pdf

    “and tell me if Page 1 is a direct conversion from Word to PDF, or whether it is a scan of a paper document. Anyone with the least competence could answer that question and say why.

    “Hint.

    “Make a word document and save it as a PDF, then look at what you get.
    “The answer to my question only takes a glance!

    “”Hermitian: The work flow is problematic for your second scenario . There would be no need to retain a hard copy and scan it to PDF. The direct conversion from word to PDF eliminates two steps.”“

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    Whenever possible Engineers eliminate the guesswork. As I stated previously, the first three pages of the court document 35-1.pdf was uploaded to Scribd on 06/06/2012. This is document

    96221274-MDEC-Request-for-Hawaii-DOH-Verification.pdf

    which is identical to pages 1-3 of your linked document. The METADATA from this file indicates that the three-page document was also created on 06/06/2012. The creator tool was Adobe Acrobat Pro Extended 9.5.1. The document was produced by the same tool. This document was not scanned.

    The contents of a PDF file created by converting a WORD .DOC file depends on the method used to convert. For example a .PDF file converted using the WORD “Save As” option is entirely different from the same .DOC file converted to PDF with Corel Fusion.

    So I don’t see your point.
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

  127. avatar
    Keith January 9, 2013 at 12:51 am #

    Hermitian: The President had his LFCOLB posted on the WH web site. This purported act of fraud is the basis for the ongoing investigation by Sheriff Arpaio’s Cold Case Posse investigation.

    Scanning a paper document into a PDF file so that it can be published on the internet is not fraud.

    The paper document that is scanned is not changed in any way by the scanning process. If the paper document happens to be a certified document it does not lose that status by the act of scanning it.

    The resultant computer file, whether PDF or JPEG or TIFF or GIF or whatever format the file happens to be, is not a certified document. It the file is printed, the printout is not a certified document unless it is subsequently certified in its own right.

    This is not rocket science, Hermie. What is your problem?

  128. avatar
    W. Kevin Vicklund January 9, 2013 at 1:50 am #

    The work flow is problematic for your second scenario . There would be no need to retain a hard copy and scan it to PDF. The direct conversion from word to PDF eliminates two steps.

    No, it doesn’t. Since a hard copy of all official correspondence is required, you already have one step (generating the hard copy). All you have to do is:

    1) scan it,
    2) find the scanned file, and
    3) send it.

    If you convert to pdf, you have to:
    1) open Adobe,
    2 click combine files,
    3) find the word file,
    4) find the 15-1 document file,
    5) find what page the COLB image is on,
    6) restrict the 15-1 file to just the correct page,
    7) wait for it to convert the word file,
    8) name the file,
    9) find the file, and
    10) send it.

    It’s easier to just scan it, though it sometimes takes longer. My own office does this all the time. We only convert direct to pdf if we need clean copies in pdf form, or if it’s a single file we often will use CutePDFWriter in addition to printing out a hard copy for the records. It’s too much of a pain in the ass to convert it using Adobe if it’s not necessary.

  129. avatar
    aesthetocyst January 9, 2013 at 2:08 am #

    Hermitian: “The President believed the distraction over his birth certificate wasn’t good for the country. It may have been good politics and good TV, but it was bad for the American people and distracting from the many challenges we face as a country. Therefore, the President directed his counsel to review the legal authority for seeking access to the long form certificate and to request on that basis that the Hawaii State Department of Health make an exception to release a copy of his long form birth certificate. They granted that exception in part because of the tremendous volume of requests they had been getting. President Barack Obama’s long form birth certificate can be seen here (PDF):”

    Hmmmmm …. which of the actions described by the WH is the example of the President acting in his official capacity?

    • The President monitoring current events?
    • The President directing his personal counsel (a private law firm) to review the availability of and request a copy of personal document?
    • The President directing WH staff to post something on the WH website?

    In our system of checks and balances, any exercise of the Executive power (y’know, an ‘official action’) should be subject to review and possible opposition, even negation.

    Why and how would Congress or SCOTUS have oversight over the White House website? Over the President’s access to his personal papers? Over his assessments of current events?

    And why are you suddenly taking the WH at their word on anything?

  130. avatar
    donna January 9, 2013 at 3:30 am #

    hermit/martian: The next report from the lead investigator is scheduled for 01/15/2013.

    how propos – that’s MLK’s birthday – do you think there is a significance/conspiracy around that? the presser will just be another lame opportunity for the frozen fools to scam money from their ignorant flock – will this be another (corsi) book party? will the “person of interest” (forger) be named & present? what about 96 year old Verna K. Lee? will she be there? ONE WOULD THINK that, by now, all of their supposed “evidence” would have been turned over to prosecutors and that their “witnesses” would have testified before a grand jury (and NOT the bogus “citizens” kind) – or, in the alternative, that ole joe and zullo would have testified under oath (and destroyed under cross examination) – i hope i live long enough to read how the history books portray the JOKE that is the “birthers”

  131. avatar
    roadburner January 9, 2013 at 3:37 am #

    Keith:

    This is not rocket science, Hermie. What is your problem?

    a dark skinned guy with a funny name in the white house?

  132. avatar
    The Magic M January 9, 2013 at 5:25 am #

    donna: and that their “witnesses” would have testified before a grand jury (and NOT the bogus “citizens” kind)

    They won’t even testify before their fantasy CGJ’s. Go figure.

    donna: will this be another (corsi) book party?

    If they didn’t have something to sell, they wouldn’t do it. After all, the propaganda value is zero after the elections. Obama will not run a third time. So why do a show if there is nothing to be gained? So you can be sure there’s some money to be made in their opinion – be it another Corsi book, or selling more “investigation reports” or whatever.

  133. avatar
    The Magic M January 9, 2013 at 5:30 am #

    SluggoJD: Newspapers reported Obama’s birth in Hawaii.
    The state of Hawaii has verified he was born there.
    Plus his mom was a citizen, so it really doesn’t even matter.

    So here’s my question – why is a copy of his BC so important?

    The basic birther belief has always been that there is “something” on the vault BC that Obama wants to hide. However, with everything related to NBC status out of the way (for the reasons you stated), all that remains is the birther minority which believes that it is simply something embarassing (y’know, from “his father was a die-hard Marxist” to “his mother was a Hawaiian prostitute”). Though those will have nothing to fawn over anymore since Obama won’t run again, so any propaganda value that could be reaped from that is now non-existant.

  134. avatar
    Scientist January 9, 2013 at 6:41 am #

    Hermitian: Second, fraud or perjury requires not just untruth but willful and MATERIAL untruth. And if the information on the certificate is correct, as Hawaii has verified, then there is no material untruth. Even a lie about who the father was (to cover up Frank Marshall Davis or Malcolm X or whomever) wouldn’t be material in the matter of presidential eligibility.”

    So, since we know the information on the certificate is correct, as Hawaii has verified numerous times, then THERE IS NO CRIME. There isn’t even an immoral or unethical act. So, nothing to investigate. Now we have it from your own words.

  135. avatar
    Scientist January 9, 2013 at 6:45 am #

    Hermitian: The next report from the lead investigator is scheduled for 01/15/2013.
    “Chief Cold Case Posse Investigator Mike Zullo to Speak at Surprise, AZ Tea Party Meeting 1-15-13

    And you don’t see the inappropriate nature of a “law enforcement” “report” being “delivered” at a political meeting?

  136. avatar
    Reality Check January 9, 2013 at 7:14 am #

    First there is nothing to “end” except Birther insanity and that is boundless. The verification letter was exactly the correct document to for the MDEC to file in Judge Wingate’s court from a legal perspective. The verification in the statute exists to cover situations where the information needs to be verified by the issuing authority. The MDEC had to satisfy that they met the requirements of the Hawaii statutes to be entitled to receive one. They could because Taitz had filed the poor copy in her motion and had questioned authenticity of the information on the document.

    So the short version is Taitz gave the MDEC a big fat hanging curve ball which Tepper and Begley proceeded to knock out of the park. Now Henry Blake, Irey, Taitz and apparently you are just mad that they took the opening Taitz gave them.

    Hermitian: We could easily end all of this fraud if Obama would just release his two certified copies to Judge Wingate.

  137. avatar
    Northland10 January 9, 2013 at 7:20 am #

    JD Reed: Actually, Orly is not a usurper. She’s merely a wannabe, but she’ll never succeed.

    Good point.

  138. avatar
    bovril January 9, 2013 at 8:24 am #

    Hermitian: We could easily end all of this fraud if Obama would just release his two certified copies to Judge Wingate.

    Do tell, “Hermetically sealed from reality”

    Exactly WHEN did the good Judge ask for these documents..?

    Under which statute did the good Judge state he had judicial need or requirement to see said documents?

    At which stage did the US legal system change To one where the a judge performs investigatory work..?

    Please do tell, as I cannot for the life of me see these requests or changes anywhere….?

  139. avatar
    aesthetocyst January 9, 2013 at 8:43 am #

    Reality Check: So the short version is Taitz gave the MDEC a big fat hanging curve ball which Tepper and Begley proceeded to knock out of the park

    As Herms is so very fond of saying …. “it only takes one pitch to hit a home run!” :D

    Oh, and “facts are as hard as diamonds”. Whatever that means to a person that picks and chooses his facts like other pick and choose diamonds, I dunno.

  140. avatar
    The Magic M January 9, 2013 at 8:48 am #

    Scientist: Now we have it from your own words.

    No, that was Hermitian “quoting” you. It’s his atrocious quoting style that made it look like those were his words.

    bovril: Hermitian: We could easily end all of this fraud if Obama would just release his two certified copies to Judge Wingate.

    First, why would we believe any birther claiming “it will all be over when Obama …” after the previous times where this proved to be a lie?

    Second, why would he release BOTH certified copies? So that birthers cannot claim Hawaii gave him two copies with different contents?

    Third, why would birthers be satisfied? They are already calling Judge Wingate a traitor. What reason could birthers have to believe Judge Wingate when he says “I’ve reviewed both certified copies and they are legit”? They’d just claim he was “in on it” as well.

    Fourth, you obviously have no idea how a lawsuit works and what a judge does and doesn’t do.

  141. avatar
    Northland10 January 9, 2013 at 9:13 am #

    aesthetocyst: As Herms is so very fond of saying …. “it only takes one pitch to hit a home run!”

    Oh, and “facts are as hard as diamonds”. Whatever that means to a person that picks and chooses his facts like other pick and choose diamonds, I dunno.

    To hit a home run, it helps to be facing the right direction, in the batter’s box, on the same field as the pitcher, and before the game is over. But Hermie is hopeful.

  142. avatar
    Scientist January 9, 2013 at 9:19 am #

    The Magic M: No, that was Hermitian “quoting” you. It’s his atrocious quoting style that made it look like those were his words.

    Nope. Sorry. Those words appeared under his name. If he is too stupid or lazy to use the quote feature Doc has so kindly provided that is his problem not mine.

    So, everybody, Hermy admited that as long as the information is correct everything is 100% Kosher,which, as misha will attest means God him/herself approves.

  143. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy January 9, 2013 at 10:27 am #

    The point is that anyone who cannot even tell the difference between a scanned document and one created directly from a Microsoft Word document (whether by the Acrobat printer driver, or by Word’s native Save to Document feature) lacks the basic competence of an office clerk, much less is someone who pretends to be qualified to submit an affidavit to be used as expert testimony in federal court. Earth to Bizarro world: An Image is different from a structured document.

    Oh, and you do know that Adobe Acrobat Pro does scanning?

    You don’t need any software, just look at the damned thing. That’s the reason I didn’t do your silly comparison between the Obama PDF and the Tepper correspondence. It was obvious in a second that it was a scan (both the letter and the birth certificate) and so there was nothing of interest. Apparently you are so lost in your conspiracy PDF elements that you cannot be bothered to actually look at them, or to read them, or to comprehend them, much less think.

    Until you can provide some coherent answer to why you say the Tepper copy of the Hawaii correspondence (any page) was “not scanned” or admit that you are wrong, I’m not going to waste any more time with you, because it’s a waste of my time to talk to someone who cannot or will not think.

    Hermitian: Whenever possible Engineers eliminate the guesswork. As I stated previously, the first three pages of the court document 35-1.pdf was uploaded to Scribd on 06/06/2012. This is document

    96221274-MDEC-Request-for-Hawaii-DOH-Verification.pdf

    which is identical to pages 1-3 of your linked document. The METADATA from this file indicates that the three-page document was also created on 06/06/2012. The creator tool was Adobe Acrobat Pro Extended 9.5.1. The document was produced by the same tool. This document was not scanned.

    The contents of a PDF file created by converting a WORD .DOC file depends on the method used to convert. For example a .PDF file converted using the WORD “Save As” option is entirely different from the same .DOC file converted to PDF with Corel Fusion.

    So I don’t see your point.

  144. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy January 9, 2013 at 10:36 am #

    Since the Hawaii declarations, the birthers are in complete disarray. They no longer even pretend to attempt to present a coherent alternate narrative. They are now just trying to get Obama out of the White House by finding a typo somewhere.

    Scientist: So, since we know the information on the certificate is correct, as Hawaii has verified numerous times, then THERE IS NO CRIME. There isn’t even an immoral or unethical act. So, nothing to investigate. Now we have it from your own words.

  145. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy January 9, 2013 at 10:38 am #

    The birthers aren’t even in the ballpark.

    aesthetocyst: As Herms is so very fond of saying …. “it only takes one pitch to hit a home run!

