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Waiting for Zullo

Flying Commando Cody from the movie serial Radar Men from the MoonThis is a compilation of things promised by, or information reasonably expected from Mike Zullo and the Cold Case Posse, that we are still waiting for. While Zullo uses phrases like “ongoing investigation,” from the beginning the Cold Case Posse has chosen to make its case before the public, and not before a jury. Therefore, there are significant questions outstanding from the court of public opinion:

  1. A list of crimes President Obama allegedly committed in the jurisdiction of Sheriff Arpaio.
  2. Any charges filed against President Obama.
  3. The transcript of phone the conversation with Verna K. Lee.
  4. The report of handwriting expert Reed Hayes.
  5. Copies of any vital statistics manuals that support the race code sets claimed by the Zullo in the press conference and YouTube videos.
  6. What title Zullo held as a municipal policeman, and precisely how long he was in that job and what were his duties.
  7. How many Selective Service registration forms did the CCP examine in determining that two-digit years never appear.
  8. The results of tests of Xerox WorkCentre 7655 scanning a birth certificate compared to the White House PDF of President Obama’s certificate.
  9. A motive for the President to forge his birth certificate, when the State of Hawaii verifies everything on it.
  10. Explanation of why he considers the 1960 vital statistics manual materially different from the 1961 manual on the question of race coding.
  11. What was in the “secret” breakout session for the  Constitutional Peace Officers convention, and why it’s secret.
  12. Financial report of the income and expenses of the 501(c)(3) non-profit Cold Case Posse.
  13. Explanation of why the Cold Case Posse is not registered as a non-profit with the State of Arizona.
  14. Explanation of how Zullo has “personal knowledge” (as stated in his sworn affidavit) of things he only read about.
  15. Release of the conclusive proof that will “convince even the greatest skeptic,” “evidence beyond a reasonable doubt” he mentioned in January of 2013.
  16. Explanation of how Zullo had “verified” the Cold Case Posse findings
  17. Exactly who is on the Cold Case Posse “investigating” Obama’s birth certificate and what are their qualifications.
  18. A statement of how much money Zullo received for the book he and Corsi jointly wrote.
  19. A statement of how much of the Cold Case Posse reports were written by persons not on the Posse, and their names.
  20. An explanation of why Mike Zullo pressured Mark Gillar not to debate Frank Arduini on his radio show.
  21. An explanation of why Mike Zullo pressured John Sampson not to testify for Orly Taitz in Indiana.
  22. A disclosure of all financial dealings between Mike Zullo and WorldNetDaily.
  23. The results of interviews by the Cold Case Posse of the White House press corps members who personally viewed the President’s original long form birth certificate.
  24. Documentation of the foreign-born children of foreign nationals having Hawaiian birth certificates that Zullo claims to have.
  25. Results of the IRS investigation into the tax-exempt status of the Cold Case Posse as the result of the June 2012 complaint.
  26. The results of contacts between the CCP and the Hawaii Department of Health.
  27. The documentation of two children who were allegedly listed as newborns in the Honolulu newspapers who were actually 3 years old at the time.
  28. Documentation of the foreign born children listed in Department of Health birth announcements in the Obama birth time frame.
  29. What are the names and the credentials of the “computer graphics experts” and “forensic document examiners” consulted by the Posse in 2012?
  30. Why was John Woodman rebuffed when he offered to present technical information to the Posse?
  31. What was the response of the Postal Service regarding two-digit date images on postmarks?
  32. What was the response of the Selective Service regarding two-digit date images on postmarks?
  33. What was the response of the White House to Cold Case Posse requests as to the details of how the President’s long form birth certificate was scanned and processed for release to the public?
  34. Who is the investigation’s "person of interest?"
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436 Responses to Waiting for Zullo

  1. avatar
    richCares July 6, 2013 at 11:41 am #

    how dare you question Zullo, why his performance was so impressive that he went from Lt. direct to Commander without doing the intermediate step of Captain. This is like jumping to the 8th grade from 5th grade, an amazing feat. He fully deserves our complete lack of respect. More than likely he went from Lt. to Clown to Commander. The only title he fully deserves is “Clown”!

  2. avatar
    scott e July 6, 2013 at 11:44 am #

    this is a terrific list. and you say you’re not well organized… lol

  3. avatar
    scott e July 6, 2013 at 11:45 am #

    richCares:
    how dare you question Zullo, why his performance was so impressive that he went from Lt. direct to Commander without doing the intermediate step of Captain. This is like jumping to the 8th grade from 5th grade, an amazing feat. He fully deserves our complete lack of respect. More than likely he went from Lt. to Clown to Commander. The only title he fully deserves is “Clown”!

    why should he bother you like that rC ??

  4. avatar
    Curious George July 6, 2013 at 12:02 pm #

    Do ccp members get paid?

  5. avatar
    dunstvangeet July 6, 2013 at 12:06 pm #

    Curious George:
    Do ccp members get paid?

    Alledgely, no. However, they apparently get unmarked police cars, and gas paid for by the County.

  6. avatar
    CarlOrcas July 6, 2013 at 12:07 pm #

    O ye of little faith!! Don’t you understand it’s all going to come together……any day now……and then the posse will be at the gates of the White House to arrest the usurper. Honest.

    In the meantime please send your generous contribution to the super secret, super secure posse mail drop:

    MCSO Cold-Case Posse
    P.O. Box 74374
    Phoenix, Arizona 85087

    I know, I know…..it looks like a UPS store but that’s just part of the plan.

    Any day now.

  7. avatar
    CarlOrcas July 6, 2013 at 12:16 pm #

    Curious George:
    Do ccp members get paid?

    No. No posse members are paid.

    Here’s a page on the MCSO website with some information that may help you with the questions you have:

    http://www.mcso.org/About/Posse.aspx

    Our of curiosity……why did you come here to ask questions like this rather than go right to the source?

  8. avatar
    Curious George July 6, 2013 at 12:23 pm #

    Alledgely, no. However, they apparently get unmarked police cars, and gas paid for by the County.

    Wouldn’t county cars and gas be paid by county taxes? I heard no tax dollars were being used. Is this true?

  9. avatar
    Dave B. July 6, 2013 at 12:28 pm #

    I seem to recall Zullo promising, while answering questions during the first pep rally, that mailman Allen Hulton’s “information” was going to be developed. I’d like to ask him some pointed questions about that one.
    I’d like to know who decided he’d make an ideal Head Duck-weigher for this particular witch hunt, and why. And exactly whose idea it was to use Mara Zebest, and how they justified it.
    I’d like to know if their specific intention was to produce nothing but a bunch of inadmissible nonsense, or if that’s just how it turned out.
    And in light of Brian Reilly’s recent confessions, I’d like for Zullo to come to Jesus about all use of Maricopa County resources by the CCCP– any office space or supplies, vehicles, meals, whatever.

  10. avatar
    Curious George July 6, 2013 at 12:29 pm #

    Our of curiosity……why did you come here to ask questions like this rather than go right to the source?

    Look at the list of questions that have no answers from the source.

  11. avatar
    Whatever4 July 6, 2013 at 12:34 pm #

    dunstvangeet: Alledgely, no.However, they apparently get unmarked police cars, and gas paid for by the County.

    And why did Brian Reilly say he had driven around to 8 states on CCP business? What did he investigate?

  12. avatar
    CarlOrcas July 6, 2013 at 12:46 pm #

    Curious George: I heard no tax dollars were being used. Is this true?

    That’s what Arpaio and Zullo have claimed at various times.

  13. avatar
    CarlOrcas July 6, 2013 at 12:50 pm #

    Curious George:
    Our of curiosity……why did you come here to ask questions like this rather than go right to the source?

    Look at the list of questions that have no answers from the source.

    What list are you talking about? Doc’s? The one in this thread or another one?

    I was just curious why you didn’t go right to the MCSO site to try and answer your questions about how the posse operates.

  14. avatar
    alg July 6, 2013 at 1:26 pm #

    With apologies to Samuel Beckett:

    “Let us do something, while we have the chance! It is not every day that we are needed. Not indeed that we personally are needed. Others would meet the case equally well, if not better. To all mankind they were addressed, those cries for help still ringing in our ears! But at this place, at this moment of time, all mankind is us, whether we like it or not. Let us make the most of it, before it is too late! Let us represent worthily for one the foul brood to which a cruel fate consigned us! What do you say? It is true that when with folded arms we weigh the pros and cons we are no less a credit to our species. The tiger bounds to the help of his congeners without the least reflexion, or else he slinks away into the depths of the thickets. But that is not the question. What are we doing here, that is the question. And we are blessed in this, that we happen to know the answer. Yes, in the immense confusion one thing alone is clear. We are waiting for Zullo to come — ”

  15. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy July 6, 2013 at 2:10 pm #

    Yes, that was the inspiration for the title.

    alg: … We are waiting for Zullo to come

  16. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy July 6, 2013 at 2:50 pm #

    Well, I just scanned back through my articles here and skimmed the high points. While the Obots are not organized as a group, this web site is, I think, pretty well organized.

    http://www.obamaconspiracy.org/category/whoswho/mike-zullo/

    I particularly avoided look at Arduini’s “Annotated Zullo” because I thought it would be too easy.

    scott e: this is a terrific list. and you say you’re not well organized… lol

  17. avatar
    Curious George July 6, 2013 at 3:27 pm #

    The ones listed in this thread.

  18. avatar
    Julius B Censor July 6, 2013 at 3:45 pm #

    I see you let loose another wordy salvo today, attacking Mike Zullo and the good-faith efforts of the Maricopa County Cold Case Posse. Some day someone will add up all the time and effort that you have expended on defending the unusual inaction of the pretensident while demeaning the efforts of those who seek the simplest corroboration of his “narrative.”

    Hour after hour pours into word after word that goes into sentence after sentence comprising paragraph after paragraph and numbered list after numbered list into blog post after blog post making day after day of week after week of month after month of year after year of you and your minions going on and on and on about how the president should be allowed to get away with using inadmissible evidence to prove his bona fides.

    In light of the fact that the president could clear the whole thing with two minutes of forthright adult conduct, casual observers can easily conclude that the pretensident considers Kevin Davidson’s time and effort to be worthless. Why else would he let you squander your precious remaining time on earth in such a frivolous pursuit? After all, signing a waiver to allow access to the birth record originals could be done in the same time it takes to sign a golf score-card.

    Sadly, the pretensident considers Kevin Davidson just another plaything. And even Kevin Davidson will eventually see it.

  19. avatar
    Paul July 6, 2013 at 4:10 pm #

    I was just curious why you didn’t go right to the MCSO site to try and answer your questions about how the posse operates.

    Ummm…. because they lie like mofos…?

  20. avatar
    dunstvangeet July 6, 2013 at 4:46 pm #

    Curious George:
    Alledgely, no. However, they apparently get unmarked police cars, and gas paid for by the County.

    Wouldn’t county cars and gas be paid by county taxes? I heard no tax dollars were being used. Is this true?

    That’s false.

    Arpaio sent a deputy to Hawaii to accompy the Cold Case Posse, paid him salary and overtime for being there, as well as paid for his plane ticket, meals and other things that you would expect. The Cold Case Posse offered about half of the money that it cost the county, but the county refused it basically seeing it as a precedent of a private corporation paying for the use of a police officer.

    Members of the Cold Case Posse have said that they got unmarked police cars for use on Posse business, as well as cards to be used for gas, all paid with Taxpayer money.

    I’m sure there are other examples, but these are the two that jump out at me right away.

  21. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy July 6, 2013 at 4:53 pm #

    It is my desire to prevent others from falling into the delusions of which you suffer that motivates me to continue my quest for truth, justice, reason and critical thinking.

    There has never been anything remotely resembling “good faith” from the Cold Case Posse. The whole thing started as a right-wing political publicity stunt by WorldNetDaily and the local Tea Party. In furtherance of the smear campaign they lied, they misled and they fabricated evidence. They have left a string of disproven claims behind them. To date they have not come up with one single shred of evidence that there is anything to their politically-motivated investigation. They produce nothing but a lengthening string of unanswered questions.

    What American patriot could help but be outraged by their conduct? If Zullo were man enough to debate, this might play out differently, but he is not.

    Julius B Censor: I see you let loose another wordy salvo today, attacking Mike Zullo and the good-faith efforts of the Maricopa County Cold Case Posse. Some day someone will add up all the time and effort that you have expended on defending the unusual inaction of the pretensident while demeaning the efforts of those who seek the simplest corroboration of his “narrative.”

  22. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy July 6, 2013 at 5:15 pm #

    Wow! What have YOU been smoking?

    Julius B Censor: In light of the fact that the president could clear the whole thing with two minutes of forthright adult conduct,

  23. avatar
    CarlOrcas July 6, 2013 at 5:19 pm #

    Julius B Censor: Hour after hour pours into word after word that goes into sentence after sentence comprising paragraph after paragraph,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

    Oh the irony!

  24. avatar
    CarlOrcas July 6, 2013 at 5:21 pm #

    Julius B Censor: In light of the fact that the president could clear the whole thing with two minutes of forthright adult conduct…………….

    What could the President say, or do, in two minutes that would clear things up for you?

  25. avatar
    Julius B Censor July 6, 2013 at 5:29 pm #

    Thanks for at least considering the proposition that the president considers your time worthless.

  26. avatar
    aarrgghh July 6, 2013 at 5:35 pm #

    CarlOrcas (to julius b): What could the President say, or do, in two minutes that would clear things up for you?

    confess and resign of course! we’ll also accept trial and execution but that might take three minutes.

    <birf/>

  27. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy July 6, 2013 at 5:37 pm #

    I sincerely doubt that Barack Obama had ever heard of me.

    Julius B Censor: Thanks for at least considering the proposition that the president considers your time worthless.

  28. avatar
    richCares July 6, 2013 at 5:46 pm #

    “why should he bother you like that rC ??”
    /
    are you kidding, Zullo is a lying political hack, a make believe cop with a political agenda, that is bad, vey bad, he deserves ridicule, fom his made up codig to his lack of real investigating. He made no attempt to contact Savannah Guthrie on her photo of the BC, he contacted no member of the press that viewed the original, he made no attempt to view the original at the white house, instead he download a pdf copy from the internet and called it a fraud. Zullo is the real fraud.

  29. avatar
    misha marinsky July 6, 2013 at 5:53 pm #

    Julius B Censor: In light of the fact that the president could clear the whole thing with two minutes of forthright adult conduct

    You want adult conduct?! OK – Why aren’t you concerned about Glenn Beck, who raped and murdered a girl? It’s all here:

    http://didglennbeckrapeandmurderagirl.blogspot.com/

    Where did Mitt Romney bury the girl he strangled in 1987? Why aren’t you investigating that?

    Answer me. Then, maybe I’ll tell you what I know about President Obama’s birth circumstances.

    Deal?

  30. avatar
    sfjeff July 6, 2013 at 5:58 pm #

    I am no one’s minion.

    I prefer the term ‘co-conspirator’, though truth seeker works even better.

  31. avatar
    Daniel July 6, 2013 at 6:03 pm #

    Julius B Censor: how the president should be allowed to get away with using inadmissible evidence to prove his bona fides.

    Why do you hate America and the Constitution?

  32. avatar
    Bob July 6, 2013 at 6:12 pm #

    Julius: B Censor Some day someone will . . .

    I think you mean “any day now.”

  33. avatar
    donna July 6, 2013 at 6:50 pm #

    Julius B Censor: how the president should be allowed to get away with using inadmissible evidence to prove his bona fides.

    per favore, kindly post the “inadmissible evidence” obama and other defendants used to win EVERY lawsuit

    grazie mille

  34. avatar
    Dr Kenneth Noisewater July 6, 2013 at 7:50 pm #

    Julius B Censor:
    I see you let loose another wordy salvo today, attacking Mike Zullo and the good-faith efforts of the Maricopa County Cold Case Posse. Some day someone will add up all the time and effort that you have expended on defending the unusual inaction of the pretensident while demeaning the efforts of those who seek the simplest corroboration of his “narrative.”

    Hour after hour pours into word after word that goes into sentence after sentence comprising paragraph after paragraph and numbered list after numbered list into blog post after blog post making day after day of week after week of month after month of year after year of you and your minions going on and on and on about how the president should be allowed to get away with using inadmissible evidence to prove his bona fides.

    In light of the fact that the president could clear the whole thing with two minutesof forthright adult conduct, casual observers can easily conclude that the pretensident considers Kevin Davidson’s time and effort to be worthless. Why else would he let you squander your precious remaining time on earth in such a frivolous pursuit? After all, signing a waiver to allow access to the birth record originals could be done in the same time it takes to sign a golf score-card.

    Sadly, the pretensident considers Kevin Davidson just another plaything. And even Kevin Davidson will eventually see it.

    Do you even know what the words you use even mean? Zullo never made a good faith effort in fact their entire “investigation” has been entirely based in bad faith starting from their avoidance of not even bothering to contact anyone who could directly contradict their claims starting with Hawaii, Savannah Guthrie, Ivan Zatkovich, Dr Krawetz, or any number of people who actually looked at the claims.

    Yes it was entirely unusual for the President to show his birth certificate going back to 2008 considering no president before him had showed their birth certificate publicly. Obama was under no obligation to show it in the first place and yet he did anyway.

    You continue to show yourself to be a fool who argues in bad faith.

  35. avatar
    Jim July 6, 2013 at 7:59 pm #

    Julius B Censor:
    In light of the fact that the president could clear the whole thing with two minutes of forthright adult conduct.

    Really? How does adult conduct against a backdrop of birthers hanging on to every lie and made up fantasy they can find compare? How does the birther childish antics match up against the State of Hawaii, who has been totally consistent throughout? How does that match up with Zullo being caught in multiple lies and then saying “I’m taking my report home and you can’t see it” and then expecting people to believe any of the BS he’s pushing to scam you?

    Julius B Censor:
    After all, signing a waiver to allow access to the birth record originals could be done in the same time it takes to sign a golf score-card.

    Interesting Julius, why don’t you run down to your local Department of Health (or whatever department your state uses) and ask them for a waiver that allows release of all YOUR records? Wait, they’re not YOUR records? They belong to the state and not you? Amazing, you might want to check up on that.

    Besides, we already know that you and the rest of the birthers don’t really care anyway, so hold your breath until January 20, 2017 and see if anyone really cares if you turn blue.

  36. avatar
    dunstvangeet July 6, 2013 at 8:02 pm #

    Julius B Censor: In light of the fact that the president could clear the whole thing with two minutes of forthright adult conduct, casual observers can easily conclude that the pretensident considers Kevin Davidson’s time and effort to be worthless.

    Nice trolling. However, please explain exactly what those two minutes of forthright adult conduct would be? What would it be? Because every adult conduct that he has done, you’ve considered it to be not adequate and just demand more?

    How about posting his birth certificate up on his website for all the world to see? He did this in June of 2008. You decided that it was not enough, that it was a forgery, and therefore didn’t actulaly mean anything. You then claim that if he’d just release his long-form, everything would go away.

    How about walking into the White House Press corps, with the document that his critics have said that is his “real birth certificate”, holding it up in front of camera, passing it around the press Room, and then allowing anybody who wanted touch it? He did this in April of 2011. You guys claim that he forged it.

    Now, please tell me, supported by not only national law, but by Hawaiian Law, exactly what President Obama should do to satisfy you. And please show where in Hawaiian Law does it state that it’s possible for him to do. What will it take for him to satisfy you personally?

    Why else would he let you squander your precious remaining time on earth in such a frivolous pursuit? After all, signing a waiver to allow access to the birth record originals could be done in the same time it takes to sign a golf score-card.

    Please show me in Hawaiian Law where it allows him to do this? Name the administrative rule, or the Hawaiian Revised Statute. Please be specific. Someone can’t just waive their privacy, and have the Hawaii Department of Health grant them access to the originals. This has to be outlined in Hawaiian law to be possible. Hawaii is a nation of laws, which the President has absolutely no control over. None of those laws allow the President to do what you want. Prove me wrong by quoting the exact chapter and verse of the law.

  37. avatar
    W. Kevin Vicklund July 6, 2013 at 9:22 pm #

    Julius B Censor: After all, signing a waiver to allow access to the birth record originals could be done in the same time it takes to sign a golf score-card.

    And that waiver would gain you the same amount of access to the birth record originals as the golf score-card. Not even the President is allowed access to the originals.

    And even if he could sign a waiver, you’d have to track down the other 499 people whose original birth records are contained in that volume and get a waiver or proof of death for each of them. Good luck with that!

  38. avatar
    Reality Check July 6, 2013 at 9:58 pm #

    A recent case in Hawaii, Wolf v Fuddy, addressed this. According to the court the birth records belong to the DoH and not the individual. President Obama could give a certified copy of his short form to anyone he chooses but neither he nor anyone else other than the DoH has access to the original records.

    Julius B Censor: After all, signing a waiver to allow access to the birth record originals could be done in the same time it takes to sign a golf score-card.

  39. avatar
    dunstvangeet July 6, 2013 at 10:13 pm #

    Julius B Censor: the president should be allowed to get away with using inadmissible evidence to prove his bona fides.

    Please show me exactly what the Admissible evidence is? If you’re talking about the birth certificate, it is admissible, and has been admitted in various courts. One court specifically mentioned that it was the only thing that the birthers presented that was actually admissible. The COLB that he released in June of 2008 specifically mentions that it’s “prima facie evidence in any court”, and has been verified by the Hawaii Department of Health that it is “a valid Hawaii state birth certificate.”

    If there ever was a hearing on the merits, all Obama would have to do is present the same documentation that Obama produced over 5 years ago. He’d then say, “I rest my case” and walk out. The judge would have no choice but to admit the “valid Hawaii state birth certificate” as prima facie evidence of the place of birth. He’d then goto the birthers, and ask them if they have any evidence that specifically contradicts that. After sifting through that, he’d find the exact same thing that the Adminstrative court judge in Georgia that the only thing admissible would be the birth certificate, and then rule that Obama was born in the United States.

  40. avatar
    Steve July 6, 2013 at 10:16 pm #

    misha marinsky: You want adult conduct?! OK – Why aren’t you concerned about Glenn Beck, who raped and murdered a girl? It’s all here:

    http://didglennbeckrapeandmurderagirl.blogspot.com/

    Where did Mitt Romney bury the girl he strangled in 1987? Why aren’t you investigating that?

    Answer me. Then, maybe I’ll tell you what I know about President Obama’s birth circumstances.

    Deal?

    Yeah, and how do we know that Julius is not Mel Torme?

  41. avatar
    Benji Franklin July 7, 2013 at 1:46 am #

    Julius B Censor: Some day someone will add up all the time and effort that you have expended on defending the unusual inaction of the pretensident while demeaning the efforts of those who seek the simplest corroboration of his “narrative.”

    We aren’t defending the President from the intellectually vacuous and naively invented Birther bowel movements which comprise the silly arguments challenging Obama’s Presidential eligibility, because no one in their right mind seriously doubts his eligibility.

    We’re defending the English Language and the American people who rely on its sensible use for their enlightenment, from your politically motivated attempt to make it practically meaningless as you spread endless Birther lies.

  42. avatar
    richCares July 7, 2013 at 2:33 am #

    Julius says “Some day someone will add up all the time and effort that you have expended on defending the unusual inaction of the pretensident”
    .
    No one here has a problem with people not liking our president, if you are against Obama for political reason no problems with us.
    .
    However this birther stuff is ridiculous. We don’t defend him on this silly issue, we laugh at silly birthers like you for your delusions and total lack of credibility, Obama showed his papers, courts consider that a done deal, and when Obama leaves office in 2017 he will find streets, buildings, and naval ships named after him (in honor). Where will you be in history (most likely a trash can)

  43. avatar
    jtmunkus July 7, 2013 at 3:17 am #

    Excellent list, Doc. Except for a detailed accounting of all the county money being spent on this charade.

    We know there are Crown Vics, county gas credit cards, trip(s) to Hawai’i with real officer(s), and Zullo said he’s got an office at MCSO downtown (in a posh office building where asshole Arpaio squanders yet more tax dollars). So are there county cell phones? General expense credit cards? County-paid junkets to conventions with the fake sheriff Mack and the anarchist with a badge Kessler? Office supplies? Who pays for the 12-hour calls to Butterdezillionaire & Lunatic Joy Adams & Alf Hendershot?

    The reason Sheriff Joe doesn’t want to get voted out of office, besides keeping the grift flowing, is that if he’s alive after his 21-year pilfering of Maricopa County, he knows he’ll get his ass thrown into Pink Tent City when all the books are straightened out.

    The reason Zullo keeps his grift alive, is because all the moron racist rubes like Jesus H. Censor who are so aroused by the CCP that they even give it their hard earned (entitlement?) money.

  44. avatar
    nbc July 7, 2013 at 4:06 am #

    Julius B Censor: I see you let loose another wordy salvo today, attacking Mike Zullo and the good-faith efforts of the Maricopa County Cold Case Posse.

    Good faith efforts. Now that is a somewhat ironic description of their work. Have they looked at the Xerox workcentre yet which has been identified as the ‘forger’?

    Zullo et al are just Arpaio’s little distraction to keep the tea baggers of his back, nothing more, nothing less. Arpaio knows very well that there is nothing that merits criminal charges or a congressional investigation

    Our president has provided more than is necessary to show himself eligible.
    For some that is apparently not enough… Such fools…

  45. avatar
    Jason Swenson July 7, 2013 at 8:09 am #

    Julius B Censor: In light of the fact that the president could clear the whole thing with two minutes of forthright adult conduct, casual observers can easily conclude that the pretensident considers Kevin Davidson’s time and effort to be worthless. Why else would he let you squander your precious remaining time on earth in such a frivolous pursuit? After all, signing a waiver to allow access to the birth record originals could be done in the same time it takes to sign a golf score-card.

    Another birther lie.

    A) the president does not own the original lfbc.
    B) There is nothing to end.
    C) The COLB was sufficient to prove birthers wrong.
    D) Anyone following this would know that birthers would move the goal posts again. In fact Corsi already laid the groundwork for the next lie by claiming that an alleged insider told him that a forgery using 1960s materials had been planted in the HDOH.

    Who are you kidding? And by what authority are you making ridiculous demands?

  46. avatar
    realist July 7, 2013 at 8:23 am #

    Julius B Censor: After all, signing a waiver to allow access to the birth record originals could be done in the same time it takes to sign a golf score-card.

    Except by law he can’t do that. It’s not his record. His is the certified copies.

    Besides, if past is prologue, it would not matter. Excuses have already been made by ignorant birthers in the event HI were ordered to permit viewing of the original records… you know, like, it’s a forgery.

  47. avatar
    scott e July 7, 2013 at 1:17 pm #

    Dr. Conspiracy:
    Yes, that was the inspiration for the title.

    godot ? (beckett) jablonski… LOL

  48. avatar
    Joey July 7, 2013 at 1:54 pm #

    This birth certificate “issue” is irrelevant when the federal government considers a U.S. Passport to be the preferred form of evidence of citizenship and establishing identity. And a U.S. Passport showing birth in the US establishes “natural born citizenship.”

    The Law Of The Land:
    PRIMARY EVIDENCE of US Citizenship is established by an undamaged US Passport or undamaged previous passports.
    A birth certificate is secondary evidence of citizenship.

    42 CFR 435.407 – Types of acceptable documentary evidence of citizenship.

    435.407
    Types of acceptable documentary evidence of citizenship.
    For purposes of this section, the term “citizenship” includes status as a “national of the United States” as defined by section 101(a)(22) of the Immigration and Nationality Act (8 U.S.C. 1101(a)(22)) to include both citizens of the United States and non-citizen nationals of the United States.
    (a) Primary evidence of citizenship and identity. The following evidence must be accepted as satisfactory documentary evidence of both identity and citizenship:
    (1) A U.S. passport. The Department of State issues this. A U.S. passport does not have to be currently valid to be accepted as evidence of U.S. citizenship, as long as it was originally issued without limitation. Note: Spouses and children were sometimes included on one passport through 1980. U.S. passports issued after 1980 show only one person. Consequently, the citizenship and identity of the included person can be established when one of these passports is presented. Exception: Do not accept any passport as evidence of U.S. citizenship when it was issued with a limitation. However, such a passport may be used as proof of identity.
    (2) A Certificate of Naturalization (DHS Forms N-550 or N-570.) Department of Homeland Security issues for naturalization.
    (3) A Certificate of U.S. Citizenship (DHS Forms N-560 or N-561.) Department of Homeland Security issues certificates of citizenship to individuals who derive citizenship through a parent.
    (4) A valid State-issued driver’s license, but only if the State issuing the license requires proof of U.S. citizenship before issuance of such license or obtains a social security number from the applicant and verifies before certification that such number is valid and assigned to the applicant who is a citizen. (This provision is not effective until such time as a State makes providing evidence of citizenship a condition of issuing a driver’s license and evidence that the license holder is a citizen is included on the license or in a system of records available to the Medicaid agency. The State must ensure that the process complies with this statutory provision in section 6036 of the Deficit Reduction Act of 2005. CMS will monitor compliance of States implementing this provision.).