  146. avatar
    aesthetocyst January 9, 2013 at 10:55 am #

    Dr. Conspiracy:
    The birthers aren’t even in the ballpark.

    That is the response he always gets! I used to keep a count of his use of ‘home runs’ versus ‘diamonds’. I forgot which was winning.

    Herms is a very sheltered guy. He wants attention, but wants to stay safe and sheltered.

  147. avatar
    Paper January 9, 2013 at 11:00 am #

    Just looking for one honest umpire…

    Dr. Conspiracy:
    The birthers aren’t even in the ballpark.

  148. avatar
    LW January 9, 2013 at 11:31 am #

    Hermitian: “ScientistJanuary 8, 2013 at 4:52 pm (Quote)#

    So here’s the thing that is puzzling many of us. You obviously know there’s a “Quote” function. Several people have pointed it out to you. As shown above, you even have copied and pasted it.

    Why the HHHHHHHHHHeck aren’t you capable of using it? Is it a cognitive blind spot?

  149. avatar
    Yoda January 9, 2013 at 11:35 am #

    Hermitian: 1. A second Case Label was added

    I have not read through all of the posts, so forgive me if I am repeating something that someone else said, but if this is an example of the Dr. Blake’s analysis, none of his opinions are worth anything.

    Case labels are place on documents by the court, not the person filing the document. So in this particular case the fact that there are two case labels means only that the document that was filed was a photocopy of a filed document (hence there being an original case label) and the second case label was added by the court.

    This is certainly not any evidence that the document was altered. In any event, the question whether a document is altered is not really an issue, the question is whether it was altered in a material way. For example, adding a security background is not a material alteration, but changing the date of the birth would be.

    I certainly do not have the technical background that some on this blog have, but I have enough experience with the reproduction of documents to know that even photocopying a document can appear to “alter” it in some way, whether it clipping off information, distorting images, darkening images or something else. I also know that photocopying a photocopy can enhance this even more. I was once involved in case where we copied a document and then copied the copy and so on, about 20 times–there were things on the 20th generation copy, such as dots and lines that were not visible on the original document.

    For about the 487,938th time, it is the content that is important, nothing else. For all the finger wagging done by birthers, they have never been able to show anything wrong with the content of the lfbc or that it was altered in any way.

  150. avatar
    W. Kevin Vicklund January 9, 2013 at 12:17 pm #

    Whenever possible Engineers eliminate the guesswork. As I stated previously, the first three pages of the court document 35-1.pdf was uploaded to Scribd on 06/06/2012. This is document

    96221274-MDEC-Request-for-Hawaii-DOH-Verification.pdf

    which is identical to pages 1-3 of your linked document. The METADATA from this file indicates that the three-page document was also created on 06/06/2012. The creator tool was Adobe Acrobat Pro Extended 9.5.1. The document was produced by the same tool. This document was not scanned.

    So why are you assuming that the document uploaded to Scribd by Jack Ryan, who appears to be a Friend of the Fogbow, not Tepper, the attorney who created the original document, was unaltered? Indeed, Jack Ryan uploaded another file that day, which was a 12 page document, containing the 7 page document 35, all 4 pages of 35-1, and the 1 page document 35-2 (Fuddy’s response). This document was also created on 6/6/2012, but at 12:44 pm, almost exactly 3 hours before the three page 35-1 file was created (at 3:43 pm).

    But wait…

    The Tepper four-page PDF court document 35-1 was created on 06/04/2012 and was last modified on 06/06/2012.

    The four-page document 35-1 was created two full days before the three-page document, according to you. So what does the METADATA say for that file?

    Created: 6/4/2012 12:33:38 PM
    Modified: 6/6/2012 2:20:29 PM
    Application:PFU SnapScan Manager 5.0.21 #S1500

    Not only is this proof it was scanned in, you had to have seen this proof at some point.

  151. avatar
    Scientist January 9, 2013 at 12:21 pm #

    Dr. Conspiracy: They are now just trying to get Obama out of the White House by finding a typo somewhere.

    Would a typo constitute a high crime or would it be a misdemeanor?

  152. avatar
    W. Kevin Vicklund January 9, 2013 at 12:21 pm #

    BTW, the 12 page document I referenced can be found here:

    http://www.scribd.com/doc/96200621/2012-06-06-MDEC-Motion-to-Supplement-Response-to-Motion-for-Sanctions-S-D-Miss

    Other referenced documents are found earlier in the discussion.

  153. avatar
    JD Reed January 9, 2013 at 12:45 pm #

    Scientist: And you don’t see the inappropriate nature of a “law enforcement” “report” being “delivered” at a political meeting?

    Also, despite the fact that Zullo has come up with zero actual evidence in his previous forays, Herms remains optimistic. He’s just the type Alexander Pope was thinking of when he penned these lines:
    “Hope springs eternal in the human breast;: Man never Is, but always To be blest.”
    One of the “facts” Zullo swore in in a recent affidavit is just flatly false, that is, that Mr. Obama in his first full day in office sealed all his personal records with his first executive order. This was thoroughly debunked four years ago.
    Check this link to Mr. Obama’s executive order on presidential records, and show me the specific passage that seals his personal records.
    http://www.whitehouse.gov/the_press_office/ExecutiveOrderPresidentialRecords
    Then check the link below for the text of President Ronald Reagan’s last executive order, also dealling with presidential records.
    http://www.reagan.utexas.edu/archives/speeches/1989/011889f.htm
    Now show us any substantive difference between these two documents, which are more than 95 percent identical in wording.
    Zullo is either the most clueless investigator since Inspector Clouseau, or he’s simply a garden variety grifter.

  154. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy January 9, 2013 at 1:12 pm #

    It appears that Zullo, and many of the other birther mouthpieces lead very insular lives, oblivious to the debunking that undermines them before they speak.

    JD Reed: Zullo is either the most clueless investigator since Inspector Clouseau, or he’s simply a garden variety grifter.

  155. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy January 9, 2013 at 1:21 pm #

    This is a good example that shows Hermitian’s inability to grasp that the document was scanned.

    Look at Page 1 of the document linked below. This is an example of something created by a word processing program. In a word, it is “sharp.” This is because there is no image, but rather text and fonts in the PDF file. Zoom in. Zoom and zoom, and zoom and zoom. It stays sharp! It’s not a scanned image.

    Now scroll down to page 8. This page is, in a word, “fuzzy.” Zoom in. Zoom and zoom, and zoom and zoom. It gets fuzzy and artifacts start appearing. This is because one is looking at a scanned image.

    Word Processing — sharp
    Scanned — fuzzy

    DUH!!!!!!!

    W. Kevin Vicklund: BTW, the 12 page document I referenced can be found here:

    http://www.scribd.com/doc/96200621/2012-06-06-MDEC-Motion-to-Supplement-Response-to-Motion-for-Sanctions-S-D-Miss

    Other referenced documents are found earlier in the discussion.

  156. avatar
    W. Kevin Vicklund January 9, 2013 at 1:37 pm #

    Also, look at the bottom margin of the three page letter. It’s shaded a mottled blue-grey. This is something you often get in scanning. You don’t get that in direct to pdf conversions (again, see the seven page memorandum). And there’s a bunch of random mottled bits in the “white space” of the page.

    For those of you with an LCD screen, here’s a way to really make this show up. Look at the page on your screen from an extreme angle. The seven page memorandum has a uniform background (on my screen, when looking at about 60 degrees, it’s a pale blue). The three page letter to Fuddy, on the other hand, is extremely mottled (on my screen, a bunch of muted blues, purples, greys, and white with rectangular shapes).

  157. avatar
    aesthetocyst January 9, 2013 at 2:10 pm #

    In Herms’ defense, since he can’t offer one of his own, It could be that someone placed images of scanned documents in Word, and exported that to PDF. Why would anyone do such a thing? If exporting from Word was their ONLY PDF creation option. Perhapos they are a very silly person. Or insane. Too lazy to retype a hard copy.

    The markup in the PDF should demonstrate this is not the case. I believe someone else already pointed out that this is so.

    Ah, yes, Vicklund, up above:
    http://www.obamaconspiracy.org/2013/01/mississippi-fritz-documents-and-copies/#comment-236967

  158. avatar
    Hermitian January 9, 2013 at 2:20 pm #

    “aesthetocystJanuary 8, 2013 at 6:52 pm (Quote)#
    Comment

    “Hermitian: Did Tepper attach the page 8 PDF or the extensively altered page 4/11 PDF to his letter to Fuddy?”

    “OMG, Herms! Whatever Tepper sent to HI was reference only, to demonstrate what he had filed in MS.

    “Onaka’s verification to Tepper is not verifying whatever Tepper mailed him. As you quoted it, Onaka doesn’t even mention it. He doesn’t have to, because ….

    “If you can read plainly (heh, old Herm term), Onaka is verifying that the PDF posted at whitehouse.gov matches the original on file (yes, THE original) at HDOH …. neatly circumventing all the paper flying in MS, and making your pointless allegation moot.
    Everyone’s filing points to the WH PDF, and, by extension thanks to this verification, what’s in the vault in Hawaii.

    “By rule, that’s the best evidence possible.”

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    Aes is the poor reader here.

    “Onaka’s statement:

    “2. The information contained in the “Certificate of Live Birth” published at
    http://www.whitehouse gov/blog/2011/04/27/president-obamas-lonq-form-
    birth-certificate and reviewed by me on the date of this verification, a copy of
    which is attached with your request, matches the information contained in
    the original Certificate of Live Birth for Barack Hussein Obama, ll on file with
    the State of Hawaii Department of Health”

    “Did Tepper attach the page 8 PDF or the extensively altered page 4/11 PDF to his letter to Fuddy?”

    You read right over “a copy of which is attached with your request” dude.

    By the way! I had also included this same quote of Onaka’s in my response to Mr. C which I had posted right over your post.

    All Obots are poor readers.

    Now when are you going to answer my question (see above)?

  159. avatar
    Hermitian January 9, 2013 at 2:45 pm #

    “KeithJanuary 9, 2013 at 12:51 am (Quote)#

    “Hermitian: The President had his LFCOLB posted on the WH web site. This purported act of fraud is the basis for the ongoing investigation by Sheriff Arpaio’s Cold Case Posse investigation.

    “Scanning a paper document into a PDF file so that it can be published on the internet is not fraud.

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    Better ask Arpaio and Zullo about that Keith. These two experienced lawmen seem to think that to do so is a crime in Arizona. You see the President and his staff represented the PDF image as his long-form-birth certificate. They then associated the same PDF image file with the letter correspondence between Obama and Fuddy in a court document filed in a Federal District Court. That was clearly an act of fraud propagated on the court. That’s why the MDEC attorneys testified in a later filing to the court that they did not doubt that the image was genuine when they had filed it. But in the same filing they also claimed that they hadn’t asked the Judge to take judicial notice of the WH LFCOLB PDF image. So judge — it’s OK but don’t look at it.
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

    “The paper document that is scanned is not changed in any way by the scanning process. If the paper document happens to be a certified document it does not lose that status by the act of scanning it.

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    What an idiot! Do you suppose that’s also true for dry copy process? Although there have been many times when the Xerox ate my originals.
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

    “The resultant computer file, whether PDF or JPEG or TIFF or GIF or whatever format the file happens to be, is not a certified document. It the file is printed, the printout is not a certified document unless it is subsequently certified in its own right.

    “This is not rocket science, Hermie. What is your problem?”
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    That Obama and his minions claimed that it was his long-form birth certificate on the WH web site. This was a deliberate act intended to deceive the American citizens and the world.
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

  160. avatar
    JD Reed January 9, 2013 at 3:01 pm #

    Dr. Conspiracy:
    It appears that Zullo, and many of the other birther mouthpieces lead very insular lives, oblivious to the debunking that undermines them before they speak.

    Thanks, Doc, for adding insularity to incompetency and dishonesty as reasons that Zullo is still floggiing the sealedg-records executive order. But it’s hard for me to imagine anyone’s being so isolated or insurated that they haven’t even heard of the debunking of said executive order meme. And any intellectually honest and capable investigator could have, with a minimum of Google research , found the executive order in question, and would have realized that it most certainly does not seal anyone’s personal records.

  161. avatar
    Hermitian January 9, 2013 at 3:03 pm #

    “W. Kevin VicklundJanuary 9, 2013 at 1:50 am (Quote)#

    “The work flow is problematic for your second scenario . There would be no need to retain a hard copy and scan it to PDF. The direct conversion from word to PDF eliminates two steps.

    “No, it doesn’t. Since a hard copy of all official correspondence is required, you already have one step (generating the hard copy). All you have to do is:

    1) scan it,
    2) find the scanned file, and
    3) send it.

    “If you convert to pdf, you have to:
    1) open Adobe,
    2 click combine files,
    3) find the word file,
    4) find the 15-1 document file,
    5) find what page the COLB image is on,
    6) restrict the 15-1 file to just the correct page,
    7) wait for it to convert the word file,
    8) name the file,
    9) find the file, and
    10) send it.

    “It’s easier to just scan it, though it sometimes takes longer. My own office does this all the time. We only convert direct to pdf if we need clean copies in pdf form, or if it’s a single file we often will use CutePDFWriter in addition to printing out a hard copy for the records. It’s too much of a pain in the ass to convert it using Adobe if it’s not necessary.

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    You are fired !

    1. Type document in WORD
    2. Save document as PDF using “Sav_As PDF”
    or alternatively (actually I perfer) convert WORD document to PDF document using Corel Fusion. This is done by dragging the WORD .DOC and dropping it onto the “Assembly View” in Fusion. Fusion will also merge all kinds of formatted files into one PDF document.
    For multiple documents I use the Corel PDF Batch Converter which is integrated with Fusion
    3. Send either the WORD .DOC or the .PDF file.

    I also use PDF Tools Pro for manipulating files.

    Job Finished !
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

  162. avatar
    Hermitian January 9, 2013 at 3:19 pm #

    “aesthetocystJanuary 9, 2013 at 2:08 am (Quote)#

    “Hermitian: “The President believed the distraction over his birth certificate wasn’t good for the country. It may have been good politics and good TV, but it was bad for the American people and distracting from the many challenges we face as a country. Therefore, the President directed his counsel to review the legal authority for seeking access to the long form certificate and to request on that basis that the Hawaii State Department of Health make an exception to release a copy of his long form birth certificate. They granted that exception in part because of the tremendous volume of requests they had been getting. President Barack Obama’s long form birth certificate can be seen here (PDF):”

    “Hmmmmm …. which of the actions described by the WH is the example of the President acting in his official capacity?

    “• The President monitoring current events?
    • The President directing his personal counsel (a private law firm) to review the availability of and request a copy of personal document?
    • The President directing WH staff to post something on the WH website?

    “In our system of checks and balances, any exercise of the Executive power (y’know, an ‘official action’) should be subject to review and possible opposition, even negation.

    “Why and how would Congress or SCOTUS have oversight over the White House website? Over the President’s access to his personal papers? Over his assessments of current events?

    “And why are you suddenly taking the WH at their word on anything?”

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    None of the above.

    The official act was when the President addressed the press at 9:48 am and read his entire official Presidential Statement regarding the release of additional information about his birth; the transcript of which is on the White House web site.

    The President left right after he finished without answering any questions.

    The press core had been told at the earlier press gaggle that the President would be making a Presidential Statement at 9:48 am.

  163. avatar
    W. Kevin Vicklund January 9, 2013 at 3:58 pm #

    Another problem with Blake’s “if my workflow isn’t followed exactly it must have been forged” scenario: the letter to Fuddy has all the appearance of being hand-signed. If Tepper had simply converted the word doc to pdf, the letter would be unsigned. I know in my workflow, if I sign anything, it has to be scanned in.

    THe problem is that Blake is assuming that the workflow was designed with an electronic document as the end point. But hard copy was the end point, with an electronic copy as an afterthought.

    And of course, Blake still hasn’t addressed the fact that there is proof that the document was scanned. (Or, it hasn’t made it through moderation.)

  164. avatar
    W. Kevin Vicklund January 9, 2013 at 4:03 pm #

    Also, Tepper uses “/s/ Scott J. Tepper” to electronically sign documents (see 12 page document referenced earlier), so it doesn’t make sense for the signature in the letter to Fuddy to be electronic.

  165. avatar
    LW January 9, 2013 at 4:04 pm #

    Hermitian: The information contained in the “Certificate of Live Birth” published at
    http://www.whitehouse gov/blog/2011/04/27/president-obamas-lonq-form-
    birth-certificate and reviewed by me on the date of this verification, a copy of
    which is attached with your request, matches the information contained in
    the original Certificate of Live Birth for Barack Hussein Obama, ll on file with
    the State of Hawaii Department of Health”

    “Did Tepper attach the page 8 PDF or the extensively altered page 4/11 PDF to his letter to Fuddy?”

    You read right over “a copy of which is attached with your request” dude.

    Simplifying this sentence, without changing its meaning:

    “The information contained in the CoLB published at the WH web site matches the information contained in the original CoLB on file with the HI DoH.”

    Right?

    Onaka is thus certifying that the president was born in the USA on August 4, 1961, to Ann and Barack Obama.

    What else is relevant?

  166. avatar
    CarlOrcas January 9, 2013 at 4:20 pm #

    Hermitian: The official act was when the President addressed the press at 9:48 am and read his entire official Presidential Statement regarding the release of additional information about his birth; the transcript of which is on the White House web site.

    Here is a link to the “Remarks by the President” on the White House website:

    http://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press-office/2011/04/27/remarks-president

    Notice that the White House does not characterize them as an “official act” or “official Presidential Statement”. In fact the first paragraph seems to indicate that his appearance in the briefing room was a spur of the moment thing.

    So…..what is your point?

    Hermitian: The press core had been told at the earlier press gaggle that the President would be making a Presidential Statement at 9:48 am.

    I guess we’ve given up on getting you to use the quote function but, please, learn how to spell. There is no such thing as the “press core”. A core is what you have left over when you finish a roll of toilet paper.

    The people the President was talking to on this occasion are the “press corps”. Check the third definition and save it for future reference:

    corps
    [ kawr ]
    corps Plural
    NOUN
    1. military specialized military force: a military force that carries out specialized duties
    2. military tactical unit: a tactical military unit that is made up of two or more divisions with additional supporting services
    3. group of associated people: a group of people who work together or are associated
    “the press corps”

  167. avatar
    W. Kevin Vicklund January 9, 2013 at 4:28 pm #

    I must admit, I had forgotten about the save as pdf in Word. When it first was available, I tried using it, but it never worked (either an unreadable file or it crashed the computer) so I quickly stopped trying to use it. Looking back, I think I had problems with an old version of Acrobat and a new version of Reader borking each other.

  168. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy January 9, 2013 at 4:41 pm #

    I have Microsoft Office 2007 on this machine, and the save to PDF works super. I save both Word and Excel regularly. I also have Acrobat 9, so that also gives me a PDF printer driver. I also have a copy of Win2PDF, but haven’t used it much.

    One can also open a Word document Open Office and save to PDF.

    W. Kevin Vicklund: I must admit, I had forgotten about the save as pdf in Word. When it first was available, I tried using it, but it never worked (either an unreadable file or it crashed the computer) so I quickly stopped trying to use it. Looking back, I think I had problems with an old version of Acrobat and a new version of Reader borking each other.

  169. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy January 9, 2013 at 4:46 pm #

    Here I must disagree. I have a signature image that I can insert in a document and then convert it to a PDF. However, if you zoom in on that PDF, the text will enlarge without losing sharpness, but the signature will not.

    W. Kevin Vicklund: I know in my workflow, if I sign anything, it has to be scanned in.

  170. avatar
    W. Kevin Vicklund January 9, 2013 at 4:51 pm #

    We use CutePDF Writer, because printing to pdf is the only way that some of our work product can be converted to pdf (engineering firm – in fact, I’m the only one in the firm that even has an electronic signature). Most of the pdfs we generate are scans, because they are either hard copy from outside sources, or require a signature. I’m sure the save as pdf works fine now (if nothing else, new computer), I’d just gotten used to doing it other ways.

    EDIT TO ADD: I am aware of the ability to use images for signatures, just saying that at my work, our signatures are required to be done by hand. There has only been one exception in 10 years, and that’s why I’m the only one that has one.

  171. avatar
    Scientist January 9, 2013 at 4:51 pm #

    CarlOrcas: Notice that the White House does not characterize them as an “official act” or “official Presidential Statement”. In fact the first paragraph seems to indicate that his appearance in the briefing room was a spur of the moment thing.

    I don’t think press statements are “offical acts”. For example the President held a press event to announce that he was nominating Chuck Hagel as Defense Secretary. But, legally speaking, that was not actually the nomination, which occurs when he submits the name in writing to the Senate for approval.

    Hermitian: Scanning a paper document into a PDF file so that it can be published on the internet is not fraud.
    Better ask Arpaio and Zullo about that Keith. These two experienced lawmen seem to think that to do so is a crime in Arizona

    Really? Then perhaps those 2 “experienced lawmen” would be so kind as to cite the Arizona statute one violates by posting a document on a server in Washington DC, a document with no official purpose in the state of Arizona. Perhaps they woud also take a little time out of their busy schedule talking to Tea Party groups and make an arrest. I don’t know about Arizona, but here in New York we don’t pay our “experienced lawmen” to address political groups, we pay them to make arrests.

  172. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy January 9, 2013 at 4:52 pm #

    Yeah, you could do that, but it wouldn’t look anything like the Tepper document.

    Do any of your direct PDF conversion tricks and then compare it to the Tepper document. Hint ZOOM in. They are nothing whatever alike.

    So your crank theory is exploded.

    Our illustrious PDF expert doesn’t know the difference between text and image.

    Hermitian: 1. Type document in WORD
    2. Save document as PDF using “Sav_As PDF”
    or alternatively (actually I perfer) convert WORD document to PDF document using Corel Fusion. This is done by dragging the WORD .DOC and dropping it onto the “Assembly View” in Fusion. Fusion will also merge all kinds of formatted files into one PDF document.
    For multiple documents I use the Corel PDF Batch Converter which is integrated with Fusion
    3. Send either the WORD .DOC or the .PDF file.

  173. avatar
    HKL (Keith away from home) January 9, 2013 at 4:53 pm #

    Hermitian: Better ask Arpaio and Zullo about that Keith. These two experienced lawmen seem to think that to do so is a crime in Arizona

    If they think so, they are wrong.

    Anyway, Zullo is not an ‘experienced lawman’ and wouldn’t know how to pour water out of a boot if the instructions were written on the heel.

    Arpaio has never said that photocopying a certified document is fraud under Arizona law or any law. It happens all the time; this is just silly.

    Hermitian: What an idiot! Do you suppose that’s also true for dry copy process?

    Yes. Dry Copy = Xerography = Photocopy = ‘Scan’

    The process would be worthless if it didn’t produce a faithful copy of the original. It would also be useless if it damaged the original so that more copies could not be made.

    Birth Certificates have security tokens specifically included to ensure that copies are not mistaken for the original. The seal is 3D, some security paper doesn’t copy well or exposes obvious stuff during the copy – notice how Mitt’s BC had the word ‘VOID’ written all over it; that was a security feature of the paper that is only visible on a copied version.

    But in no case is the original itself changed.

    Although there have been many times when the Xerox ate my originals.

    Mechanical destruction of the document is not changing the certification nor the information that has been certified. During the Tehran Hostage Crisis that Reagan exploited to defeat Carter, the Iranians pieced together the shredded embassy personnel documents to help locate missing staff (see the movie ‘Argo’). Were those records fraudulently changed? Should the Iranians have not used them and instead insisted that the Carter administration provide the valid originals? Are you insane or just crazy?

    Hermitian: That Obama and his minions claimed that it was his long-form birth certificate on the WH web site. This was a deliberate act intended to deceive the American citizens and the world.

    No such claim has EVER been made by ANYONE other than a birther trying lamly to find some kind of mud that will stick to something, anything.

    Obama and his staff have always asserted that it is a “scanned image” of his LFBC.

    Now it is true that people use short cuts in spoken English. We don’t say ‘scanned image of the birth certificate’ every time we mention it. Neither do we say ‘original paper birth certificate’ every time we mention it. The context allows us to use shortcuts.

    When it is said that the ‘Birth Certificate’ is ‘posted online’ the words ‘computer based scanned image of’ are assumed to precede the words ‘Birth Certificate’.

    Do you really think you will bring down the President because the English language allows its speakers to use short cuts that everybody else understands?

    I know you have a real problem with communication, refusing to use the quote function as you do and forcing your readers to decipher your scribblings, but disingenuously pretending to not understand common English and argue endlessly about pedantic crap like this is beyond boring.

  174. avatar
    Rickey January 9, 2013 at 5:01 pm #

    Hermitian:

    The official act was when the President addressed the press at 9:48 am and read his entire official Presidential Statement regarding the release of additional information about his birth; the transcript of which is on the White House web site.

    So when the President releases his NCAA basketball brackets, that is an official act? His picks are posted on the White House website. Can we impeach him if he gets them wrong?

    http://www.whitehouse.gov/blog/2012/03/14/president-obamas-2012-ncaa-tournament-bracket

    And I’m still waiting for you to identify the Federal statute which Obama violated if he did indeed release a forged birth certificate.

  175. avatar
    CarlOrcas January 9, 2013 at 6:31 pm #

    Scientist: I don’t think press statements are “offical acts”.

    Not sure what the definition of “official acts” is but I agree that talking to the press doesn’t make the cut. My guess (without wasting time) is that things like Executive Orders, appointments submitted to the Senate for confirmation, etc., would be but I’m still trying to figure out what H’s point is with this line of reasoning……such as it is.

  176. avatar
    CarlOrcas January 9, 2013 at 6:34 pm #

    Dr. Conspiracy: I have Microsoft Office 2007 on this machine, and the save to PDF works super. I save both Word and Excel regularly. I also have Acrobat 9, so that also gives me a PDF printer driver.

    Yes, I use all those. I’ve also begun saving bills and payment confirmations to PDF’s and attaching them to payments in Quicken. Clean, fast and easy.

  177. avatar
    Hermitian January 9, 2013 at 7:06 pm #

    “Dr. ConspiracyJanuary 9, 2013 at 1:21 pm
    Comment

    “This is a good example that shows Hermitian’s inability to grasp that the document was scanned.”

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    Engineers can smell a setup a mile away. I am fully aware that you Obots have a history of hiding the creation history on Obama’s birth certificates. The prime example is the WH LFCOLB which was run through Apple Preview for the express purpose of scrubbing all previous METADATA from the final PDF file. So if you thought that I would play your silly game then you can forget it. But one thing that you can do is put any fact that I post in the bank.