    (b) Secondary evidence of citizenship. If primary evidence from the list in paragraph (a) of this section is unavailable, an applicant or recipient should provide satisfactory documentary evidence of citizenship from the list specified in this section to establish citizenship and satisfactory documentary evidence from paragraph (e) of this section to establish identity, in accordance with the rules specified in this section.
    (1) A U.S. public birth certificate showing birth in one of the 50 States, the District of Columbia, Puerto Rico (if born on or after January 13, 1941), Guam (on or after April 10, 1899), the Virgin Islands of the U.S. (on or after January 17, 1917), American Samoa, Swain’s Island, or the Northern Mariana Islands (after November 4, 1986 (NMI local time)).
    [excerted]

  49. avatar
    Ms D July 7, 2013 at 5:52 pm #

    IF Barack’s birth parents are who he’s stated they were – here was the law at the time of his ‘supposed’ birth – “Obama was born of a father who was a British subject/citizen and Obama himself was the same.” “Here is the law per FindLaw.com that applied at the time of his birth—IF his parents were legally married
    4. December 24, 1952 to November 13, 1986: If ONLY ONE PARENT was a U.S. CITIZEN AT THE TIME OF YOUR BIRTH, that parent MUST HAVE RESIDED IN the United States for at least TEN YEARS, at least FIVE OF WHICH HAD TO BE AFTER THE AGE OF 16. If the above law is found to be the correct law applying at the time of the birth of BaraCk Obama, he is legally not qualified to hold the office of President.” Stanley Ann Dunham was ‘supposedly’ 18 at the time of Barack’s ‘supposed birth’.

  50. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy July 7, 2013 at 6:05 pm #

    That law only applies to persons born outside the United States. Barack Obama was born a citizen in the United States.

    Thanks for playing.

    Ms D: IF Barack’s birth parents are who he’s stated they were – here was the law at the time of his ‘supposed’ birth – “Obama was born of a father who was a British subject/citizen and Obama himself was the same.” “Here is the law per FindLaw.com that applied at the time of his birth—IF his parents were legally married
    4. December 24, 1952 to November 13, 1986: If ONLY ONE PARENT was a U.S. CITIZEN AT THE TIME OF YOUR BIRTH, that parent MUST HAVE RESIDED IN the United States for at least TEN YEARS, at least FIVE OF WHICH HAD TO BE AFTER THE AGE OF 16. If the above law is found to be the correct law applying at the time of the birth of BaraCk Obama, he is legally not qualified to hold the office of President.” Stanley Ann Dunham was ‘supposedly’ 18 at the time of Barack’s ‘supposed birth’.

  51. avatar
    Dave B. July 7, 2013 at 6:21 pm #

    Gosh, that changes everything!

    Ms D:
    IF Barack’s birth parents are who he’s stated they were – here was the law at the time of his ‘supposed’ birth – “Obama was born of a father who was a British subject/citizen and Obama himself was the same.” “Here is the law per FindLaw.com that applied at the time of his birth—IF his parents were legally married
    4. December 24, 1952 to November 13, 1986: If ONLY ONE PARENT was a U.S. CITIZEN AT THE TIME OF YOUR BIRTH, that parent MUST HAVE RESIDED IN the United States for at least TEN YEARS, at least FIVE OF WHICH HAD TO BE AFTER THE AGE OF 16. If the above law is found to be the correct law applying at the time of the birth of BaraCk Obama, he is legally not qualified to hold the office of President.”Stanley Ann Dunham was ‘supposedly’ 18 at the time of Barack’s ‘supposed birth’.

  52. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy July 7, 2013 at 6:26 pm #

    Added:

    34. Who is the investigation’s “person of interest?”

  53. avatar
    Joey July 7, 2013 at 6:51 pm #

    Ms D:
    IF Barack’s birth parents are who he’s stated they were – here was the law at the time of his ‘supposed’ birth – “Obama was born of a father who was a British subject/citizen and Obama himself was the same.” “Here is the law per FindLaw.com that applied at the time of his birth—IF his parents were legally married
    4. December 24, 1952 to November 13, 1986: If ONLY ONE PARENT was a U.S. CITIZEN AT THE TIME OF YOUR BIRTH, that parent MUST HAVE RESIDED IN the United States for at least TEN YEARS, at least FIVE OF WHICH HAD TO BE AFTER THE AGE OF 16. If the above law is found to be the correct law applying at the time of the birth of BaraCk Obama, he is legally not qualified to hold the office of President.”Stanley Ann Dunham was ‘supposedly’ 18 at the time of Barack’s ‘supposed birth’.

    As Doc. C. Already pointed out, that law only applied to children born outside of the US. Barack Obama was born in Hawaii.

    Several court rulings have already clarified the issue. Here’s one of many rulings:
    Purpura & Moran v Obama: New Jersey Administrative Law Judge Jeff S. Masin: “No court, federal, state or administrative, has accepted the challengers’ position that Mr. Obama is not a “natural born Citizen” due to the acknowledged fact that his father was born in Kenya and was a British citizen by virtue of the then applicable British Nationality Act. Nor has the fact that Obama had, or may have had, dual citizenship at the time of his birth and thereafter been held to deny him the status of natural born. It is unnecessary to reinvent the wheel here. … The petitioners’ legal position on this issue, however well intentioned, has no merit in law. Thus, accepting for the point of this issue that Mr. Obama was born in Hawaii, he is a ‘natural born Citizen’ regardless of the status of his father.” April 10, 2012
    http://www.scribd.com/doc/88936737/2012-04-10-NJ-Purpura-Moran-v-Obama-Initial-Decision-of-ALJ-Masin-Apuzzo

  54. avatar
    gorefan July 7, 2013 at 6:54 pm #

    Ms D: IF Barack’s birth parents are who he’s stated they were

    Here is the law that you cite.

    1952 Immigration and Nationality Act

    The part that covers President Obama is Title III Chapter 1 Section 301 (a) (1) a person born in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof;

    The part you are citing which does not apply, is Title III Chapter 1 Section 301 (a) (7).

  55. avatar
    misha marinsky July 7, 2013 at 7:03 pm #

    Ms D: IF Barack’s birth parents are who he’s stated they were – here was the law at the time of his ‘supposed’ birth

    You should refuse to pay your taxes.

  56. avatar
    Loren July 7, 2013 at 8:20 pm #

    Waaaay back in March 2012, after the first Posse press conference, I put together this list of things they either hinted at in their statements or *should* have addressed but didn’t. Most of these holes in their public presentations remain unfilled; the only two items that *have* been addressed (and which I removed below) involved postman Allen Hulton and the 1961 INS records. Both of which, oddly enough, were specifically investigated not by any actual Posse members, but by Jerome Corsi.

    Anyhow, here’s my old list of Posse unanswered questions:

    - The names of the posse members.

    - The names of their ‘multiple’ experts.

    - Copies of the multiple affidavits they kept referring to.

    - Specifics about the “dozens”(?) of interviews they supposedly conducted.

    - Information about their individual forgery suspect (is it “Mike”?)

    - Some kind of operating hypothesis as to who they’re accusing of forgery, if not Obama. Administration officials? Hawaiian officials?

    - Discussion of the birth announcements and index data, including those counter-examples it was specifically stated they possessed.

    - An explanation for why the FOIA-obtained August 1961 memo referring to Obama’s Honolulu birth isn’t trustworthy.

    - An explanation for the correspondence showing Obama requesting the long-form, and the Hawaii DoH webpage. Also, the two press releases by the DoH prior to the long-form’s release.

    - An explanation of why the COLB isn’t trustworthy.

  57. avatar
    Arthur July 7, 2013 at 11:32 pm #

    Julius B Censor: I see you let loose another wordy salvo today, attacking Mike Zullo and the good-faith efforts of the Maricopa County Cold Case Posse. Some day someone will add up all the time and effort that you have expended on defending the unusual inaction of the pretensident while demeaning the efforts of those who seek the simplest corroboration of his “narrative.”

    It appears that “Julius B. Censor” is Kenneth Olsen, operator of the Lysander Spooner “Law School.” Here’s the original passage which he posted on his website the same day it appeared here:

    “Kevin Davidson let loose another wordy salvo today, attacking Mike Zullo and the good-faith efforts of the Maricopa County Cold Case Posse. Some day someone will add up all the time and effort that the unusual Mr. Davidson has expended on defending the unusual inaction of the pretensident while demeaning the efforts of those who seek the simplest corroboration of his ‘narrative.’”

    http://www.lysanderspoonerlawschool.org/index.php?option=com_content&view=category&id=20&Itemid=183

  58. avatar
    James M July 8, 2013 at 12:43 am #

    dunstvangeet Obama was born in the United States.

    Don’t the majority of birthers believe that anyway? I thought the Donofrio birthers outnumbered the Berg birthers.

  59. avatar
    dunstvangeet July 8, 2013 at 3:07 am #

    James M: Don’t the majority of birthers believe that anyway?I thought the Donofrio birthers outnumbered the Berg birthers.

    You’ve got to understand something about birthers. They start with a conclusion (Obama is ineligible to be President) and work back from there. They will take any theory that produces that and claim that it’s the truth, no matter if they are contradictory.

    They’ll claim that the Hawaii Department of Health forged a birth certificate to make it show that Obama was born in Hawaii, and then take at the word of a convicted forger a birth certificate where the person alledgely signing the birth certificate spells his own name differently from how he normally spells it.

    They’ll claim that the Founding Fathers wanted national soverignity, then spout theories that give every other nation a veto over who becomes President of the United States (hello Dual Citizenship theories).

    They’ll claim that Obama was not born in the United States, and that his grandparents lied to get him to be eligible to be President, and that they were so incompentant at his job that they did it in a way that Obama would not be eligible to be President anyways.

    Mutually exclusive theories do not bother Birthers. They all lead to the same conclusion, that Obama is ineligible to be President, and that’s all that they want.

  60. avatar
    The Magic M July 8, 2013 at 4:16 am #

    Documentation of the foreign-born children of foreign nationals having Hawaiian birth certificates stating Hawaiian birth that Zullo claims to have.

    Without that addition, it’s pointless; even if Zullo had thousands of those, it wouldn’t mean a thing (namely that a Hawaiian BC does not prove Hawaiian birth).

    Why was John Woodman rebuffed when he offered to present technical information to the Posse?

    I think their explanation was that Woodman isn’t an expert (which is stupid since law enforcement should never turn away people offering evidence simply because they’re not experts); I’m not sure if they also said they looked at his findings and found them not convincing, but I think they did. (Which is kinda funny since they didn’t have experts on board at the time to actually evaluate technical evidence, only the stuff that was funneled to them through WND, like the Zebest report.)

  61. avatar
    scott e July 8, 2013 at 10:40 am #

    Loren:
    Waaaay back in March 2012, after the first Posse press conference, I put together this list of things they either hinted at in their statements or *should* have addressed but didn’t.Most of these holes in their public presentations remain unfilled; the only two items that *have* been addressed (and which I removed below) involved postman Allen Hulton and the 1961 INS records.Both of which, oddly enough, were specifically investigated not by any actual Posse members, but by Jerome Corsi.

    Anyhow, here’s my old list of Posse unanswered questions:

    - The names of the posse members.

    - The names of their ‘multiple’ experts.

    - Copies of the multiple affidavits they kept referring to.

    - Specifics about the “dozens”(?) of interviews they supposedly conducted.

    - Information about their individual forgery suspect (is it “Mike”?)

    - Some kind of operating hypothesis as to who they’re accusing of forgery, if not Obama. Administration officials? Hawaiian officials?

    - Discussion of the birth announcements and index data, including those counter-examples it was specifically stated they possessed.

    - An explanation for why the FOIA-obtained August 1961 memo referring to Obama’s Honolulu birth isn’t trustworthy.

    - An explanation for the correspondence showing Obama requesting the long-form, and the Hawaii DoH webpage. Also, the two press releases by the DoH prior to the long-form’s release.

    - An explanation of why the COLB isn’t trustworthy.

    hey are you going to run for congress again ??

  62. avatar
    scott e July 8, 2013 at 10:44 am #

    scott e: godot ? (beckett) jablonski… LOL

    ever read pinter, ionesco or other absurdists ? theatre of the absurd, well placed here.

  63. avatar
    Majority Will July 8, 2013 at 10:47 am #

    I thought that idiotic drivel sounded familiar. The puerile use of “Pretensident” is another giveaway.

    It must be an experiment in Artificial Stupidity.

    How incredibly ironic for such a prolific birther bigot to moan about whiners and wasting copious amounts of time and effort.

    *smh*

    Arthur: “Julius B. Censor”

  64. avatar
    Rickey July 8, 2013 at 10:53 am #

    Ms D:
    IF Barack’s birth parents are who he’s stated they were – here was the law at the time of his ‘supposed’ birth – “Obama was born of a father who was a British subject/citizen and Obama himself was the same.”

    It doesn’t matter who his parents were, because he was born in the United States. The only thing about his parents which matters is that they were not foreign diplomats or invading soldiers.

    What is a “supposed” birth? Do you have a theory that Obama was created in a laboratory?

  65. avatar
    Majority Will July 8, 2013 at 11:03 am #

    Ms D: ‘supposed’ birth

    BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA ! ! ! !

    Whew! Thanks for the laugh! Bless those cotton pickin’, little birther bigot hearts!

  66. avatar
    Majority Will July 8, 2013 at 11:06 am #

    Should we trust and believe the official authority of the state of Hawaii or anonymous, hate motivated birther bigots who make it abundantly clear that they have no grasp of actual history or U.S. laws?

    /snark

  67. avatar
    Graham Shevlin July 8, 2013 at 11:25 am #

    Arthur: It appears that “Julius B. Censor” is Kenneth Olsen, operator of the Lysander Spooner “Law School.” Here’s the original passage which he posted on his website the same day it appeared here:

    “Kevin Davidson let loose another wordy salvo today, attacking Mike Zullo and the good-faith efforts of the Maricopa County Cold Case Posse. Some day someone will add up all the time and effort that the unusual Mr. Davidson has expended on defending the unusual inaction of the pretensident while demeaning the efforts of those who seek the simplest corroboration of his ‘narrative.’”

    http://www.lysanderspoonerlawschool.org/index.php?option=com_content&view=category&id=20&Itemid=183

    He is either the Dean of the Lysander Spooner operation, or he is ripping off somebody’s writing hook line and sinker…

  68. avatar
    Rickey July 8, 2013 at 11:33 am #

    Arthur: It appears that “Julius B. Censor” is Kenneth Olsen, operator of the Lysander Spooner “Law School.” Here’s the original passage which he posted on his website the same day it appeared here:

    Good catch, Arthur. Olsen posted here under his own name last year when he was trying to defend Jack Cashill. Olsen also believes that Larry Sinclair is credible and that Bill Ayers wrote Obama’s book, and he seems to be obsessed with Doc C.

    http://www.obamaconspiracy.org/2012/02/the-strange-case-of-dr-conspiracy-and-mr-obot/

    Incidentally, Cashill’s book about Obama is now #636,917 on Amazon. Amazon is practically giving it away for less than $10.

    Cashill is not new to conspiracy theories. He co-wrote a book in 2003 claiming that TWA Flight 800 was shot down by terrorists, and his upcoming book (to be published by WND, of course) is titled “If I had a Son: Race, Guns, and the Railroading of George Zimmerman.” Hey, who needs to wait for a trial by jury when you can just make up your mind in advance?

  69. avatar
    Majority Will July 8, 2013 at 12:20 pm #

    Rickey: Olsen posted here under his own name last year when he was trying to defend Jack Cashill. Olsen also believes that Larry Sinclair is credible and that Bill Ayers wrote Obama’s book, and he seems to be obsessed with Doc C.

    Truly bizarre and miles and miles down the unbalanced birther bigot rabbit hole lined with all things asinine, disturbing and creepy.

  70. avatar
    Ms D July 8, 2013 at 12:32 pm #

    First – Note to Majority Will – there is no need for ‘name calling’ – solves nothing- not that this would make any difference to you (IMO) I AM NOT a “Birther”! – - to all, here’s another issue that doesn’t seem to be being addressed – “When Barack Sr. was 18 he married a woman named Kezia and had four children with her. Two of them later returned to Kenya from the United States. HE NEVER DIVORCED HER. In the US, POLYGAMY IS ILLEGAL. If you are already married, regardless of where you got married, ALL SUBSEQUENT MARRIAGES ARE INVALID. This is the case with the marriage of Stanley Ann Dunham and Barack Obama Sr. in February 1961. Barak Obama Jr. was born out of wedlock. WHERE ARE THE LAWS COVERING a child born out of wedlock? I’ve read different ‘definitions’ on the citizenship laws regarding this – can anyone clarify???

  71. avatar
    Kiwiwriter July 8, 2013 at 12:32 pm #

    Kenneth Olsen and the Lysander Spooner “Law School,” hey? Right up there with Harvard, Yale, and Princeton, no doubt.

    In that case, I demand that Mr. Olsen produce the achievements of his law school and his credentials thereof.

  72. avatar
    Majority Will July 8, 2013 at 12:35 pm #

    Ms D: First – Note to Majority Will – there is no need for ‘name calling’ –

    If you don’t want to be ridiculed, don’t be ridiculous.

    You are, by definition, a birther if you can’t state plainly that President Barack Obama is a natural born citizen of the United States of America and has always been eligible to hold the office of President.

    One other symptom of the disease of birtherism is the inability to admit when you’ve made a mistake as you did in a previous post.

  73. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy July 8, 2013 at 12:53 pm #

    Obama Sr. contended that he had divorced his previous wife, but if the marriage was indeed void and the President was born out of wedlock, then the prevailing law would make him a US citizen.

    Birth Abroad Out-of-Wedlock to a U.S. Citizen Mother:

    A person born abroad out-of-wedlock to a U.S. citizen mother may acquire U.S. citizenship under Section 309(c) of the INA if the mother was a U.S. citizen at the time of the person’s birth and if the mother was physically present in the United States or one of its outlying possessions for a continuous period of one year prior to the person’s birth. The mother must be genetically related to the person in order to transmit U.S. citizenship.

    http://travel.state.gov/law/citizenship/citizenship_5199.html

    Ms D: “When Barack Sr. was 18 he married a woman named Kezia and had four children with her. Two of them later returned to Kenya from the United States. HE NEVER DIVORCED HER. In the US, POLYGAMY IS ILLEGAL. If you are already married, regardless of where you got married, ALL SUBSEQUENT MARRIAGES ARE INVALID. This is the case with the marriage of Stanley Ann Dunham and Barack Obama Sr. in February 1961. Barak Obama Jr. was born out of wedlock. WHERE ARE THE LAWS COVERING a child born out of wedlock? I’ve read different ‘definitions’ on the citizenship laws regarding this – can anyone clarify???

  74. avatar
    Loren July 8, 2013 at 12:54 pm #

    scott e: hey are you going to run for congress again ??

    Eh, maybe. The write-in thing was fun the first time, but it lost a lot of luster the second time round. If I do it again, it’ll need to be on the ballot.

    BTW, I noticed a comment of yours from the other day where you said I never responded to your emails. I admit I’m not great on maintaining correspondence, but I checked, and I couldn’t find any emails of yours. Just thought I’d let you know.

  75. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy July 8, 2013 at 12:55 pm #

    Dr. Conspiracy:
    Obama Sr. contended that he had divorced his previous wife, but if the marriage was indeed void and the President was born out of wedlock, then the prevailing law would make him a US citizen, even if born overseas (which he wasn’t).

    http://travel.state.gov/law/citizenship/citizenship_5199.html

  76. avatar
    Majority Will July 8, 2013 at 12:57 pm #

    Ms D: here was the law at the time of his ‘supposed’ birth

    Oh, and please, please, please, for the entertainment of all, explain what the heck a ‘supposed’ birth is to your captivated audience here.

    I’m still trying to wrap my head around that darling and precious gem of yours!

    :-D

  77. avatar
    Ms D July 8, 2013 at 1:13 pm #

    to
    Majority Will
    birther

    noun
    •a person who believes – against evidence – that Barack Obama was born outside of the United States.
    noun

    birthers are opponents of US President Barack Obama, who claim that he is not a ‘natural born citizen’ (not born in the USA)
    Verification – I have NEVER STATED that I believe Barack Obama was born out of the US of A – therefore, I am not a ‘Birther”

    http://www.canadafreepress.com/index.php/article/4418

    http://atlasshrugs2000.typepad.com/atlas_shrugs/2011/04/the-strange-loves-of-barack-hussein-obama-senior.html

    Elder Obama, Bigamist Non-PhD (Part Two)

    http://sweetness-light.com/archive/elder-obama-bigamist-non-phd-part-two#.Udrv1RHn-Lg

    There is no evidence to suggest Obama Sr. was divorced from Aoko either in Kenya before he left for Hawaii or in Hawaii prior to the alleged marriage with Dunham
    Read more at http://www.wnd.com/2009/09/111491/#3O4sif7xpdgEjBBZ.99

  78. avatar
    Dave B. July 8, 2013 at 1:23 pm #

    That’s one meaning. Birthers, in general, believe that because of the circumstances of his BIRTH, President Obama is ineligible (or even unfit!) for the Presidency. So yes, you are a birther.

    Ms D: birther

    noun
    •a person who believes – against evidence – that Barack Obama was born outside of the United States.
    noun

  79. avatar
    Majority Will July 8, 2013 at 1:33 pm #

    Ms D: a person who believes – against evidence – that Barack Obama was born outside of the United States . . . therefore, I am not a ‘Birther”

    Wrong. Flat out, 100% wrong.

    If you erroneously think that our President is not eligible for the office of President of the United States, you are most definitely a birther – whatever your motivation.

    There are birthers who think he was born in Kenya and birthers who mistakenly believe that dual citizenship matters and birthers who incorrectly think Emer de Vattel influenced our Constitution on the subject of natural born citizenship and that you must have citizen parents or that the legal documentation on file with the Hawaii DOH is a forgery and many other asinine, peurile and delusional lies and distortions of history, facts and actual legal precedent.

    Also, citing ridiculous birther bigot internet sources doesn’t help your case either.

    I’m still waiting for you to admit you were wrong about the law and PLEASE explain the meaning of a ‘supposed’ birth to the class.

    I’m still chuckling over that.

  80. avatar
    Dave B. July 8, 2013 at 1:49 pm #

    The marriage could be voidable. Turning again to the State Department,
    “A marriage that did not conform to the laws of the country or state in which it was performed may be a void marriage, but only after declared so by an appropriate authority, usually a court in the jurisdiction where the marriage occurred. Prior to such judicial declaration, the marriage may be considered voidable. A voidable marriage is considered valid for all purposes unless and until annulled or voided by the court. Even after a marriage is voided, there is every likelihood that the children’s status will not be affected. Every state in the United States, for example, considers children of a void marriage to be legitimate (see 7 FAM 1133 EXHIBIT 1133.4-2(A), Part II).”

    http://www.state.gov/documents/organization/86757.pdf (Pp. 32-33)

    Not that it makes any difference, of course.

    Dr. Conspiracy: Obama Sr. contended that he had divorced his previous wife, but if the marriage was indeed void and the President was born out of wedlock, then the prevailing law would make him a US citizen.

  81. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy July 8, 2013 at 1:52 pm #

    Thanks, Dave. That explains some email comments I got from Prof. Chin on this topic. He said the marriage would probably be considered valid for this purpose. I went back to my old article on this topic and added the link you provided.

    http://www.obamaconspiracy.org/2011/04/no-no-no-cnn/

    Dave B.: The marriage could be voidable.

  82. avatar
    misha marinsky July 8, 2013 at 2:16 pm #

    Ms D: WHERE ARE THE LAWS COVERING a child born out of wedlock? I’ve read different ‘definitions’ on the citizenship laws regarding this – can anyone clarify???

    Anyone born out of wedlock is legally a bastard, and cannot hold office. Here’s an example:

    “That bastard couldn’t get elected dog catcher.”

  83. avatar
    misha marinsky July 8, 2013 at 2:28 pm #

    Ms D: If the above law is found to be the correct law applying at the time of the birth of BaraCk Obama, he is legally not qualified to hold the office of President.

    Ms D: Verification – I have NEVER STATED that I believe Barack Obama was born out of the US of A – therefore, I am not a ‘Birther”

    It’s called Seroquel – look into it.

  84. avatar
    Sactosintolerant July 8, 2013 at 2:29 pm #

    Zullo’s not dumb enough to take on obot claims. He already undercut birtherism enough the one time he did by showing optimization DOES cause “layers.”

    However, surely there are 242 Maricopans willing to petition Arpaio to answer some questions about this “investigation.”

  85. avatar
    W. Kevin Vicklund July 8, 2013 at 2:35 pm #

    Ms D: Verification – I have NEVER STATED that I believe Barack Obama was born out of the US of A – therefore, I am not a ‘Birther”

    And yet you are asking about laws that only apply if he was born outside the United States. Therefore, you are either a birther*, or failed to read the laws you are quoting.

    *edit to add “by your own definition”

  86. avatar
    misha marinsky July 8, 2013 at 2:36 pm #

    Ms D: Elder Obama, Bigamist Non-PhD (Part Two)

    Willard Mitt Romney’s paternal grandfather was a bigamist non-PhD. Mormons still practice polygamy in private. I worked for a Mormon in DC, who had two wives and 7 children.

    “Polygamy and Mormonism are inseparably entwined. One of the most offensive aspects of Mormon-based polygamy is the rampant practice of taking underage girls as polygamous wives.”

    http://www.exmormon.org/mormon/mormon216.htm

  87. avatar
    Dave B. July 8, 2013 at 2:48 pm #

    Here’s Hawaii Revised Statute
    580-23 Former husband or wife living. A marriage may be declared null on the ground that one of the parties has an undivorced husband or wife living, on the application of either of the parties during the lifetime of the other, or on the application of the former husband or wife. [CC 1859, 1315; RL 1925, 2957; RL 1935, 4452; RL 1945, 12203; RL 1955, 324-3; HRS 580-23]
    http://www.capitol.hawaii.gov/hrscurrent/Vol12_Ch0501-0588/HRS0580/HRS_0580-0023.htm
    and

    580-27 Legitimacy in case of annulment. Upon the annulment of a marriage on account of nonage, lack of mental capacity of either party to consent to the marriage, or of a marriage that is prohibited on account of consanguinity between the parties, or for any other ground specified in section 580-21, the issue of the marriage shall be legitimate. [CC 1859, 1319, 1320; am imp L 1870, c 24, 1, rep L 1872, c 23, 2; am L 1872, c 23, 1; RL 1925, 2961, 2962; RL 1935, 4456, 4457; am L 1935, c 115, 1, 2; RL 1945, 12207; RL 1955, 324-7; HRS 580-27; am L 1980, c 43, 3]
    http://www.capitol.hawaii.gov/hrscurrent/Vol12_Ch0501-0588/HRS0580/HRS_0580-0027.htm
    So it’s a little complicated. Now neither party to the Obama-Dunham marriage is living. The marriage was dissolved decades ago, and upon its dissolution Barack Obama Sr. remarried in Kenya. In 1989, in adjudicating Barack Obama, Sr.’s estate, Judge J.F. Shields of Nairobi’s High Court ruled that Obama Sr. and his first wife, Grace Kezia Aoko Obama (who is, I believe, still living) had indeed been divorced.

    Not that it makes any difference, of course.

    Dr. Conspiracy:
    Thanks, Dave. That explains some email comments I got from Prof. Chin on this topic. He said the marriage would probably be considered valid for this purpose. I went back to my old article on this topic and added the link you provided.

    http://www.obamaconspiracy.org/2011/04/no-no-no-cnn/

  88. avatar
    dunstvangeet July 8, 2013 at 2:48 pm #

    Ms D:
    First – Note to Majority Will – there is no need for ‘name calling’ – solves nothing- not that this would make any difference to you (IMO) I AM NOT a “Birther”!– -to all, here’s another issue that doesn’t seem to be being addressed – “When Barack Sr. was 18 he married a woman named Kezia and had four children with her. Two of them later returned to Kenya from the United States. HE NEVER DIVORCED HER. In the US, POLYGAMY IS ILLEGAL. If you are already married, regardless of where you got married, ALL SUBSEQUENT MARRIAGES ARE INVALID. This is the case with the marriage of Stanley Ann Dunham and Barack Obama Sr. in February 1961. Barak Obama Jr. was born out of wedlock. WHERE ARE THE LAWS COVERING a child born out of wedlock? I’ve read different ‘definitions’ on the citizenship laws regarding this – can anyone clarify???

    It doesn’t matter. You said that you believe that

    Ms D:
    Verification – I have NEVER STATED that I believe Barack Obama was born out of the US of A – therefore, I am not a ‘Birther”

    Welcome to the Obots! Because if he was born in the United States, then the only thing that applies is the following: “born in the United States and subject to the jurisdiction thereof.” Subject to the United States was defined in the Court Case U.S. v. Wong Kim Ark, and includes everybody with the exception of a few groups, none of which apply to Obama (Native Americans born on Tribal Land, Children born to Invading Armies, children born to people with diplomatic immunity, etc.)

    Therefore, you must believe that Obama is constitutionally eligible to be President. I expect you therefore to be spouting out that Obama is constitutionally eligible to be President from the highest rooftops.

    So, welcome to the Obots, you can get your marching orders from your unit leader. These orders come directly from Soros himself!

  89. avatar
    Ms D July 8, 2013 at 2:49 pm #

    To Majority Will – IMO we all ought to be able to voice our own personal opinions and/or questions – as adults we ought to be able to ‘agree to disagree’. (I’m neither an ‘Arguer’ or a “‘Debater’) My use of ‘supposed’ is because, IMO, Obama’s Birth Certificate has not been validated – many persons who experts in Adobe Photoshop or Illustrator software have stated the Birth Certificate(s) are forged. (More than one BC has shown up.)

    To Dr. Conspiracy – “Barack Hussein Obama Sr’s immigration file was recently released by the United States Citizenship and Immigration Services in response to a Freedom of Information Act Request.

    The FOIA release from USCIS shows Barack Obama Sr. TO HAVE BEEN A POLYGAMIST. INS questioned the validity of his marriage to the presidents mother and conspired with Harvard to have Obama Sr. removed from the country. Obama Sr. left willingly after overstaying his visa and having extensions den.” http://www.witnessesuntome.com/2011/04/obama-sr-polygamist-illegal-alien-obama-jr-hawaii-native/

    I live in Arizona, and believe me, I have emailed Sheriff Arpaio as well as Zullo – - Arpaio never responds but Zullo does!
    I’m neither a Conservative and/or a Liberal – I’m a Legally registered USA Citizen and am EXTREMELY concerned as to where out country is headed.