    To prove my point, I wanted to teach Mr. C. a little lesson. However before I get to that I need to make three points. To be clear I will number my points.

    1. Adobe Reader is inadequate as a diagnostic tool for PDF documents

    2. Trying to judge the creation history of a PDF document from examining its appearance is sheer folly.

    3. In response to questions regarding the creation method or history of a PDF document, I will consider only the creation of the latest PDF file in a chain of creation steps. Moreover I will do so only if the METADATA from the last step is available. Also my findings will always be based on the predicate that the METADATA from this step has not intentionally been modified by the forger.

    Mr C posted a link to the following four-page court document:

    gov.uscourts.mssd.78493.35.1.pdf

    He asked if the first page of this document had been typed or scanned. Within the self-imposed constraints of my point number three the correct answer is both. I happened to have already discovered this answer before Mr. C. Had asked his question.

    As I had previously posted, the first three pages of Mr. C’s document were uploaded to Scribd on 06/06/2012 as a separate document. This was the PDF document

    96221274-MDEC-Request-for-Hawaii-DOH-Verification.pdf

    This date 06/06/2012 was also the date of last modification of Mr. C’s four-page document. It is also the date that Mr. C’s document was uploaded to the Federal District court web site via the ECF system. Examination of the METADATA from the two files indicates that the three-page file was not scanned. Mr. C’s four-page file was scanned. A comparison of the first page of each of these two court documents indicates no significant difference in their appearance.

    To speculate as to the prior history for either document I will not do. Also my findings assume that the METADATA was not intentionally modified by the forger.
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

    “Look at Page 1 of the document linked below. This is an example of something created by a word processing program. In a word, it is “sharp.” This is because there is no image, but rather text and fonts in the PDF file. Zoom in. Zoom and zoom, and zoom and zoom. It stays sharp! It’s not a scanned image.
    “Now scroll down to page 8. This page is, in a word, “fuzzy.” Zoom in. Zoom and zoom, and zoom and zoom. It gets fuzzy and artifacts start appearing. This is because one is looking at a scanned image.
    Word Processing — sharp
    Scanned — fuzzy

    DUH!!!!!!!

    “W. Kevin Vicklund: BTW, the 12 page document I referenced can be found here:

    http://www.scribd.com/doc/96200621/2012-06-06-MDEC-Motion-to-Supplement-Response-to-Motion-for-Sanctions-S-D-Miss

    “Other referenced documents are found earlier in the discussion.”

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    Now for lesson number two. Kevin Vickland posted the above link for a third document from the same court case. The first page of this document was typed. However, examination of the METADATA from this 12-page PDF file indicate that it was created and produced by the same tool as the aforementioned three-page file from Scribd. Neither or these two files was scanned in their last creation step. The tool for both was Adobe Acrobat Pro Extended 9.5.1.
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

  178. avatar
    Northland10 January 9, 2013 at 7:15 pm #

    Hermitian: Better ask Arpaio and Zullo about that Keith. These two experienced lawmen seem to think that to do so is a crime in Arizona.

    Would this be why they make presentations to political groups and not submit any charges to the prosecutor? Most experienced lawmen do not advance an investigation by printing a book and making presentations to Tea Party groups. Have your experienced lawmen ever actually stated what Arizona law was broken and who broke it?

    Are you really so gullible as to let Arpaio and Zullo play you like a cheap fiddle?

  179. avatar
    Hermitian January 9, 2013 at 7:54 pm #

    W. Kevin VicklundJanuary 9, 2013 at 12:17 pm
    Comment

    ““Whenever possible Engineers eliminate the guesswork. As I stated previously, the first three pages of the court document 35-1.pdf was uploaded to Scribd on 06/06/2012. This is document

    96221274-MDEC-Request-for-Hawaii-DOH-Verification.pdf

    “”which is identical to pages 1-3 of your linked document. The METADATA from this file indicates that the three-page document was also created on 06/06/2012. The creator tool was Adobe Acrobat Pro Extended 9.5.1. The document was produced by the same tool. This document was not scanned.”“

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    Rest assured I already knew that 35-1 was scanned with the Fugitsu and most likely made editable, selectable and searchable by means of the Adobe Paper Copy Plug in. I have known all of this since early October. (See my affidavit)

    But I also already knew that the three page document had not been scanned. And I already knew that the creation tool for the 12-page document was the same as for the three-page document. Mr. C’s page 1 is page 8 of the 12-page document and is of course page 1 of the other two documents. These three pages in the three documents are identical.
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

    “So why are you assuming that the document uploaded to Scribd by Jack Ryan, who appears to be a Friend of the Fogbow, not Tepper, the attorney who created the original document, was unaltered? Indeed, Jack Ryan uploaded another file that day, which was a 12 page document, containing the 7 page document 35, all 4 pages of 35-1, and the 1 page document 35-2 (Fuddy’s response). This document was also created on 6/6/2012, but at 12:44 pm, almost exactly 3 hours before the three page 35-1 file was created (at 3:43 pm).”

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    I don’t assume anything that I can’t prove. Probably, the fourth page was extracted from 35-1 and the remaining three-page document uploaded to Scribd. This assumption would be consistent with someone not wanting page 4 to be readily available to the public. Certainly the forger would not want that. My interest is not on page 1 of 35-1 but rather on the Tepper page 4 LFCOLB.
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

    But wait…

    The Tepper four-page PDF court document 35-1 was created on 06/04/2012 and was last modified on 06/06/2012.

    The four-page document 35-1 was created two full days before the three-page document, according to you. So what does the METADATA say for that file?

    Created: 6/4/2012 12:33:38 PM
    Modified: 6/6/2012 2:20:29 PM

    Application:PFU SnapScan Manager 5.0.21 #S1500

    Not only is this proof it was scanned in, you had to have seen this proof at some point.
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    Correct I have known this since early October. But that’s not the end of the story.
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

  180. avatar
    Hermitian January 9, 2013 at 8:16 pm #

    “Reality CheckJanuary 9, 2013 at 7:14 am

    “First there is nothing to “end” except Birther insanity and that is boundless. The verification letter was exactly the correct document to for the MDEC to file in Judge Wingate’s court from a legal perspective. The verification in the statute exists to cover situations where the information needs to be verified by the issuing authority. The MDEC had to satisfy that they met the requirements of the Hawaii statutes to be entitled to receive one. They could because Taitz had filed the poor copy in her motion and had questioned authenticity of the information on the document.”

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    Except the Onaka verification purports to verify two different forged PDF images and is therefore worthless. Moreover, because Obama’s original Birth certificate is altered or delayed, then it has no probative value under Hawaii law. Only a court of competent jurisdiction can establish the probative value of obama’s original records and the facts of his birth.

    So let’s see the two certified copies and get on with the court case.
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

  181. avatar
    Hermitian January 9, 2013 at 8:25 pm #

    “The Magic MJanuary 9, 2013 at 8:48 am
    Comment

    “Second, why would he release BOTH certified copies? ”

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    The plaintiffs have a right to inspect both certified copies because Obama stipulated to the court that he has two certified copies in his possession.

    If this inspection indicates that both copies are identical then it would prove that both copies are forgeries. Don’t bother to ask me why that is. Figure it out for yourself.
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

  182. avatar
    Hermitian January 9, 2013 at 8:48 pm #

    Dr. ConspiracyJanuary 9, 2013 at 10:27 am
    Compare

    “The point is that anyone who cannot even tell the difference between a scanned document and one created directly from a Microsoft Word document (whether by the Acrobat printer driver, or by Word’s native Save to Document feature) lacks the basic competence of an office clerk, much less is someone who pretends to be qualified to submit an affidavit to be used as expert testimony in federal court. Earth to Bizarro world: An Image is different from a structured document.

    “Oh, and you do know that Adobe Acrobat Pro does scanning?”

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    Yes I did. And that’s why I prefer to discriminate between rasterizing and scanning. Adobe Illustrator can also rasterize.

    Obviously Mr. C. is not angling to be an expert forensic examiner. Terminology means something to the real experts.
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

    “You don’t need any software, just look at the damned thing. That’s the reason I didn’t do your silly comparison between the Obama PDF and the Tepper correspondence. It was obvious in a second that it was a scan (both the letter and the birth certificate) and so there was nothing of interest. Apparently you are so lost in your conspiracy PDF elements that you cannot be bothered to actually look at them, or to read them, or to comprehend them, much less think.”

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    This is going to be a hell of a lot easier than I thought.

    By the way what’s your interest in page 1?

    Don’t you want to examine page 4 just a little bit?

    No! Well good! That keeps you right behind the eight ball and thus totally useless for any defense effort.

    Cuz you know we have already found that page 4 is a gold mine of pure forgery.

    Just keep your denial up. It will probably be better for you if you do.

    Just saying…
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

    “Until you can provide some coherent answer to why you say the Tepper copy of the Hawaii correspondence (any page) was “not scanned” or admit that you are wrong, I’m not going to waste any more time with you, because it’s a waste of my time to talk to someone who cannot or will not think.”

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    Contrare! Please post where I ever said that 35-1 was never scanned. You misunderstood. I told you that the three-page letter that was uploaded to Scribd was not scanned per the METADATA. If this is a problem for you then blame it on whoever uploaded this bizzaro three-page document. Maybe you should re-read my post below.

    But I never said that the Tepper four-page document was never scanned. Just ask Taitz, Irey or Vogt. They will fill your ear up about the Epson ScanSnap S 1500 and the Adobe Acrobat Paper Capture Plug in.
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

    “Hermitian: Whenever possible Engineers eliminate the guesswork. As I stated previously, the first three pages of the court document 35-1.pdf was uploaded to Scribd on 06/06/2012. This is document

    96221274-MDEC-Request-for-Hawaii-DOH-Verification.pdf

    “”which is identical to pages 1-3 of your linked document. The METADATA from this file indicates that the three-page document was also created on 06/06/2012. The creator tool was Adobe Acrobat Pro Extended 9.5.1. The document was produced by the same tool. This document was not scanned.

    “”The contents of a PDF file created by converting a WORD .DOC file depends on the method used to convert. For example a .PDF file converted using the WORD “Save As” option is entirely different from the same .DOC file converted to PDF with Corel Fusion.

    “”So I don’t see your point.””

  183. avatar
    aesthetocyst January 9, 2013 at 9:14 pm #

    Hermitian: I prefer to discriminate between rasterizing and scanning.

    No need to discriminate, as the differences in results are screamingly obvious.

    Hermitian: Cuz you know we have already found that page 4 is a gold mine of pure forgery.

    In your deluded minds. Yet, with a crime so brazen, involving a forgery so obvious, with stakes so high … you aren’t willing to put yourself on the line. Why is that? You are a true believer aren’t you? This is a serious matter, isn’t it? You’re not just joking, right?

    [Redacted. Doc.]

    Odds are, no one will testify about anything in MS. Birfers cases are just too ridiculous. But if a hearing occurs, and witnesses are allowed, then please, Herms, pleeeeeease testify. Please?

    Your testimony could make all the differences in … ummm … well, the length of the hearing. Taitz needs ya, Herms. Don’t let her down!

  184. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy January 9, 2013 at 9:18 pm #

    Hermitian: But I never said that the Tepper four-page document was never scanned. Just ask Taitz, Irey or Vogt. They will fill your ear up about the Epson ScanSnap S 1500 and the Adobe Acrobat Paper Capture Plug in.

    I’m not interested at this point in what you told Irey, Taitz and Vogt. I’m interested in what you said:

    Hermitian: No given the circumstances, a sane person would extract the page 8 WH PDF image from the 15-1.pdf court document, add the second case label in green color, and then merge that minimally altered WH LFCOLB PDF image page with the PDF file of the Tepper 3-page letter as page 4.

    .

    or

    Hermitian: The work flow is problematic for your second scenario . There would be no need to retain a hard copy and scan it to PDF. The direct conversion from word to PDF eliminates two steps.

    or

    Hermitian: 1. Type document in WORD
    2. Save document as PDF using “Sav_As PDF”
    or alternatively (actually I perfer) convert WORD document to PDF document using Corel Fusion. This is done by dragging the WORD .DOC and dropping it onto the “Assembly View” in Fusion. Fusion will also merge all kinds of formatted files into one PDF document.
    For multiple documents I use the Corel PDF Batch Converter which is integrated with Fusion
    3. Send either the WORD .DOC or the .PDF file.

    I also use PDF Tools Pro for manipulating files.

    Job Finished !

    See how effective the quote function is!

    So let’s be plain here, are you saying that the Mississippi docket Entry 35-1 is the output of scanning or not? I and others said: well if you want to mail some stuff to Hawaii, you print it out and mail it, and if you want to show the court what you mailed to Hawaii you scan it all in (likely with Adobe Acrobat Pro) and save it as a PDF file.

    You seem to be have been saying that this is a complicated and wasteful scenario, even though folks who work in offices (myself included) do it all the time, and that the document would have been converted directly from Word to PDF.

    Now you seem to be saying it was scanned?

    You seem to be avoiding discussing Pages 1-3 of the document. Were they scanned for the court PDF file or not? If they were scanned, why in the world would they not scan page 4 too?

    It seems that you are arguing two contradictory positions.

  185. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy January 9, 2013 at 9:28 pm #

    I don’t understand what you are saying here. Adobe Acrobat Pro is a scanning program. How does the file being created by Acrobat Pro mean that the last step wasn’t scanning?

    Hermitian: Neither or these two files was scanned in their last creation step. The tool for both was Adobe Acrobat Pro Extended 9.5.1.

  186. avatar
    Reality Check January 9, 2013 at 9:28 pm #

    And of course you can prove that for us?

    Just a question if I might? Are you that incredibly stupid as to not figure out how to use the quote function or are you just being a smartass like “all lower case all the time” SCOTT E?

    Hermitian: Moreover, because Obama’s original Birth certificate is altered or delayed, then it has no probative value under Hawaii law.

  187. avatar
    Andy January 9, 2013 at 9:42 pm #

    Why is Henry still arguing here? He knows that he can’t be right: one of the documents was made with Word, the other document was made by scanning. (You can see it plainly around the edges without even needing to zoom in – the color isn’t solid white on the borders…)

    Mr. Blake here seems to think he’s got it figured out. We all know he’s wrong, so is there really a point in arguing with someone so wrong?

  188. avatar
    Thinker January 9, 2013 at 9:55 pm #

    If Henry changed his mind based on evidence and logic demonstrating he is wrong, he wouldn’t be a birfer. Being stuck on stupid is absolutely necessary in birferism.

    Andy:
    Why is Henry still arguing here?He knows that he can’t be right:one of the documents was made with Word, the other document was made by scanning.

  189. avatar
    LW January 9, 2013 at 11:18 pm #

    Hermitian: The prime example is the WH LFCOLB which was run through Apple Preview for the express purpose of scrubbing all previous METADATA from the final PDF file.

    No, the WHHH LFCOLB was run througHHH Apple Preview because that’s what HHHappens when you click on a PDF email attachment on a Mac. You’d HHHave to go out of your way for that not to HHHappen.

    I may HHHave mentioned this before.

  190. avatar
    aesthetocyst January 10, 2013 at 9:23 am #

    Hermitian: The prime example is the WH LFCOLB which was run through Apple Preview for the express purpose of scrubbing all previous METADATA from the final PDF file.

    Dear Herms,

    I invented this meme. 18 months later, birfers still cling to it for hope.

    You’re welcome!

  191. avatar
    sfjeff January 10, 2013 at 10:40 pm #

    I still don’t see Hermie answering the pertinent question

    What is the material fraud that he believes was committed.

    Hawaii has confirmed multiple times that Obama was born in Hawaii, and that his birth certificate is on file. Hawaii has stated that a copy of Barack Obama’s BC was posted on the White House’s website.

    What is the material fraud that you think is committed on the birth certificate copy that was posted? I will make it easier and give you choices:
    a) Do you believe the birth certificate shows the wrong state of birth?
    b) Do you believe that the birth certificate shows the wrong date of birth?

    Those are the only two material facts on the birth certificate regarding Presidential eligiblity.

    Tell us Hermitian- what do you claim is the material fraud here?

  192. avatar
    Benji Franklin January 10, 2013 at 11:47 pm #

    sfjeff: I still don’t see Hermie answering the pertinent question

    What is the material fraud that he believes was committed.

    He knows no material fraud was committed. To displace that nightmarish (for him) reality, he pretends that Obama’s “ineligibility” should be manifestly obvious to anyone who merely hears a Birther demand answers to fantastic Obama-challenging questions that no sane person would even pose. Hermie hates Obama; it’s that simple.

  193. avatar
    Keith January 11, 2013 at 1:49 am #

    sfjeff: What is the material fraud that you think is committed on the birth certificate copy that was posted? I will make it easier and give you choices:
    a) Do you believe the birth certificate shows the wrong state of birth?
    b) Do you believe that the birth certificate shows the wrong date of birth?

    On the ‘should Hermie be banned or not’ discussion, I vote that he be placed in moderation and all comments rejected until he answers that question directly and unambiguously.

  194. avatar
    CarlOrcas January 11, 2013 at 2:34 am #

    Keith: On the ‘should Hermie be banned or not’ discussion, I vote that he be placed in moderation and all comments rejected until he answers that question directly and unambiguously.

    I think Doc is handling him just fine. The truth is that what Hermitian ignores and doesn’t respond to says far more about him than any of his elaborate and overly long responses ever will.

  195. avatar
    Majority Will January 11, 2013 at 4:00 am #

    CarlOrcas: I think Doc is handling him just fine. The truth is that what Hermitian ignores and doesn’t respond to says far more about him than any of his elaborate and overly long responses ever will.

    Hermitian’s Principle of Uncertainty.

  196. avatar
    Majority Will January 11, 2013 at 5:02 am #

    Majority Will: Hermitian’s Principle of Uncertainty.

    Some of you may remember this principle as a tenet from the Doctrines of Dumbassery.

  197. avatar
    The Magic M January 11, 2013 at 6:49 am #

    Birthers’ Axiom of Choice: “I choose to hate the black guy”

    Zorn’s Lemma, birther version: “If in a partially insane set B of birthers, every lawsuit is denied cert by SCOTUS, then B contains at least one racist.”

    Cook-Levin Theorem, birther version: “The birther satisfiability problem is BC-incomplete.” (BC = the class of problems related to birth certificates)
    Also formulated as “birthers will never be satisfied”.

    Heine-Borel Theorem, birther version: “For a birther worldview V, the following are equivalent:
    (1) V is closed and bounded
    (2) Every series of events in V contains a finite number of events caused by the conspiracy, i.e. V is cranky”

    Krein-Milman Theorem, birther version: “Every birther theory lies in the convex hull created by Orly Taitz, Mario Apuzzo and Jerome Corsi”.

  198. avatar
    Hermitian January 11, 2013 at 3:21 pm #

    aesthetocystJanuary 9, 2013 at 9:14 pm (Quote)#

    Hermitian: I prefer to discriminate between rasterizing and scanning.

    No need to discriminate, as the differences in results are screamingly obvious.

    Hermitian: Cuz you know we have already found that page 4 is a gold mine of pure forgery.

    In your deluded minds. Yet, with a crime so brazen, involving a forgery so obvious, with stakes so high … you aren’t willing to put yourself on the line. Why is that? You are a true believer aren’t you? This is a serious matter, isn’t it? You’re not just joking, right?

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    Yup! Crime, Brazen, Obvious Forgery, High Stakes

    Those are all the right words dude.
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

  199. avatar
    Hermitian January 11, 2013 at 4:20 pm #

    “Dr. ConspiracyJanuary 9, 2013 at 9:18 pm (Quote)#
    Comment

    “Hermitian: But I never said that the Tepper four-page document was never scanned. Just ask Taitz, Irey or Vogt. They will fill your ear up about the Epson ScanSnap S 1500 and the Adobe Acrobat Paper Capture Plug in.

    “I’m not interested at this point in what you told Irey, Taitz and Vogt. I’m interested in what you said:

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    From my Email on page 123 of the Strunk appeal which you referenced in your initial post:

    “Alternatively, Tepper might have had someone else modify the WH LFCOLB PDF image to create the altered PDF image. That might explain why the METADATA was not entirely erased from his four-page electronic document. We know that a scanner was used so Tepper’s forger would have had to have some means of re-sizing a scanned and altered image of the WH LFCOLB back to the correct size to match a real 1961 Certificate of Live Birth printed form.”

    This Email was dated Dec 04, 2012.

    From the raw data from Tepper’s 35-1.pdf document:

    2012-06-06T14:20:29-05:00
    2012-06-04T12:33:38-07:00
    2012-06-06T14:20:29-05:00
    PFU ScanSnap Manager 5.0.21 #S1500

    application/pdf

    uuid:1bd34253-ce1a-426c-90d4-55119120c8b0
    uuid:6de61fee-fb04-4b3f-9039-9c5b2c0e5460

    Adobe Acrobat 9.51 Paper Capture Plug-in

    The answer to your question was in your post all along.
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

  200. avatar
    Hermitian January 11, 2013 at 4:30 pm #

    Reality Check:
    And of course you can prove that for us?

    Just a question if I might? Are you that incredibly stupid as to not figure out how to use the quote function or are you just being a smartass like “all lower case all the time” SCOTT E?

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    Just one time for you RC.
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

  201. avatar
    Hermitian January 11, 2013 at 4:36 pm #

    Dr. Conspiracy:
    I don’t understand what you are saying here. Adobe Acrobat Pro is a scanning program. How does the file being created by Acrobat Pro mean that the last step wasn’t scanning?

    Based on my self imposed constraint (point No. 3) together with the evidence I have already posted I will only give the answer based on the METADATA from the last operation. Moreover I am assuming that the forger did not screw with the METADATA.

  202. avatar
    Hermitian January 11, 2013 at 4:43 pm #

    Dr. Conspiracy:
    I don’t understand what you are saying here. Adobe Acrobat Pro is a scanning program. How does the file being created by Acrobat Pro mean that the last step wasn’t scanning?

    The METADATA from 35-1.pdf indicates that a Fugitsu ScanSnap S1500 scanner was the creator tool and Adobe Acrobat 9.51 Paper Capture Plug in was the producer tool.

    The METADATA from 96221274-MDEC-Request-for-Hawaii-DOH-Verification.pdf indicates that the creator and producer tool was Adobe Acrobat Pro Extended 9.5.1.

    The first three pages of these two documents are identical so take your pick.

  203. avatar
    aesthetocyst January 11, 2013 at 5:21 pm #

    Hermitian: Moreover I am assuming that the forger did not screw with the METADATA.

    You are very generous to forgers.

  204. avatar
    aesthetocyst January 11, 2013 at 5:26 pm #

    Hermitian: Yup! Crime, Brazen, Obvious Forgery, High Stakes

    Umm-hmmm, yep, right …. but you just can’t quite say what the crime was/is?

    Hey, I have an “official action” suggestion for you!

    What about the Executive Order he announced back at that press conference in April 2011? You know, the one demanding his birth certificate be placed on display, under armed guard, in the Library of Congress, and all the schoolchildren in the country to be flown in for a required viewing, each required to bow before it in the direction of Mecca, and further declaring any questioning of his life story to be treasonous sedition, published by death at the discretion of the death panels?

    Surely that order overstepped a few bounds.

  205. avatar
    Majority Will January 11, 2013 at 5:31 pm #

    aesthetocyst: You are very generous to forgers.

    It’s like trash TV waiting to see a troll with a steaming pile of irrelevant idiocy try to out asinine himself.

    Corsi and others are obvious proof that a Ph.D. doesn’t mean jack squat when it comes to common sense. But then, there are allegedly intelligent folks that still fall for things like the Nigerian 419 scams.

    Just swap greed for bigotry and you’ve got a delusional birther.

  206. avatar
    JD Reed January 11, 2013 at 5:42 pm #

    Rickey: So when the President releases his NCAA basketball brackets, that is an official act? His picks are posted on the White House website. Can we impeach him if he gets them wrong?

    And I’m still waiting for you to identify the Federal statute which Obama violated if he did indeed release a forged birth certificate.

    Rickey, please don’t go too long without exhaling.
    I’ve noted that birther bloggers here just ignore pointed questions that if they answer one way, they’re conceding a point to their adversaries, while if they answer the other way,
    they’ll be caught peddling provable falsehoods..
    Case in point: None of Zullo’s acolytes, such as Hermitian, World Net Daily, et all, will address the question of why Zullo affirmed under oath that Obama on his first full day in office issued an executive order sealing his personal records. This is so simple to prove, just by looking at the president’s first executive order, which was on the topic of presidential records. Despite the widespread circulation this false report has enjoyed, no one (to my knowledge) has ever pointed to the specific passage that supposedly seals the prez’s personal records.
    I suspect the likes of Herms will see Jan. 20, 2017, come and go, and the Obama presidential library open for business, without once publicly acknowledging that the supposed executive order sealing Obama’s personal records never existed. And therefore that Zullo is a charlatan or a real-life Inspector Clouseau.

  207. avatar
    Hermitian January 11, 2013 at 5:55 pm #

    sfjeff:
    I still don’t see Hermie answering the pertinent question

    What is the material fraud that he believes was committed.

    Hawaii has confirmed multiple times that Obama was born in Hawaii, and that his birth certificate is on file. Hawaii has stated that a copy of Barack Obama’s BC was posted on the White House’s website.

    What is the material fraud that you think is committed on the birth certificate copy that was posted? I will make it easier and give you choices:
    a) Do you believe the birth certificate shows the wrong state of birth?
    b) Do you believe that the birth certificate shows the wrong date of birth?

    Those are the only two material facts on the birth certificate regarding Presidential eligiblity.

    Tell us Hermitian- what do you claim is the material fraud here?

    IANAL but if I were the prosecutor I would start with wire fraud. That is a Federal felony which gets you maybe 20 years. Then there would be conspiracy to comment forgery. Conspiracy to comment forgery of a certifying element. And of course the forgery charges for the forgers.

  208. avatar
    aesthetocyst January 11, 2013 at 6:00 pm #

    JD Reed: None of Zullo’s acolytes, such as Hermitian, World Net Daily, et all, will address the question of why Zullo

    WND setup Zullo; Corsi entranced Arpaio, Zullo was already on his posse, Corsi connected him to various ot birfer nuts. They pretend Zullo is a source, that they are reporting on his activities. But it’s a collaboration at best. At worst, Zullo is Corsi’s meat puppet.

  209. avatar
    Hermitian January 12, 2013 at 8:45 am #

    “It should be obvious from the court docket headers exactly where the documents came from and it is obvious that no “new” copy of the birth certificate has appeared anywhere. Despite Taitz’ wild claims, there was no flim-flam directed at confusing the Court. This is just a copy of a copy.”