  90. avatar
    dunstvangeet July 8, 2013 at 3:01 pm #

    Ms D

    You state that it has never been verified? The Hawaii Department of Health has verified it multiple times, most notably on the birth certificate itself (the official verification). Other statements from the State of Hawaii.

    “It’s a valid Hawaii State birth certificate.” – Janice K. Okubo, spokesperson for the Hawaii Department of Health.

    “…Barack Obama was born in Hawaii and is a Natural-Born American Citizen” – Cherome Fukino, Director of the Hawaii Department of Health (at the time she made this statement).

    And of course, there’s the verifications of the data that were sent to the Arizona Attorney General, the Mississippi court, and the Alabama Court.

    Also, Hawaii Directly links to the White House PDF from their website, saying that this is Barack Obama’s birth certificate.

    If you still believe that it’s “never been verified”, then by your own definition, you’re a birther.

  91. avatar
    Dave B. July 8, 2013 at 3:02 pm #

    I can only hope you don’t live in Pima County. So what’s the relevance of this nonsense about bigamy?
    How, exactly, do you reckon your “experts in Adobe Photoshop or Illustrator software” stack up against the genuine authorities who are responsible for Hawaii’s vital records? How do you figure they’d fare, as Judge Jeff Masin said, ” in a legal proceeding, not a press conference, not a political rally, in a legal proceeding”?

    Ms D: I live in Arizona, and believe me, I have emailed Sheriff Arpaio as well as Zullo – – Arpaio never responds but Zullo does!
    I’m neither a Conservative and/or a Liberal – I’m a Legally registered USA Citizen and am EXTREMELY concerned as to where out country is headed.

  92. avatar
    Reality Check July 8, 2013 at 3:05 pm #

    Funny thing. Zullo doesn’t respond to my emails. :lol:

    Ms D: Arpaio never responds but Zullo does!

  93. avatar
    richCares July 8, 2013 at 3:10 pm #

    “Obama’s Birth Certificate has not been validated – many persons who experts in Adobe Photoshop or Illustrator software have stated the Birth Certificate(s) are forged.”
    WOW
    and you say people call you names, can you blame them after spouting such garbage?

  94. avatar
    misha marinsky July 8, 2013 at 3:12 pm #

    Ms D: IMO, Obama’s Birth Certificate has not been validated

    Gov. Linda Lingle: “You know, during the campaign of 2008, I was actually in the mainland campaigning for Sen. McCain. This issue kept coming up so much in the campaign, and again I think it’s one of those issues that is simply a distraction from the more critical issues that are facing the country. And so I had my health director, who is a physician by background, go personally view the birth certificate in the birth records of the Department of Health, and we issued a news release at that time saying that the president was, in fact, born at Kapi’olani Hospital in Honolulu, Hawaii. And that’s just a fact. And yet people continue to call up and e-mail and want to make it an issue. And I think it’s, again, a horrible distraction for the country by those people who continue this. … It’s been established. He was born here.”

    http://voices.washingtonpost.com/right-now/2010/05/hawaii_gov_lingle_answers_the.html

  95. avatar
    misha marinsky July 8, 2013 at 3:18 pm #

    Ms D: I’m a Legally registered USA Citizen

    What are the differences among “Legally registered USA Citizen,” “registered USA Citizen,” and “USA Citizen”? Inquiring minds want to know.

    Ms D: and am EXTREMELY concerned as to where out country is headed.

    Obama is going to declare a communist dictatorship the last six weeks of his “presidency.”

    I read it on Alex Jones’ website.

  96. avatar
    Majority Will July 8, 2013 at 3:19 pm #

    Ms D: My use of ‘supposed’ is because, IMO, Obama’s Birth Certificate has not been validated

    Complete and utter nonsense. And the funny part is that you said, “supposed birth” which means he was allegedly born. Comedy gold.

    It’s NOT a matter of OPINION.

    Verification by the DOH of the state of Hawaii of President Obama’s birth in the state of Hawaii on August 4th, 1961 is a FACT.

    ” . . . we ought to be able to ‘agree to disagree’.”

    Gibberish.

    “many persons who experts in Adobe Photoshop or Illustrator software have stated the Birth Certificate(s) are forged”

    More nonsense from hardcore birther bigots with clear motivations and more proof you have absolutely no idea what you’re talking about.

    The state of Hawaii has confirmed the information, notably name and date and place of birth, on President Obama’s birth certificate.

    Saying his birth certificate is forged is like saying the Bureau of Engraving and Printing forges U.S. dollars.

    ” . . . and am EXTREMELY concerned as to where out (sic) country is headed.”

    Which has ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to do with Presidential eligibility but it does reveal, at least in part, why you are a birther.

  97. avatar
    Majority Will July 8, 2013 at 3:21 pm #

    Ms D: I’m a Legally registered USA Citizen

    Does that mean dark skinned people frighten you?

  98. avatar
    misha marinsky July 8, 2013 at 3:21 pm #

    Ms D: The FOIA release from USCIS shows Barack Obama Sr. TO HAVE BEEN A POLYGAMIST.

    You are a birther and a religionist.

  99. avatar
    Majority Will July 8, 2013 at 3:22 pm #

    Reality Check:
    Funny thing. Zullo doesn’t respond to my emails.

    Probably because you didn’t pay for his attention.

  100. avatar
    CarlOrcas July 8, 2013 at 3:24 pm #

    Ms D: My use of ‘supposed’ is because, IMO, Obama’s Birth Certificate has not been validated – many persons who experts in Adobe Photoshop or Illustrator software have stated the Birth Certificate(s) are forged. (More than one BC has shown up.)

    Ms D,

    First, the State of Hawaii has validated his birth certificate. And, of course, the PDF we have all seen on the internet isn’t his birth certificate. It’s an image of it.

    But, all that aside, exactly what would it take for you to accept that he was born in Hawaii and that his birth there means he is eligible to be President of the United States?

    Ms D: I live in Arizona, and believe me, I have emailed Sheriff Arpaio as well as Zullo – – Arpaio never responds but Zullo does!

    Two things: Arpaio doesn’t have a computer in his office. He’s quite proud of that as I recall.

    And do you understand that if – big IF – Zullo was really conducting a legitimate criminal investigation it would be beyond inappropriate for him to be exchanging e-mails with private citizens let alone speaking before political groups and appearing on talk radio.

  101. avatar
    CarlOrcas July 8, 2013 at 3:36 pm #

    misha marinsky: Obama is going to declare a communist dictatorship the last six weeks of his “presidency.”
    I read it on Alex Jones’ website.

    Cool! That’s much easier to put on my calendar than “any day now”.

  102. avatar
    Majority Will July 8, 2013 at 3:45 pm #

    CarlOrcas: Cool! That’s much easier to put on my calendar than “any day now”.

    I’m getting my own FEMA camp. I will name it Camp Soros, of course.

  103. avatar
    donna July 8, 2013 at 3:45 pm #

    CarlOrcas: And do you understand that if – big IF – Zullo was really conducting a legitimate criminal investigation it would be beyond inappropriate for him to be exchanging e-mails with private citizens let alone speaking before political groups and appearing on talk radio.

    CORRECT – the line is always “this is an ongoing investigation” – law enforcement and investigators don’t become pen-pals with the public nor do they use the public for “private meetings” as zullo recently did nor do they beg for dollars

    and why would zullo swear as a private citizen in an affidavit as he did in mississippi?

  104. avatar
    Kiwiwriter July 8, 2013 at 3:47 pm #

    misha marinsky: What are the differences among “Legally registered USA Citizen,” “registered USA Citizen,” and “USA Citizen”? Inquiring minds want to know.

    Obama is going to declare a communist dictatorship the last six weeks of his “presidency.”

    I read it on Alex Jones’ website.

    Can I be head of the Secret Police? I’ve wanted to be head of the Secret Police since I was a teenager.

    I always wanted to be O’Brien “1984″ or the interrogator in Kafka’s “The Trial.”

  105. avatar
    CarlOrcas July 8, 2013 at 3:52 pm #

    donna: and why would zullo swear as a private citizen in an affidavit as he did in mississippi?

    Simple answer: That’s all he is……a private citizen playing cops and robbers.

  106. avatar
    misha marinsky July 8, 2013 at 3:59 pm #

    Majority Will: I will name it Camp Soros, of course.

    I had first dibs. Get your own name.

  107. avatar
    Majority Will July 8, 2013 at 4:05 pm #

    misha marinsky: I had first dibs. Get your own name.

    Fair enough. Camp Frank Marshall Davis, then.

  108. avatar
    MN-Skeptic July 8, 2013 at 4:14 pm #

    Ms D: I’m a Legally registered USA Citizen

    Or so you say. How do we know that? I don’t know of anyone here who has seen proof of your citizenship. Are you going to post a copy of your birth certificate? How will we know it’s yours? For all we know, you’re an undercover North Korean agent sowing disinformation in order to destabilize our government. Think about it. How are you going to prove anything to us? Right now all we can do is judge you by your words. Your words indicate that you are probably a RWNJ and a conspiracy believing, low information voting birther. But that’s just a guess on my part. I’m just extrapolating from the evidence you’ve provided. :)

  109. avatar
    Kiwiwriter July 8, 2013 at 4:14 pm #

    How about “Camp Orly Taitz?”

  110. avatar
    Ms D July 8, 2013 at 4:22 pm #

    Friday, May 25, 2012

    WT: Hawaii State Registrar Does Not Verify Authenticity of Obama’s Birth Certificate The “Verification of Birth” letter sent by the Hawaii State Registrar Alvin T. Onaka Ph.D to Arizona Secretary of State Ken Bennett fails to respond to the fundamental question asked by Mr. Bennett in a March 30, 2012 letter to Hawaii Department of Health officials: Whether or not the image of President Obama’s “long form” Certificate of Live Birth, posted on the White House web site on April 27, 2011 is a “true and accurate representation of the original record in your files”.
    The official whose signature appears on the “Verification of Birth,” as well as the copy of President Obama’s Certificate of Live Birth released by the White House is Onaka who is refusing to talk to Maricopa County Sheriff’s Office (Ariz.) Cold Case Posse investigator Mike Zullo who was on the ground in Hawaii. At question is that an “official birth certificate” provided on request is not the original document created at the time of birth. If you are from, say Chicago, you can order an official birth certificate from City Hall, but it is not the original or even an exact facsimile of your birth certificate. The document you receive carries the Secretary of State’s seal confirming that the same “information” that would be found on your original birth certificate records is accurately reflected http://obamareleaseyourrecords.blogspot.com/2012/05/washington-times-hawaii-state-registrar.html Hawaii State Registrar Did Not Verify Authenticity Of Obama’s Birth Certificate http://www.politicalforum.com/current-events/249324-hawaii-state-registrar-did-not-verify-authenticity-obamas-birth-certificate-az.html

  111. avatar
    Majority Will July 8, 2013 at 4:29 pm #

    Kiwiwriter:
    How about “Camp Orly Taitz?”

    Free but extremely painful dental care included.

  112. avatar
    Majority Will July 8, 2013 at 4:37 pm #

    Ms D: WT: Hawaii State Registrar . . . blah blah blah

    The technical term for what you just posted is birther bullsh!t.

    DEPARTMENT OF HEALTH
    News Release
    LINDA LINGLE
    GOVERNOR
    __

    CHIYOME LEINAALA FUKINO M.D.
    DIRECTOR

    __

    For Immediate Release: July 27, 2009 09-063

    STATEMENT BY HEALTH DIRECTOR CHIYOME FUKINO, M.D.

    “I, Dr. Chiyome Fukino, Director of the Hawai‛i State Department of Health, have seen the original vital records maintained on file by the Hawai‘i State Department of Health verifying Barack Hussein Obama was born in Hawai‘i and is a natural-born American citizen. I have nothing further to add to this statement or my original statement issued in October 2008 over eight months ago.”

    ###

    http://hawaii.gov/health/vital-records/obama.html

    Should I believe the relevant and legal authority of the state of Hawaii or the deliberate lies from a handful of delusional and paranoid birther bigots and con artists who are sworn political enemies of the President?

    Gee, that’s a tough one.

  113. avatar
    CarlOrcas July 8, 2013 at 4:41 pm #

    Ms D:
    Friday, May 25, 2012

    WT: Hawaii State Registrar Does Not Verify Authenticity of Obama’s Birth Certificate The “Verification of Birth” letter sent by the Hawaii State Registrar Alvin T. Onaka Ph.D to Arizona Secretary of State Ken Bennett fails to respond to the fundamental question asked by Mr. Bennett in a March 30, 2012 letter to Hawaii Department of Health officials: Whether or not the image of President Obama’s “long form” Certificate of Live Birth, posted on the White House web site on April 27, 2011 is a “true and accurate representation of the original record in your files”.
    The official whose signature appears on the “Verification of Birth,” as well as the copy of President Obama’s Certificate of Live Birth released by the White House is Onaka who is refusing to talk to Maricopa County Sheriff’s Office (Ariz.) Cold Case Posse investigator Mike Zullo who was on the ground in Hawaii. At question is that an “official birth certificate” provided on request is not the original document created at the time of birth. If you are from, say Chicago, you can order an official birth certificate from City Hall, but it is not the original or even an exact facsimile of your birth certificate. The document you receive carries the Secretary of State’s seal confirming that the same “information” that would be found on your original birth certificate records is accurately reflected http://obamareleaseyourrecords.blogspot.com/2012/05/washington-times-hawaii-state-registrar.htmlHawaii State Registrar Did Not Verify Authenticity Of Obama’s Birth Certificatehttp://www.politicalforum.com/current-events/249324-hawaii-state-registrar-did-not-verify-authenticity-obamas-birth-certificate-az.html

    Ms. D,

    I don’t mean to hurt your feelings but you are wasting your time posting outdated and long ago debunked birther bilge on this website.

    Why in the world are you doing this?

  114. avatar
    donna July 8, 2013 at 4:44 pm #

    Ms D:

    you are a tad late to the party here – hawaii has provided 3 verifications

    338-14.3 Verification in lieu of a certified copy. (a) Subject to the requirements of section 338-18, the department of health, upon request, shall furnish to any applicant, in lieu of the issuance of a certified copy, a verification of the existence of a certificate and any other information that the applicant provides to be verified relating to the vital event that pertains to the certificate.

    (b) A verification shall be considered for all purposes certification that the vital event did occur and that the facts of the event are as stated by the applicant.

  115. avatar
    Majority Will July 8, 2013 at 4:45 pm #

    Ms D: If the above law is found to be the correct law applying at the time of the birth of BaraCk Obama, he is legally not qualified to hold the office of President.” Stanley Ann Dunham was ‘supposedly’ 18 at the time of Barack’s ‘supposed birth’.

    And you still haven’t admitted you were wrong about the law in your first post.

    Birthers have a real hard time admitting mistakes. It’s extremely rare.

    Why is that?

    Also, if you continue to cite internet sources that are birther bigot cesspools known for deliberate lies and misinformation, at least admit you’re not open to learning the truth.

    I will give you credit for one thing. Birthers have been extremely helpful in embarrassing ultraconservatives and the Republican party.

    Thanks for that.

  116. avatar
    gorefan July 8, 2013 at 4:45 pm #

    Ms D: Whether or not the image of President Obama’s “long form” Certificate of Live Birth, posted on the White House web site on April 27, 2011 is a “true and accurate representation of the original record in your files”.

    Donna,

    Since the DOH did not produce the PDF and since the original record is on plain white paper and since, unlike the PDF, the certified copies do not have a white border around the edges, could Dr. Onaka legally say that it was a “true and accurate representation of the original record in your files”?

    Dr. Onaka verified that President Obama was born at Kapiolani Maternity & Gynecological Hospital on August 4th, 1961. Do you know if there is another Kapiolani Maternity & Gynecological Hospital anywhere in the world besides Honolulu?

  117. avatar
    Kiwiwriter July 8, 2013 at 4:48 pm #

    Ms. D., it would appear that you have missed a great many classes as well as staff meetings.

    As a “registered US citizen,” how did you pass your citizenship tests?

  118. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy July 8, 2013 at 5:04 pm #

    No, they only verified the authenticity of all the information on it. Duh.

    If you don’t want to be taken for a birther, don’t walk in wearing a birther t-shirt, carrying the birther flag and humming the birther national anthem.

    Ms D: WT: Hawaii State Registrar Does Not Verify Authenticity of Obama’s Birth Certificate

  119. avatar
    donna July 8, 2013 at 5:05 pm #

    why would i care if there is another hospital with the same name anywhere else in the world? are there 2 in hawaii?

    the DATA is what is verified

    the verification: http://www.azcentral.com/12news/Obama-Verification.pdf

    zullo recently said: “The truth about this PDF, this birth certificate is you can’t bring it into a court of law. The truth is it cannot survive judicial scrutiny on any level.” he said “you couldn’t take YOUR birth certificate, scan it into a computer and have somebody tell you ‘okay, i’ll accept this’, it’s NOT GONNA HAPPEN”

  120. avatar
    gorefan July 8, 2013 at 5:31 pm #

    donna: why would i care if there is another hospital with the same

    Not meant for you – Ms. D, I think is also Donna.

  121. avatar
    Rickey July 8, 2013 at 6:18 pm #

    Ms D:
    More than one BC has shown up.

    Of course more than one has shown up. Most people have more than one, a short form which contains the essential information and is preferred by most states, and a long form which contains more detailed information.

    In my case, I have two short form birth certificates, one which was issued shortly after I was born and another which I needed for an employer in 1988. They contain the same information, but they do not look alike. I suspect that if I ordered another one today it would not look much like the 1988 certificate. And my state’s Department of Health has a third birth certificate, the long form which contains the name of the doctor who delivered me and the name of the hospital where I was born.

    Obama has released two versions of his birth certificate, one the short form and the other the long form.

  122. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy July 8, 2013 at 6:55 pm #

    States with which I am familiar charge a “search fee” to look up the record, and then a copy fee. You save money by buying multiples at the same time.

    Rickey: Of course more than one has shown up. Most people have more than one, a short form which contains the essential information and is preferred by most states, and a long form which contains more detailed information.

  123. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy July 8, 2013 at 6:56 pm #

    Donald Trump tried it, and it seemed to work OK for him.

    donna: zullo recently said: “The truth about this PDF, this birth certificate is you can’t bring it into a court of law. The truth is it cannot survive judicial scrutiny on any level.” he said “you couldn’t take YOUR birth certificate, scan it into a computer and have somebody tell you ‘okay, i’ll accept this’, it’s NOT GONNA HAPPEN”

  124. avatar
    Crustacean July 8, 2013 at 7:20 pm #

    Dr. Conspiracy: …humming the birther national anthem

    You mean the one that begins like this? (with apologies to Geezer Butler)

    “Finished with our POTUS ’cause he couldn’t help us with our minds
    People think we’re crazy because we are frowning all the time
    All day long we make up things but nothing seems to satisfy
    Think we’ll lose our minds if we don’t find a judge to off this guy”

  125. avatar
    Ms D July 8, 2013 at 7:22 pm #

    Monday July 8, 2013 BREAKING! World Tribune Reports! Obama’s BC is 100% FAKE!BREAKING! Mike Zullo is on Capitol Hill TODAY (July 8) meeting with MORE high level government officials in the Obama Fraud Case! This is moving closer and closer to a full blown congressional investigation. ” “We have obtained an affidavit from a certified document analyzer, Reed Hayes, that states the document is a 100 percent forgery, no doubt about it,” said Cold Case Posse Lead Investigator Lt. Mike Zullo in an exclusive interview with WorldTribune.” “This is a key development, asserts Lt. Zullo, because Mr. Hayes is a certified handwriting analyst and forensic document examiner who worked repeatedly for Perkins Coie, a reputable law firm, and was deemed a dependable professional in their legal cases. Moreover, Perkins Coie has defended Mr. Obama in his legal jousts on the birth certificate matter over the past five years.” “Mr. Obama’s operatives cannot discredit him,” said Lt. Zullo. “Mr. Hayes has been used as the firm’s reliable expert. The very firm the president is using to defend him on the birth certificate case has used Mr. Hayes in their cases.” In addition, Mr. Hayes is a Democrat whose business is based in Hawaii. He cannot easily be accused of having a political axe to grind in this matter, explains Lt. Zullo.”

  126. avatar
    Jim July 8, 2013 at 7:28 pm #

    Ms D:
    Monday July 8, 2013BREAKING! World Tribune Reports! Obama’s BC is 100% FAKE!BREAKING! Mike Zullo is on Capitol Hill TODAY (July 8) meeting with MORE high level government officials in the Obama Fraud Case!

    Interesting, and how would they know a document they’ve never examined is 100% fake?

  127. avatar
    Majority Will July 8, 2013 at 7:33 pm #

    Ms D: Monday July 8, 2013 BREAKING! World Tribune Reports! . . . more idiotic birther drivel and pathetic con job

    *facepalm*

  128. avatar
    Dave B. July 8, 2013 at 7:34 pm #

    Well, in the first place, the President has no such authority. Either to tell the State of Hawaii what to do, or to tell the Supreme Court what to do. The Supreme Court doesn’t want anything to do with you.
    In the second place, why should rational people jump through such hoops for a goofy bunch of birthers like you, Ms. D?

    Ms D: One wonders why the matters revolving around the various birth certificate issues cannot be resolved once and for all by President Obama by simply authorizing a special master of the Supreme Court of the United States to travel to Hawaii and view the original document in situ (in its original form, in its place along side other birth certificates issues in the same time period) to determine the validity of the document posted on the White House web site?

    Ms D: To leave the perception that the President of the United States is ineligible to hold the office is unconscionable.

    And the suggestion that Obama’s Social Security Number and Draft Card are bogus documents only highlights the need for a high-level investigation.

    Your perceptions are your own problem.

  129. avatar
    gorefan July 8, 2013 at 7:35 pm #

    Ms D: Monday July 8, 2013 BREAKING! World Tribune Reports

    Did you know that the author of the World Tribune article is Dr. Grace Vuoto?

    “Dr. Grace Vuoto is a regular correspondent on Freedom Friday with Carl Gallups.”

    http://beforeitsnews.com/alternative/2013/05/bombshell-in-the-benghazi-e-mails-grace-vuoto-from-freedom-friday-in-world-tribune-2655036.html

  130. avatar
    Majority Will July 8, 2013 at 7:40 pm #

    gorefan: Did youknow that the author of the World Tribune article is Dr. Grace Vuoto?

    “Dr. Grace Vuoto is a regular correspondent on Freedom Friday with Carl Gallups.”

    http://beforeitsnews.com/alternative/2013/05/bombshell-in-the-benghazi-e-mails-grace-vuoto-from-freedom-friday-in-world-tribune-2655036.html

    Just like a good birther, Ms D made up her mind first about the President’s eligibility and then went only to birther bigot websites to confirm her bias. Her citations reek of the Bad and the Ugly. It’s like researching the atrocities of WWII by surfing the Stormfront website.

  131. avatar
    CarlOrcas July 8, 2013 at 7:41 pm #

    Ms D: Monday July 8, 2013 BREAKING! World Tribune Reports! Obama’s BC is 100% FAKE!BREAKING! Mike Zullo is on Capitol Hill TODAY (July 8) meeting with MORE high level government officials in the Obama Fraud Case! This is moving closer and closer to a full blown congressional investigation.

    The World Tribune story says nothing about Zullo in Washington.

    http://www.worldtribune.com/2013/07/08/forensic-findings-on-obamas-birth-certificate-a-100-percent-forgery-no-doubt-about-it/

    The World Tribune story is simple a regurgitation (in the most real sense) of virtually every bit of birther bilge with absolutely no mention of anything in Washington today.

    Why do you present the quote as though it does? Could it be you just picked up this nonsense from one of Carl Gallups’ websites without checking the source?

    Could you be a birther?

  132. avatar
    gorefan July 8, 2013 at 7:48 pm #

    Ms D: “Mr. Obama’s operatives cannot discredit him,” said Lt. Zullo. “Mr. Hayes has been used as the firm’s reliable expert. The very firm the president is using to defend him on the birth certificate case has used Mr. Hayes in their cases.”

    That statement right there shows that Zullo is

    a) really stupid

    or

    b) knows that the birthers are really stupid

  133. avatar
    misha marinsky July 8, 2013 at 9:17 pm #

    Ms D: this is NOT ‘outdated materiel’

    Materiel usually has an expiration date. What is that expiration date, so we know in fact it is not outdated.

  134. avatar
    misha marinsky July 8, 2013 at 9:24 pm #

    Ms D: Perkins Coie, a reputable law firm

    Thanks for bringing up Perkins Coie, because Obama has had it with Orly Taitz and her crowd:

    Obama: ‘I Am Suing Orly Taitz’ – Perkins Coie To File In Orange County

    Full story:

    http://www.newyorkleftist.blogspot.com/2012/11/obama-i-am-suing-orly-taitz.html

  135. avatar
    CarlOrcas July 8, 2013 at 9:38 pm #

    misha marinsky: Thanks for bringing up Perkins Coie, because Obama has had it with Orly Taitz and her crowd:

    Obama: ‘I Am Suing Orly Taitz’ – Perkins Coie To File In Orange County

    Full story:

    http://www.newyorkleftist.blogspot.com/2012/11/obama-i-am-suing-orly-taitz.html

    Once again you are ahead of the curve. I salute you sir!

  136. avatar
    Curious George July 8, 2013 at 9:39 pm #

    World Tribune Reports– “As a precaution against others misusing or manipulating Mr. Hayes’s report, Lt. Zullo has copyrighted it.”

    A chapter in book number two to be presented to Congress? A copyright on someone else’s work product? Since when do you copyright evidence?

  137. avatar
    Ms D July 8, 2013 at 9:47 pm #

    gorefan

    Name of the Hospital Obama was supposedly born at should have been Kauikeolani Children’s Hospital until 1978. Then they merged with the Kapi‘olani Maternity Home in 1978 and became Kapi‘olani Medical Center for Women & Children
    The following is from the website http://www.kapiolani.org/women-and-children/about-us/default.aspx

    The point here is to verify that the TWO HOSPITALS DID NOT MERGE UNTIL 1978, 16 years AFTER Obama‘s birth. The certificate (White House rendition) uses Kapiolani Maternity & Gynecological Hospital

  138. avatar
    misha marinsky July 8, 2013 at 9:51 pm #

    Ms D: The point here is to verify that the TWO HOSPITALS DID NOT MERGE UNTIL 1978, 16 years AFTER Obama‘s birth. The certificate (White House rendition) uses Kapiolani Maternity & Gynecological Hospital

    What are you going to do about this obvious fraud?

  139. avatar
    US Citizen July 8, 2013 at 9:55 pm #

    “Supposed birth” of Obama?

    Obama is a human and all humans are born.
    Ergo, Obama was born.
    There’s no supposition about it unless you’re taking the standpoint, as some birthers have, that Obama is a reptile.

    If you’re suggesting Obama is a reptile, I don’t think it’s important whether you’re a birther or not.
    Believing he’s a reptile is far beyond any craziness that birtherism has suggested or endorsed.

  140. avatar
    MattR July 8, 2013 at 9:58 pm #

    Ms D: gorefanName of the Hospital Obama was supposedly born at should have been Kauikeolani Children’s Hospital until 1978. Then they merged with the Kapi‘olani Maternity Home in 1978 and became Kapi‘olani Medical Center for Women & ChildrenThe following is from the website http://www.kapiolani.org/women-and-children/about-us/default.aspxThe point here is to verify that the TWO HOSPITALS DID NOT MERGE UNTIL 1978, 16 years AFTER Obama‘s birth. The certificate (White House rendition) uses Kapiolani Maternity & Gynecological Hospital

    So then this birth certificate must be a fake as well. If you are actually interested in the truth, here is a comment from this site made a couple years ago with multiple links showing that the name was in fact Kapiolani Maternity & Gynecological Hospital in 1961.

  141. avatar
    CarlOrcas July 8, 2013 at 10:11 pm #

    Ms D: The point here is to verify that the TWO HOSPITALS DID NOT MERGE UNTIL 1978, 16 years AFTER Obama‘s birth. The certificate (White House rendition) uses Kapiolani Maternity & Gynecological Hospital

    Why don’t you just call them and ask?

  142. avatar
    Matt July 8, 2013 at 10:12 pm #

    Ms D: The certificate (White House rendition) uses Kapiolani Maternity & Gynecological Hospital

    So do the Nordyke twins’ certificates.

  143. avatar
    MattR July 8, 2013 at 10:15 pm #

    CarlOrcas: Why don’t you just call them and ask?

    If they tell her that the name was Kapiolani Maternity & Gynecological Hospital
    in 1961 that is just proof that they are part of the conspiracy.

  144. avatar
    dunstvangeet July 8, 2013 at 10:16 pm #

    Ms D:The certificate (White House rendition) uses Kapiolani Maternity & Gynecological Hospital

    Same as other certificates, which the birthers claim are genuine. Susan and Gretchen Nordyke were born one day after Obama. Their birth certificates have the same name as what Obama’s birth certificate “Kapiolani Maternity & Gynecological Hospital”.

    You can view negatives of their birth certificates here: http://obamanotqualified.com/images/nordyke-twins-1961-hawaian-birth-certificate-01.gif

    Have your next debunked Obama Meme ready. I’m willing to go and debunk them all.

  145. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy July 8, 2013 at 10:17 pm #

    You are really stupid and ignorant. You must have spent all your time on birther web sites among the other stupid and ignorant people where you can get away with nonsense like this.