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    Yes everyone should look at those two shiny Case Labels at the top edge and nothing else on the certificate. Maybe that’s why the forger chose those bright rainbow colors for the second label? Do you suppose?
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

  210. avatar
    aesthetocyst January 12, 2013 at 12:18 pm #

    Hermitian: Maybe that’s why the forger chose those bright rainbow colors for the second label?

    No. No intentional agency involved.

  211. avatar
    brygenon January 12, 2013 at 3:43 pm #

    Hermitian: That Obama and his minions claimed that it was his long-form birth certificate on the WH web site. This was a deliberate act intended to deceive the American citizens and the world.

    The Hawaii Department of Health confirms: “On April 27, 2011 President Barack Obama posted a certified copy of his original Certificate of Live Birth.” They link to the White House site.
    http://hawaii.gov/health/vital-records/obama.html

    Hermitian, near as I can tell, you are objecting on grounds that would be a strong candidate for a world record level of stupid. Did you think that the White House, the Hawaii Department of Health, and birther debunkers were announcing development of technology to move physical paper over TCP/IP?

    I know that sounds harsh, but that’s what you’ve left us. Yes, it’s an electronic image. Obviously. The Internet transfers information, not physical objects. Is that news to you? When descriptions have omitted “an image of” it was because we had not yet imagined anyone would be, or pretend to be, so deluded.

  212. avatar
    brygenon January 12, 2013 at 4:56 pm #

    Hermitian wrote: Except the Onaka verification purports to verify two different forged PDF images and is therefore worthless. Moreover, because Obama’s original Birth certificate is altered or delayed, then it has no probative value under Hawaii law.

    You tell not the truth. The relevant verifications from the Hawaii Department of Health, written by Registrar of Vital Statistics for the State of Hawaii Alvin T. Onaka, confirm that the original records maintained by the state of Hawaii match the records disclosed by Obama’s campaign and administration.

    There’s no indication of “forged” nor “altered or delayed” from Hawaii’s Registrar of Vital Statistics. That’s all you, either so gullible as to buy birther fabrications or so dishonest as to make up such garbage yourself.

    Hermitian wrote: Only a court of competent jurisdiction can establish the probative value of obama’s original records and the facts of his birth.

    Here’s a real court:

    “The President released his long form birth certificate on April 27, 2011, and posted a copy on the White House Web site. The certificate confirms the President’s birth in Honolulu Hawaii. See Michel D. Sheer, “With Document, Obama seeks to end “Birther issue”, The new York Times, Apr 28, 2011, at A1” [US District Court for the District of Columbia; 11-cv-421 RCL]

    So engineer Hermitian, what do you do when reality so strongly refutes your theory?

  213. avatar
    Hermitian January 13, 2013 at 10:39 am #

    “brygenonJanuary 12, 2013 at 4:56 pm
    Comment

    ““Hermitian wrote: Except the Onaka verification purports to verify two different forged PDF images and is therefore worthless. Moreover, because Obama’s original Birth certificate is altered or delayed, then it has no probative value under Hawaii law.”“

    ”You tell not the truth. The relevant verifications from the Hawaii Department of Health, written by Registrar of Vital Statistics for the State of Hawaii Alvin T. Onaka, confirm that the original records maintained by the state of Hawaii match the records disclosed by Obama’s campaign and administration.”

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    Wrong Bryg! Under Hawaii law an altered or Delayed original birth certificate has zero evidentiary value. Consequently, a verification of this document also has zero evidentiary value. Obama has never produced either of his two certified copies to any court or election official. He knows that if he were to do so then the certified copies would reveal that his original certificate is altered or delayed. And then he would have to go to court to prove that he is even an American citizen. Only a court of competent jurisdiction can establish the facts of his birth. So let’s see the two certified copies and get on with the court case.
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

    “There’s no indication of “forged” nor “altered or delayed” from Hawaii’s Registrar of Vital Statistics. That’s all you, either so gullible as to buy birther fabrications or so dishonest as to make up such garbage yourself.”

    “”Hermitian wrote: Only a court of competent jurisdiction can establish the probative value of obama’s original records and the facts of his birth.”“

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    As I have been saying for many months, there is absolute proof that Obama’s original birth certificate is altered or delayed. The evidence is so obvious that you blind Obots (who are loyal to Obama but not to the country) will never discover it.
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

    “Here’s a real court:

    “The President released his long form birth certificate on April 27, 2011, and posted a copy on the White House Web site. The certificate confirms the President’s birth in Honolulu Hawaii. See Michel D. Sheer, “With Document, Obama seeks to end “Birther issue”, The new York Times, Apr 28, 2011, at A1” [US District Court for the District of Columbia; 11-cv-421 RCL]

    “So engineer Hermitian, what do you do when reality so strongly refutes your theory”

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    Reality is in the eye of the beholder. Like that quote above of Michael D. Sheer versus the recent quote from Mr. C. :

    “White House birth certificate: not identical to original”

    “By Dr. Conspiracy on January 5, 2013
    in Birth Certificate

    “Experts agree”

    There are no Federal rules of evidence that permit the production of non-duplicate copies in lieu of an original document.

    End of story!
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

  214. avatar
    aesthetocyst January 13, 2013 at 11:22 pm #

    Hermitian: Hermitian January 13, 2013 at 10:39 am

    Lolz. Herms is in a loop. I do like the new twist he is pushing this week, that the ‘evidence’ of ‘late/altered/delayed’ness is no longer super-sekrit and under wraps, but rather hidden in plain sight. I for one cannot wait for the big reveal. How happy I will be when the scales fall from mine peepers!

  215. avatar
    Whatever4 January 13, 2013 at 11:28 pm #

    Hermitian:

    As I have been saying for many months, there is absolute proof that Obama’s original birth certificate is altered or delayed.The evidence is so obvious that you blind Obots (who are loyal to Obama but not to the country) will never discover it.

    Oh most wise and erudite one who insists on ignoring the quote feature, enlighten us poor ignorant worms.

  216. avatar
    W. Kevin Vicklund January 14, 2013 at 1:01 am #

    Wrong Bryg! Under Hawaii law an altered or Delayed original birth certificate has zero evidentiary value.

    Wrong, Hermie! Under Hawai’i law, an altered or delayed (the statute actually says late) original birth certificate has evidentiary value as determined by the court.

    338-17 Late or altered certificate as evidence. The probative value of a “late” or “altered” certificate shall be determined by the judicial or administrative body or official before whom the certificate is offered as evidence. [L 1949, c 327, 21; RL 1955, 57-20; HRS 338-17; am L 1997, c 305, 4]

    Judges are perfectly within their rights to accept the certificates as evidence, and under the Full Faith and Credit Clause and various federal statutes arising under it, will almost certainly do so if accompanied by HDOH attestation, barring compelling evidence to the contrary.

    As I have been saying for many months, there is absolute proof that Obama’s original birth certificate is altered or delayed. The evidence is so obvious that you blind Obots (who are loyal to Obama but not to the country) will never discover it.

    We know that the original birth certificate can’t be delayed/late. Here is the Hawai’ian law to that effect:

    338-16 Procedure concerning late and altered birth certificates. (a) Birth certificates registered one year or more after the date of birth, and certificates which have been altered after being filed with the department of health, shall contain the date of the late filing and the date of the alteration and be marked distinctly “late” or “altered”.

    (b) A summary statement of the evidence submitted in support of the acceptance for late filing or the alteration shall be endorsed on the certificates.

    (c) Such evidence shall be kept in a special permanent file.

    (d) When an applicant does not submit the minimum documentation required by the rules for late registration or when the state registrar finds reasons to question the validity or adequacy of the certificate or the documentary evidence, the state registrar shall not register the late certificate and shall advise the applicant of the reason for this action.

    The department of health may by rule provide for the dismissal of an application which is not actively prosecuted.

    (e) As used in this section, “late” means one year or more after the date of birth. [L 1949, c 327, 20; RL 1955, 57-19; am L Sp 1959 2d, c 1, 19; HRS 338-16; am L 1972, c 66, 1(2); am L 1997, c 305, 3]

    The birth certificate, verified by Onaka, was filed within one year of birth. It was filed August 8, 1961, four days after Obama’s birth, which was on a Friday. The response from Fuddy is probative to whether it was late or delayed.

    So that leaves altered. There is no evidence on the birth certificate images that the original has been altered. The marks used for coding are not alterations in the meaning of the statute. There are no alterations marked on the certificate. So Hermitian’s “proof” must not come from the PDFs of the birth certificate.

    But wait! We can show that the original certificate on file was not altered OR delayed. Box 23 on the birth certificate is “Evidence for Delayed Filing or Alteration.” It is unmarked. There is no date of late filing. There is no date of alteration. If a record is altered or delayed, by law this box must be filled out. Fuddy has attested that the scan of the certificate on the WH website matches the information on file. If the original record on file was delayed or altered, this box would be filled out and therefore the information would not match. Since it does match, it can not be altered or delayed.

  217. avatar
    brygenon January 14, 2013 at 1:48 am #

    Hermitian: Wrong Bryg! Under Hawaii law an altered or Delayed original birth certificate has zero evidentiary value. Consequently, a verification of this document also has zero evidentiary value.

    I tried to be so clear: I was talking about *reality*, where Hawaii and not you decides Hawaiian law and where Hawaii confirms that Obama’s birth certificate was accepted by the Local Registrar on Aug-8 1961, which is just four days after the event. Your fantasy world may be different; that’s up to you.
    http://www.obamaconspiracy.org/2013/01/heres-the-birth-certificate/

    Hermitian: Obama has never produced either of his two certified copies to any court or election official.

    Courts have no need of it, which is why all 44 U.S. presidents (counting Cleveland twice) have never wasted a court’s time in such a way. Whatever your real reason for singling out President Obama, it cannot be failure to show a birth certificate.

    Hermitian: He knows that if he were to do so then the certified copies would reveal that his original certificate is altered or delayed.

    Your imagined psychic powers there have failed you. President Obama explained what he knows:

    “I know that there’s going to be a segment of people for which no matter what we put out this issue will not be put to rest.” [White House Briefing Room, 27 April 2011]
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dnkQ9TABCFM

    Hermitian: As I have been saying for many months, there is absolute proof that Obama’s original birth certificate is altered or delayed.

    How hard it must have been to convince yourself.

    Hermitian: Reality is in the eye of the beholder.

    Whether or not you were ever really an engineer, please stay out. Your fantasies could get people hurt.

  218. avatar
    The Magic M January 14, 2013 at 4:16 am #

    brygenon: Did you think that the White House, the Hawaii Department of Health, and birther debunkers were announcing development of technology to move physical paper over TCP/IP?

    Maybe engineer Hermitian has secretly developed Star Trek transporter technology. Though if that existed to “beam” a copy of the BC to his home, he would just claim there is no way of telling if the document hasn’t been altered during the transmission process (as Star Trek technology *can* alter transported objects, used e.g. to filter out potentially hazardous microbes).
    And if they had used it to “beam” Hermitian to the Hawaiian vault, he would claim there is no way of knowing if they altered his brainwaves in the process to make him see an original long long long form BC where there is none…

  219. avatar
    bovril January 14, 2013 at 5:09 am #

    The Magic M: altered his brainwaves in the process to make him see an original long long long form BC where there is none…

    Ahem…..assumes facts not in evidence…… 8-)

  220. avatar
    Paper January 14, 2013 at 7:38 am #

    It makes sense that you would want to toy with us here, withholding your proof, teasing us with our failure to discover your evidence, but why haven’t you told Orly Taitz or anyone who has been trying to litigate this matter? Because they haven’t discovered it either. It’s good for you that you are so observant, but why are you hurting the cause by not sharing your evidence with them?

    Hermitian:

    As I have been saying for many months, there is absolute proof that Obama’s original birth certificate is altered or delayed.The evidence is so obvious that you blind Obots (who are loyal to Obama but not to the country) will never discover it.

  221. avatar
    Thomas Brown January 14, 2013 at 8:30 am #

    Paper:
    It makes sense that you would want to toy with us here, withholding your proof, teasing us with our failure to discover your evidence, but why haven’t you told Orly Taitz or anyone who has been trying to litigate this matter?Because they haven’t discovered it either.It’s good for you that you are so observant, but why are you hurting the cause by not sharing your evidence with them?

    Because Hermie is a liar. Proven. Demonstrated. He is also no scientist. So H: put up or shut up, quisling.

  222. avatar
    The Magic M January 14, 2013 at 9:41 am #

    Hermitian: there is absolute proof that Obama’s original birth certificate is altered or delayed

    Lemme guess: it’s a rehash of Butterdezillion’s “it’s in what Hawaii DIDN’T say or HOW they said what they said” meme?
    I think she was the first to claim that certain of Onaka’s words “actually” meant the BC was amended (like his “failure” to say “identical to”).

    So either you’re recycling old crap or you just like to feel important by claiming to have unique valuable knowledge (that in reality doesn’t exist), i.e. you’re a textbook example of a birther nut.

  223. avatar
    CarlOrcas January 14, 2013 at 10:27 am #

    Hermitian: As I have been saying for many months, there is absolute proof that Obama’s original birth certificate is altered or delayed. The evidence is so obvious that you blind Obots (who are loyal to Obama but not to the country) will never discover it.

    And where is your loyalty? Your loyalty to the truth and to the country you seem to be so concerned about?

    A person truly loyal to both those things wouldn’t hesitate for a moment to offer up his “evidence” at every opportunity. Why don’t you? Why haven’t you?

  224. avatar
    Dr Kenneth Noisewater January 14, 2013 at 10:45 am #

    The Magic M: Maybe engineer Hermitian has secretly developed Star Trek transporter technology. Though if that existed to “beam” a copy of the BC to his home, he would just claim there is no way of telling if the document hasn’t been altered during the transmission process (as Star Trek technology *can* alter transported objects, used e.g. to filter out potentially hazardous microbes).And if they had used it to “beam” Hermitian to the Hawaiian vault, he would claim there is no way of knowing if they altered his brainwaves in the process to make him see an original long long long form BC where there is none…

    Actually in Star Trek the explanation of how a transporter works is that the original is destroyed and a copy is made. This means everytime Kirk beams somewhere he dies and an exact copy of him is created. Thus there would be no real Hermy on arrival and no original.

  225. avatar
    Dr Kenneth Noisewater January 14, 2013 at 10:49 am #

    aesthetocyst: Lolz. Herms is in a loop. I do like the new twist he is pushing this week, that the ‘evidence’ of ‘late/altered/delayed’ness is no longer super-sekrit and under wraps, but rather hidden in plain sight. I for one cannot wait for the big reveal. How happy I will be when the scales fall from mine peepers!

    Remember the last time? He claimed he revealed it on Amazon and then would never point to where he proved it.

  226. avatar
    The Magic M January 14, 2013 at 10:53 am #

    Dr Kenneth Noisewater: This means everytime Kirk beams somewhere he dies and an exact copy of him is created.

    Oh, I didn’t know that. So it’s like “The Prestige” then. Bummer. I always disliked the idea of immortality by keeping a copy of the brain contents stored somewhere, to be restored in a “clean” clone if you die – a copy would live on, but I, the original, would still be dead. Kinda like a twin surviving when you die, not what I’d consider immortality…
    Now I know why Bones hated the transporter so much.

    Dr Kenneth Noisewater: Thus there would be no real Hermy on arrival and no original.

    Since birthers would twist the meaning of “original” until it means the opposite of what it actually means anyway, that is a moot point. If there was a way to create a true 1:1 copy, how would one determine (forensically) which is the original anyway? But birthers would still insist they are not the same.

  227. avatar
    aesthetocyst January 14, 2013 at 11:59 am #

    Dr Kenneth Noisewater: Actually in Star Trek the explanation of how a transporter works is that the original is destroyed and a copy is made.

    When/where was that explanation given? Not really the impression the writing is giving IMO, but an interesting comment on the nature of fictional characters. When it comes to common objects, included copies of BCs, who cares, right? But unique items, fine art, historical artifacts (including original records (including BCs)), destroying the original would remove a bit of luster from the provenance, even if it is identical down to the last quark.

    Dr Kenneth Noisewater: He claimed he revealed it on Amazon and then would never point to where he proved it.

    Sounds about right. Got better things to do than to follow all the rambling there! Crazy makes my eyes glaze over.

  228. avatar
    Thomas Brown January 14, 2013 at 1:25 pm #

    Absolutely anyone who says “I have proof that will win the argument, but I can’t show it” is a LIAR. That goes for Swarf Arpiehole, Taitz, Hermie, Joseph Smith…. anyone.

  229. avatar
    Rickey January 14, 2013 at 1:35 pm #

    Hermitian:

    There are no Federal rules of evidence that permit the production of non-duplicate copies in lieu of an original document.

    What is a “non-duplicate” copy? I have never heard that one before.

    I hope you realize that “original” documents are not required if a copy is properly certified.

    Rule 902. Evidence That Is Self-Authenticating

    The following items of evidence are self-authenticating; they require no extrinsic evidence of authenticity in order to be admitted:

    Certified Copies of Public Records. A copy of an official record — or a copy of a document that was recorded or filed in a public office as authorized by law — if the copy is certified as correct by:

    (A) the custodian or another person authorized to make the certification; or

    (B) a certificate that complies with Rule 902(1), (2), or (3), a federal statute, or a rule prescribed by the Supreme Court.

    http://www.law.cornell.edu/rules/fre/rule_902

  230. avatar
    Hermitian January 14, 2013 at 2:36 pm #

    aesthetocyst: You are very generous to forgers.

    To the contrary. It’s you Obots who are generous to forgers. I don’t know any Birthers who have one on their payroll.

    But I do know that wherever there is a forgery then there must be a forger.

  231. avatar
    Hermitian January 14, 2013 at 2:37 pm #

    aesthetocyst: Umm-hmmm, yep, right …. but you just can’t quite say what the crime was/is?

    Hey, I have an “official action” suggestion for you!

    What about the Executive Order he announced back at that press conference in April 2011?You know, the one demanding his birth certificate be placed on display, under armed guard, in the Library of Congress, and all the schoolchildren in the country to be flown in for a required viewing, each required to bow before it in the direction of Mecca, and further declaring any questioning of his life story to be treasonous sedition, published by death at the discretion of the death panels?

    Surely that order overstepped a few bounds.

    Keep saying that Aes and the Obots will believe it.

  232. avatar
    Hermitian January 14, 2013 at 2:49 pm #

    brygenon: The Hawaii Department of Health confirms: “On April 27, 2011 President Barack Obama posted a certified copy of his original Certificate of Live Birth.” They link to the White House site.
    http://hawaii.gov/health/vital-records/obama.html

    Hermitian, near as I can tell, you are objecting on grounds that would be a strong candidate for a world record level of stupid. Did you think that the White House, the Hawaii Department of Health, and birther debunkers were announcing development of technology to move physical paper over TCP/IP?

    I know that sounds harsh, but that’s what you’ve left us. Yes, it’s an electronic image. Obviously. The Internet transfers information, not physical objects. Is that news to you? When descriptions have omitted “an image of” it was because we had not yet imagined anyone would be, or pretend to be, so deluded.

    Then maybe you could explain why the MDEC attorneys produced two different LFCOLB PDF images rather than the two certified paper copies to a Federal District Court but produced the original paper letter from Onaka which purports to verify two different LFCOLB PDF images but does not verify the two certified copies.

  233. avatar
    Hermitian January 14, 2013 at 3:30 pm #

    “RickeyJanuary 14, 2013 at 1:35 pm
    Comment

    “”Hermitian: There are no Federal rules of evidence that permit the production of non-duplicate copies in lieu of an original document.”“

    “What is a “nonduplicate” copy? I have never heard that one before.”
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    A non-duplicate copy is a copy which is not a duplicate copy.

    ““Rule 1001. Definitions That Apply to This Article”

    “In this article:”

    (a) A “writing” consists of letters, words, numbers, or their equivalent set down in any form.

    (b) A “recording” consists of letters, words, numbers, or their equivalent recorded in any manner.

    (c) A “photograph” means a photographic image or its equivalent stored in any form.

    (d) An “original” of a writing or recording means the writing or recording itself or any counterpart intended to have the same effect by the person who executed or issued it. For electronically stored information, “original” means any printout — or other output readable by sight — if it accurately reflects the information. An “original” of a photograph includes the negative or a print from it.

    (e) A “duplicate” means a counterpart produced by a mechanical, photographic, chemical, electronic, or other equivalent process or technique that accurately reproduces the original.

    You have probably never heard of the “Best Evidence Rule: either.
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

    “I hope you realize that “original” documents are not required if a copy is properly certified.”

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    Obama has never submitted a certified copy of his original birth certificate.

    The Best Evidence Rule precludes the introduction of a duplicate copy in lieu of the original if an issue has been raised concerning the original.

    “Rule 1003. Admissibility of Duplicates”

    “A duplicate is admissible to the same extent as the original unless a genuine question is raised about the original’s authenticity or the circumstances make it unfair to admit the duplicate.”

    Multiple attorneys have raised genuine questions about Obama’s original birth certificate. Moreover, the two LFCOLB PDF images that were filed in Federal District court are not duplicate copies. Thus the production of these non-duplicate copies in lieu of the two certified copies is unfair to the plaintifs.
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

    “Rule 902. Evidence That Is Self-Authenticating

    “The following items of evidence are self-authenticating; they require no extrinsic evidence of authenticity in order to be admitted:

    “Certified Copies of Public Records. A copy of an official record — or a copy of a document that was recorded or filed in a public office as authorized by law — if the copy is certified as correct by:

    “(A) the custodian or another person authorized to make the certification; or

    “(B) a certificate that complies with Rule 902(1), (2), or (3), a federal statute, or a rule prescribed by the Supreme Court.

    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
    Obama has never produced his two certified paper copies. So Rule 902 does not apply in any of his cases. A verification of a birth certificate has probative value only to the extent that the original certificate has probative value.
    HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

  234. avatar
    Hermitian January 14, 2013 at 3:40 pm #

    Dr Kenneth Noisewater: I do like the new twist he is pushing this week, that the ‘evidence’ of ‘late/altered/delayed’ness is no longer super-sekrit and under wraps, but rather hidden in plain sight. I for one cannot wait for the big reveal. How happy I will be when the scales fall from mine peepers!

    It’s been right in front of your nose for months and months. And it’s still there.

  235. avatar
    Hermitian January 14, 2013 at 4:16 pm #

    The Magic M: Lemme guess: it’s a rehash of Butterdezillion’s “it’s in what Hawaii DIDN’T say or HOW they said what they said” meme?
    I think she was the first to claim that certain of Onaka’s words “actually” meant the BC was amended (like his “failure” to say “identical to”).

    So either you’re recycling old crap or you just like to feel important by claiming to have unique valuable knowledge (that in reality doesn’t exist), i.e. you’re a textbook example of a birther nut.

    I know that Butterdezillion is a big girl and can take care of herself but I think you Obots are totally misreading the Hawaii law permitting verifications.

    “338-14.3 Verification in lieu of a certified copy. (a) Subject to the requirements of section 338-18, the department of health, upon request, shall furnish to any applicant, in lieu of the issuance of a certified copy, a verification of the existence of a certificate and any other information that the applicant provides to be verified relating to the vital event that pertains to the certificate.
    1. (b) A verification shall be considered for all purposes certification that the vital event did occur and that the facts of the event are as stated by the applicant.
    (c) Verification may be made in written, electronic, or other form approved by the director of health.
    (d) The fee for a verification in lieu of a certified copy shall be a maximum of one half of the fee established in section 338-14.5 for the first certified copy of a certificate issued.
    (e) Fees received for verifications in lieu of certified copies shall be remitted, and one half of the fee shall be deposited to the credit of the vital statistics improvement special fund in section 338-14.6 and the remainder of the fee shall be deposited to the credit of the state general fund. [L 2001, c 246, 1; am L 2010, c 55, 1]”

    It’s that “shall furnish” where you Obots are going off track. Onaka doesn’t get to pick and choose from his pile of bits and pieces of birth records. Maybe he should read his own regulations. You remember the ones that haven’t been revised since 1976.

    “(3) Unauthorized Certified Copies
    Except as authorized by these regulations and other applicable law,
    no person shall prepare or issue any record which purports to be an
    original or certified copy of a certificate of birth, death. fetal death
    (stillbirth), marriage or divorce. The penalties for violation of this
    section shall be as set forth in Section 338-30 of the Hawaii Revised
    Statutes.”

    “338-30 Penalties. (a) Except where a different penalty is provided in this part, any person who violates this part, or neglects or refuses to perform any of the duties imposed upon the person by this part, shall be fined not more than $100.

    ” (b) Any person who wilfully makes or alters any certificate or certified copy thereof provided for in this part except in accordance with this part, shall be fined not more than $1,000, or imprisoned not more than six months, or both.

    “(c) Any person, who knowingly transports, or accepts for transportation, interment, or other disposition, a dead body without an accompanying permit issued in accordance with this part, shall be fined not more than $500.

    “(d) Any person who presents false information in order to obtain access to or a certified copy of a vital record for which the person is not eligible is guilty of a misdemeanor and shall be fined not more than $1,000. [L 1949, c 327, 33; RL 1955, 57-33; HRS 338-30; am L 1977, c 118, 2; gen ch 1985]

    “Cross References

    Classification of offense and authorized punishment, see 701-107, 706-640, 663.”

  236. avatar
    sfjeff January 14, 2013 at 4:48 pm #

    Hermitian: sfjeff:
    I still don’t see Hermie answering the pertinent question
    What is the material fraud that he believes was committed.
    Hawaii has confirmed multiple times that Obama was born in Hawaii, and that his birth certificate is on file. Hawaii has stated that a copy of Barack Obama’s BC was posted on the White House’s website.
    What is the material fraud that you think is committed on the birth certificate copy that was posted? I will make it easier and give you choices:
    a) Do you believe the birth certificate shows the wrong state of birth?
    b) Do you believe that the birth certificate shows the wrong date of birth?
    Those are the only two material facts on the birth certificate regarding Presidential eligiblity.
    Tell us Hermitian- what do you claim is the material fraud here?
    IANAL but if I were the prosecutor I would start with wire fraud. That is a Federal felony which gets you maybe 20 years. Then there would be conspiracy to comment forgery. Conspiracy to comment forgery of a certifying element. And of course the forgery charges for the forgers.

    You are still playing coy here Hermitian….why so coy?

    Tell us Hermitian- what do you claim is the material fraud here?

    a) Do you believe the birth certificate shows the wrong state of birth?
    b) Do you believe that the birth certificate shows the wrong date of birth?

    Look- I made it easy for you- do you believe a or b?