    Ms D: The point here is to verify that the TWO HOSPITALS DID NOT MERGE UNTIL 1978, 16 years AFTER Obama‘s birth. The certificate (White House rendition) uses Kapiolani Maternity & Gynecological Hospital

  146. avatar
    misha marinsky July 8, 2013 at 10:21 pm #

    Ms D: The point here is to verify that the TWO HOSPITALS DID NOT MERGE UNTIL 1978, 16 years AFTER Obama‘s birth. The certificate (White House rendition) uses Kapiolani Maternity & Gynecological Hospital

    Kapi’olani Medical Center – 808-983-6000. Let us know what happens.

  147. avatar
    Northland10 July 8, 2013 at 10:26 pm #

    Ms D: The FOIA release from USCIS shows Barack Obama Sr. TO HAVE BEEN A POLYGAMIST. INS questioned the validity of his marriage to the presidents mother and conspired with Harvard to have Obama Sr. removed from the country. Obama Sr. left willingly after overstaying his visa and having extensions den.”

    First of all, 2 years ago is rarely considered recent. Second, how does somebody’s father’s behavior have anything to do with a child’s citizenship. Have you considered that an invalid marriage would actually strengthen his citizenship argument?

    I do not expect a response since Ms. D. does not reply to questions about her comments but just posts other, long-debunked tripe.

  148. avatar
    donna July 8, 2013 at 10:28 pm #

    dunstvangeet: You can view negatives of their birth certificates here: http://obamanotqualified.com/images/nordyke-twins-1961-hawaian-birth-certificate-01.gif

    As Eleanor Nordyke told WMC,

    I entered the Kapiolani Maternity and Gynecological Hospital on early Friday afternoon, August 4, 1961. I was registered and my expected twins were given Hawaii State birth certificate numbers 10637 and 10638. My labor was slow with poor contractions from a distended uterus.

    Apparently, Stanley Ann Dunham Obama came in shortly after I arrived, because her baby was registered as number 10641. Her labor was strong, and she delivered Barack Hussein Obama early that evening. The next morning my contractions strengthened. The twins finally emerged at 2:05 and 2:12 p.m. Saturday, August 5th. By the way, I don’t want to do that again!”

    http://www.forbes.com/sites/shenegotiates/2012/05/02/new-witness-obamas-american-birth/

    http://www.womensmediacenter.com/feature/entry/for-birthers-honolulu-mom-an-inconvenient-truth

  149. avatar
    gorefan July 8, 2013 at 10:32 pm #

    Ms D: Name of the Hospital Obama was supposedly born at should have been Kauikeolani Children’s Hospital until 1978.

    You are an idiot. Even WND thinks you are an idiot.

    http://www.wnd.com/2011/04/292717/

    http://www.wnd.com/2011/05/298537/

    Because I don’t think you are smart enough to understand what is in these two WND articles, let me explain it to you.

    The first shows President Obama’s LFBC next to Gretchen Nordyke’s LFBC. Both say “Kapiolani Maternity & Gynecological Hospital”.

    And the second article has an image of a 1959 Hawaiian LFBC. It also say “Kapiolani Maternity & Gynecological Hospital”. But they abbreviated (that means the shortened the name a little) the name “Kapiolani Mat. & Gyn. Hospital”.

  150. avatar
    Daniel July 8, 2013 at 10:34 pm #

    Ms D:
    gorefan

    Name of the Hospital Obama was supposedly born at should have been Kauikeolani Children’s Hospital until 1978. Then they merged with the Kapi‘olani Maternity Home in 1978 and became Kapi‘olani Medical Center for Women & Children
    The following is from the website http://www.kapiolani.org/women-and-children/about-us/default.aspx

    The point here is to verify that the TWO HOSPITALS DID NOT MERGE UNTIL 1978, 16 years AFTER Obama‘s birth. The certificate (White House rendition) uses Kapiolani Maternity & Gynecological Hospital

    So why are you telling us? If you are really a law abiding patriot and you believe these things point to fraud by the POTUS, why aren’t you filing a police report right now?

  151. avatar
    richCares July 8, 2013 at 10:35 pm #

    “Ms D: The point here is to verify that the TWO HOSPITALS DID NOT MERGE UNTIL 1978″
    my daughter was born in 1965 at Kapiolani, her LFBC has the same hospital info as Obama’s, so your 1978 story is worthless.

  152. avatar
    Dr Kenneth Noisewater July 8, 2013 at 10:39 pm #

    Ms D:
    gorefan

    Name of the Hospital Obama was supposedly born at should have been Kauikeolani Children’s Hospital until 1978. Then they merged with the Kapi‘olani Maternity Home in 1978 and became Kapi‘olani Medical Center for Women & Children
    The following is from the website http://www.kapiolani.org/women-and-children/about-us/default.aspx

    The point here is to verify that the TWO HOSPITALS DID NOT MERGE UNTIL 1978, 16 years AFTER Obama‘s birth. The certificate (White House rendition) uses Kapiolani Maternity & Gynecological Hospital

    You claim you aren’t a birther yet you follow the same tired birther script making BS claim after BS claim. You’re going through each and every birther claim one by one and instead of acknowledging you regurgitated bad information as with typical birthers you just jump to the next claim. As has been pointed out the birthers hold up the Nordyke twins certificates as being real well they have the same hospital name on theirs. You’ve been lied to.

  153. avatar
    CarlOrcas July 8, 2013 at 10:39 pm #

    MattR: If they tell her that the name was Kapiolani Maternity & Gynecological Hospital
    in 1961 that is just proof that they are part of the conspiracy.

    Who isn’t part of the conspiracy?????

  154. avatar
    CarlOrcas July 8, 2013 at 10:44 pm #

    gorefan: Even WND thinks you are an idiot.

    Wow! These guys are good. World Net Daily is even in on the conspiracy. Who would have thought?

  155. avatar
    richCares July 8, 2013 at 10:52 pm #

    for those interested here is link to History of Kapi’olani Hospital
    note that
    In 1931, its name was changed to the Kapiʻolani Maternity and Gynecological Hospital.
    In 1971, its name was changed to Kapiʻolani Hospital.
    In 1976, Kapiʻolani Hospital and Kauikenolani Children’s Hospital began a protracted, decade-long merger(completed 1978).
    .
    sorry Ms D, this confirms you are an idiot!
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kapiolani_Medical_Center_for_Women_and_Children

  156. avatar
    gorefan July 8, 2013 at 10:57 pm #

    Dr Kenneth Noisewater: You claim you aren’t a birther yet you follow the same tired birther script making BS claim after BS claim.

    Man, what year is it? It feels like April, 2011. I image next Ms. D will be explaining how Kenya wasn’t called Kenya back in 1961.

  157. avatar
    jayHG July 8, 2013 at 11:08 pm #

    Ms D:
    Monday July 8, 2013BREAKING! World Tribune Reports! Obama’s BC is 100% FAKE!BREAKING! Mike Zullo is on Capitol Hill TODAY (July 8) meeting with MORE high level government officials in the Obama Fraud Case!This is moving closer and closer to a full blown congressional investigation.”“We have obtained an affidavit from a certified document analyzer, Reed Hayes, that states the document is a 100 percent forgery, no doubt about it,” said Cold Case Posse Lead Investigator Lt. Mike Zullo in an exclusive interview with WorldTribune.”“This is a key development, asserts Lt. Zullo, because Mr. Hayes is a certified handwriting analyst and forensic document examiner who worked repeatedly for Perkins Coie, a reputable law firm, and was deemed a dependable professional in their legal cases. Moreover, Perkins Coie has defended Mr. Obama in his legal jousts on the birth certificate matter over the past five years.” “Mr. Obama’s operatives cannot discredit him,” said Lt. Zullo. “Mr. Hayes has been used as the firm’s reliable expert. The very firm the president is using to defend him on the birth certificate case has used Mr. Hayes in their cases.” In addition, Mr. Hayes is a Democrat whose business is based in Hawaii. He cannot easily be accused of having a political axe to grind in this matter, explains Lt. Zullo.”

    Lol!!!!!

  158. avatar
    Ms D July 8, 2013 at 11:23 pm #

    Specifically to Dr. Conspiracy – and the others on your ‘blog’ that have done so to me – “Psychological abuse includes behaviours such as:
    Name calling,
    Yelling,
    Insulting the person,
    Threatening the person or threatening to take away something that is important to them,
    Imitating or mocking the person,
    Swearing at them,
    ETC.
    I ought to have known better than to have attempted to participate – - – - I TRULY believe that TRUTH will prevail – - perhaps not in my lifetime – - the best to you all

  159. avatar
    CarlOrcas July 8, 2013 at 11:31 pm #

    Ms D:
    Specifically to Dr. Conspiracy – and the others on your ‘blog’ that have done so to me –“Psychological abuse includes behaviours such as:
    Name calling,
    Yelling,
    Insulting the person,
    Threatening the person or threatening to take away something that is important to them,
    Imitating or mocking the person,
    Swearing at them, ETC.
    I ought to have known better than to have attempted to participate – – – – I TRULY believe that TRUTH will prevail – – perhaps not in my lifetime – – the best to you all

    Ms D,

    If you are what you say you are and if you really think you were psychologically abused here then I really suggest you seek some professional help. Really. Honest.

  160. avatar
    Dave B. July 8, 2013 at 11:35 pm #

    You spread lies. That’s not okay.

    Ms D:
    Specifically to Dr. Conspiracy – and the others on your ‘blog’ that have done so to me –“Psychological abuse includes behaviours such as:
    Name calling,
    Yelling,
    Insulting the person,
    Threatening the person or threatening to take away something that is important to them,
    Imitating or mocking the person,
    Swearing at them, ETC.
    I ought to have known better than to have attempted to participate – – – – I TRULY believe that TRUTH will prevail – – perhaps not in my lifetime – – the best to you all

  161. avatar
    jtmunkus July 8, 2013 at 11:36 pm #

    Let’s see, come to Mr. Davidson’s blog, spew a bunch of ridiculous lies, and get laughed at. Spew more lies, be corrected with facts over and over again, and present no facts to back up her lies, and she gets mocked. Determined to keep her eyes closed, except everyone was mean and now she won’t stick around to edumacate the Obama operatives on the fantasy web of birther reality, as she sees it.

    I hope Ms. D. lives hatefully ever after.

  162. avatar
    misha marinsky July 8, 2013 at 11:39 pm #

    Ms D: Specifically to Dr. Conspiracy – and the others on your ‘blog’ that have done so to me – “Psychological abuse includes behaviours such as:

    Get Seroquel and get help.

    Are you from Canada, or the UK?

  163. avatar
    misha marinsky July 8, 2013 at 11:41 pm #

    Ms D: I TRULY believe that TRUTH will prevail

    It has. Too bad you refuse to accept it.

  164. avatar
    MattR July 8, 2013 at 11:43 pm #

    Ms D: Specifically to Dr. Conspiracy – and the others on your ‘blog’ that have done so to me – “Psychological abuse includes behaviours such as:Name calling,Yelling,Insulting the person,Threatening the person or threatening to take away something that is important to them,Imitating or mocking the person,Swearing at them,ETC.I ought to have known better than to have attempted to participate – – – – I TRULY believe that TRUTH will prevail – – perhaps not in my lifetime – – the best to you all

    By focusing on the personal aspect of the comments, you choose to ignore all the facts that were included in those comments which indicated errors in your claims. If you were really interested in the truth prevailing, you would consider those facts and either concede that your original argument was wrong or offer some sort of counter argument or additional facts that refute what the commenters here have presented.

    For example, whether or not the name of the hospital was Kapiʻolani Maternity and Gynecological Hospital at time of President Obama’s birth is not in any way dependent on if people here said rude things to you. Have you looked at the actual evidence presented? Do you still think the name is wrong on his BC?

  165. avatar
    Rickey July 9, 2013 at 12:03 am #

    Ms D: “This is a key development, asserts Lt. Zullo, because Mr. Hayes is a certified handwriting analyst and forensic document examiner who worked repeatedly for Perkins Coie, a reputable law firm, and was deemed a dependable professional in their legal cases. Moreover, Perkins Coie has defended Mr. Obama in his legal jousts on the birth certificate matter over the past five years.” “Mr. Obama’s operatives cannot discredit him,” said Lt. Zullo. “Mr. Hayes has been used as the firm’s reliable expert. The very firm the president is using to defend him on the birth certificate case has used Mr. Hayes in their cases.” In addition, Mr. Hayes is a Democrat whose business is based in Hawaii. He cannot easily be accused of having a political axe to grind in this matter, explains Lt. Zullo.”

    Mike Zullo is an ignoramus and a liar.

    It is not at all unusual for experts to testify for a law firm in one case and against that same law firm in another case. I have been in the business for nearly 40 years and I have seen it happen many, many times.

    Also, Mr. Hayes is not a Democrat. Hawaii does not allow voters to register by party. You will notice that Hawaii’s voter registration form has no space for declaring a party affiliation.

    http://hawaii.gov/elections/forms/voter_pab_application_english.pdf

  166. avatar
    Rickey July 9, 2013 at 12:06 am #

    MattR: By focusing on the personal aspect of the comments, you choose to ignore all the facts that were included in those comments which indicated errors in your claims.If you were really interested in the truth prevailing, you would consider those facts and either concede that your original argument was wrong or offer some sort of counter argument or additional facts that refute what the commentors here have presented.

    Yes, “Ms.D” failed to provide a single substantive response to any of the corrections to her erroneous statements.

  167. avatar
    Dr Kenneth Noisewater July 9, 2013 at 12:10 am #

    Ms D:
    Specifically to Dr. Conspiracy – and the others on your ‘blog’ that have done so to me –“Psychological abuse includes behaviours such as:
    Name calling,
    Yelling,
    Insulting the person,
    Threatening the person or threatening to take away something that is important to them,
    Imitating or mocking the person,
    Swearing at them, ETC.
    I ought to have known better than to have attempted to participate – – – – I TRULY believe that TRUTH will prevail – – perhaps not in my lifetime – – the best to you all

    Doc she’s trolling. She should be in moderation until she answers our questions. Jumping from claim to claim isn’t productive to the overall discussion.

    Ms D you have no room to talk you’ve avoided specifics you don’t get to dictate to Doc C.

  168. avatar
    Dr Kenneth Noisewater July 9, 2013 at 12:11 am #

    gorefan: Man, what year is it?It feels like April, 2011.I image next Ms. D will be explaining how Kenya wasn’t called Kenya back in 1961.

    No I’m waiting for the it shouldn’t say “African-American” claim and instead negro despite it not saying African-American on it. Doc do you have the birther template for claims you’ve noticed? They usually follow a specific pattern.

  169. avatar
    sfjeff July 9, 2013 at 1:51 am #

    Curious George: World Tribune Reports– “As a precaution against others misusing or manipulating Mr. Hayes’s report, Lt. Zullo has copyrighted it.”
    A chapter in book number two to be presented to Congress? A copyright on someone else’s work product? Since when do you copyright evidence?

    When its not evidence….

  170. avatar
    sfjeff July 9, 2013 at 1:53 am #

    Ms D: Specifically to Dr. Conspiracy – and the others on your ‘blog’ that have done so to me – “Psychological abuse includes behaviours such as:
    Name calling,
    Yelling,
    Insulting the person,
    Threatening the person or threatening to take away something that is important to them,
    Imitating or mocking the person,
    Swearing at them,
    ETC.
    I ought to have known better than to have attempted to participate – – – – I TRULY believe that TRUTH will prevail – – perhaps not in my lifetime – – the best to you all

    Seriously- I know that sometimes refer to CAPS as yelling on the internet.

    But you do know don’t you- that written words really can’t yell at you?

  171. avatar
    richCares July 9, 2013 at 2:00 am #

    “Yes, “Ms.D” failed to provide a single substantive response to any of the corrections to her erroneous statements.”
    .
    this is true of almost all birthers (including scott e), stepping in all that poo must ruin their shoes. that “wrong hospital” name story is till wide spread on birther sites even though Nordyke’s BC and others show it to be BS, Ms D ignores that – strange!

  172. avatar
    misha marinsky July 9, 2013 at 2:41 am #

    sfjeff: written words really can’t yell at you?

    OH YEAH?!

  173. avatar
    The Magic M July 9, 2013 at 4:25 am #

    Curious George: World Tribune Reports– “As a precaution against others misusing or manipulating Mr. Hayes’s report, Lt. Zullo has copyrighted it.”

    Does that mean he will finally release the report? Or will he continue his current “I got it but I won’t show it” routine?

    Besides, that choice of words (“misusing”) sounds to me like he might want to publish it but then try to stifle all rebuttal by hitting everyone who quotes from the report with a cease-and-desist letter.

    Yup, sounds like completely normal law enforcement work. NOT.

  174. avatar
    The Magic M July 9, 2013 at 4:29 am #

    Dr Kenneth Noisewater: As has been pointed out the birthers hold up the Nordyke twins certificates as being real well they have the same hospital name on theirs.

    I haven’t heard any mention of the Nordykes on birther sites for ages. Either they have buried them in silence or they have followed Butterdezillion’s claims that *all* Hawaiian BC’s on the net (including the Nordykes) are forgeries.

  175. avatar
    Daniel July 9, 2013 at 4:40 am #

    Ms D:

    I ought to have known better than to have attempted to participate – – – – I TRULY believe that TRUTH will prevail – – perhaps not in my lifetime – – the best to you all

    You didn’t come here to participate. You came here to preach, to show us how wrong we were, and how smart you were. You got schooled. Deal with it.

    You don’t want truth to prevail. You want your delusions to be true. That’s two very different things. The universe doesn’t care what you want to be true. Deal with it.

  176. avatar
    Majority Will July 9, 2013 at 5:05 am #

    Ms D:
    Specifically to Dr. Conspiracy – and the others on your ‘blog’ that have done so to me –

    Posting lie after lie without acknowledging the refutations is known as trolling and it is abusive of your privilege to post as a guest on a privately owned blog. It is also obnoxious and childish behavior especially when you are clearly wrong but are too stubborn to admit you made a mistake.

    Blaming others for your lack of reading comprehension skills is just sad.

  177. avatar
    The Magic M July 9, 2013 at 9:10 am #

    Dr Kenneth Noisewater: Doc do you have the birther template for claims you’ve noticed? They usually follow a specific pattern.

    The choice which goalpost comes next is typically random, but they all eventually end up checking off the same items on the list.
    The common denominator is that they never discuss any item (or take 20 rebuttals as a sign that maybe their other 80 talking points are BS, too) but simply move to the next one. I usually call it the BS avalanche.

  178. avatar
    donna July 9, 2013 at 9:15 am #

    The Magic M: I haven’t heard any mention of the Nordykes on birther sites for ages. Either they have buried them in silence or they have followed Butterdezillion’s claims that *all* Hawaiian BC’s on the net (including the Nordykes) are forgeries.

    in fact, eleanor nordyke said “I have even been telephoned and told I was lying about Obama’s birth!”

    http://www.womensmediacenter.com/feature/entry/for-birthers-honolulu-mom-an-inconvenient-truth

    ‘New’ Witness to Obama’s American Birth

    http://www.forbes.com/sites/shenegotiates/2012/05/02/new-witness-obamas-american-birth/

    not only did eleanor say that her twins were in obama’s class at Punahou but another Punahou classmate (interviewed by Fox) also said the twins were in their class

    Obama Classmate Dishes to Fox News (transcript & video)

    http://nation.foxnews.com/president-obama/2013/01/04/obama-classmate-dishes-fox-news

  179. avatar
    Dr Kenneth Noisewater July 9, 2013 at 9:47 am #

    The Magic M: I haven’t heard any mention of the Nordykes on birther sites for ages. Either they have buried them in silence or they have followed Butterdezillion’s claims that *all* Hawaiian BC’s on the net (including the Nordykes) are forgeries.

    Well then if that’s the case they can’t claim the numbering is off on Obama’s BC since they used the Nordyke certificates as the basis for the claim

  180. avatar
    Dr Kenneth Noisewater July 9, 2013 at 9:55 am #

    The Magic M: The choice which goalpost comes next is typically random, but they all eventually end up checking off the same items on the list.The common denominator is that they never discuss any item (or take 20 rebuttals as a sign that maybe their other 80 talking points are BS, too) but simply move to the next one. I usually call it the BS avalanche.

    I prefer the BS shitstorm or a Sharknado
    http://cdn.bleedingcool.net/wp-content/uploads//2012/11/sharknado.jpg

  181. avatar
    Dave B. July 9, 2013 at 11:01 am #

    Next thing you know they’ll be ripping off our good friend Lupin and coming out with “Zombiecane!”.
    And I can hardly wait.

    Dr Kenneth Noisewater: I prefer the BS shitstorm or a Sharknado
    http://cdn.bleedingcool.net/wp-content/uploads//2012/11/sharknado.jpg

  182. avatar
    The Magic M July 9, 2013 at 11:17 am #

    Dr Kenneth Noisewater: Well then if that’s the case they can’t claim the numbering is off on Obama’s BC since they used the Nordyke certificates as the basis for the claim

    I haven’t seen a single birther talk about the BC number for months. All those who still refer to the BC are either hung up on “African” or sometimes “Kenya”. But very few still care about details anymore anyway.

  183. avatar
    donna July 9, 2013 at 11:39 am #

    Dr Kenneth Noisewater: Well then if that’s the case they can’t claim the numbering is off on Obama’s BC since they used the Nordyke certificates as the basis for the claim

    according to eleanor nordyke, “I entered the Kapiolani Maternity and Gynecological Hospital on early Friday afternoon, August 4, 1961. I was registered and my expected twins were given Hawaii State birth certificate numbers 10637 and 10638. My labor was slow with poor contractions from a distended uterus.”

    “Apparently, Stanley Ann Dunham Obama came in shortly after I arrived, because her baby was registered as number 10641. Her labor was strong, and she delivered Barack Hussein Obama early that evening. The next morning my contractions strengthened. The twins finally emerged at 2:05 and 2:12 p.m. Saturday, August 5th. By the way, I don’t want to do that again!”

    http://www.womensmediacenter.com/feature/entry/for-birthers-honolulu-mom-an-inconvenient-truth

  184. avatar
    scott e July 9, 2013 at 11:53 am #

    sfjeff: When its not evidence….

    you haven’t seen it j.

  185. avatar
    W. Kevin Vicklund July 9, 2013 at 11:54 am #

    Since I doubt that Ms. D understands how this blog works, I thought it best to let her know that her posts have not actually been deleted, but are being moved to the “Open Thread” – which is where off-topic conversations are permitted. The current open thread can be found at the following link:

    http://www.obamaconspiracy.org/2013/06/the-occasional-open-thread-pollyanna-edition/#comment-274747

    On topic: Thanks for the Eleanor Nordyke quote, donna. It addresses something I had long suspected but hadn’t seen confirmed.

  186. avatar
    scott e July 9, 2013 at 11:56 am #

    richCares:
    “Yes, “Ms.D” failed to provide a single substantive response to any of the corrections to her erroneous statements.”
    .
    this is true of almost all birthers (including scott e), stepping in all that poo must ruin their shoes. that “wrong hospital” name story is till wide spread on birther sites even though Nordyke’s BC and others show it to be BS, Ms D ignores that – strange!

    snopes got it wrong… this “they were both called queens” is a relatively new antibirther affectation.

    I came here to participate, and to use capital letters sparingly.

  187. avatar
    scott e July 9, 2013 at 11:58 am #

    Dr Kenneth Noisewater: Doc she’s trolling.She should be in moderation until she answers our questions.Jumping from claim to claim isn’t productive to the overall discussion.

    Ms D you have no room to talk you’ve avoided specifics you don’t get to dictate to Doc C.

    I have to agree, some of the regulars here seem more petulant, some can be very nice.
    some like to preach….

  188. avatar
    scott e July 9, 2013 at 12:01 pm #

    Dr. Conspiracy:
    No, they only verified the authenticity of all the information on it. Duh.

    If you don’t want to be taken for a birther, don’t walk in wearing a birther t-shirt, carrying the birther flag and humming the birther national anthem.

    what’s wrong with being taken for a birther. I have birther T-shirts doc.

  189. avatar
    scott e July 9, 2013 at 12:04 pm #

    Dr Kenneth Noisewater: Doc she’s trolling.She should be in moderation until she answers our questions.Jumping from claim to claim isn’t productive to the overall discussion.

    Ms D you have no room to talk you’ve avoided specifics you don’t get to dictate to Doc C.

    this is why i’m glad doc joined PF. just in case.

  190. avatar
    Majority Will July 9, 2013 at 12:05 pm #

    donna:
    Dr Kenneth Noisewater: Well then if that’s the case they can’t claim the numbering is off on Obama’s BC since they used the Nordyke certificates as the basis for the claim

    according to eleanor nordyke, “I entered the Kapiolani Maternity and Gynecological Hospital on early Friday afternoon, August 4, 1961. I was registered and my expected twins were given Hawaii State birth certificate numbers 10637 and 10638. My labor was slow with poor contractions from a distended uterus.”

    “Apparently, Stanley Ann Dunham Obama came in shortly after I arrived, because her baby was registered as number 10641. Her labor was strong, and she delivered Barack Hussein Obama early that evening. The next morning my contractions strengthened. The twins finally emerged at 2:05 and 2:12 p.m. Saturday, August 5th. By the way, I don’t want to do that again!”

    http://www.womensmediacenter.com/feature/entry/for-birthers-honolulu-mom-an-inconvenient-truth

    Great line from the article:

    “There’s no likely end to this story—only the lull in the debate until the next Trump climbs onto the pitcher’s mound. Cue the carnival barker.”

    Or birther clown car.

  191. avatar
    Dr Kenneth Noisewater July 9, 2013 at 12:09 pm #

    Majority Will: Great line from the article:“There’s no likely end to this story—only the lull in the debate until the next Trump climbs onto the pitcher’s mound. Cue the carnival barker.”Or birther clown car.

    I think the funniest part is where Eleanor explains that people call her and tell her she’s a liar about being there. She really destroys their claim by being a personal witness to Ann being in Hawaii and not being overseas.

  192. avatar
    scott e July 9, 2013 at 12:09 pm #

    Rickey: Leave a Reply

    Vermont does that too. but the antibirthers used political persuasion to embellish their case… right ??

  193. avatar
    Buscando La Verdad July 9, 2013 at 12:09 pm #

    OBAMA – AFRICA – http://devvy.net/pdf/nov08/exhibit1.pdf

    Affidavit Bishop Ron McRae

    [This is our Ms. D trying out a new identity, and dumping really outdated stuff in the wrong place again. Moved to the Open Thread. Doc]

  194. avatar
    donna July 9, 2013 at 12:18 pm #

    Dr Kenneth Noisewater: I think the funniest part is where Eleanor explains that people call her and tell her she’s a liar about being there. She really destroys their claim by being a personal witness to Ann being in Hawaii and not being overseas.

    also from the link “Obama and the Nordyke girls also wound up in the same classes at Noelani Elementary School and later at Punahou School from the seventh grade to graduation in 1979.”

    that was also mentioned in the fox interview with another classmate at Punahou:

    WATTERS: Now, last question. There was that controversy about his birth certificate. When you heard that, how did that make you feel when everybody was talking about that?

    BOWERS: I thought it was the most ridiculous debate I had ever seen. Because all of us were born in Hawaii at that time, we have the same birth certificates… If you happen to have kept the original one, which is a very thin extremely blackened out piece of paper with, you know, it’s very fragile, and what was even funnier was that our classmates, we have twins in our class, they were born right before then, literally their numbers in that hospital were right before his. Their mother knew the doctor who delivered him. So, we all felt that that was an extremely useless debate and wish that American hadn’t gone there.

    Read more: http://nation.foxnews.com/president-obama/2013/01/04/obama-classmate-dishes-fox-news#ixzz2YZ8kNxLu

  195. avatar
    scott e July 9, 2013 at 12:38 pm #

    Dr. Conspiracy:
    Well, I just scanned back through my articles here and skimmed the high points. While the Obots are not organized as a group, this web site is, I think, pretty well organized.

    http://www.obamaconspiracy.org/category/whoswho/mike-zullo/

    I particularly avoided look at Arduini’s “Annotated Zullo” because I thought it would be too easy.

    and you are a leader for them, organized.

    as for frank’s piece… don’t forget he wouldn’t tell me the names of the two “special police” he spoke to in Demerest NJ. mike told me he didn’t know any of the special police. frank got the definition of affidavit wrong, and on and on and so forth. where is the eminent mr. arduini lately?? joined the john woodman club ? gee, and things were getting more interesting… he posted my phone # at pf, then forgot or missed that he had. all i’m saying is the eppy/historian/wong dude ain’t perfect.

  196. avatar
    scott e July 9, 2013 at 12:41 pm #

    CarlOrcas: What could the President say, or do, in two minutes that would clear things up for you?

    showing his birth certificate and releasing records would be a great damn transparent start.

  197. avatar
    scott e July 9, 2013 at 12:45 pm #

    Loren: Eh, maybe.The write-in thing was fun the first time, but it lost a lot of luster the second time round.If I do it again, it’ll need to be on the ballot.

    BTW, I noticed a comment of yours from the other day where you said I never responded to your emails.I admit I’m not great on maintaining correspondence, but I checked, and I couldn’t find any emails of yours.Just thought I’d let you know.

    thanks man… you are a libertarian, no ??

  198. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy July 9, 2013 at 12:58 pm #

    I left a few comments.

    scott e: this is why i’m glad doc joined PF. just in case.

  199. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy July 9, 2013 at 12:59 pm #

    Ms. D denied being a birther. Try to follow the thread.

    scott e: what’s wrong with being taken for a birther. I have birther T-shirts doc.