  237. avatar
    Hermitian January 14, 2013 at 6:03 pm #

    sfjeff: Tell us Hermitian- what do you claim is the material fraud here?
    a) Do you believe the birth certificate shows the wrong state of birth?
    b) Do you believe that the birth certificate shows the wrong date of birth?
    Look- I made it easy for you- do you believe a or b?

    I thought this site filtered out the recycle. But anywho — I have never seen an Obama birth certificate so I couldn’t say.

    But I do know what the crimes of wire fraud, forgery, and forgery of a certifying element are. I also know that by Hawaii law, only the Hawaii Director of Health has the legal authority to produce and issue any Hawaii birth certificate.

  238. avatar
    Hermitian January 14, 2013 at 6:12 pm #

    Thomas Brown: I have proof

    “Thomas BrownJanuary 14, 2013 at 1:25 pm
    Comment

    “Absolutely anyone who says “I have proof that will win the argument, but I can’t show it” is a LIAR. That goes for Swarf Arpiehole, Taitz, Hermie, Joseph Smith…. anyone.”

    And also by extrapolation to Obama. Obama has published two different PDF images of his purported LFCOLB. He also claims to have an original 1961 hospital-generated long-form birth certificate on file at the HDOH and two certified copies of it buried somewhere. He has represented the PDF images of his LFCOLB as duplicate copies while fighting to withhold the original and certified copies. In other words he has proof but he can’t show it to us.

  239. avatar
    G January 14, 2013 at 8:03 pm #

    Agreed.

    Thomas Brown:
    Absolutely anyone who says “I have proof that will win the argument, but I can’t show it” is a LIAR.That goes for Swarf Arpiehole, Taitz, Hermie, Joseph Smith…. anyone.

  240. avatar
    justlw January 14, 2013 at 8:18 pm #

    Obama received two certified copies — both of which were showed to the press.

    Savannah Guthrie took pictures of one of them, and posted them to the web.

    High resolution copies of one of them were handed out to the press.

    Some people scanned their handout and posted the scan to the web, some of them at pretty high resolution.

    The White House scanned one of them and posted that scan to the web, at mediocre resolution.

    (Did I miss any?)

    All of these images contain the same data. (Unless you buy into the “Huwaii” story, and if you do, please make sure all your electrical outlets have safety covers.)

    None of these copies show anything other than “blank” for box 23, and this is the data that Onaka has certified multiple times over.

  241. avatar
    Hermitian January 14, 2013 at 8:25 pm #

    justlw: Obama received two certified copies — both of which were showed to the press.

    The WH press secretary claimed to have only one at the podium. He flashed it from a distance and then removed it from the room before Obama arrived later.

  242. avatar
    Hermitian January 14, 2013 at 8:32 pm #

    justlw: The White House scanned one of them and posted that scan to the web, at mediocre resolution.

    If you consider binary monochrome text at 300 PPI mediocre resolution.

    You are just another clueless Obot. Obviously one who has never even looked at any of Obama’s many published birth certificate images. It’s refreshing to know that none of you Obots will have anything to offer for his defense.

  243. avatar
    aesthetocyst January 14, 2013 at 8:33 pm #

    justlw: (Did I miss any?)

    Copies appear on t-shirts and mugs. Quantities unknown.

    Did anyone verify them all for accuracy? What is one of those mugs is a non-duplicate copy? A duplicate-copy-certified-working-draft?

    At what point in the silliness does something finally go triplicate? Quadruple platinum?

  244. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy January 14, 2013 at 9:39 pm #

    That’s wrong on two counts. It was not the press secretary that “flashed” the birth certificate, it was Mr. Bauer.

    Second, the fact that Savannah Guthrie was able to photograph it up close, proves that it wasn’t merely flashed and removed. At least one reporter, and I have no reason to think only one, got an up close look. Guthrie stated that she felt the raised seal.

    So you’re reporting of things is worthless and detached from the evidence.

    Hermitian: The WH press secretary claimed to have only one at the podium. He flashed it from a distance and then removed it from the room before Obama arrived later.

  245. avatar
    aesthetocyst January 14, 2013 at 9:54 pm #

    Hermitian: If you consider binary monochrome text at 300 PPI mediocre resolution.

    Consider the source being scanned, yes, that is a very mediocre resolution, particularly when considering the color-depth, as you did. 300dpi greyscale would have been a vast improvement. 300dpi RGB even better.

    When scanning a document with such fine text (the preprinted field labels are ~6pt, the capitals are only 20px high) as a bitmap, 600 dpi is minimum.

    But again, it was scanned for web display and distribution, file size and legibility had to be balanced.

    “binary monochrome”? Could you be more out of touch?

  246. avatar
    justlw January 14, 2013 at 9:55 pm #

    Hermitian: The WH press secretary claimed to have only one at the podium.He flashed it from a distance and then removed it from the room before Obama arrived later.

    I may indeed be wrong about both copies being there. I may have gotten that impression from the “Huwaii” claims, of all things. My apologies.

    Hermitian: If you consider binary monochrome text at 300 PPI mediocre resolution.

    You are just another clueless Obot.Obviously one who has never even looked at any of Obama’s many published birth certificate images.It’s refreshing to know that none of you Obots will have anything to offer for his defense.

    We’re nothing but a pack of cards.

    Funny thing is, I don’t need to have anything to offer for his defense, because… no crime has been committed. No charges have been filed. And… we’re just these guys on the web, you know?

    Things would have been a lot less muddled if John Woodman had been asked to participate in the CCP. But that was never going to happen.

    The White House scan, of course, was not binary, monochrome, nor text. And yeah, 300 dpi is “mediocre” for the kind of things that people then try to read into it, such as TXE. There are higher resolution images available.

  247. avatar
    Dr Kenneth Noisewater January 14, 2013 at 10:01 pm #

    Hermitian: It’s been right in front of your nose for months and months.And it’s still there.

    Ah yes just as you did on Amazon claim you presented proof and when asked to show the proof you claim you will only show it to the proper people. Do you not see your contradiction?

  248. avatar
    Thomas Brown January 14, 2013 at 10:07 pm #

    No, no little Hermie. We have everything: credible reports of certified physical copies of the LFBC. Photographic and digital images of those copies. A certified COLB, the legally cognizable self-authenticating document. Birth announcements from the Hawaii Heath Dept. printed in not one but two newspapers. Two hundred court decisions. US Law, under which nothing his parents ever did or said could strip BHO’s NBC status and hence eligibility to be President. Sane Republicans call the idea that he is ineligible “absurd.” No members of Congress objected to a single Electoral vote for Obama. The Chief Justice swore him into office and will again, with that big SCOTUS smile on his face.

    He has never been impeached, and never will be. It’s surer than death and taxes that he won’t be due to ineligibility.
    So what have you got, little fella? Eh? No, not baseless accusations. Not made-up crap from the internet. PROOF.
    HARD, ACTUAL EVIDENCE.

    You ever heard the phrase “Whomp; there it is!” ? That’s how an argument is clinched: show what you got. You don’t show the cards, you get no pot.

    And you got nothin’.

  249. avatar
    justlw January 14, 2013 at 10:23 pm #

    Hermitian: I don’t know any Birthers who have one on their payroll.

    *cough* Zullo *cough*

  250. avatar
    aesthetocyst January 14, 2013 at 10:35 pm #

    Hermitian: wherever there is a forgery

    Again, a forgery lies where? As you say, where’s there’s a forgery there must be a forger. If there are no forgeries, then there are, at best, only potential, or wannabe forgers.

    Determination of the existence of a forgery comes first.

    We’re still waiting.

  251. avatar
    aesthetocyst January 14, 2013 at 10:39 pm #

    justlw: *cough* Zullo *cough*

    How much was that Hawaii tour again? Hehe.

    At least he’s smarter than the various other ‘freelance’ / ‘volunterr’ birforgers. Lucas. The guy that makes the super-crappy edited photos.

    Not to mention the various liars—er, forgers of truthiness …. which would be every birfer prophet who’s ever created or embellished a birfer meme.

  252. avatar
    CarlOrcas January 14, 2013 at 10:51 pm #

    Hermitian: In other words he has proof but he can’t show it to us.

    Actually he (through his staff and lawyers) says it’s been there right in front of our noses for four years.

    Sound familiar?

  253. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy January 14, 2013 at 11:42 pm #

    I don’t think Zullo is a forger, just one who passes forges documents as legitimate ones. Whether he knows or is just another birther dupe, I cannot say.

    justlw: *cough* Zullo *cough*

  254. avatar
    justlw January 15, 2013 at 12:28 am #

    aesthetocyst: The guy that makes the super-crappy edited photos.

    Oh, Cashill? He’s a gem.

  255. avatar
    G January 15, 2013 at 12:28 am #

    …And Obama has been running the country for 4 years – and is still there!

    Hermitian: It’s been right in front of your nose for months and months.And it’s still there.

  256. avatar
    justlw January 15, 2013 at 12:32 am #

    Dr. Conspiracy:
    I don’t think Zullo is a forger, just one who passes forges documents as legitimate ones. Whether he knows or is just another birther dupe, I cannot say.

    I guess since HHH’s comment was about people who “have one on their payroll”, the distinction would be who works for whom in the CCP/WND complex.

  257. avatar
    Keith January 15, 2013 at 1:34 am #

    Dr. Conspiracy:
    I don’t think Zullo is a forger, just one who passes forges documents as legitimate ones. Whether he knows or is just another birther dupe, I cannot say.

    The hell you say! You are accusing Zullo of uttering?!? Oh my gosh and golly! What a pickle. And all I want to do is ride my motor-sickle.

  258. avatar
    brygenon January 15, 2013 at 2:15 am #

    Hermitian: Then maybe you could explain why the MDEC attorneys produced two different LFCOLB PDF images rather than the two certified paper copies to a Federal District Court but produced the original paper letter from Onaka

    Why? To trounce the birthers of course. If you thought they were trying to appease your tantrums then you’ve misunderstood.

  259. avatar
    brygenon January 15, 2013 at 2:42 am #

    Hermitian: But I do know that wherever there is a forgery then there must be a forger.

    Ergo there is a forger in your imagination.

  260. avatar
    The Magic M January 15, 2013 at 6:15 am #

    Hermie, what exactly are we “misreading”?

    Let’s read the part you quoted, only the relevant words:

    “The department of health, upon request, shall furnish to any applicant, in lieu of the issuance of a certified copy, a verification of the existence of a certificate and any other information that the applicant provides to be verified [...]
    A verification shall be considered for all purposes certification that the vital event did occur and that the facts of the event are as stated by the applicant

    In even simpler words:

    Verification instead of a certified copy means:

    (1) Confirm that the birth took place

    (2) Confirm all data the applicant provides to be correct, if that is the case

    Which is exactly what Onaka did with his verifications.
    So what exactly did Onaka or we not understand?

    Hermitian: (a) Subject to the requirements of section 338-18, the department of health, upon request, shall furnish to any applicant, in lieu of the issuance of a certified copy, a verification of the existence of a certificate and any other information that the applicant provides to be verified relating to the vital event that pertains to the certificate.
    1. (b) A verification shall be considered for all purposes certification that the vital event did occur and that the facts of the event are as stated by the applicant.
    (c) Verification may be made in written, electronic, or other form approved by the director of health.
    (d) The fee for a verification in lieu of a certified copy shall be a maximum of one half of the fee established in section 338-14.5 for the first certified copy of a certificate issued.
    (e) Fees received for verifications in lieu of certified copies shall be remitted, and one half of the fee shall be deposited to the credit of the vital statistics improvement special fund in section 338-14.6 and the remainder of the fee shall be deposited to the credit of the state general fund. [L 2001, c 246, 1; am L 2010, c 55, 1]”

    It’s that “shall furnish” where you Obots are going off track. Onaka doesn’t get to pick and choose from his pile of bits and pieces of birth records. Maybe he should read his own regulations.

  261. avatar
    Paper January 15, 2013 at 9:34 am #

    Are you failing to read the rest of the text on purpose? The bits and pieces after “shall furnish”?

    …shall furnish…a verification of the existence of a certificate and any other information that the applicant provides to be verified…

    Note the part about the applicant providing other information to be verified. In other words, applicant doesn’t ask? Applicant does not receive. Which is why Arizona received no additional verification of Obama’s birth date.

    But then this post is about Mississippi, and that verification has no such concern.

    Note finally the words:

    “A verification shall be considered for all purposes certification that the vital event did occur and that the facts of the event are as stated by the applicant.”

    How do you get around that little detail?

    Hermitian:
    It’s that “shall furnish” where you Obots are going off track.Onaka doesn’t get to pick and choose from his pile of bits and pieces of birth records.

    “338-14.3 Verification in lieu of a certified copy. (a) Subject to the requirements of section 338-18, the department of health, upon request, shall furnish to any applicant, in lieu of the issuance of a certified copy, a verification of the existence of a certificate and any other information that the applicant provides to be verified relating to the vital event that pertains to the certificate.
    1. (b) A verification shall be considered for all purposes certification that the vital event did occur and that the facts of the event are as stated by the applicant.”

  262. avatar
    Paper January 15, 2013 at 10:02 am #

    One of a mere 62,611,250 plus.

    Just to start with, that’s how many things (read: votes) people in this country have to offer for his defense.

    I myself will be taking refreshment during this coming inauguration in less than a week.

    Why do you think you have the leverage to gloat?

    Hermitian:

    …just another clueless Obot….It’s refreshing to know that none of you Obots will have anything to offer for his defense.