  200. avatar
    scott e July 9, 2013 at 1:01 pm #

    Majority Will: Does that mean dark skinned people frighten you?

    ms. D is a good example of “people are just discovering this”. this story hasn’t lost it’s luster, that we are all here proves that. I haven’t noticed ms D using any profanity, or hurling personal insults. maybe in a different thread. I see you being arrogant and smug, you seem to enjoy your own impishness.

    even in the web address is written Obama conspiracy (theory). why do you let people who disagree with you in, just to drive them away, that nice miss Debbie from a few months ago comes to mind.

    I think more people getting interested in this subject even now is what scares you the most.

    it’s your sandbox (MW as a regular here, it’s really doc’s arena), do what you want, but what is your overall objective when it comes to civil discourse, let someone else be the bad cop for awhile… just saying. if you were so right and sure, would you even need to act like a bully. I notice most of you have a different persona on the radio, than you do here. why is that Will ??

  201. avatar
    scott e July 9, 2013 at 1:04 pm #

    Dr. Conspiracy:
    Ms. D denied being a birther. Try to follow the thread.

    I think she’s new enough not to know what that term really means, especially the way all of you use it. i’ll try to follow the thread.

  202. avatar
    scott e July 9, 2013 at 1:07 pm #

    Dr. Conspiracy:
    I left a few comments.

    you make good comments… here and there…

  203. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy July 9, 2013 at 1:07 pm #

    Ms D. Was here (under another ID) pasting stuff from Phil Berg and Sharon Rondeau back in February of 2012. She’s not “just discovering this” nor is she new to this site.

    Her Obama conspiracy theory web postings go back at least to January of 2012, including comments at such sites as:

    Orly Taitz Esq.
    Examiner.com
    We The People
    The National Patriot
    Minute Man News
    Reagan Coalition
    We Are Winning Our Great Country Back
    Butterdezillion
    gulag bound
    godfather politics
    Facebook Wayne Allyn Root
    The Obama Hussle
    Personal Liberty.com
    Glenn Beck
    Patriot Update
    Guns.com

    It’s not hard to see where she gets her alternative view of reality, living in the right-wing world of fantasy politics.

    Rather than discuss, she mostly just dumps things from birther web sites. I’m ill-disposed towards people who don’t represent their own views, but crib from others. I also do not appreciate people dumping stuff without taking into consideration the prior discussions of the topic here.

    scott e: ms. D is a good example of “people are just discovering this”. this story hasn’t lost it’s luster, that we are all here proves that. I haven’t noticed ms D using any profanity, or hurling personal insults. maybe in a different thread. I see you being arrogant and smug, you seem to enjoy your own impishness.

  204. avatar
    Dr Kenneth Noisewater July 9, 2013 at 1:07 pm #

    scott e: showing his birth certificate and releasing records would be a great damn transparent start.

    He did show his birth certificate you didn’t think that was good enough. So Scott did you think Romney was thoroughly vetted? When you were asked this on PF you begged the admins to remove the posts.

  205. avatar
    Dr Kenneth Noisewater July 9, 2013 at 1:09 pm #

    scott e: and you are a leader for them, organized.

    How is Doc a leader of anti-birthers. Does this mean you consider yourself a leader of the birthers since you run a website?

  206. avatar
    CarlOrcas July 9, 2013 at 1:10 pm #

    scott e: showing his birth certificate and releasing records would be a great damn transparent start.

    What birth certificate? I’ve seen several of them on the internet. Other than those what do you have in mind?

    What other “records”?

    And just how would those settle the matter for you?

  207. avatar
    Dr Kenneth Noisewater July 9, 2013 at 1:13 pm #

    scott e: ms. D is a good example of “people are just discovering this”. this story hasn’t lost it’s luster, that we are all here proves that. I haven’t noticed ms D using any profanity, or hurling personal insults. maybe in a different thread. I see you being arrogant and smug, you seem to enjoy your own impishness.

    Then you obviously don’t understand once again what the words you use mean. She’s not “just discovering this” she’s trolling. People who are just discovering would actually engage in an honest conversation instead of every time they’re questioned post entire articles by birthers in response.

    Come on Scotty don’t you should know your own troll ilk when you see them.

    I notice your personality on the radio seems to match yours here completely sniveling, avoiding real discussion and trolling.

  208. avatar
    Dr Kenneth Noisewater July 9, 2013 at 1:14 pm #

    scott e: I have to agree, some of the regulars here seem more petulant, some can be very nice.
    some like to preach….

    But hey at least the trolls are consistent right scott?

  209. avatar
    Dave B. July 9, 2013 at 1:35 pm #

    Barack Obama’s birth certificate revealed here
    June 16, 2008
    http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/washington/2008/06/obama-birth.html

    scott e: showing his birth certificate and releasing records would be a great damn transparent start.

  210. avatar
    sfjeff July 9, 2013 at 1:41 pm #

    scott e: you haven’t seen it j.

    Like I said- ‘whent its not evidence’

    Evidence doesn’t need to be copyrighted- and indeed if it is ‘evidence’ and presented to trial, I don’t know how any such copyright would stand- it would be in the public domain.

    Of course the only one who claims to have seen the ‘evidence’ is Mike Zullo.

    Which doesnt’ evoke confidence except in gullible Birthers

  211. avatar
    Dave B. July 9, 2013 at 1:42 pm #

    That should be “Ofuscando La Verdad.”

    Buscando La Verdad: [This is our Ms. D trying out a new identity, and dumping really outdated stuff in the wrong place again. Moved to the Open Thread. Doc]

  212. avatar
    sfjeff July 9, 2013 at 1:45 pm #

    scott e: ms. D is a good example of “people are just discovering this”. this story hasn’t lost it’s luster, that we are all here proves that. I haven’t noticed ms D using any profanity, or hurling personal insults. maybe in a different thread. I see you being arrogant and smug, you seem to enjoy your own impishness.even in the web address is written Obama conspiracy (theory). why do you let people who disagree with you in

    Scott- I would take your posts more seriously if I didn’t know that you will not engage in substantive debate- your claims of just looking for truth don’t hold much substance when you only will consider something to be ‘truth’ if it comes from a Birther source.

  213. avatar
    Dave B. July 9, 2013 at 1:45 pm #

    Well that’s ironic.

    scott e: some like to preach….

  214. avatar
    Dave B. July 9, 2013 at 1:53 pm #

    scott e: ms. D is a good example of “people are just discovering this”.

    And as it turns out, she exemplifies people who make that claim quite well:

    Dr. Conspiracy: Ms D. Was here (under another ID) pasting stuff from Phil Berg and Sharon Rondeau back in February of 2012. She’s not “just discovering this” nor is she new to this site.

  215. avatar
    dunstvangeet July 9, 2013 at 1:54 pm #

    scott e: showing his birth certificate and releasing records would be a great damn transparent start.

    So, if you see his “valid Hawaii state birth certificate”, then you’ll say that Obama is eligible to be President, and is the legitimate President of the United States?

  216. avatar
    Majority Will July 9, 2013 at 2:41 pm #

    Dave B.:
    That should be “Ofuscando La Verdad.”

    Or Difundir Las Mentiras.

  217. avatar
    Rickey July 9, 2013 at 3:42 pm #

    scott e: Vermont does that too. but the antibirthers used political persuasion to embellish their case… right ??

    I have no idea what you are referring to.

  218. avatar
    Rickey July 9, 2013 at 3:47 pm #

    scott e: and you are a leader for them, organized.

    Doc is a discussion leader and a facilitator, but not a leader of a group in the traditional sense.

  219. avatar
    Buscando La Verdad July 9, 2013 at 3:58 pm #

    3 Items -

    To misha marinsky – some information on Perkins Coie suing Orly Taitz – 1st response was June 8, 2013 Orly Taitz – 16 Responses to “Regime is reposting an article published right after the election, claiming that Bob Bauer’s Perkins Coie will sue me for defamation of Obama. In spite of 5 years of threats they did not do it, but be my guest, make my day, I’ll be entitled to subpoena all of Obama’s original birth records”

    To those who were correcting my ‘searching for the truth’ – Buscando La Verdad http://www.bing.com/translator/?ref=TThis&from=en&to=es&text=searching%20for%20the%20truth

    [Copyrighted material from the following source deleted. Doc]

    http://www.theobamafile.com/_eligibility/LingleLies.htm

    [I'm leaving this comment, off topic, on the Zullo thread so that Ms. D. might find it. Any other comments not dealing with the Zullo article will be moved to the Open Thread, which can always be found with the prominent Open Thread link in the menu bar on the site. I will comment that Governor Lingle knew that the President was born at Kapi'olani because she learned it at this secret meeting. Doc.]

  220. avatar
    Majority Will July 9, 2013 at 5:53 pm #

    Rickey: I have no idea what you are referring to.

    Something about Vermont, pancakes, punctuation and how Bill Ayers is to blame.

    Or maybe you’re being credited with the “Leave a Reply” comment section. Good work.

  221. avatar
    Buscando La Verdad July 9, 2013 at 6:09 pm #

    Dr. Conspiracy – - am I missing something here?? You’ve stated that ‘ Any other comments not dealing with the Zullo article will be moved to the Open Thread, which can always be found with the prominent Open Thread link in the menu bar on the site.” IMO there are numerous comments here that ‘fit’ your requirement – - -????

  222. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy July 9, 2013 at 6:14 pm #

    That’s your problem. You think things for convenience, not because you have a good reason to. Ms. D is a very experienced Internet commenter, and not new to this site either.

    scott e: I think she’s new enough not to know what that term really means

  223. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy July 9, 2013 at 6:20 pm #

    A large number of comments of yours that I moved do not in my view relate to the list of Items asked of Mike Zullo.

    Do you know Zullo personally? Is he paying you to comment here?

    Buscando La Verdad: Dr. Conspiracy – – am I missing something here??

  224. avatar
    Buscando La Verdad July 9, 2013 at 6:24 pm #

    Dr. Conspiracy – your #5 – Race codes for reporting the mother’s and father’s race on the standard Certificate of Live Birth in 1961 were the same codes and were as follows: (found in this website)

    http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-JhLdiQKzkTg/T05_bBIRffI/AAAAAAAAAR8/bA82gRWwX_g/s400/FathersRace_1960s.bmp

    Plus more – -

  225. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy July 9, 2013 at 6:31 pm #

    Buscando La Verdad:
    Dr. Conspiracy – your #5 – Race codes for reporting the mother’s and father’s race on the standard Certificate of Live Birth in 1961 were the same codes and were as follows: (found in this website)

    http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-JhLdiQKzkTg/T05_bBIRffI/AAAAAAAAAR8/bA82gRWwX_g/s400/FathersRace_1960s.bmp

    Plus more – -

    The race code image you linked came from the 1968-69 code manual. They are not the ones used in 1960-1. Zullo said that he had the 1961 manual, but he never produced it. He didn’t produce it because no 1961 manual with those codes exists. He lied. I know, because I do have the 1961 manual.

    I presume that this is why that Zullo has dropped all of the stuff that was so prominent in his 2nd press conference about the race codes in his subsequent interviews and his affidavit. He got caught.

  226. avatar
    Buscando La Verdad July 9, 2013 at 6:49 pm #

    AFFIDAVIT OF MICHAEL ZULLO

    [The rest of the ENTIRE ZULLO AFFIDAVIT deleted. You can read it here: http://www.scribd.com/doc/141557773/05-14-2013-AFFIDAVIT-OF-MICHAEL-ZULLO-HUGH-McINNISH-et-al-vs-BETH-CHAPMAN-in-her-capacity-as-Secretary-of-State-SUPREME-COURT-OF-ALABAMA-Case Doc.]

  227. avatar
    Buscando La Verdad July 9, 2013 at 7:14 pm #

    Statement from Mike Zullo re: his Affidavit – “This affidavit is the concise stating of the facts pertinent to the Alabama case and the Obama fraud case. The affidavit is thorough and factual – backed up by over a year and half of criminal investigation. The criminal investigation was conducted through the Maricopa County Sheriff’s office and the Cold Case Posse. This is not a ‘birther’ issue. The exact location of his birth is irrelevant at this point. The fact is that right now we have a criminal fraud case emanating from the White House. Someone fabricated a fake birth certificate. Now the questions are – Who did it? and Why did they have to do it? I have a feeling that the world will soon know the answers to those and many more questions.”

  228. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy July 9, 2013 at 7:19 pm #

    He lied.

    Buscando La Verdad: Statement from Mike Zullo re: his Affidavit – “This affidavit is the concise stating of the facts pertinent to the Alabama case and the Obama fraud case. The affidavit is thorough and factual

  229. avatar
    donna July 9, 2013 at 7:25 pm #

    Buscando La Verdad: Someone fabricated a fake birth certificate. Now the questions are – Who did it? and Why did they have to do it? I have a feeling that the world will soon know the answers to those and many more questions.”

    get out the handcuffs – the “forger” is the Xerox Workcentre 7655.

    http://nativeborncitizen.wordpress.com/2013/06/24/the-proof-forgery-done-by-xerox-workcentre-7655/#comment-64477

  230. avatar
    Jim July 9, 2013 at 7:48 pm #

    Buscando La Verdad:
    Statement from Mike Zullo re: his Affidavit –“This affidavit is the concise stating of the facts pertinent to the Alabama case and the Obama fraud case. The affidavit is thorough and factual – backed up by over a year and half of criminal investigation. The criminal investigation was conducted through the Maricopa County Sheriff’s office and the Cold Case Posse. This is not a ‘birther’ issue. The exact location of his birth is irrelevant at this point. The fact is that right now we have a criminal fraud case emanating from the White House. Someone fabricated a fake birth certificate. Now the questions are – Who did it? and Why did they have to do it? I have a feeling that the world will soon know the answers to those and many more questions.”

    You might want to read a breakdown of Zullo’s daffydavit. Shows how little he truly can testify to.

    http://www.scribd.com/doc/116752480/The-Annotated-Zullo

  231. avatar
    Squeeky Fromm, Girl Reporter July 9, 2013 at 8:02 pm #

    Or maybe Buscando la Verde could just get it straight from the horse’s rear end:

    “I know [Taitz] had 20-some-odd court cases on this very issue and maybe now she’s feeling very threatened,” Zullo said. “There is not enough evidence to convict him on jaywalking … let alone anything else.”

    http://missionviejo.patch.com/groups/politics-and-elections/p/orly-taitz-criticized-by-sheriff-joe-arpaios-cold-case-posse

    That would just cut out the middle women and men, wouldn’t it???

    Squeeky Fromm
    Girl Reporter

  232. avatar
    Reality Check July 9, 2013 at 8:07 pm #

    Zullo is such a liar there is an entire Facebook page devoted to documenting his lies. https://www.facebook.com/TheLiesOfMikeZullo

  233. avatar
    Majority Will July 9, 2013 at 8:08 pm #

    Buscando La Verdad: Statement from Mike Zullo

    How long have you worked for Mike Zullo? Are there fringe benefits?

  234. avatar
    Joey July 9, 2013 at 8:22 pm #

    Personally, I can’t wait for the ruling in the Alabama Supreme Court appeal because that particular case is an all-Republican affair. Both the plaintiffs and the defendants are Republicans and every member of the Alabama Supreme Court is a Republican as well.
    If the defendant, the Republican Secretary of State of Alabama, Beth Chapman prevails (which I expect she will), it will be a conservative Republican in a deep red southern state successfully defending the eligibility (de jure) of President Obama.
    If the plaintiffs somehow manage to come out victorious (after all, it IS Alabama!), then the Secretary of State will get one of those Letters of Verification in Lieu of Certified Copy from Hawaii’s state Registrar and she will declare that President Obama was indeed eligible for the 2012 ballot (in a state won handily by Romney anyway). The Republican Secretaries of State in Arizona (Bennett) and Kansas (Kobach) already got Verification letters from the Hawaii state Registrar, Alvin T, Onaka.
    This appeal is a “win-win” for Obots and anti-birthers.

  235. avatar
    Squeeky Fromm, Girl Reporter July 9, 2013 at 8:24 pm #

    Reality Check:
    Zullo is such a liar there is an entire Facebook page devoted to documenting his lies. https://www.facebook.com/TheLiesOfMikeZullo

    True. But, Zullo is a GREAT dancer!

    http://birtherthinktank.files.wordpress.com/2013/07/zullo-in-lederhosen-hotpants1.jpg

    Squeeky Fromm
    Girl Reporter

  236. avatar
    Reality Check July 9, 2013 at 8:25 pm #

    :lol: Nice legs!

  237. avatar
    Reality Check July 9, 2013 at 8:30 pm #

    Squeeky

    I hope it is OK but I “borrowed” that image of the dancing Zullo to use as one of the scrolling photos for the show tonight.

  238. avatar
    Squeeky Fromm, Girl Reporter July 9, 2013 at 8:42 pm #

    Reality Check:
    Squeeky

    I hope it is OK but I “borrowed” that image of the dancing Zullo to use as one of the scrolling photos for the show tonight.

    Borrow, smorrow. You can have and use any of my stuff whenever you need it.

    Squeeky Fromm
    Girl Reporter

  239. avatar
    misha marinsky July 9, 2013 at 8:55 pm #

    Buscando La Verdad: Someone fabricated a fake birth certificate.

    I was the one who did it.

    Buscando La Verdad: Now the questions are –… Why did they have to do it?

    I took the fall for Soros, that’s why.

    Buscando La Verdad: Why did they have to do it?

    To show the behind-the-scenes power of the International Jewish Conspiracy™.

  240. avatar
    Rickey July 9, 2013 at 9:41 pm #

    Buscando La Verdad:
    “The fact is that right now we have a criminal fraud case emanating from the White House.”

    Yet Zullo is unable to cite a specific statute which has been broken, and the Maricopa County District Attorney has informed him that his “evidence” is mere speculation.

  241. avatar
    Majority Will July 10, 2013 at 12:03 am #

    Rickey: Yet Zullo is unable to cite a specific statute which has been broken, and the Maricopa County District Attorney has informed him that his “evidence” is mere speculation.

    You would think the brighter members of the birther klan would ask why.

    They can’t all be completely clueless, right?

  242. avatar
    Benji Franklin July 10, 2013 at 2:23 am #

    Buscando La Verdad: “This affidavit is the concise stating of the facts pertinent to the Alabama case and the Obama fraud case.

    No, it’s an overlong, deliberate attempt to mislead Congress into sponsoring a racist fishing expedition looking for dirt on Obama. Terming “forgery”, an Internet conveyed PDF likeness of Obama’s birth certificate, which was never submitted to any governmental agency as proof of anything, but whose vital information Hawaii has confirmed as matching that on the original, is so idiotic, even members of Congress will see Zullos’ scam for what it is – Zullos’ scam.

  243. avatar
    The Magic M July 10, 2013 at 4:32 am #

    Dr. Conspiracy: I presume that this is why that Zullo has dropped all of the stuff that was so prominent in his 2nd press conference about the race codes in his subsequent interviews and his affidavit. He got caught.

    This is likely what motivated his entire “all my new evidence is sekrit now” strategy he’s been pursuing ever since.

    He is desperate to prevent the “VIP’s” he wants to address from reading any thorough debunking of his claims on the internet. He’s been misleading before, but now it seems he thinks bald-faced lies are his only hope, and he can’t have those exposed.

  244. avatar
    Bovril July 10, 2013 at 5:06 am #

    Now Busty,

    You are aware I trust that the daffydavid of Grand Mufti Zullo is in point of fact 80+% direct and in many case word for word lifts out of Jerome Corsi various “releases”

    In which case, the vast majority of much of the “information” is in point of fact dated and arrant speculation by a further removed individual.

    As such when Panjandrum Zullo swears to direct knowledge he is lying like a rug

  245. avatar
    The Magic M July 10, 2013 at 6:03 am #

    And it shows once more how he is not “law enforcement”, because real law enforcement knows that “I reads it on the intertubes” is not personal knowledge.

    Reminds me of a guy on my favourite law forum the other day. He had a secret tape recording that was inadmissible as evidence and asked if it would become admissible if he just had someone listen to the tape and then testify to its contents. At least that guy was inventive. ;)

  246. avatar
    Keith July 10, 2013 at 7:54 am #

    Bovril: As such when Panjandrum Zullo swears to direct knowledge he is lying like the rug on Donald Trumps head

    FIFY

  247. avatar
    scott e July 10, 2013 at 12:36 pm #

    Dr. Conspiracy:
    Ms D. Was here (under another ID) pasting stuff from Phil Berg and Sharon Rondeau back in February of 2012. She’s not “just discovering this” nor is she new to this site.

    Her Obama conspiracy theory web postings go back at least to January of 2012, including comments at such sites as:

    Orly Taitz Esq.
    Examiner.com
    We The People
    The National Patriot
    Minute Man News
    Reagan Coalition
    We Are Winning Our Great Country Back
    Butterdezillion
    gulag bound
    godfather politics
    Facebook Wayne Allyn Root
    The Obama Hussle
    Personal Liberty.com
    Glenn Beck
    Patriot Update
    Guns.com

    It’s not hard to see where she gets her alternative view of reality, living in the right-wing world of fantasy politics.

    Rather than discuss, she mostly just dumps things from birther web sites. I’m ill-disposed towards people who don’t represent their own views, but crib from others. I also do not appreciate people dumping stuff without taking into consideration the prior discussions of the topic here.

    fair enough, this community is growing faster than I can keep up.

  248. avatar
    scott e July 10, 2013 at 12:40 pm #

    Dr Kenneth Noisewater: He did show his birth certificate you didn’t think that was good enough.So Scott did you think Romney was thoroughly vetted?When you were asked this on PF you begged the admins to remove the posts.

    I haven’t begged anyone for anything. my position has always been all candidates have to be treated equally, irrespective of colour race religion or political persuasion, sexual orientation… etc..
    can you substantiate your claim that I begged the PF admin to “remove my posts” ??

  249. avatar
    scott e July 10, 2013 at 12:45 pm #

    Dr Kenneth Noisewater: How is Doc a leader of anti-birthers.Does this mean you consider yourself a leader of the birthers since you run a website?

    because he has this website where people collect to discuss the topic, and to be informed. he is one of the eminent experts on the subject, he has a substantial web presence. he runs a well organized shop, I think it’s great.

    as for me ? I would certainly like to be considered a leader of the birthers, because it’s something I really believe in, just as all of you do. this is America, we get to do that.

    I am just high profile enough to get a few death threats (actually quite a few over the years), not all for the birther role, get called names and be excoriated.

    but being a “leader” is something I will continue to aspire to.

  250. avatar
    scott e July 10, 2013 at 12:53 pm #

    CarlOrcas: What birth certificate? I’ve seen several of them on the internet. Other than those what do you have in mind?

    What other “records”?

    And just how would those settle the matter for you?

    he turned down five million dollars to show his grades. my instinct tells me that with his ego, if everything was copacetic, he would have ridden that wave.

  251. avatar
    scott e July 10, 2013 at 12:57 pm #

    Dr Kenneth Noisewater: Then you obviously don’t understand once again what the words you use mean.She’s not “just discovering this” she’s trolling.People who are just discovering would actually engage in an honest conversation instead of every time they’re questioned post entire articles by birthers in response.

    Come on Scotty don’t you should know your own troll ilk when you see them.

    I notice your personality on the radio seems to match yours here completely sniveling, avoiding real discussion and trolling.

    that’s ok kenneth…

  252. avatar
    scott e July 10, 2013 at 1:00 pm #

    Dr Kenneth Noisewater: But hey at least the trolls are consistent right scott?

    troll seems like a cop out term to me. I was called a “concern troll” when I arrived. I looked at the definition, and I think you guys had it wrong. anyway sticks and stones Kenneth. doesn’t bother me. the ridicule ship set sail a long time ago.

  253. avatar
    scott e July 10, 2013 at 1:02 pm #

    Majority Will: Something about Vermont, pancakes, punctuation and how Bill Ayers is to blame.

    Or maybe you’re being credited with the “Leave a Reply” comment section. Good work.

    Vermont doesn’t ask for party affiliation… to register.

  254. avatar
    scott e July 10, 2013 at 1:04 pm #

    sfjeff: Scott- I would take your posts more seriously if I didn’t know that you will not engage in substantive debate- your claims of just looking for truth don’t hold much substance when you only will consider something to be ‘truth’ if it comes from a Birther source.

    I don’t need your approval j. here or there. let’s just see what happens.

  255. avatar
    scott e July 10, 2013 at 1:06 pm #

    dunstvangeet: So, if you see his “valid Hawaii state birth certificate”, then you’ll say that Obama is eligible to be President, and is the legitimate President of the United States?

    I think he’s all that now. I want to know if anyone in the administration used the power of the office to conceal or destroy anything that may tell a different story than the one we know now.

  256. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy July 10, 2013 at 1:10 pm #

    I think the distinction lies between “leader of the birthers” and “leading birther.”

    scott e: as for me ? I would certainly like to be considered a leader of the birthers, because it’s something I really believe in, just as all of you do. this is America, we get to do that.

  257. avatar
    scott e July 10, 2013 at 1:11 pm #

    Rickey: Doc is a discussion leader and a facilitator, but not a leader of a group in the traditional sense.

    i’m ok with that. foggy and RC are leaders too, community organisers if you will. loren, NBC, the oh for goodness sake lady, kerchner, gallups, woodman, gillar… and so forth.

  258. avatar
    scott e July 10, 2013 at 1:13 pm #

    Dr. Conspiracy:
    A large number of comments of yours that I moved do not in my view relate to the list of Items asked of Mike Zullo.

    Do you know Zullo personally? Is he paying you to comment here?

    I know zullo personally, no dough though.

  259. avatar
    Jim July 10, 2013 at 1:13 pm #

    scott e: I think he’s all that now. I want to know if anyone in the administration used the power of the office to conceal or destroy anything that may tell a different story than the one we know now.

    I’m still waiting for the opposition to come up with any proof that the President was born anywhere but Hawaii. So far, they’ve come up empty.

    BTW, for the first election it would have been the Bush administration that was doing the coverup and destruction that you imagine.

  260. avatar
    scott e July 10, 2013 at 1:14 pm #

    Dr. Conspiracy:
    That’s your problem. You think things for convenience, not because you have a good reason to. Ms. D is a very experienced Internet commenter, and not new to this site either.

    I stand corrected, thanks.

  261. avatar
    scott e July 10, 2013 at 1:20 pm #

    Dr. Conspiracy:
    I think the distinction lies between “leader of the birthers” and “leading birther.”

    me too.

  262. avatar
    sfjeff July 10, 2013 at 1:20 pm #

    scott e: I don’t need your approval j. here or there. let’s just see what happens.

    Oh certainly you don’t need my approval or particularly appreciate my analysis of your posts.

    But you keep posting, and occasionally I feel like posting why I don’t take your posts seriously- and rarely respond to them anymore.

    As far as ‘lets see what happens’- if history is any teacher- nothing is going to happen- nothing of any significance or relevance.

  263. avatar
    Rickey July 10, 2013 at 1:20 pm #

    scott e: I think he’s all that now. I want to know if anyone in the administration used the power of the office to conceal or destroy anything that may tell a different story than the one we know now.

    What “anything” are you looking for which would in any way be related to Obama’s eligibility? Please be specific.

  264. avatar
    sfjeff July 10, 2013 at 1:22 pm #

    scott e: he turned down five million dollars to show his grades. my instinct tells me that with his ego, if everything was copacetic, he would have ridden that wave.

    No, Obama never turned down anything.

    My instinct tells me that Donald Trump is an egotistic liar.

  265. avatar
    Rickey July 10, 2013 at 1:23 pm #

    scott e: I know zullo personally, no dough though.

    Please ask him to cite the specific statute which he believes has been broken, assuming that the LFBC is indeed a forgery.

    We have dozens of other questions to ask him, but let’s start with this one.

  266. avatar
    Rickey July 10, 2013 at 1:26 pm #

    scott e: he turned down five million dollars to show his grades. my instinct tells me that with his ego, if everything was copacetic, he would have ridden that wave.

    Trump never would have paid off, just like Farah refused to pay when the LFBC was released.

    How many other presidents have released their college grades? How many other presidents and presidential candidates have you demanded to see their grades? Please be specific.

  267. avatar
    scott e July 10, 2013 at 1:27 pm #

    Rickey: Please ask him to cite the specific statute which he believes has been broken, assuming that the LFBC is indeed a forgery.

    We have dozens of other questions to ask him, but let’s start with this one.

    I think that’s the plan.

  268. avatar
    Rickey July 10, 2013 at 1:28 pm #

    scott e: Vermont doesn’t ask for party affiliation… to register.

    Can I assume then that you concede that Zullo lied when he said that Reed Hayes is a Democrat?

  269. avatar
    scott e July 10, 2013 at 1:29 pm #

    Rickey: Trump never would have paid off, just like Farah refused to pay when the LFBC was released.

    How many other presidents have released their college grades? How many other presidents and presidential candidates have you demanded to see their grades? Please be specific.

    I don’t start my sentences with “I demand”. he has every right to keep private his records, that has been the precedent. you can’t be selective according to political bent.

  270. avatar
    scott e July 10, 2013 at 1:31 pm #

    Rickey: Can I assume then that you concede that Zullo lied when he said that Reed Hayes is a Democrat?

    it’s irrelevant, same as laura lingle.

  271. avatar
    scott e July 10, 2013 at 1:32 pm #

    sfjeff: Oh certainly you don’t need my approval or particularly appreciate my analysis of your posts.

    But you keep posting, and occasionally I feel like posting why I don’t take your posts seriously- and rarely respond to them anymore.

    As far as ‘lets see what happens’- if history is any teacher- nothing is going to happen- nothing of any significance or relevance.

    I enjoy you analysis j. we’ve been at this for years. you know I like you.

  272. avatar
    The Magic M July 10, 2013 at 1:32 pm #

    scott e: he turned down five million dollars to show his grades.

    Playing the Donald’s game would’ve set a dangerous precedent.

    Next a billionaire offers 10 million to charity if the President went on national TV and said “I hate the gays”.
    Then a billionaire offers 100 million to charity if the President dances naked on the steps of the WH.

    I mean, how can the President refuse? IT’S FOR THE CHILDREN! DOES HE NOT CARE?

    Besides, since when does anyone trust the guy whose “investigators who can’t believe what they’re finding” never existed? Playing Trump’s game would’ve been “fool me twice… won’t get fooled again” (GWB).

  273. avatar
    Kiwiwriter July 10, 2013 at 1:36 pm #

    The Magic M: Playing the Donald’s game would’ve set a dangerous precedent.

    Next a billionaire offers 10 million to charity if the President went on national TV and said “I hate the gays”.
    Then a billionaire offers 100 million to charity if the President dances naked on the steps of the WH.

    I mean, how can the President refuse? IT’S FOR THE CHILDREN! DOES HE NOT CARE?

    Besides, since when does anyone trust the guy whose “investigators who can’t believe what they’re finding” never existed? Playing Trump’s game would’ve been “fool me twice… won’t get fooled again” (GWB).

    Not to mention that given Trump’s history, that check might bounce.

    He’s the master of “bait and switch.” Ask all his ex-wives, who signed pre-nuptial agreements and got dumped right before they could collect.

  274. avatar
    Dave B. July 10, 2013 at 1:37 pm #

    If it’s your “instinct” that has led you to birtherism, you’ve got an instinct problem.

    scott e: my instinct tells me that with his ego, if everything was copacetic, he would have ridden that wave.

  275. avatar
    CarlOrcas July 10, 2013 at 1:40 pm #

    scott e: he turned down five million dollars to show his grades. my instinct tells me that with his ego, if everything was copacetic, he would have ridden that wave.

    And…………………..if he had played Trump’s silly game you would have been criticizing him for being a publicity hound.

    And, while we’re at it…..how about answers to the real questions:

    What birth certificate? I’ve seen several of them on the internet. Other than those what do you have in mind?

    What other “records”?

  276. avatar
    Dr Kenneth Noisewater July 10, 2013 at 1:41 pm #

    scott e: I haven’t begged anyone for anything. my position has always been all candidates have to be treated equally, irrespective of colour race religion or political persuasion, sexual orientation… etc..
    can you substantiate your claim that I begged the PF admin to “remove my posts” ??

    Ah yes Scott the admins hadn’t been in the thread forever and the moment you’re put on the spot they removed the posts. You couldn’t answer a simple question and you ran as you always do. Okay so was Romney thoroughly vetted Scott?

  277. avatar
    Dr Kenneth Noisewater July 10, 2013 at 1:42 pm #

    scott e: because he has this website where people collect to discuss the topic, and to be informed. he is one of the eminent experts on the subject, he has a substantial web presence. he runs a well organized shop, I think it’s great.

    as for me ? I would certainly like to be considered a leader of the birthers, because it’s something I really believe in, just as all of you do. this is America, we get to do that.

    I am just high profile enough to get a few death threats (actually quite a few over the years), not all for the birther role, get called names and be excoriated.

    but being a “leader” is something I will continue to aspire to.

    So that makes you a leader because you own a website. Yes we know you’re a true believer even though you have no real reason to believe the way you do. Have you been calling in death threats to yourself again Scotty?

  278. avatar
    CarlOrcas July 10, 2013 at 1:43 pm #

    scott e: I want to know if anyone in the administration used the power of the office to conceal or destroy anything that may tell a different story than the one we know now.

    How do you propose to do that?

  279. avatar
    Dr Kenneth Noisewater July 10, 2013 at 1:45 pm #

    scott e: he turned down five million dollars to show his grades. my instinct tells me that with his ego, if everything was copacetic, he would have ridden that wave.

    Tell me Scotty what does showing his grades have to do with the qualifications to be President under the constitution? You do realize it would have been considered a bribe to accept Donald’s nonserious offer. You notice the caveat Donald put in his “offer”? It had to be to his satisfaction. Donald also claimed if only Obama released the long form it would all go away and Donald trump proved himself a liar. So by your logic every other president wasn’t copacetic since they didn’t show you diddly squat?

    It’s funny how you continue your show us your papers boy mentality without realizing how ridiculous it makes you look

  280. avatar
    CarlOrcas July 10, 2013 at 1:45 pm #

    scott e: I know zullo personally, no dough though.

    Are you a member of the Cold Case Posse? Or any other MCSO posses? Do you know who the other members of the Cold Case Posse are? Have you seen their work product?

    What does Zullo tell you about his position and authority?

  281. avatar
    Dr Kenneth Noisewater July 10, 2013 at 1:46 pm #

    scott e: troll seems like a cop out term to me. I was called a “concern troll” when I arrived. I looked at the definition, and I think you guys had it wrong. anyway sticks and stones Kenneth. doesn’t bother me. the ridicule ship set sail a long time ago.

    You mean like how you refuse to answer any direct questions scott? Everytime you’re asked a direct question you run from it. You don’t engage that’s a troll. Obviously it does bother you as you whined about it on RC’s show a while back.

  282. avatar
    Dr Kenneth Noisewater July 10, 2013 at 1:47 pm #

    scott e: I think he’s all that now. I want to know if anyone in the administration used the power of the office to conceal or destroy anything that may tell a different story than the one we know now.

    Feel free to use your imagination it never stopped you from believing nonsense before.

  283. avatar
    Dr Kenneth Noisewater July 10, 2013 at 1:48 pm #

    scott e: I know zullo personally, no dough though.

    No surprise shady individuals seem to stick pretty close together it’s what you guys have in common with fecal matter.

  284. avatar
    Yoda July 10, 2013 at 1:58 pm #

    The Magic M: Playing the Donald’s game would’ve set a dangerous precedent.

    Next a billionaire offers 10 million to charity if the President went on national TV and said “I hate the gays”.
    Then a billionaire offers 100 million to charity if the President dances naked on the steps of the WH.

    I mean, how can the President refuse? IT’S FOR THE CHILDREN! DOES HE NOT CARE?

    Besides, since when does anyone trust the guy whose “investigators who can’t believe what they’re finding” never existed? Playing Trump’s game would’ve been “fool me twice… won’t get fooled again” (GWB).

    Birthers have never understood the consequences of their demands and what would happen to the office of the Presidency if Obama kowtowed to their ridiculous demands or the Country itself if a certified copy of a BC is not given full faith and credit.

  285. avatar
    Squeeky Fromm, Girl Reporter July 10, 2013 at 2:12 pm #

    Here is a photo of the “high” government official and Zullo”

    http://birtherthinktank.files.wordpress.com/2013/07/zullo-and-high-govt-official_phixr.jpg

    Squeeky Fromm
    Girl Reporter

  286. avatar
    scott e July 10, 2013 at 2:16 pm #

    Rickey: What “anything” are you looking for which would in any way be related to Obama’s eligibility? Please be specific.

    this is only an hour show. but here are a few. why are mainstream media centers providing disinformation or no information. why can’t someone post a photo of other draft reg’s w/two digit year. why did gibbs lie to the media about bilderberg meeting.
    why did the pressroom drown out les kinsolving as shown in my video “one lone voice”, gibbs never answers. axelrod’s “their kids went to school together.” his associations with wright, rezko etc. why hadn’t michelle robinson ever heard of bill ayers growing up, with her political family, as assistant to mayor daley.

    this is a good time to say it isn’t just the birth certificate, it’s everything. I think Benghazi is still outstanding. guns for tequila, why natural born and born became the same, and why people declare the discussion over yet the supreme court has never defined natural born according to wikepedia.

    why did the president need a special waiver to get his 2nd certificate ?

    but for me it’s always been the give and take between all of us. there seems to be more pushback than necessary for such a trivial dead non issue. it’s become a cult and a cottage industry.

    let me think about this and add more later. the fact is, is that no one has been able to crack the egg, to all of your credit. all i’m saying is that there are always new discoveries (as w/the Xerox thing). if everything is right and the science proves out, history will show everything eventually. I think the administration is corrupt. I think we’ll here more about intimidation, coercion, etc.

    this is just me, I have to admit, that while I have communicated with just about all of the players, I continue to operate on gut feeling and hunches and instinct. all very unscientific. but there is something about all of it that keeps me compelled.

    I’ll try to gather more specific things that I’ve red flagged over the years. I don’t know everything, but I think mr. zullo does, as does dr. corsi and a few others.

  287. avatar
    Daniel July 10, 2013 at 2:18 pm #

    scott e: i’m ok with that. foggy and RC are leaders too, community organisers if you will.

    Now you’re weaseling between definitions. There’s a huge difference between someone who runs a blog, like Doc or Foggy, and someone who is a “Community Organizer”

    You need for anti-birthers to be a formed group, organized and run from an HQ type of setup, because that’s what you need in order for your “conspiracy” to make sense. You birthers appear to want this to be two opposing armies, locked in battle, fighting and clawing for every inch of ground, with the “Patriotic and righteous” birthers valiantly struggling against the “forces of evil”, the “paid obots” we hear so much about from your side.

    The reality is far, far different. We anti-birthers are not led, we gather. We come together naturally by gravity to places where we can collectively giggle at the ridiculous antics of the birthers. We are not organized or led, any more than a bunch of sports fans who happen to show up at the same bar to watch the same game are “organized and led” by some nefarious evil-sporter.

    And if one were to examine the situation critically, it’s not a case of two armies, locked in mortal combat. The birther “issue” can be more aptly described as a few deluded birthers in cardboard armor with macaroni swords, stumbling about on a playing field, poking futiley at models of windmills and poorly sewn strawmen, while a few anti-birthers sit in the bleachers laughing at the spectacle. The bleachers are mostly empty because, other than a few of us who find your wandering staggers-and-jags entertaining….. nobody else cares.

  288. avatar
    scott e July 10, 2013 at 2:21 pm #

    The Magic M: Playing the Donald’s game would’ve set a dangerous precedent.

    Next a billionaire offers 10 million to charity if the President went on national TV and said “I hate the gays”.
    Then a billionaire offers 100 million to charity if the President dances naked on the steps of the WH.

    I mean, how can the President refuse? IT’S FOR THE CHILDREN! DOES HE NOT CARE?

    Besides, since when does anyone trust the guy whose “investigators who can’t believe what they’re finding” never existed? Playing Trump’s game would’ve been “fool me twice… won’t get fooled again” (GWB).

    I have to agree, as president he shouldn’t respond to such an offer, maybe afterwards, just for fun.

  289. avatar
    scott e July 10, 2013 at 2:26 pm #

    Rickey: Can I assume then that you concede that Zullo lied when he said that Reed Hayes is a Democrat?

    you can assume. did mike say “registered” ? there are lots of democrats in Vermont. has mr. hayes ever been affiliated w/ that party ? that seems nit picky to me. again, irrelevant. I;ve heard your side craft their message in the very same way.

  290. avatar
    scott e July 10, 2013 at 2:28 pm #

    Dr Kenneth Noisewater: Tell me Scotty what does showing his grades have to do with the qualifications to be President under the constitution?You do realize it would have been considered a bribe to accept Donald’s nonserious offer.You notice the caveat Donald put in his “offer”?It had to be to his satisfaction.Donald also claimed if only Obama released the long form it would all go away and Donald trump proved himself a liar.So by your logic every other president wasn’t copacetic since they didn’t show you diddly squat?

    It’s funny how you continue your show us your papers boy mentality without realizing how ridiculous it makes you look

    that’s fine Kenneth.

  291. avatar
    scott e July 10, 2013 at 2:39 pm #

    Dr Kenneth Noisewater: Ah yes Scott the admins hadn’t been in the thread forever and the moment you’re put on the spot they removed the posts.You couldn’t answer a simple question and you ran as you always do.Okay so was Romney thoroughly vetted Scott?

    are you able to substantiate that I begged the administration to pull my posts ? did they ? can you link us to that ? the only mod I know of is shiva (?), whom is certainly not a birther. please enlighten us, and remind us of how you can know the backstage goings on at PF ? that would be interesting too. I can truthfully say that I have never asked a mod on any forum ever to remove my posts, much less begged. I have corrected lots of posts within the allotted time, I have deleted posts myself, primarily because of duplication. I have on occasion reported vicious vulgar racist posts, every now and then, mindless persecution, ala alinsky for example.

    was Romney thoroughly vetted ? I honestly don’t know. I think part of the problem is that very definition. there is no or there are minimal legal standards, right ?. I stand by my always constant position that all candidates be vetted equally, that any information that may arrive is fair game, that goes for anyone and everyone. as long as no one is hiding something incriminating, there should be no problem.

    I thought reid broadcasting from the senate floor that Romney hadn’t paid his taxes for ten years was inappropriate. my immediate thought was, “wouldn’t the IRS know about that?”. it seemed political to me.

  292. avatar
    scott e July 10, 2013 at 2:46 pm #

    Daniel: Now you’re weaseling between definitions. There’s a huge difference between someone who runs a blog, like Doc or Foggy, and someone who is a “Community Organizer”

    You need for anti-birthers to be a formed group, organized and run from an HQ type of setup, because that’s what you need in order for your “conspiracy” to make sense. You birthers appear to want this to be two opposing armies, locked in battle, fighting and clawing for every inch of ground, with the “Patriotic and righteous” birthers valiantly struggling against the “forces of evil”, the “paid obots” we hear somuch about from your side.

    The reality is far, far different. We anti-birthers are not led, we gather. We come together naturally by gravity to places where we can collectively giggle at the ridiculous antics of the birthers. We are not organized or led, any more than a bunch of sports fans who happen to show up at the same bar to watch the same game are “organized and led” by some nefarious evil-sporter.

    And if one were to examine the situation critically, it’s not a case of two armies, locked in mortal combat. The birther “issue” can be more aptly described as a few deluded birthers in cardboard armor with macaroni swords, stumbling about on a playing field, poking futiley at models of windmills and poorly sewn strawmen, while a few anti-birthers sit in the bleachers laughing at the spectacle. The bleachers are mostly empty because, other than a few of us who find your wandering staggers-and-jags entertaining….. nobody else cares.

    it’s all good, I meant no disrespect.

  293. avatar
    W. Kevin Vicklund July 10, 2013 at 3:05 pm #

    scott e: he turned down five million dollars to show his grades. my instinct tells me that with his ego, if everything was copacetic, he would have ridden that wave.

    No, he was offered $5 million to show his grades AND his college applications (destroyed by school policy in the 1980s) AND his passports (passports are only valid for 10 years or so, do you hang on to the old ones) AND his passport applications (which he doesn’t have control over). It would be impossible to meet the requirements of the offer.

    Besides, do you want your President to be someone willing to accept bribes?

  294. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy July 10, 2013 at 3:47 pm #

    Since 2001 is has been the Department of Health policy to issue only the short form certificate although they can grant a waiver if the application has a legitimate need for the other form. This is what happened for Obama, and also for Dannae who got a copy of her long form and posted it. No mystery here.

    scott e: why did the president need a special waiver to get his 2nd certificate ?

  295. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy July 10, 2013 at 3:50 pm #

    Yes, Mike said “registered.” Here’s the full quote:

    This ought to serve as a warning shot across the bow to the naysayers of our criminal investigation in the Obama fraud case. The impressive credentials of Mr. Hayes, and the fact that he has testified in court cases for Perkins-Coie coupled with the fact that Mr. Hayes is a registered Democrat, demonstrates the integrity of our investigation and our conviction that we possess incontrovertible evidence to back our case.

    scott e: did mike say “registered”

  296. avatar
    scott e July 10, 2013 at 4:06 pm #

    Dr. Conspiracy:
    Yes, Mike said “registered.” Here’s the full quote:

    was he ever a registered democrat anywhere ??

  297. avatar
    scott e July 10, 2013 at 4:10 pm #

    Dr. Conspiracy:
    Since 2001 is has been the Department of Health policy to issue only the short form certificate although they can grant a waiver if the application has a legitimate need for the other form. This is what happened for Obama, and also for Dannae who got a copy of her long form and posted it. No mystery here.

    not foia ? the cnn reporter said, you can get it but it takes a long time, and the state doesn’t want people to do it cause it’s a lot of work.” have other people foia’ed. sunahara’s brother ??

  298. avatar
    scott e July 10, 2013 at 4:11 pm #

    W. Kevin Vicklund: No, he was offered $5 million to show his grades AND his college applications (destroyed by school policy in the 1980s) AND his passports (passports are only valid for 10 years or so, do you hang on to the old ones) AND his passport applications (which he doesn’t have control over).It would be impossible to meet the requirements of the offer.

    Besides, do you want your President to be someone willing to accept bribes?

    not a bribe… but no, you are right.

  299. avatar
    Dr Kenneth Noisewater July 10, 2013 at 4:55 pm #

    scott e: was Romney thoroughly vetted ? I honestly don’t know. I think part of the problem is that very definition. there is no or there are minimal legal standards, right ?. I stand by my always constant position that all candidates be vetted equally, that any information that may arrive is fair game, that goes for anyone and everyone. as long as no one is hiding something incriminating, there should be no problem.

    So did you have any problem with his candidacy? I don’t see the same insane fervor over Romney that you have over the president. So do you think Romney was hiding anything?

  300. avatar
    Dr Kenneth Noisewater July 10, 2013 at 4:56 pm #

    scott e: that’s fine Kenneth.

    As usual Scott can’t answer direct questions.

  301. avatar
    Dr Kenneth Noisewater July 10, 2013 at 4:58 pm #

    scott e: I thought reid broadcasting from the senate floor that Romney hadn’t paid his taxes for ten years was inappropriate. my immediate thought was, “wouldn’t the IRS know about that?”. it seemed political to me.

    And how does this relate to your claims about Obama’s BC? Did you ask for romney to show his BC and have it submitted to the same amount of scrutiny you did with Obama?

  302. avatar
    Dr Kenneth Noisewater July 10, 2013 at 5:02 pm #

    scott e: I thought reid broadcasting from the senate floor that Romney hadn’t paid his taxes for ten years was inappropriate. my immediate thought was, “wouldn’t the IRS know about that?”. it seemed political to me.

    You also thought wrong since this didn’t happen from the senate floor let alone within the senate.

  303. avatar
    CarlOrcas July 10, 2013 at 5:03 pm #

    scott e: I have on occasion reported vicious vulgar racist posts, every now and then, mindless persecution, ala alinsky for example.

    Saul Alinsky attacked you on the internet? Neat trick.

  304. avatar
    Jim July 10, 2013 at 5:14 pm #

    scott e
    I thought reid broadcasting from the senate floor that Romney hadn’t paid his taxes for ten years was inappropriate. my immediate thought was, “wouldn’t the IRS know about that?”. it seemed political to me.

    Wow, can’t you get anything right? He said NOTHING about Romney not paying his taxes, he was asking why Romney wasn’t doing what every Presidential candidate since Romney’s father had done, RELEASE 10 years worth of tax returns. I wondered why too, then I realized it might show how many jobs he created overseas and how many jobs he cost Americans.

  305. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy July 10, 2013 at 5:23 pm #

    That wouldn’t result in a certified copy. It would be a copy of the record, but it wouldn’t be an actual birth certificate.

    I don’t personally know of anyone who used a Hawaiian Uniform Information Practices (UIPA) to obtain a birth record.

    scott e: not foia ? the cnn reporter said, you can get it but it takes a long time, and the state doesn’t want people to do it cause it’s a lot of work.” have other people foia’ed. sunahara’s brother ??

  306. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy July 10, 2013 at 5:27 pm #

    Well scott, why don’t you ask your buddy investigator Zullo for an explanation of his remarks, and post them here. We’d all like to hear it.

    Perhaps you should get right on it.

    scott e: was he ever a registered democrat anywhere ??

  307. avatar
    Jim July 10, 2013 at 5:46 pm #

    Dr. Conspiracy:
    Well scott, why don’t you ask your buddy investigator Zullo for an explanation of his remarks, and post them here. We’d all like to hear it.

    Perhaps you should get right on it.

    Also, could you ask him when he’s going to arrest the Xerox copier for forgery? I’d love to get that perp walk on Youtube.

  308. avatar
    CarlOrcas July 10, 2013 at 6:17 pm #

    Jim: Also, could you ask him when he’s going to arrest the Xerox copier for forgery? I’d love to get that perp walk on Youtube.

    Note to scott e.: Be sure to tell Zullo that he’ll need to undo the wheel locks before he tries to push the copier into the 4th Avenue Jail. A “perp push”…..if you will.

  309. avatar
    Buscando La Verdad July 10, 2013 at 8:46 pm #

    FYI – - -Posted on Tuesday, June 04, 2013 1:09:33 PM by Seizethecarp – -http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-bloggers/3027263/posts

    On June 1, 2013 Joe Arpaio’s Cold Case Posse lead investigator, Mike Zullo, revealed for the first time that Reed Hayes of Hawaii is the Certified Document Examiner (CDE) who produced the 40 page opinion referenced in an Alabama court affidavit concluding that Obama’s White House pdf birth certificate image was completely fabricated.

    Obots (FogBlowers) have rushed to denounce Reed Hayes as a “quack” but might be surprised to find that one of Hayes’ clients listed in the Expert Witness Directory at the thread link is an attorney with Perkins Coie. That is the law firm whose partners have provided Obama’s personal defense against all birth certificate and natural born citizen litigation over the past five years.

    Should Sheriff Arpaio succeed in getting congress to investigate the authenticity of Obama’s BC, the Perkins Coie legal team defending Obama will be hard pressed to denounce Reed Hayes as a “quack” when members of their own firm have used him as an expert witness. Their own prior cases where Hayes was used as a witness would be compromised if they use Alinski-style mocking ad hominem attacks on Hayes.

    Obots are already peppering Hayes with e-mails trying to discover the details in his 40-page forensic analysis of the pdf BC, but Hayes has properly refused to disclose any details and refers them to Arpaio and the CCP who own his report.

    The Obot attempt to find “dirt” on Hayes was quickly derailed by their discovery that Hayes had a male “partner” (now deceased) who had been an ACLU lawyer in Hawaii making it likely that Hayes himself was a liberal progressive and likely Obama supporter and not some Tea Party “birther” prior to being engaged to examine Obama’s BC image. This ruins their usual playbook of smearing truth-tellers on the right. Obots have even debated at length whether personal attacks should be suspended due to this discovery and only Hayes’ work product be attacked. That’s generous of some of them but other Obots chimed in that just because Hayes’ partner was ACLU doesn’t mean that Hayes wasn’t some kind of Obama-hating right-wing “birther.”

  310. avatar
    Keith July 10, 2013 at 8:48 pm #

    scott e: I thought reid broadcasting from the senate floor that Romney hadn’t paid his taxes for ten years was inappropriate.

    It didn’t happen on the Senate floor. It happened in public without the protection of ‘parliamentary privilege’. He could be sued if it was defamatory or libelous. He hasn’t been. Why not?

    my immediate thought was, “wouldn’t the IRS know about that?”. it seemed political to me.

    And you can’t see the irony just dripping from that one? Probably not, so I’ll spell it out for you…

    With respect to the possibility of a forged birth certicicate:

    my immediate thought was, “wouldn’t the Hawai’i Department of Health know about that?”. it seemed political to me.

  311. avatar
    Buscando La Verdad July 10, 2013 at 9:00 pm #

    To the majority that post here – I realize that Orly Taitz isn’t ‘appreciated’ – - however, I’m attempting to stay on the “Zullo subject” as Dr. Conspiracy has requested – from Orly – June 7, 2013
    Recently Sheriff Arpaio and Mike Zullo announced that they have an opinion of a forensic document examiner Reed Hayes that Obama’s BC is a forgery. They also stated that Hayes is a registered Democrat in HI. First, I received information that HI does not register party affiliation, so there is a need for clarification, why is it being announced that he is a registered Democrat in HI? I contacted Mr. Hayes, he stated that he made a deal with Mike Zullo that he will not cooperate with anyone else.” http://www.orlytaitzesq.com/?p=424038

  312. avatar
    Buscando La Verdad July 10, 2013 at 9:06 pm #

    CONTINUING – Reed Hayes to Orly Taitz – ”

    Reed Hayes

    to Mike, me

    Mike Zullo is my client with respect to the Obama Certificate of Live Birth and any related material. Mr. Zullo and I have an agreement that I will not perform work for anyone else pertaining to the matter.

    Please contact Mr. Zullo directly for answers to any other questions.

    Sincerely,

    Reed Hayes

    Reed Hayes, CDE

    P.O. Box 235213

    Honolulu, Hawaii 96823

    Tel: 808-737-0502 • Fax: 808-356-0811

    Website: http://www.reedwrite.com

  313. avatar
    Majority Will July 10, 2013 at 9:36 pm #

    Keith: It didn’t happen on the Senate floor. It happened in public without the protection of ‘parliamentary privilege’. He could be sued if it was defamatory or libelous. He hasn’t been. Why not?

    And you can’t see the irony just dripping from that one? Probably not, so I’ll spell it out for you…

    With respect to the possibility of a forged birth certificate:

    my immediate thought was, “wouldn’t the Hawai’i Department of Health know about that?”. it seemed political to me.

    It’s too bad there is zero chance any birther will grasp that.

    Especially the dimmer, focus challenged ones.

  314. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy July 11, 2013 at 12:33 am #

    Yes, we discussed this last month. See:

    http://www.obamaconspiracy.org/2013/06/reed-hayes-expert-enigma/

    Two points to note:

    1) Hayes is not a “registered Democrat” because voters aren’t registered by party in Hawaii. Zullo lied.

    2) Hayes’ report has not been made public, so we really don’t know what he said. Until his report is released, there is no report. All we know so far is Zullo bought himself a name.

    Buscando La Verdad: To the majority that post here – I realize that Orly Taitz isn’t ‘appreciated’ – – however, I’m attempting to stay on the “Zullo subject” as Dr. Conspiracy has requested – from Orly – June 7, 2013
    Recently Sheriff Arpaio and Mike Zullo announced that they have an opinion of a forensic document examiner Reed Hayes that Obama’s BC is a forgery. They also stated that Hayes is a registered Democrat in HI. First, I received information that HI does not register party affiliation, so there is a need for clarification, why is it being announced that he is a registered Democrat in HI? I contacted Mr. Hayes, he stated that he made a deal with Mike Zullo that he will not cooperate with anyone else.”

  315. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy July 11, 2013 at 12:39 am #

    I would think that EVERYBODY, Birthers and Obots alike would like to know something about Hayes and what his report says. Birthers are contacting Hayes too. Zullo makes a big deal about the importance of the report, and then keeps it hidden, and hidden for no discernible reason.

    Zullo has exhibited a pattern of promising sensational, convincing evidence and then not delivering it (reminds one a little of Ed Hale). See the 34 questions in the article above. That anybody would be excited about the Hayes report is a measure of how gullible they are. “Fooled me twice, shame on me.”

    Buscando La Verdad: Obots are already peppering Hayes with e-mails trying to discover the details in his 40-page forensic analysis of the pdf BC, but Hayes has properly refused to disclose any details and refers them to Arpaio and the CCP who own his report.

  316. avatar
    Rickey July 11, 2013 at 12:55 am #

    scott e:
    I thought reid broadcasting from the senate floor that Romney hadn’t paid his taxes for ten years was inappropriate. my immediate thought was, “wouldn’t the IRS know about that?”. it seemed political to me.

    Harry Reid never accused Romney of not paying his taxes for ten years, and he certainly didn’t do it from the Senate floor. Reid said that a Bain investor told him that Romney hadn’t paid his taxes for ten years, and that Romney could clear it up by releasing his returns. In fact, Reid specifically told Huffington Post that he didn’t know if Romney had paid taxes during those years:

    “He didn’t pay taxes for 10 years! Now, do I know that that’s true? Well, I’m not certain,” said Reid. “But obviously he can’t release those tax returns. How would it look?

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/07/31/harry-reid-romney-taxes_n_1724027.html

  317. avatar
    Rickey July 11, 2013 at 1:09 am #

    Buscando La Verdad:

    …one of Hayes’ clients listed in the Expert Witness Directory at the thread link is an attorney with Perkins Coie. That is the law firm whose partners have provided Obama’s personal defense against all birth certificate and natural born citizen litigation over the past five years.

    That is an out and out falsehood. In fact, Perkins Coie has had minimal involvement in birther litigation over the past five years.

    Should Sheriff Arpaio succeed in getting congress to investigate the authenticity of Obama’s BC, the Perkins Coie legal team defending Obama will be hard pressed to denounce Reed Hayes as a “quack” when members of their own firm have used him as an expert witness. Their own prior cases where Hayes was used as a witness would be compromised if they use Alinski-style mocking ad hominem attacks on Hayes.

    More birther nonsense. First of all, Perkins Coie is a highly-respected law firm which would never attack an opposing expert on the grounds that he is a “quack” unless that had solid evidence that the expert is a charlatan. That said, they might well question Hayes’ expertise (e.g., does he have an experience in authenticating Hawaii birth certificates?), and they certainly would not be precluded from attacking his conclusions simply because he once was retained by Perkins Coie.

  318. avatar
    Rickey July 11, 2013 at 1:29 am #

    scott e: this is only an hour show. but here are a few. why are mainstream media centers providing disinformation or no information. why can’t someone post a photo of other draft reg’s w/two digit year. why did gibbs lie to the media about bilderberg meeting.
    why did the pressroom drown out les kinsolving as shown in my video “one lone voice”, gibbs never answers. axelrod’s “their kids went to school together.”his associations with wright, rezko etc. why hadn’t michelle robinson ever heard of bill ayers growing up, with her political family, as assistant to mayor daley.

    this is a good time to say it isn’t just the birth certificate, it’s everything. I think Benghazi is still outstanding. guns for tequila, why natural born and born became the same, and why people declare the discussion over yet the supreme court has never defined natural born according to wikepedia.

    why did the president need a special waiver to get his 2nd certificate ?

    None of which has anything to do with Obama’s eligibility, other than that the Supreme Court has never defined natural born citizen. However, retired Supreme Court Justice Sandra Day O’Connor has said that Obama is a natural born citizen because he was born in Hawaii, and Justice Scalia has said that in the United States the doctrine of jus soli controls. So if Obama’s eligibility ever came to be rule upon by the Supreme Court, there is no chance that the court would ever accept the “two-citizen parents” argument.

    but for me it’s always been the give and take between all of us. there seems to be more pushback than necessary for such a trivial dead non issue. it’s become a cult and a cottage industry.

    let me think about this and add more later. the fact is, is that no one has been able to crack the egg, to all of your credit. all i’m saying is that there are always new discoveries (as w/the Xerox thing). if everything is right and the science proves out, history will show everything eventually. I think the administration is corrupt. I think we’ll here more about intimidation, coercion, etc.

    this is just me, I have to admit, that while I have communicated with just about all of the players, I continue to operate on gut feeling and hunches and instinct. all very unscientific. but there is something about all of it that keeps me compelled.

    I’ll try to gather more specific things that I’ve red flagged over the years. I don’t know everything, but I think mr. zullo does, as does dr. corsi and a few others.

  319. avatar
    CarlOrcas July 11, 2013 at 1:37 am #

    Dr. Conspiracy: Zullo has exhibited a pattern of promising sensational, convincing evidence and then not delivering it (reminds one a little of Ed Hale). See the 34 questions in the article above. That anybody would be excited about the Hayes report is a measure of how gullible they are. “Fooled me twice, shame on me.”

    I watched one of my favorite movies a couple nights ago…..The Music Man.

    And right towards the end of the movie where the anvil salesman shows up and tries to tell the folks of River City the truth about Professor Harold Hill someone comments about the Professor’s credentials” and the salesman screams…….”What credentials??? He doesn’t have any credentials!!!”

    That’s where we are with this nonsense. Zullo, like Harold Hill, is a pied piper for people who want to believe something that isn’t true. Unlike Hill (with the help of Hollywood) Zullo will not be leading the birthers on a march around Lafayette Square.

    Zullo is a con man, a flim flam artist……through and through.

  320. avatar
    Ellen July 11, 2013 at 2:41 am #

    Re: ” I don’t know everything, but I think mr. zullo does, as does dr. corsi and a few others.”

    Answer: Do they know whether or not Obama’s mother had a passport in 1961? If they do, why haven’t they said? No birther site, so far as I know, has ever said whether or not Obama’s mother had a passport in 1961. And, if she did not have a passport (and it would be most unlikely that she had one since so few 18-year-olds did in 1961), then what in @#@*^%#@*@ is all the birther blather about?

  321. avatar
    The Magic M July 11, 2013 at 4:01 am #

    Buscando La Verdad: Obots have even debated at length whether personal attacks should be suspended due to this discovery

    Oh darn, we have a mole! Everybody with clearance 7C and above immediately switch to encryption protocol Theta Lemma Zippo! This is not a drill!

  322. avatar
    The Magic M July 11, 2013 at 4:03 am #

    scott e: why did the president need a special waiver to get his 2nd certificate ?

    Because HI law does not give the person on the BC a right to get a copy of the vault document(s).
    Sheesh, you should read up on basics before spouting questions answered zillion times before.

  323. avatar
    nbc July 11, 2013 at 4:12 am #

    scott e: why did the president need a special waiver to get his 2nd certificate ?

    I guess you cannot really read the statutes… Poor Scott, just trying to pretend there is something nefarious and too lazy or biased to properly research it.

  324. avatar
    bovril July 11, 2013 at 4:33 am #

    Dear Busty

    Regarding your bull about Hays and Perkins Coie

    What is ACTUALLY there is an unsubstantiated claim by Hays to have worked ONCE for ONE of the lawyers who ONCE worked in ONE of the offices of Perkins Coie.

    A lawyer who hasn’t worked at PC for a decade or more, in point of fact

    So, yes SeizureCarp and the rest of the RWNJ buffoons are in fact lying as is Zullo,

    I do trust Hays was paid a substantial amount by Zullo and the CCCP as he has managed to completely destroy any professional credibility he may have built up over time.

    The next time, if ever, he is presented to a court as an “expert witness” will be brutal for him as opposing counsel will be able to shred his status just on the released Zullo statements alone. IANAL but lets see what would happen if he attempted this nonsense in a court

    Demonstrable bias………….Check
    Unsubstantiated testimony………….Check
    Inability to differentiate between fact, supposition and opinion………….Check
    No demonstrable experience in the subject matter at hand………….Check
    No professional standing or background in the subject matter at hand………….Check
    Failure to demonstrate ability in the field at hand………….Check
    Failure to articulate the difference between an image and an original………….Check
    Failure to demonstrate the difference between hearsay and evidence………….Check
    Attempted to enter hearsay, supposition and opinion as evidence………….Check

    One could continue but leaves it as an exercise for the student

  325. avatar
    The Magic M July 11, 2013 at 7:25 am #

    bovril: as opposing counsel will be able to shred his status just on the released Zullo statements alone

    Maybe there is no report and/or Hayes agreed to a stipulation that he doesn’t comment and Zullo doesn’t “release” anything. That way Hayes can always say Zullo mischaracterized his report when the going gets tough. You can’t impeach an expert based on hearsay about something that was never published.

  326. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy July 11, 2013 at 7:27 am #

    Birther sites have said that Obama’s mother had a passport in 1961, but they say this because they need it to be true, not because they have any evidence of it. My own FOIA to the Department of State resulted in a statement that they had searched the microfilm records of passport issuance cards, which is supposed to be complete, and they didn’t find one.

    Ellen: Answer: Do they know whether or not Obama’s mother had a passport in 1961? If they do, why haven’t they said? No birther site, so far as I know, has ever said whether or not Obama’s mother had a passport in 1961. And, if she did not have a passport (and it would be most unlikely that she had one since so few 18-year-olds did in 1961), then what in @#@*^%#@*@ is all the birther blather about?

  327. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy July 11, 2013 at 7:29 am #

    Zullo’s statements are hearsay and inadmissible.

    Mr. Hayes has authored several books:

    Effective Witness Techniques for Handwriting & Document Experts
    Forensic Handwriting Examination: A Definitive Guide
    Between The Lines: Understanding Yourself & Others Through Handwriting Analysis
    Guide To Children’s Handwriting

    There’s nothing remotely related to electronic documents there.

    bovril: The next time, if ever, he is presented to a court as an “expert witness” will be brutal for him as opposing counsel will be able to shred his status just on the released Zullo statements alone.

  328. avatar
    misha marinsky July 11, 2013 at 8:26 am #

    W. Kevin Vicklund:do you want your President to be someone willing to accept bribes?

    Spiro Agnew

  329. avatar
    misha marinsky July 11, 2013 at 8:34 am #

    Buscando La Verdad: I realize that Orly Taitz isn’t ‘appreciated’

    I appreciate that Orly Taitz is a shonde, a refusenik and a nogoodnik.

    Here’s the latest from the Russian circus:

    Step Right Up, Kids, the Tiger Will Look Good in Your Photo

    http://www.nytimes.com/2013/07/11/world/europe/russian-circuses-offer-tigers-and-bears-as-props.html

  330. avatar
    misha marinsky July 11, 2013 at 8:37 am #

    The Magic M:Everybody with clearance 7C and above immediately switch to encryption protocol Yiddish! This is not a drill!

    FIFY

  331. avatar
    bovril July 11, 2013 at 8:38 am #

    Ohhhh Busty,

    Mad Ole Orly is “appreciated” all right, appreciated for the laughter, giggles and outright hilarity everything she does elicits.

  332. avatar
    misha marinsky July 11, 2013 at 8:51 am #

    Buscando La Verdad: Obots are already peppering Hayes with e-mails trying to discover the details

    How did you hack into my account?

    Buscando La Verdad: Obots have even debated at length whether personal attacks should be suspended due to this discovery

    So you have a confederate attending our meetings, eh?

    Personal attacks? Yes!

    Eric Cantor does not have catholic tastes.

  333. avatar
    bovril July 11, 2013 at 9:00 am #

    I love how Birfoons like Busty, Snottie and their ilk have this fantasy of the Obots as this monolithic, “open secret”, managed set of operatives.

    I think it goes with the pretty plain lack of a sense of humor and irony.

    I mean, can anyone imagine Orly/Zullo/KBOA/Corsi/Dr K(H)ate/BitterDelusional/et-al telling a good knock-knock joke or reciting the Dead Parrot Sketch…?

  334. avatar
    The Magic M July 11, 2013 at 9:44 am #

    Dr. Conspiracy: There’s nothing remotely related to electronic documents there.

    We don’t know if Hayes’ report is based on specifics of the PDF file or limited to handwriting analysis. Then again I doubt he’d need 40 pages to state something like “the signatures are forgeries”.

    Additional encrypted message (7C+ only): $@iP09/bnfM4r%&@@Knqw@0r1y.+41+z.

  335. avatar
    Rickey July 11, 2013 at 12:40 pm #

    I see that my last note to Scott above got screwed up and contains superfluous stuff from his note which now appears to be from me.

    The part which is from me ends with “‘two-citizen parents’ argument.” What follows is all Scott.

  336. avatar
    Rickey July 11, 2013 at 12:42 pm #

    The Magic M: We don’t know if Hayes’ report is based on specifics of the PDF file or limited to handwriting analysis. Then again I doubt he’d need 40 pages to state something like “the signatures are forgeries”.

    I suspect that Zullo won’t release it because the report contains a disclaimer that no definitive opinion can be made without seeing the original document.

  337. avatar
    scott e July 11, 2013 at 12:53 pm #

    nbc: I guess you cannot really read the statutes… Poor Scott, just trying to pretend there is something nefarious and too lazy or biased to properly research it.

    so you don’t know either… that’s fine.

  338. avatar
    CarlOrcas July 11, 2013 at 1:20 pm #

    Rickey: I suspect that Zullo won’t release it because the report contains a disclaimer that no definitive opinion can be made without seeing the original document.

    And if it does provide a definitive opinion then it’s nonsense. A no-win deal for Mr. Zullo.

  339. avatar
    Jim July 11, 2013 at 1:27 pm #

    Rickey: I suspect that Zullo won’t release it because the report contains a disclaimer that no definitive opinion can be made without seeing the original document.

    I’ll bet it’s just a handwriting analysis of the signatures, along with the disclaimer. It will never see the light of day and will never affect Hays’ career because that’s what Zullo promised him.

  340. avatar
    Rickey July 11, 2013 at 1:28 pm #

    scott e: so you don’t know either… that’s fine.

    Doc already answered your question. In case you missed it:

    http://www.obamaconspiracy.org/2013/07/waiting-for-zullo/#comment-274968

  341. avatar
    Majority Will July 11, 2013 at 1:33 pm #

    Rickey:
    I see that my last note to Scott above got screwed up and contains superfluous stuff from his note which now appears to be from me.

    The part which is from me ends with “‘two-citizen parents’ argument.” What follows is all Scott.

    It’s real easy to tell the difference even if all of the sentences were randomly jumbled.

    Your comments are mature, rational, thoughtful and sane and are devoid of vacuous, paranoid, infantile and delusional lunacy.

  342. avatar
    scott e July 11, 2013 at 1:47 pm #

    Dr Kenneth Noisewater: You also thought wrong since this didn’t happen from the senate floor let alone within the senate.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lMChd6QchaU

    wouldn’t the IRS have a clue ??

  343. avatar
    scott e July 11, 2013 at 1:54 pm #

    this has always stuck with me as odd and curious…

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CCkoz-QUjIM&feature=youtu.be

    oh… I see, it’s complicated… well, that’s good enough for me.

    the health department said he was a birther… hmmm

    also in this series of Obama stumping reports are the touting of fukino and lingle as “republicans”

  344. avatar
    scott e July 11, 2013 at 2:39 pm #

    nbc: I guess you cannot really read the statutes… Poor Scott, just trying to pretend there is something nefarious and too lazy or biased to properly research it.

    please cite/link said statutes…

  345. avatar
    scott e July 11, 2013 at 2:40 pm #

    The Magic M: Because HI law does not give the person on the BC a right to get a copy of the vault document(s).
    Sheesh, you should read up on basics before spouting questions answered zillion times before.

    this is still unclear to me.

  346. avatar
    scott e July 11, 2013 at 2:44 pm #

    Rickey: Can I assume then that you concede that Zullo lied when he said that Reed Hayes is a Democrat?

    is he… or was he ??

  347. avatar
    scott e July 11, 2013 at 3:00 pm #

    Dr. Conspiracy:
    Well scott, why don’t you ask your buddy investigator Zullo for an explanation of his remarks, and post them here. We’d all like to hear it.

    Perhaps you should get right on it.

    ok

  348. avatar
    Keith July 11, 2013 at 3:26 pm #

    scott e: please cite/link said statutes…

    been there, done that. got the t-shirt.

    and worn it out years ago.

    I’m sure you can find the links in Doc’s Debunker’s Guide in the Features section (menu at top of the page) or Quick Reference (at the bottom of the page).

  349. avatar
    Dr Kenneth Noisewater July 11, 2013 at 3:41 pm #

    scott e: please cite/link said statutes…

    Here’s the directive: http://hawaii.gov/health/vital-records/Policy_Memo_5_15_2001.PDF

    The information regarding this has been in plain sight
    http://hawaii.gov/health/vital-records/obama.html

    This isn’t the first time you’ve been given this link. Why didn’t you read it the first few hundred times you’ve been referred to it?

  350. avatar
    Dr Kenneth Noisewater July 11, 2013 at 3:42 pm #

    scott e: is he… or was he ??

    You have any proof he was registered in another state?

  351. avatar
    Dr Kenneth Noisewater July 11, 2013 at 3:45 pm #

    scott e: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lMChd6QchaUwouldn’t the IRS have a clue ??

    Wouldn’t the DOH have a clue about the BC if it was forged as you birthers have claimed? I notice Romney never denied it?

  352. avatar
    Majority Will July 11, 2013 at 3:54 pm #

    Dr Kenneth Noisewater: Here’s the directive: http://hawaii.gov/health/vital-records/Policy_Memo_5_15_2001.PDF

    The information regarding this has been in plain sight
    http://hawaii.gov/health/vital-records/obama.html

    This isn’t the first time you’ve been given this link.Why didn’t you read it the first few hundred times you’ve been referred to it?

    Too much paint thinner?

  353. avatar
    CarlOrcas July 11, 2013 at 3:58 pm #

    scott e: is he… or was he ??

    Why don’t you ask your pal Zullo?

    Also…..why don’t you try answering some of the questions you’ve been asked?

  354. avatar
    Rickey July 11, 2013 at 4:25 pm #

    scott e:

    also in this series of Obama stumping reports are the touting of fukino and lingle as “republicans”

    Linda Lingle ran for Governor and Senator as a Republican, which makes her a Republican. That was so easy it should make you feel foolish.

    Clearly there are Republicans and Democrats in Hawaii, but they aren’t registered as such. Dr. Fukino was appointed by Lingle, so one might assume that she is a Republican, but I am unaware of any proof of her party affiliation.

  355. avatar
    Rickey July 11, 2013 at 4:29 pm #

    scott e: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lMChd6QchaU

    wouldn’t the IRS have a clue ??

    You expect the IRS to comment on Romney’s tax returns?

    Wouldn’t Romney have a clue? All he had to do was release his returns for the years in question. What was he hiding? Did you care?

    Please provide links to any posts you made in 2012 demanding that Romney release all of his records.

  356. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy July 11, 2013 at 5:12 pm #

    According to CNN, Dr. Fukino is a “registered Republican.”

    You can’t make this stuff up.

    http://cnnpressroom.blogs.cnn.com/2011/04/26/cnn-birther-investigation-no-doubt-president-obama-was-born-in-hawaii/

    Rickey: Clearly there are Republicans and Democrats in Hawaii, but they aren’t registered as such. Dr. Fukino was appointed by Lingle, so one might assume that she is a Republican, but I am unaware of any proof of her party affiliation.

  357. avatar
    CarlOrcas July 11, 2013 at 6:07 pm #

    Dr. Conspiracy:
    According to CNN, Dr. Fukino is a “registered Republican.”

    You can’t make this stuff up.

    http://cnnpressroom.blogs.cnn.com/2011/04/26/cnn-birther-investigation-no-doubt-president-obama-was-born-in-hawaii/

    Everyone needs an editor…..a good editor. A couple thoughts: Either Abercrombie told Tuchman she’s a Republican or he assumed being on the ballot as a Republican equated with being a “registered Republic”.

    Sloppy but, like most birther nits, not worth picking at.

  358. avatar
    Oaka July 11, 2013 at 6:18 pm #

    yes fukino said she was a republican and also said “She found the original birth record, properly numbered, half typed and half handwritten, and signed by the doctor who delivered Obama, located in the files. ”

    http://www.nbcnews.com/id/42519951/ns/politics-more_politics/#.Ud8t6kGsiSo

    so what does that mean exactly?

  359. avatar
    gorefan July 11, 2013 at 6:30 pm #

    Rickey: I am unaware of any proof of her party affiliation.

    She donated $600 to the Hawaii Republican Party in 2006.

    FUKINO, CHIYOME
    HONOLULU, HI 96813

    HAWAII REPUBLICAN PARTY
    02/21/2006 600.00 26920034136

    Total Contributions: 600.00

    http://www.fec.gov/finance/disclosure/norindsea.shtml

    Search by last name – Fukino

    With regards to what Zullo said about Mr. Hayes, I suspect he asked Mr.Hayes what his party affiliation was and he said Democrat.

  360. avatar
    Rickey July 11, 2013 at 6:40 pm #

    gorefan:

    With regards to what Zullo said about Mr. Hayes, I suspect he asked Mr.Hayes what his party affiliation was and he said Democrat.

    That could be. However, given that it is Zullo, it is just as likely that he made it up. He knows that his followers will never bother to check on it.

    I noticed that there are no contributions listed for Reed Hayes.

  361. avatar
    gorefan July 11, 2013 at 6:42 pm #

    From the CNN video (3:45).

    Tuckman: And you are a register Republican?

    Dr. Fukino: At the present time, yes.

  362. avatar
    CarlOrcas July 11, 2013 at 7:12 pm #

    gorefan:
    From the CNN video (3:45).

    Tuckman:And you are a register Republican?

    Dr. Fukino:At the present time, yes.

    Here’s the voter registration form for Hawaii:

    http://hawaii.gov/elections/forms/voter_pab_application_english.pdf

    That’s for voters but it looks like candidates can and do run in what they call “single party primaries”. Here is the explanation:

    http://hawaii.gov/elections/voters/singlepartyprimary.htm

    It then looks like they then run by party in the general election.

    So…..my guess is everyone is right!!

  363. avatar
    Buscando La Verdad July 11, 2013 at 7:56 pm #

    Responding to a Freedom of Information Act request, the State Department has released passport records of Stanley Ann Dunham, President Obama’s mother – but records for the years surrounding Obama’s 1961 birth are missing.

    The State Department claims a 1980s General Services Administration directive resulted in the destruction of many passport applications and other “non-vital” passport records, including Dunham’s 1965 passport application and any other passports she may have applied for or held prior to 1965.

    Destroyed, then, would also be any records shedding light on whether Dunham did or did not travel out of the country around the time of Barack Obama’s birth…
    http://24ahead.com/state-dept-doesnt-have-passport-records-stanley-dunham-1968

    http://www.scribd.com/doc/35163631/strunk-v-dept-of-state-foia-release-stanley-ann-dunham-obama-soetoro-passport-application-file-7-29-10

  364. avatar
    sfjeff July 11, 2013 at 7:57 pm #

    If Reed Hayes has evidence of a forged document within the Hawaiian Department of Health, irregardless of his agreement with a civilian, wouldn’t that be withholding evidence of a crime?

    I mean if Reed Hayes believes he has evidence of a crime…..

  365. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy July 11, 2013 at 9:24 pm #

    That’s not actually true. If you read the contemporary GAO recommendations for the destruction of routine passport applications, they observed that the passport issuance cards were microfilmed and could be used for the determination of citizenship status, should that ever come into question.

    My own FOIA request for these records included passport issuance cards on Microfilm and there weren’t any for Obama’s mother covering 1961. (Birther FOIA requests were for applications, not issuance records, so they missed the boat.)

    In addition, other INS reports show conclusively that Dunham did not to go Africa and return, at least not by air. This is from the statistical reports, not from the microfilmed records that Corsi looked for in the wrong city.

    Sorry, there’s nothing to that claim. There are several articles with the details on this site.

    Buscando La Verdad: Destroyed, then, would also be any records shedding light on whether Dunham did or did not travel out of the country around the time of Barack Obama’s birth…
    http://24ahead.com/state-dept-doesnt-have-passport-records-stanley-dunham-1968

  366. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy July 11, 2013 at 9:28 pm #

    I note that Hayes charges $125 an hour for writing reports. But insofar as handwriting analysis goes, what’s he going to compare anything with? We’ve seen several V. K Lee signatures and they’re fine. Same for Stanley Ann Obama. Does he have a David A. Sinclair exemplar?

    40 pages sounds like a recitation of external birther talking points, sort of like the Lord Monckton statistical fallacy. That’s not encouraging.

    The Magic M: We don’t know if Hayes’ report is based on specifics of the PDF file or limited to handwriting analysis. Then again I doubt he’d need 40 pages to state something like “the signatures are forgeries”.

  367. avatar
    CarlOrcas July 11, 2013 at 9:29 pm #

    Buscando La Verdad: Responding to a Freedom of Information Act request, the State Department has…………………………………………….

    Three years ago!! Three!

    What is your point?

  368. avatar
    Dr Kenneth Noisewater July 11, 2013 at 9:32 pm #

    Buscando La Verdad:
    Responding to a Freedom of Information Act request, the State Department has released passport records of Stanley Ann Dunham, President Obama’s mother – but records for the years surrounding Obama’s 1961 birth are missing.

    The State Department claims a 1980s General Services Administration directive resulted in the destruction of many passport applications and other “non-vital” passport records, including Dunham’s 1965 passport application and any other passports she may have applied for or held prior to 1965.

    Destroyed, then, would also be any records shedding light on whether Dunham did or did not travel out of the country around the time of Barack Obama’s birth…
    http://24ahead.com/state-dept-doesnt-have-passport-records-stanley-dunham-1968

    http://www.scribd.com/doc/35163631/strunk-v-dept-of-state-foia-release-stanley-ann-dunham-obama-soetoro-passport-application-file-7-29-10

    You’re assuming she had a passport before 1965 which youve shown no proof of that.

  369. avatar
    Jim July 11, 2013 at 10:33 pm #

    Dr. Conspiracy:
    I note that Hayes charges $125 an hour for writing reports. But insofar as handwriting analysis goes, what’s he going to compare anything with? We’ve seen several V. K Lee signatures and they’re fine. Same for Stanley Ann Obama. Does he have a David A. Sinclair exemplar?

    40 pages sounds like a recitation of external birther talking points, sort of like the Lord Monckton statistical fallacy. That’s not encouraging.

    Then again, a deep analysis behind the truthfulness, the state of mind, whether they were under duress, and why…that could go forty pages. You know the BS runs deep in birfstan!

  370. avatar
    Jim July 11, 2013 at 10:41 pm #

    Buscando La Verdad:
    The State Department claims a 1980s General Services Administration directive resulted in the destruction of many passport applications and other “non-vital” passport records, including Dunham’s 1965 passport application and any other passports she may have applied for or held prior to 1965.

    OMG!!! The REAGAN administration is in on it too! Get Zullo right on it! Dig ole Ron up and have Zullo give him the third degree! Put Ron and the Xerox copier in the same room, one of them will squeal! No one can resist COMANDANTE ZULLO!!! LET THE FROGMARCHING BEGIN!!!

  371. avatar
    Rickey July 11, 2013 at 11:31 pm #

    Buscando La Verdad:
    Responding to a Freedom of Information Act request, the State Department has released passport records of Stanley Ann Dunham, President Obama’s mother – but records for the years surrounding Obama’s 1961 birth are missing.

    The State Department claims a 1980s General Services Administration directive resulted in the destruction of many passport applications and other “non-vital” passport records, including Dunham’s 1965 passport application and any other passports she may have applied for or held prior to 1965.

    Destroyed, then, would also be any records shedding light on whether Dunham did or did not travel out of the country around the time of Barack Obama’s birth…

    Well, you’re wrong again.

    If there had been a passport application circa 1961 it would have been destroyed, but if there had been a passport it would still be on microfilm. As Doc as pointed out, the birthers consistently asked for the wrong records.

    However, even if Stanley Ann Dunham had a passport in 1961, the State Department would have no record of her travel at that time. The only record of her travels would have been the stamps in her passport.

    Besides, the theory that she traveled to Kenya to give birth has never made any sense. Why would an 18-year-old college freshman travel halfway around the world, by herself, to give birth to her first child in a third-world country? We know from his State Department file that Barack Obama Sr. never left the United States between the time he entered the U.S. and when he returned to Kenya in 1964.

  372. avatar
    gorefan July 12, 2013 at 12:37 am #

    Dr. Conspiracy: Does he have a David A. Sinclair exemplar?

    Miki Booth’s son Alan’s LFBC was signed by Dr. Sinclair.

    http://www.kerchner.com/images/protectourliberty/alanbooth1981hawaiianlongformbc.jpg

  373. avatar
    Keith July 12, 2013 at 2:47 am #

    gorefan: Miki Booth’s son Alan’s LFBC was signed by Dr. Sinclair.

    http://www.kerchner.com/images/protectourliberty/alanbooth1981hawaiianlongformbc.jpg

    Allegedly..

  374. avatar
    The Magic M July 12, 2013 at 3:28 am #

    Dr. Conspiracy: But insofar as handwriting analysis goes, what’s he going to compare anything with? We’ve seen several V. K Lee signatures and they’re fine. Same for Stanley Ann Obama. Does he have a David A. Sinclair exemplar?

    Who knows what crap the CCP fed him as basis for his report?

  375. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy July 12, 2013 at 8:50 am #

    Birther party game: pass the crap. Sorta like “telephone.”

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_whispers

    The Magic M: Who knows what crap the CCP fed him as basis for his report?

  376. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy July 12, 2013 at 8:53 am #

    Thanks, I did not know that.

    gorefan: Miki Booth’s son Alan’s LFBC was signed by Dr. Sinclair.

  377. avatar
    Loren July 12, 2013 at 10:04 am #

    Dr. Conspiracy:
    I note that Hayes charges $125 an hour for writing reports…

    40 pages sounds like a recitation of external birther talking points, sort of like the Lord Monckton statistical fallacy. That’s not encouraging.

    40 pages written at $125 an hour is a lot of money to spend on a secret report.

  378. avatar
    CarlOrcas July 12, 2013 at 10:17 am #

    Loren: 40 pages written at $125 an hour is a lot of money to spend on a secret report.

    Not if it only took an hour to cut and paste it together and, of course, that would be a good reason to keep it under wraps.

  379. avatar
    scott e July 12, 2013 at 10:27 am #

    CarlOrcas: Why don’t you ask your pal Zullo?

    Also…..why don’t you try answering some of the questions you’ve been asked?

    T some up for me again, i’ll do my best. carlorcas.

  380. avatar
    scott e July 12, 2013 at 10:31 am #

    Keith: It didn’t happen on the Senate floor. It happened in public without the protection of ‘parliamentary privilege’. He could be sued if it was defamatory or libelous. He hasn’t been. Why not?

    And you can’t see the irony just dripping from that one? Probably not, so I’ll spell it out for you…

    With respect to the possibility of a forged birth certicicate:

    it looks like the senate floor to me. maybe from the set of the west wing ??

    it looks like the senate floor to me. he turns to the right and mentions his republican colleague. plus all that old furniture, the lighting, the acoustics…… you get the idea

  381. avatar
    Dr Kenneth Noisewater July 12, 2013 at 10:54 am #

    CarlOrcas: Not if it only took an hour to cut and paste it together and, of course, that would be a good reason to keep it under wraps.

    All Reed had to do was copy and paste pages from mara zebest’s report and then put a cover sheet on it and claim it’s his own. Why not that’s what Zullo has done before plagiarizing other birthers.

  382. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy July 12, 2013 at 11:31 am #

    I’ve started deleting most of your new comments, ones which are non-responsive, vacuous in information content, asking the same questions already answered, and not contributing the discussion but rather distracting.

    I.e., I’m treating you like a troll. Obviously not every comment here is a worthy essay, but you pepper the blog with lots more litter than others.

    scott e: T some up for me again, i’ll do my best. carlorcas.

  383. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy July 12, 2013 at 11:33 am #

    All I can say are the facts: Hayes is a handwriting expert. Zullo won’t publish his report.

    There’s no way that looks good for Zullo.

    Dr Kenneth Noisewater: All Reed had to do was copy and paste pages from mara zebest’s report and then put a cover sheet on it and claim it’s his own. Why not that’s what Zullo has done before plagiarizing other birthers.

  384. avatar
    Dr Kenneth Noisewater July 12, 2013 at 11:43 am #

    Dr. Conspiracy: All I can say are the facts: Hayes is a handwriting expert. Zullo won’t publish his report.There’s no way that looks good for Zullo.

    Since when has Zullo been concerned with things that look good Doc? Going on the same radio shows every week makes him look bad.

  385. avatar
    Dr Kenneth Noisewater July 12, 2013 at 11:44 am #

    Dr. Conspiracy: I’ve started deleting most of your new comments, ones which are non-responsive, vacuous in information content, asking the same questions already answered, and not contributing the discussion but rather distracting.I.e., I’m treating you like a troll. Obviously not every comment here is a worthy essay, but you pepper the blog with lots more litter than others.

    No surprise here Doc, Scotty doesn’t engage or answer direct questions. Soon enough he’ll pull something to get another ban like he did months ago

  386. avatar
    Yoda July 12, 2013 at 1:07 pm #

    Sullivan is a defense attorney’s wet dream. Between his nonstop yapping and the two daffydavits he signed there are dozens of falsehoods and documented outright lies already out there. That’s not to mention the documented incompetence of the investigation.

    In my opinion his credibility is so bad that no prosecuting attorney would ever put him on the stand. In fact, I will go further. Even if a prosecuting attorney was convinced that Zullo was right, no charges would ever be brought based on the CCP “investigation”. Any nugget of truth would be buried in the pile of manure that has been put out by Supreme Commander Mike Zullo and his minions.

  387. avatar
    CarlOrcas July 12, 2013 at 1:07 pm #

    scott e: T some up for me again, i’ll do my best. carlorcas.

    Last chance. Here are some from a couple days ago:

    CarlOrcas July 10, 2013 at 1:45 pm (Quote) #

    scott e: I know zullo personally, no dough though.

    Are you a member of the Cold Case Posse? Or any other MCSO posses? Do you know who the other members of the Cold Case Posse are? Have you seen their work product?

    What does Zullo tell you about his position and authority?

    And then this one that you obfuscated on:

    CarlOrcas July 9, 2013 at 1:10 pm (Quote) #

    scott e: showing his birth certificate and releasing records would be a great damn transparent start.

    What birth certificate? I’ve seen several of them on the internet. Other than those what do you have in mind?

    What other “records”?

    And just how would those settle the matter for you?

    Okay scott….it’s tee time.

  388. avatar
    Yoda July 12, 2013 at 1:12 pm #

    Cellphone changed Zullo to Sullivan for some reason.

  389. avatar
    scott e July 12, 2013 at 3:10 pm #

    CarlOrcas: Last chance. Here are some from a couple days ago:

    CarlOrcas July 10, 2013 at 1:45 pm(Quote) #

    scott e: I know zullo personally, no dough though.

    Are you a member of the Cold Case Posse? Or any other MCSO posses? Do you know who the other members of the Cold Case Posse are? Have you seen their work product?

    *** no

    What does Zullo tell you about his position and authority?

    *** it hasn’t come up

    And then this one that you obfuscated on:

    CarlOrcas July 9, 2013 at 1:10 pm(Quote) #

    scott e: showing his birth certificate and releasing records would be a great damn transparent start.

    What birth certificate? I’ve seen several of them on the internet. Other than those what do you have in mind?

    *** the one in the vault, presumably the original

    What other “records”?

    *** i’d like to see his college anything, but it’s up to him now.

    And just how would those settle the matter for you?

    ***by comparing the pdf to the one in the vault. nothing else matters, the rest can be systematically cross referenced.. eg the sss reg and the ss# number. in a created identity, none of them will be normal.

  390. avatar
    Dr Kenneth Noisewater July 12, 2013 at 6:32 pm #

    scott e: What other “records”?

    *** i’d like to see his college anything, but it’s up to him now.

    And just how would those settle the matter for you?

    ***by comparing the pdf to the one in the vault. nothing else matters, the rest can be systematically cross referenced.. eg the sss reg and the ss# number. in a created identity, none of them will be normal.

    And when everything checks out what then?

  391. avatar
    Daniel July 12, 2013 at 7:29 pm #

    Hey Scotte…. just out of curiosity, what makes you think you have any right at all to see Obama’s college records, or BC, or any of his personal records? What makes you more special than any other average American that you have more rights than they do?

    Also…. why didn’t you ever demand these things of any other President in the past? What is the one thing different about Obama that you seem to think only he has to show you his papers?

  392. avatar
    Daniel July 12, 2013 at 7:32 pm #

    scott e: by comparing the pdf to the one in the vault. nothing else matters,

    And since we already know that the information on the vault copy matches the information on the PDF representation of the certified BC, you must, by your own admission, be satisfied, since nothing else matters…. right?

    Or is there something else other than “patriotism” at the root of why you have singled out Obama for “special scrutiny”?

  393. avatar
    dunstvangeet July 12, 2013 at 7:45 pm #

    Scott e, if you believe that Obama is really a Natural Born Citizen, then why do you insist that he shows you documentation that he’s actually already shown.

    He’s already shown you his “valid Hawaii state birth certificate.” In June of 2008, he took the same birth certificate, scanned it into his computer, and shown it to everybody in the world by displaying it on his website. It, at that time, was said to be his “valid Hawaii state birth certificate.” Any kook could take a look at it and see it.

    He then allowed Fact Check to take a look at it in August of 2008, and take photos of it. Those Photos clearly show the seal and debunked other so-called reasons why the Birthers said it was not valid.

    The Birthers, including you, said that it was a forgery, that it didn’t actually prove anything, and it didn’t matter anyways, because he was ineligible for other reasons.

    So, in May of 2011, he made a special request to the Hawaii Department of Health to go against their policy of not issuing photocopies of long-form birth certificates. He got it copied onto official security paper, and had the Hawaii Department of Health certify it as “a true copy” of the birth certificate. He then copies it to give each member of the White House Press Corps an actual photocopy of it, and then scans it in to a PDF, and puts it up on his Website. He then walks into the White House Press Corps, and holds it up in front of cameras, saying basically “Here it is.” He also allows any member of the White House Press Corps to photograph it, and touch it. The State of Hawaii, since then, has issued 3 different verifications saying that the document matches what they have on file.

    Birthers immediately say, without even seeing it, that it’s a forgery (first claims of forgery actually came days before Obama did this), that it doesn’t prove anything, and that it doesn’t matter anyways since his father was a foreigner.

    Now, you’re wanting Obama to release something that he’s already released, or you’re wanting him to somehow convince the Hawaii Department of Health to go against their security policy regarding the storage of the birth certificates to allow someone to go in there? You guys will just claim that it’s a forgery, that it doesn’t actually prove anything, and that it doesn’t matter anyways since his father was a foreigner. Why would he believe that the birthers would act any different if he did this than the way that he’s acted for the last 5 years.

    Also, you realize that Obama could take the very same document that he scanned and had photographed 5 years ago and that it would serve as proof in any court of law that he was born in Hawaii, don’t you?

  394. avatar
    CarlOrcas July 12, 2013 at 8:03 pm #

    scott e: Are you a member of the Cold Case Posse? Or any other MCSO posses? Do you know who the other members of the Cold Case Posse are? Have you seen their work product?

    *** no

    So any comments you have made about the posse and its work are based on……what, exactly?

    scott e: What does Zullo tell you about his position and authority?

    *** it hasn’t come up

    You’re not curious? Do you acknowledge that he doesn’t have any police powers of any kind?

    scott e: What birth certificate? I’ve seen several of them on the internet. Other than those what do you have in mind?

    *** the one in the vault, presumably the original

    Like anyone born in Hawaii the President has no ability to acquire and/or release his original birth record. You do understand that……don’t you?

    scott e: What other “records”?

    *** i’d like to see his college anything, but it’s up to him now.

    To what end?

    scott e: And just how would those settle the matter for you?

    ***by comparing the pdf to the one in the vault. nothing else matters, the rest can be systematically cross referenced.. eg the sss reg and the ss# number. in a created identity, none of them will be normal.

    Since Hawaii has already certified that the information on the PDF (to say nothing of the sealed copies they provided the President) matches what is on the original birth record in the vault just exactly what would you be looking for if, by chance, you were able to examine the

    As far as the Selective Service and Social Security registrations are concerned if they’re all forgeries – for the “created identity” – just what would be abnormal about them that you could detect?

  395. avatar
    misha marinsky July 12, 2013 at 8:10 pm #

    Daniel: Hey Scotte…. just out of curiosity, what makes you think you have any right at all to see Obama’s college records, or BC, or any of his personal records?

    Boehner says scott e has a right to question Obama’s BC:

    Boehner: Not my job to correct people

    WASHINGTON — House Speaker John Boehner says Americans have a right to think what they want to think, even when they’re wrong about President Barack Obama’s citizenship and his religion.

    Some people believe that Obama, a native of Hawaii, was born outside the United States. There is also a persistent belief among some that Obama, a Christian, is actually a Muslim.

    Gregory asked, “But that kind of ignorance, about whether he’s a Muslim, doesn’t concern you?”

    “The American people have the right to think what they want to think,” Boehner replied. “I can’t – it’s not my job to tell them.”

    Boehner denied that he is willing to let those misperceptions remain because they weaken and delegitimize Obama.

    Read more: http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0211/49441.html#ixzz2Ysb0D5i0

  396. avatar
    CarlOrcas July 13, 2013 at 1:15 am #

    Dave B.:
    Well that was lame.

    Who do I sue to get back the three minutes I waste listening to that drivel?

  397. avatar
    Dave B. July 13, 2013 at 2:31 am #

    La Chismosa Mentirosa.

    CarlOrcas: Who do I sue to get back the three minutes I waste listening to that drivel?

  398. avatar
    scott e July 13, 2013 at 11:25 am #

    Daniel:
    Hey Scotte…. just out of curiosity, what makes you think you have any right at all to see Obama’s college records, or BC, or any of his personal records? What makes you more special than any other average American that you have more rights than they do?

    Also…. why didn’t you ever demand these things of any other President in the past? What is the one thing different about Obama that you seem to think only he has to show you his papers?

    I don’t. this is a popular misconception.

    this is the president we have now. being a birther is a relatively new advent for me. really just a couple of years

    .i don’t start many sentences with “I demand”. I do have a Benghazi video with “we will demand the truth”. I believe in that.

    if anyone has any evidence of crimes or misuses of power of past service, i’d like to have it for the history books.

    he doesn’t have to show his papers, to me or anyone… but he could. that’s all.

    this story will eventually play out. i’m merely fascinated by the chaos around this one issue. out of that chaos will come order.

  399. avatar
    scott e July 13, 2013 at 11:30 am #

    CarlOrcas: So any comments you have made about the posse and its work are based on……what, exactly?

    You’re not curious? Do you acknowledge that he doesn’t have any police powers of any kind?

    Like anyone born in Hawaii the President has no ability to acquire and/or release his original birth record. You do understand that……don’t you?

    To what end?

    Since Hawaii has already certified that the information on the PDF (to say nothing of the sealed copies they provided the President) matches what is on the original birth record in the vault just exactly what would you be looking for if, by chance, you were able to examine the

    As far as the Selective Service and Social Security registrations are concerned if they’re all forgeries – for the “created identity” – just what would be abnormal about them that you could detect?

    i’m not an expert at any of it, there are people that are. so we have to rely on them. when the is disagreement, how do we usually solve the dilemma, in court.

    I did say from the beginning, this is science, and I think tangible enough to be conclusive, one way or the other.

    once the unknown factors become known, the provenance will come into focus. as far as I know the sheriff’s posse is volunteer. I have never spoken directly to sheriff joe, only email.

  400. avatar
    CarlOrcas July 13, 2013 at 12:52 pm #

    scott e: once the unknown factors become known, the provenance will come into focus.

    That’s one of the most profoundly meaningless statements I have ever seen……anywhere.

    When you are willing to deal with my direct questions let me know and we’ll continue.

  401. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy July 13, 2013 at 12:53 pm #

    I disagree with you. Most questions are not settled in court. The courts are limited in their jurisdiction, and that jurisdiction does not extend to settling conspiracy theories on the Internet.

    Disagreements as far as science are settled by a consensus or a strong majority view. There has to be, however, an agreement of just who is qualified to participate in the consensus and who is not. The federal courts to have rules regarding experts, rules which the birthers have never agreed to. In fact, the birthers have never agreed to accept what the courts decide: look at the 10 decisions that people born in the United States to alien parents are natural born citizens.

    It is disingenuous for a birther to ask for something to be settled in court. It’s just a form of goalpost shifting. And it’s shifting the goalposts to somewhere birthers have already proven that they do not submit to.

    scott e: i’m not an expert at any of it, there are people that are. so we have to rely on them. when the[re] is disagreement, how do we usually solve the dilemma, in court.

  402. avatar
    CarlOrcas July 13, 2013 at 12:58 pm #

    Dave B.:
    La Chismosa Mentirosa.

    Too bad Berg is laid up for a couple years. I could have him handle it…..on contingency, of course.

  403. avatar
    jtmunkus July 13, 2013 at 1:08 pm #

    Okay. So science and the courts are going to decide whether or not there is a half century worldwide conspiracy to install a secretly foreign Manchurian candidate in the office of president by craftily breeding him as a multicultural, biracial man with an African bigamist father and a teenaged American mother, who has an African name, by staging two popular elections and duping dozens of millions of citizens into voting for him, to make it look legitimate.

    Order will never come to the chaos that is the twisted birther mind.

  404. avatar
    CarlOrcas July 13, 2013 at 1:19 pm #

    scott e: this is the president we have now. being a birther is a relatively new advent for me. really just a couple of years

    And what about this President prompted your concern…..what is so different about him?

    scott e: if anyone has any evidence of crimes or misuses of power of past service, i’d like to have it for the history books.

    Not sure which history books you’ve read scott but the ones I have seen are chock full of “crimes or misuses of power” by past Presidents. You might want to start with recent history – Iran Contra, for instance – then move on to Watergate and when you have time check out the presidency of Ulysses S. Grant.

    scott e: this story will eventually play out. i’m merely fascinated by the chaos around this one issue. out of that chaos will come order.

    In the real world, scott, there is no chaos as it regards the President’s birth. The chaos you perceive is simply a whirling dervish in one small corner of the internet.

  405. avatar
    scott e July 13, 2013 at 1:24 pm #

    Dr. Conspiracy:
    I disagree with you. Most questions are not settled in court. The courts are limited in their jurisdiction, and that jurisdiction does not extend to settling conspiracy theories on the Internet.

    Disagreements as far as scienceare settled by a consensus or a strong majority view. There has to be, however, an agreement of just who is qualified to participate in the consensus and who is not.The federal courts to have rules regarding experts, rules which the birthers have never agreed to. In fact, the birthers have never agreed to accept what the courts decide: look at the 10 decisions that people born in the United States to alien parents are natural born citizens.

    It is disingenuous for a birther to ask for something to be settled in court. It’s just a form of goalpost shifting. And it’s shifting the goalposts to somewhere birthers have already proven that they do not submit to.

    contingent on forgery. the birthers would have to prove a crime. but there may be peripheral instances of crimes committed, as with Watergate. that’s all.

  406. avatar
    scott e July 13, 2013 at 1:28 pm #

    CarlOrcas: And what about this President prompted your concern…..what is so different about him?

    Not sure which history books you’ve read scott but the ones I have seen are chock full of “crimes or misuses of power” by past Presidents. You might want to start with recent history – Iran Contra, for instance – then move on to Watergate and when you have time check out the presidency of Ulysses S. Grant.

    In the real world, scott, there is no chaos as it regards the President’s birth. The chaos you perceive is simply a whirling dervish in one small corner of the internet.

    the chaos comes from all of us carl. it doesn’t make sense. everything added up, the stories the books the misinformation… and of course the Chicago way.

  407. avatar
    Rickey July 13, 2013 at 2:20 pm #

    scott e: i’m not an expert at any of it, there are people that are. so we have to rely on them.

    The only people I know of who are experts on Selective Service registrations and Social Security Numbers are the people who serve in those agencies.

    Neither agency has ever expressed any doubts about the authenticity of President Obama’s Selective Service registration or his Social Security Number. Likewise, the IRS has repeatedly accepted Obama’s Federal Income Taxes with the Social Security Number that Orly Taitz has plastered all over the Internet. If the SSN on his tax returns did not match Social Security Administration records, the returns would have been rejected.

    You don’t get your claims adjudicated by a court when you claims are based upon nothing more than speculation and unproven theories. Even in a routine personal injury lawsuit the plaintiff has to produce prima facie evidence that the defendant was at fault.

    You birthers have no evidence that Obama was born anywhere other than Hawaii. It doesn’t matter how many “anomalies” you claim to see in the copies of his birth certificates or in his Selective Service registration. It doesn’t matter that you can’t grasp the fact that there is nothing sinister about Obama having a Social Security Number with a Connecticut prefix (as I have noted many times before, my wife has a SSN with a Pennsylvania prefix – 210 – and she never lived or worked in Pennsylvania). Bitherism is and always has been dead on arrival.

  408. avatar
    Dave B. July 13, 2013 at 3:00 pm #

    You’re not a reasonable person. Your fellow birthers are not reasonable persons. Society has no obligation to accommodate you as if you were reasonable persons.

    scott e: i’m not an expert at any of it, there are people that are. so we have to rely on them. when the is disagreement, how do we usually solve the dilemma, in court.

    I did say from the beginning, this is science, and I think tangible enough to be conclusive, one way or the other.

    once the unknown factors become known, the provenance will come into focus. as far as I know the sheriff’s posse is volunteer. I have never spoken directly to sheriff joe, only email.

  409. avatar
    Jim July 13, 2013 at 3:47 pm #

    Dr. Conspiracy:
    The courts are limited in their jurisdiction, and that jurisdiction does not extend to settling conspiracy theories on the Internet.

    IMO, this changed from a conspiracy theory to nothing more than a scam when the CCP sold itself out to the highest bidder.

  410. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy July 13, 2013 at 8:11 pm #

    Wrong. Forgery is a criminal matter. A sitting President cannot be indicted for a crime. Someone who was an accessory to a crime might be indicted, but it would be up to the prosecutor in the jurisdiction where the crime was alleged to have been committed to prove the case, not birthers.

    The only role for birthers is Internet ranting. There is no role for the Cold Case Posse but anti-Obama propaganda.

    scott e: contingent on forgery. the birthers would have to prove a crime. but there may be peripheral instances of crimes committed, as with Watergate. that’s all.

  411. avatar
    CarlOrcas July 13, 2013 at 8:56 pm #

    scott e: the chaos comes from all of us carl. it doesn’t make sense. everything added up, the stories the books the misinformation… andof course the Chicago way.

    Actually, scott, the chaos is only in the fevered minds of people like you who conjure up crime after crime out of the routine vagaries of life….especially 50 years of it.

    The chaos feeds on itself because you cannot accept simple explanations for any question or perceived inconsistency and manage to pile one imagined wrong on top of another until you’re absolutely convinced that Obama is the worst thing that ever happened in the history of man….or at least Chicago.

    Your only answer to straightforward questions is diversion with qualifier piled on qualifier to construct an imaginary world of what might have been, what might be. No one else sees it but you…..and other birthers…..and that’s where the chaos is….in your minds.

  412. avatar
    CarlOrcas July 13, 2013 at 9:02 pm #

    scott e: contingent on forgery. the birthers would have to prove a crime. but there may be peripheral instances of crimes committed, as with Watergate. that’s all.

    This is what I’m talking about, scott. Qualifier after qualifier:

    “Contingent on………………….”

    “Birthers would have to…………………….”

    “there may be peripheral………………….”

    Since you are unwilling to deal with reality the chaos…..in your mind…..will continue. For everyone else it’s just a moderately amusing sideshow.

  413. avatar
    Dr Kenneth Noisewater July 13, 2013 at 9:24 pm #

    scott e: the chaos comes from all of us carl. it doesn’t make sense. everything added up, the stories the books the misinformation… andof course the Chicago way.

    You seriously watch too many movies Scott. It’s funny how your nonsense adds up to nothing. It does make sense, it does add up. He was born in America he is legally and lawfully the president. The misinformation is coming from you birthers.

  414. avatar
    Dr. Conspiracy July 13, 2013 at 11:56 pm #

    Or scott e’s just pretending to be a birther, but is actually just a standard Internet troll who gets off wasting other people’s time.

    CarlOrcas: The chaos feeds on itself because you cannot accept simple explanations for any question or perceived inconsistency and manage to pile one imagined wrong on top of another

  415. avatar
    CarlOrcas July 14, 2013 at 12:38 am #

    Dr. Conspiracy:
    Or scott e’s just pretending to be a birther, but is actually just a standard Internet troll who gets off wasting other people’s time.

    I’ve never really understood that phenomenon. What is the point? I understand people with axes to grind, even bigots, but not just standing next to the pond throwing in rocks when you get the same ripples every time.

  416. avatar
    Dave B. July 14, 2013 at 12:37 pm #

    What, like Miss Marple?

    scott e: contingent on forgery. the birthers would have to prove a crime. but there may be peripheral instances of crimes committed, as with Watergate. that’s all.

  417. avatar
    Reality Check July 14, 2013 at 1:34 pm #

    Obama haters love to use that phrase when they have nothing factual to use to criticize the President as if the fact he is from Chicago makes him guilty of something.

    scott e: and of course the Chicago way.

  418. avatar
    sfjeff July 14, 2013 at 2:22 pm #

    Reality Check: Obama haters love to use that phrase when they have nothing factual to use to criticize the President as if the fact he is from Chicago makes him guilty of something.

    Well thats Scott’s whole bit- basically Scott says he is from Chicago and therefore he knows that Obama must be dirty and someone just needs to find the dirt.

    I think that what we learn from this is that the “Chicago Way” means judgement before evidence.

    Well that is part of Scott’s bit.

  419. avatar
    Keith July 14, 2013 at 3:10 pm #

    Ya know who else is from Chicago? Milton Friedman. He trained the the economists that encouraged and gave academic support to Pinochet in Chile. They were known as the “Chicago boys”.

    Maggie Thatcher’s policies were described as the ‘Chicago style.

    Reality Check: Obama haters love to use that phrase when they have nothing factual to use to criticize the President as if the fact he is from Chicago makes him guilty of something.

    scott e: and of course the Chicago way.

  420. avatar
    CarlOrcas July 14, 2013 at 5:51 pm #

    Reality Check:
    Obama haters love to use that phrase when they have nothing factual to use to criticize the President as if the fact he is from Chicago makes him guilty of something.

    And of course there is the word “thug” which usually creeps into their stuff sooner rather than later.

  421. avatar
    Rickey July 14, 2013 at 11:46 pm #

    scott e: and of course the Chicago way.

    Other notable politicians from Chicago:

    Henry Hyde, Republican, former chair of the House Judiciary Committee
    James Thompson, Republican, former Governor of Illinois and member of the 9/11 Commission
    Jim Sensenbrenner, Republican, currently U.S. Representative for Wisconsin
    John Ashcroft, Republican, George W. Bush’s Attorney General
    John Marshall Harlan, Republican, former U.S. Supreme Court justice appointed by President Eisenhower
    Slade Gordon, Republican, former U.S. Senator for the state of Washington
    Theodore Olson, Republican, U.S. Solicitor General under George W. Bush
    Tom Campbell, Republican, five-term U.S. Representative from California

    Under your “guilt by association with Chicago” theory, each of the Republicans listed must be or must have been corrupt thugs.

  422. avatar
    misha marinsky July 15, 2013 at 7:46 am #

    scott e: and of course the Chicago way

    Enrico Fermi split the atom in Chicago. Fermi’s wife was Jewish.
    Ray Croc was born in Chicago.
    Walt Disney was born in Chicago.
    Wesley Clark was born in Chicago. Clark’s father was Jewish.

  423. avatar
    misha marinsky July 15, 2013 at 7:49 am #

    scott e: and of course the Chicago way

    What is the “Chicago way”?

    Is that like Spiro Agnew’s Baltimore Way?

  424. avatar
    scott e July 17, 2013 at 11:47 am #

    Rickey: Other notable politicians from Chicago:

    Henry Hyde, Republican, former chair of the House Judiciary Committee
    James Thompson, Republican, former Governor of Illinois and member of the 9/11 Commission
    Jim Sensenbrenner, Republican, currently U.S. Representative for Wisconsin
    John Ashcroft, Republican, George W. Bush’s Attorney General
    John Marshall Harlan, Republican, former U.S. Supreme Court justice appointed by President Eisenhower
    Slade Gordon, Republican, former U.S. Senator for the state of Washington
    Theodore Olson, Republican, U.S. Solicitor General under George W. Bush
    Tom Campbell, Republican, five-term U.S. Representative from California

    Under your “guilt by association with Chicago” theory, each of the Republicans listed must be or must have been corrupt thugs.

    there’s no point in discussing Chicago corruption. there is no guilt by association. Obama is responsible for his own actions.

  425. avatar
    Dave B. July 17, 2013 at 4:06 pm #

    But there was one when you brought it up in the first place?

    scott e: and of course the Chicago way.

    scott e: there’s no point in discussing Chicago corruption.

  426. avatar
    CarlOrcas July 17, 2013 at 5:21 pm #

    scott e: there’s no point in discussing Chicago corruption. there is no guilt by association.

    Then why did you bring it up?

    (That’s a question, BTW, and an answer would be appropriate.)

  427. avatar
    misha marinsky July 17, 2013 at 5:30 pm #

    scott e: I have never spoken directly to sheriff joe, only email.

    Did you use your Nerf keyboard?

  428. avatar
    Jim July 17, 2013 at 5:48 pm #

    scott e: I have never spoken directly to sheriff joe, only email.

    Does Joe even use e-mail? Are you even sure that’s who you’ve been communicating with?

  429. avatar
    Rickey July 17, 2013 at 5:49 pm #

    scott e: there’s no point in discussing Chicago corruption. there is no guilt by association. Obama is responsible for his own actions.

    And how many members of the Obama administration have been charged with crimes?

    I’ll even give you the answer: Zero.

    Compare Obamas’ record with George W. Bush:

    Scooter Libby, Dick Cheney’s Chief of Staff, convicted of perjury and obstruction of justice

    Lester Crawford, Bush’s Commission of the FDA, pled guilty to conflict of interest charges

    Claude Allen, domestic policy advisor to Bush, convicted of felony theft

    Darleen Druyon, Bush’s Deputy Undersecretary of the Air Force of Acquisitions, convicted of corruption for inflating the price of contracts and unlawfully disclosing military bids to a competitor.

    And of course Jack Abramoff.

  430. avatar
    Suranis July 17, 2013 at 10:39 pm #

    This reminds me of the time, on another forum, there ScottE said flatly that Alynsky was a friend of Capone. And when challenged on it he brought out a paragraph of a biography of Alynsky. The only problem was that when you actually read the 2 pages around that paragraph it became clear that Alynsly didn’t know Capone at all. Sure, he hung around mobsters for a couple of years when he was doing a thesis on the structure of the Mob, and thoroughly enjoyed that lifestyle, but once the thesis was done he stopped hanging around with them, and Capone was already finished by the tile Alynsky started hanging around with them in any case. Plus Alynsky was adamant he never did any crimes while involved with them.

    Stunningly Scott didn’t even acknowledge this.

    But hey, people wrote books. And spooky Chicago. Ohh. Ahh

    scott e: the chaos comes from all of us carl. it doesn’t make sense. everything added up, the stories the books the misinformation… andof course the Chicago way.

  431. avatar
    misha marinsky July 17, 2013 at 10:42 pm #

    Rickey: And of course Jack Abramoff.

    I want to Jack Abramoff. [say it slowly]

  432. avatar
    Majority Will July 18, 2013 at 3:12 am #

    Suranis:
    This reminds me of the time, on another forum, there ScottE said flatly that Alynsky was a friend of Capone. And when challenged on it he brought out a paragraph of a biography of Alynsky. The only problem was that when you actually read the 2 pages around that paragraph it became clear that Alynsly didn’t know Capone at all. Sure, he hung around mobsters for a couple of years when he was doing a thesis on the structure of the Mob, and thoroughly enjoyed that lifestyle, but once the thesis was done he stopped hanging around with them, and Capone was already finished by the tile Alynsky started hanging around with them in any case. Plus Alynsky was adamant he never did any crimes while involved with them.

    Stunningly Scott didn’t even acknowledge this.

    But hey, people wrote books. And spooky Chicago. Ohh. Ahh

    So, scott/”Bernadine”, like many birthers, appears to have a severe reading comprehension problem.

  433. avatar
    Rickey July 18, 2013 at 2:23 pm #

    Suranis:
    This reminds me of the time, on another forum, there ScottE said flatly that Alynsky was a friend of Capone. And when challenged on it he brought out a paragraph of a biography of Alynsky. The only problem was that when you actually read the 2 pages around that paragraph it became clear that Alynsly didn’t know Capone at all. Sure, he hung around mobsters for a couple of years when he was doing a thesis on the structure of the Mob, and thoroughly enjoyed that lifestyle, but once the thesis was done he stopped hanging around with them, and Capone was already finished by the tile Alynsky started hanging around with them in any case. Plus Alynsky was adamant he never did any crimes while involved with them.

    Stunningly Scott didn’t even acknowledge this.

    But hey, people wrote books. And spooky Chicago. Ohh. Ahh

    Two minutes of research would have demonstrated to Scott that Capone was sent to prison in 1931, at which time Alinsky was 22 years old and a graduate student at the University of Chicago. Capone was indicted in March, 1931 and spent the rest of the year fighting the charges. The idea that he would have had any interest in associating with a 22-year-old graduate student is pretty far-fetched.

  434. avatar
    scott e July 20, 2013 at 11:10 am #

    Rickey: Two minutes of research would have demonstrated to Scott that Capone was sent to prison in 1931, at which time Alinsky was 22 years old and a graduate student at the University of Chicago. Capone was indicted in March, 1931 and spent the rest of the year fighting the charges. The idea that he would have had any interest in associating with a 22-year-old graduate student is pretty far-fetched.

    this is like the harry reid on the senate floor thing, you guys are holding on too tightly.

    http://www.progress.org/2003/alinsky5.htm

    it’s ok to be wrong now and then guys. we’re only human.

    why not just ask Hillary, I think she did her thesis on the guy.